NeoSpectra Validation and Canera Biotech Visit

0:07SpeakerOkay.

0:21BubblemanRecording in progress. Let's see how it goes. I think we're going to go live here right away. And there it is. Welcome, everybody. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Hash Church episode freaking 21, season 11. Holy smokes. We're still going. Well, as always, I'd like to start off the show by giving a big shout out to my sponsors because they rock and roll. Let's make sure, first of all, before I do this, you guys can all hear me.

0:50BubblemanYou're alive. I see and hear you all, man. I love my group. I love the audience because I was just about to go into the audience and ask before I went through the sponsors that people could actually hear me. So wonderful that you can. Without further ado, I am going to share the logos. And here we go. Big shout out to the Press Club. Trusted by top hash makers from around the world since 2016, the Press Club is your one-stop shop for award-winning solventless gear.

1:23BubblemanFrom press bags to wash bags to presses to vessels, you'll find everything you need from wash to press. We're big fans of the Press Club and what they're doing in the community. So we're excited to have them on board as an official sponsor for Hash Church. They are made in the USA. They've got the patented pink stitch, zero blowout guarantee, small family owned business. Try to support small family owned businesses when you can.

1:46BubblemanIt helps. Free expedited shipping on $75 or more. International shipping also available. You can visit them at www.thepressclub.co and use the code hashchurch to take 10% off your purchase. So big thanks to those guys. Second up we have... My good homies, Mark and Dennis from over at the Craft Greenery. They want everyone to know that Sauce Rosin Labs is coming to Vancouver, coming to British Columbia, and they are going to be very excited to be one of the stores that you can pick that up.

2:22BubblemanSo big shout out to the Craft Greenery, Vancouver's premier cannabis dispensary for sponsoring today's event. They're all about bringing the highest quality and widest variety of cannabis and extracts right to your doorstep across Canada. Whether you're a connoisseur or a curious newcomer, Craft Greenery has something special for everyone, making your cannabis journey both unique and unforgettable. Check them out for an unparalleled selection that's curated with love and expertise.

2:46BubblemanKeep up the great work, Craft Greenery. I hope to see those guys in the next couple of days. Here's a new sponsor we have. I want to give a shout out to Grassroots Fabric Pots. Bring soil to life. Power up your cannabis grow with Grassroots Fabric Pots. Proud sponsor of Hash Church. These handcrafted, breathable fabric pots are built for living soil, delivering unmatched aeration Superior drainage and explosive root growth for bigger, healthier yields.

3:13BubblemanWhether you're a home grower or commercial pro, grassroots fabric pots are your key to legendary harvests. Shop now at www.grassrootsfabricpots.com and grow like the best. You can use hashchurch as a discount code, I believe. Check them out there. Thanks for your support. Gentlemen at Grassroots Fabric Pots. And of course, we would be remiss if we didn't mention our good brothers and sisters over at Puffco. Big thanks to Puffco for sponsoring Hash Church.

3:46BubblemanLet's be honest, Puffco has absolutely revolutionized cannabis culture. It's normalized extracts with their incredible portable devices like the Puffco Peak Pro, the Pivot, and the Proxy. These amazing units deliver top-tier performance and style, making them favorites in our community. Puffco's unwavering support of all things cannabis keeps us lit and united. Check them out. Puffco's got your back. www.puffco.com. And at Puffco, last but not least, I got to give myself a shout out.

4:15BubblemanBubble Bags stand out as the premier choice for water hash extraction, and it's no surprise why. Well, we're the original innovators who set the standard for quality and performance. We crafted with durability in mind, and these bags come with a lifetime warranty, ensuring you're covered for years of consistent use. Team behind Bubble Bag takes pride in our pioneering legacy, backing every product with unwavering confidence and a commitment to excellence.

4:37BubblemanMaking us the trusted go-to for enthusiasts and professionals alike seeking top tier hash extraction results. You can find us at www.bubblebag.com. And of course, Hash Church 10 will give you a 10% discount over on the site. What's going on, Colin? How you doing, brother?

4:55Collin PalmerI'm doing really good, man. Just enjoying the Sunday. Was looking at some of this blueberry banana I have over here. It's delicious. And it's a little chilly on the East Coast this past week. Yeah, don't tell me that. I'll fly in there today. Still bundled up, right?

5:14BubblemanI got the Legends hoodie on, dude. I put the warm, you look like you got the warm hoodie on.

5:19Collin PalmerI do, bro. I found this hoodie that has this like amazing skid inside of it. Yeah, dude, that's what's up. I love it.

5:27BubblemanYou gonna go rob some liquor stores or what? Yeah, no, I'm gonna go, you know, it's not my substance, but.

5:34Collin PalmerThat is awesome.

5:38BubblemanMan, talk about sponsors, dude. We're starting to get some good little groups popping in. Little Mom and Pop Operations giving us a show here, a show there. Big shout out to the sponsors, man. I really appreciate you guys. Definitely a big shout out to Mark and Dennis at The Craft Greenery who just texted me to thank me. These are the most polite dudes in the cannabis industry.

5:59BubblemanGo give them some support. Rosin Labs, Rosin Sauce is going to be in the house. Dude, I got six jars of this rosin from Sauce Labs. I was going to photograph it. I was going to do reviews on it. I literally smoked all of it like a crackhead, Colin. And then my buddy Craig was like, let's go snowboarding. I'm like, oh, I can't wait for you to try this sauce, man.

6:20BubblemanAnd so I go and I start looking and I'm like, every jar is empty. And one jar has like the smallest little dab in it. I was like, dude, I'm I'm sorry, man. I'm a crackhead for this stuff. So I'm really excited for those guys to get the sauce rosin labs in and see how it takes foot here in British Columbia.

6:39Collin PalmerNo, I know how that goes, man. As a photographer, it's like, you're always like, I want to do this thing with it. But then you're like, Ooh, that's really nice. And then it just continued to keep saying it to yourself until it's gone.

6:51BubblemanDude, I have so much beautiful six star bubble hash right now. And I've barely been photographing it at all. I do have, Ruben is here right now. I don't know if you remember Ruben from Valenveras. He came in from Barcelona just a couple of weeks ago. Real wild curly haired guy.

7:09Collin PalmerI do remember Ruben.

7:10BubblemanYeah, yeah. Talking about his Neo Spectre device, this little guy right here.

7:16Collin PalmerNice. I saw you posted that. That looks really cool. So what's the story? What's the backstory on that? Like what is it? You know, there's a lot of devices that come out. You know, we've seen orange photonics, the purple thing, you know, blah. They all kind of do their own thing, right? But they all kind of miss each other's kind of like one solves a problem, the other doesn't kind of thing.

7:36Collin PalmerBut it's almost like.

7:39BubblemanMP3 players when they first came out. I got my first MP3 player. It was 128 kilobytes. That was the memory on it. So I would download two songs of Bob Marley off the internet and that would be it. I could put two songs on the MP3. So, and then I got like, I don't know. I remember there was one that looked like a Walkman, but it was a hard drive unit.

7:58BubblemanAnd I would, you know, I was basically working up to record. I recorded with a mini disc player. Then I got the DAT recorder. So I went through all of these things and it really wasn't until I got to the DAT that That I was like, okay, this is the fucking thing. This is why everyone's using this fucking thing. That's why masters are always on these tapes.

8:17BubblemanAnd you don't know that when you're not a musician, when you're just like a musical aficionado, if you will. You don't really realize that. So I think like the last one I had of this was the Gem Assert. It was like, oh, 60 points. All of these different light, you know, you couldn't breathe around this thing, bro. If you opened a door, it fucked everything up. If there was music and bass playing, it fucked everything up.

8:40BubblemanI kind of lost interest in them, I'll be honest. And when I met Ruben and he started showing me this thing and he's holding it and he's doing this and he's, and I'm like, whoa, dude, like, are we going to have to count? He's like, oh, don't worry, my friend. It's all good. It's all good. This is, we could do it on a train. We could do it on a trampoline if you want.

8:56BubblemanLike, no, we worked at the Dank Club and Book Club the other day. It was so fucking loud. 50 Cent blaring on the stereo, people banging the table, touching the unit while it's on. None of it affected it, bro. We were validating shit within 1% of HPLC and GC. Today, which blew my mind, today we took a piece of a plant off of my, a leaf off of my plant.

9:25BubblemanWe cooked it in the, you know, we dried it right out. And this fucking thing, after like a minute, showed me

9:37Collin PalmerPull it back. Oh, there it goes. Oh, there we go.

9:41BubblemanThese are the scan results. So now it's telling me my nitrogen, my potassium, my all of these things, right? That are in the plant and. What's crazy about it is that here, let me let Wade in. He's coming in. He's in the hospital right now. So we definitely want to hear from Wade and I'll gladly stop talking about what I'm talking about. These are the targets Colin for growth.

10:03BubblemanSo let me just get it going again here. Let me, so now you've got your minimum, your maximum, and then your averages are, are, we're all where those numbers I just showed you, they all fell within those averages. So he said, wow, this plant. He's really well fed. Imagine as a grower. Dude, that took me a minute. I dried a leaf in my air fryer and then I put it inside this thing.

10:27BubblemanAnd a minute later, I had the full macro and micronutrients of my plant.

10:33Collin PalmerHello, Brother Wade.

10:36BubblemanHey, Wade. Good to see your face. Yeah, dude. Wade's been in the hospital.

10:41SpeakerIt's nice to be here.

10:43BubblemanI'm gonna go back to listening. It's nice to see you. No problem. You're welcome here. Anytime you want to say something, you just throw your hand up and we'll love to have you. I'm talking about this little device. I was just telling Colin that I took a leaf off my plant and I basically was able to take the measurements of the macro and micronutrients of the plant right here it's telling me exactly what the numbers are my like it's just an unbelievable useful tool i put in full melt bubble yesterday poured it into the thing it came back 67 thc it was higher than all of the rosin i had a gentleman in holland who hit me up the other day told me that he feels that this device This is what he said concerning the Valenveris.

11:38BubblemanWe validated it for cannabinoid compared to our Euro EU GMP lab. Valenveris is actually better and more reliable in my very humble opinion. We can now run much, much more samples and so we can do research with increased data resolution. Ruben is not getting this device back. That's all I'm saying. And that was INEXOBV, I-N-N-E-X-O-B-V. That's DOM. You can check them out on IG. So it's nice to hear other people who are in the science.

12:12BubblemanI just can't believe how convenient this is. I'm taking it tomorrow to go visit Issam and Justin, who came and hung out with us from Canara. I'll be in Montreal later today, dude, just over the border from you.

12:24Collin PalmerThat's super cool. Yeah, so two years ago, I approached medicinal genomics with the same ideology. I was like, hey, guys, I don't know what you know about the assays, but I do know that I don't know enough about the mycorrhizal that's happening in the soil biome, and I don't know enough about All of this interplays with one another in terms of data. So they figured out a way to be able to test that and put that within the sequencing protocols, right?

12:51Collin PalmerAnd that opened up this unlocked, at least for me, this new understanding of what's possible in terms of the, you know, just the microbiome in general and how that interplays with another feeding schedules. Or what is the plant uptaking in terms of living soil and what is there and how is it doing it? This cuts driving time out, testing time. It cuts out all the stuff that I, you know, asked for.

13:18Collin PalmerAnd had to do all this work to then get it to a lab, but then they had to do all this work to get me that data back. You know, this is so meaningful.

13:25BubblemanIt just didn't exist. It just didn't exist. You know, Ruben has three degrees in engineering to have put his, yeah, he's got an agricultural degree and an electronics degree. So he's a real, real, he got two at the University of Barcelona engineering degrees and he got one at the university in Amsterdam. And so he's, you know, he's definitely put an enormous amount of work Into this little unit.

13:47BubblemanNow, this unit is not his unit. Neospectra is a unit that exists. It's one of the higher end NIH. What Ruben did was he programd this for cannabis. He put on all the data, all of the, you know, he's working right now with SC Labs. They're about to do a big project with Alec down at SC Labs that he may or may not come and tell us a little bit about later.

14:09BubblemanBut yeah, I just can't say enough about this unit, dude. It's so easy. It validates so quickly. We were within under 1% of testing against GC and gas chromatographs. So it was, it surprised me to say the least.

14:26Collin PalmerYeah, that's impressive, man. I mean, it's it's as if, you know, just needed to wait a little bit for this guy to come along. But it's interesting, you know, he's taking existing technology and increasing the wheel of it, which is the most brilliant thing you could do because it'd take him so long to get to that place of what he's doing today to start it over, you know.

14:45Collin PalmerSo it's really, really smart. And yeah, it's almost as if he's porting assays over to a new place. You know, a new device in a sense, you know, it's really, really brilliant.

14:58BubblemanIt's really the full, the full melt bubble that I tested from John Hatch, which is all just this beautiful, beautiful, perfectly grown and perfectly made bubble hash. It was coming in just under 70, around 67, 68, but all of the rosins that we tested, only one came like 0.3 higher than the bubble. Everyone else's rosin was coming in. In terpene and cannabinoid content below the full melt bubble.

15:27BubblemanAnd it really showed me that most people's rosin is mediocre bubble that they've pressed. It's not like a, it's made, if it's a five star, you're lucky. I'll put that a little above mediocre, but anything four and below, I'm kind of like four and below is, is like, and I don't say mediocre to be insulting. I just say it's not exceptional. It's just in the middle. Maybe I should call it middle.

15:48BubblemanMaybe that's a little less judgmental and a little less, uh, Harsh when I say that because, you know, I'll be, I'm obviously, I always, I don't forget that our utopian minds, Colin, are not what everyone else wants or thinks like. And I'll never forget Irv Rosenfeld smoking those shitty government Mississippi stocks ground into them weed. And we're all like, we're going to get you better weed and don't worry herb.

16:14BubblemanAnd he was just like, guys, this is, I love this herb. This is perfect for me. And we were just like, but you can't love that herb. Like you have to get the best. And it's just a weird ego problem, I guess, when you just think that you A, have the best and B, want everyone to have the best. How about this? How about we all just give everyone access and they can choose what they want.

16:35BubblemanThat sounds like a working proposition that I could get behind. A hundred, yeah.

16:40Collin PalmerNo, it's hard. You're pointing out, it's like, you know, you forget sometimes, and I think you and I are more cognitive than we've ever been about You know, where this all falls within everyone's lives. Like, what access do they have and what does that mean in terms of access for them? Some people, it just means getting access to cannabis, like, in any form possible. And some, it's a particular version of it, right?

17:05Collin PalmerAnd I think there's no wrong in that. To your point, you know, like someone yesterday, or not yesterday, on Thursday, gave me a bag of ground material and was like, dude, I smoked this all day. And I'm like, oh, brother, brother, in my head, right? But then I was like, you know what? This is kind of awesome that this guy is so stoked to share this bag with me and he gave it to me.

17:26Collin PalmerHe's like, I need you to try this. I haven't even tried it yet, but I will because he was just so adamant about it. But, you know, everyone's access point, I think, is their own journey in and of itself. So that's, you know, I think time is an education brings us to the place of So, you know, there's a lot of individual choices that go beyond the initial life access.

17:48Collin PalmerBut that's just time. You know, I really chalk that up to once you get in the door, you're now just, you know, searching through the dark room until you touch the object that you feel good with. And then you turn the lights on. You're like, oh, yeah, I like that. You know, so there's the access point in cannabis to me is I think with everyone, it's really varying in terms of what quality level you might have access to.

18:15Collin PalmerBecause now we have regulation. Someone on another episode said, back in the day, every gram mattered. And I think because of that quality, All of that kind of was a little bit more easier to find in that respect because it was, you know, people were, the growers at the time were like, it has to be the best because you just don't have as much of it and we have to get the best dollar per gram for it.

18:42Collin PalmerAnd I think there's, you know, with craft cannabis, we're having some of that kind of come back to the industry. But the consumers have to choose that, you know, it's because there's so many choices. So it's, I encourage those that are looking for that type of experience to support craft farmers, you know, if you can, if you can do that. But on the flip side, if you need that, you know, that whatever cost structure, maybe there's another brand out there that speaks better, you know, louder to you.

19:09Collin PalmerYeah. Yeah. But it's, you know, I think it's important for people to think about those things for themselves because it's often too easy to be like, well, the price is better on this version of sour diesel versus that one. And then they don't know and understand how to differentiate that in terms of what's good.

19:29BubblemanOne sour diesel and one totally isn't.

19:32Collin PalmerYeah.

19:32BubblemanWell, that's one that isn't sour diesel is so much cheaper.

19:38Collin PalmerI know. Yeah.

19:41BubblemanOr. Or in some cases, you know, it was, you know, maybe it was grown better.

19:45Collin PalmerRight. And, you know, it may not be sour diesel and it needs its own name. Right. It's true. I'm about to hit this Sunday driver.

19:54BubblemanI just scooped it off. It was so greased out. I love when hash looks like this.

20:01Collin PalmerI got to get my jar. I brought them. I'll be back. I'd love to hear from Wade. How are you doing, brother?

20:11Collin PalmerWade is happy to be here.

20:13SpeakerCan you guys hear me?

20:14BubblemanWe sure can.

20:16SpeakerWell, I am on day 12 of being in the hospital down in Sacramento. I'm at the University of California Davis Cancer Center, which is a world-renowned cancer research facility. I was originally admitted here 12 days ago.

20:44SpeakerIn hopes that they could come up with a pain management plan.

20:55SpeakerAnd they have. What's really lovely is in the last, the first week I was here was very challenging. They were trying to get me off of the pain meds that I had been using that were not very helpful. And meantime, trying to find versions of pain medications that would be effective and allow me to still function.

21:27SpeakerAnd I apologize for my tears. There's a mixture of sadness and joy in this because I can relate. I can report over the last five days. I think we found the... The combination of non-opioid medications that allowed me to wake up this morning relatively free of pain.

22:02SpeakerAnd I think most people who experience pain don't like talking about it because it's no fun to describe and you can't really know if you haven't lived it.

22:18SpeakerSo yeah, the other thing that was happening is the deal that I made with these folks is they were going to work to see if we couldn't get my pain in hand and they have. I have for years used a meditation technique called a pain body where I would create another body for myself that could sit over there Where I could witness what he was experiencing without getting caught too deeply in it.

22:55SpeakerAnd it's an effective technique. It just requires constant attention.

23:11SpeakerYeah, there's the pain body. Look at that. Isn't that interesting how that pain is moving around?

23:21SpeakerIt's a freeing exercise from the... I'm sorry, what?

23:27BubblemanWell, I think Ryan just came in accidentally with his mic on, but continue, Wade, please.

23:33SpeakerYes.

23:39SpeakerSo yeah, about five or six days ago, I think we tumbled upon the unique combination of, I mean, there's like six or seven different drugs that they've put together for me into a cocktail. Everything from ketamine to Dilaudid to a number of medications I've never heard of. But five days ago, for the first time since I got into the hospital, I slept through the night.

24:08Dr Mark ScialdoneI mean, nurses woke me up to give me medications and whatnot, but I actually slept through the night and I woke up in the morning.

24:18SpeakerFor the first time in four years or more, I woke up relatively free of pain, not having to do my meditation.

24:35SpeakerAnd all of this, it must sound like I'm really distressed or upset or bothered.

24:44SpeakerI think what's going on for me is I've recognized that I was reluctant to ask for help at many junctures when help would have been appropriate. And I've now come to the realization that, yeah, I'm sick. Seems like an obvious thing to say, but what that really means is it means that my capabilities, my opportunities to contribute to my life and to those around me has been pretty severely curtailed.

25:27SpeakerAnd And over the last two weeks, as we've gotten my pain things straightened out, the rapid heart rate is in hand. Shortness of breath seems to be in hand. A lot of things have kind of come together to support. And I will say that when I checked into this hospital, I'd pretty much given up. I said, I'm tired of fighting. I'm especially tired of fighting.

26:01SpeakerWith drugs that do more harm than good, because we don't really know what's right for my case. But now that I've been here, I feel like in addition to getting the pain thing in order, they actually have found an anti-cancer drug. It's not a chemotherapy drug. It's a, oh, let me see if I can get this terminology right. Modified monoclonal antibodies. And specifically, the ones that they're giving me have had three injections of these things in the last week, each injection stronger than the previous.

26:44SpeakerAnd then they wait 48 hours to see if it's going to kill me or help me. And it seems to be helping.

26:53SpeakerI've talked to a number of Friends who in the last few days have commented how much different my voice sounds and how energetic I sound and feel. And that's really the case for me.

27:11SpeakerAnd yeah, I have hope again. And I'm being realiztic here. I know that the chances of the current regimen Actually stopping my cancer or curing it, quote unquote, is virtually nil. There's not much chance of that. Myeloma is a very adaptable form of cancer. And so inevitably over time, it finds a way to work its way around whatever we're doing to slow its progression. But I am promised that I get out of the hospital today.

27:49SpeakerAnd when I get home, I'll be able to take up my cannabis medications again. And it'll be fun to see how cannabis and the synergy that I'm aware of there works with the medications that they've put me on. And they're being very helpful. They're really insisting they want to help me. They want me to be coming back down here for my care. And I'm very... I don't like the long drive, but I really love that there is...

28:19SpeakerA world-class cancer facility close by me.

28:27SpeakerAnd for whatever reasons, a lot of the nurses and doctors here, like I encouraged some of them to Google my name, and evidently they were impressed. I've actually had the nursing educator ask me if I would be willing to do classes here. So of course I said yes.

28:55SpeakerAnyway, that's a very teary, long-winded way of saying Wade's had a rough couple of weeks, like a cherry on top of a rough year. But I'm getting to eat the dessert now. I feel like I'm doing better. I'm really looking forward to being home. Being on the farm again, I realized that one of the challenges for me is I've been in this hospital now 12 days. I have not had a breath of fresh air in 12 days.

29:35SpeakerWhen I was in the Navy, I kind of got used to canned air. But yeah, I'm really looking forward to being home and being able to get out on my farm and look at the pond and the animals. Oh boy. Anyway, you all will be seeing more of me. It is my intention and hope to be able to contribute to Hash Church again on a more regular basis.

30:01SpeakerI feel like between Hash Church and Veterans Action Council, you all are my community now. You're my contact with the world.

30:13SpeakerAnd I want to stay in touch with the world. I feel like I have More to offer to our community. And a lot of what I'm experiencing, I'm experiencing it as grace, as me having the opportunity to really dig deep on what is surrender? What does it mean to surrender to one's life and condition?

30:47SpeakerWell, Wade, for so long, you've been the caretaker. And now it's time for you to be the one that's being cared for. And that's a hard transition to make because it's a shift in identity. Right? Well said, Ryan. I also have to say, watching you share over the last six months and more, You continue to teach us with this incredible humility. This is not something that I don't think I've ever seen anywhere before.

31:20SpeakerThe raw honesty of your journey and your courage and it's really, it's a beautiful thing. I'm trying to find the beauty in this incredible Incredibly immensely tough thing that you're going through. But in, you know, the honesty and the rawness and that you're sharing it with the world. I mean, it's really, wait, it's something else. I don't, I don't really have the words to put my emotions out there.

31:59SpeakerBut it's a beautiful thing. And I just, I see how strong you are. And I know that this probably pulls on the heartstrings of everybody else in the chat like it pulls on mine. But this is not something that you see. This is not a part of life that I think even people that are going through it personally with family members, a lot of this stuff just isn't discussed.

32:22SpeakerAnd I think that you continue to be a role model for us in this community. And I just want to say thank you and that I see your courage and I love you very much.

32:35SpeakerThank you, Ryan.

32:38Etienne FontanBrother Wade, take a deep breath. You're still with us. And that's all that matters. You know, we're here for you in every way. I have to reflect exactly what Ryan stated. Most people who are watching this, I'm going to guess, are... Pretty young. We're not used to looking or dealing with the end phase of life. It's usually something that's very sudden. Your brave honesty is something that touches all of us because we're all going to go through this in one way, shape, or form.

33:21Etienne FontanAnd you are our guide currently because of what you're going through. You have...

33:31Etienne FontanThank you so much for joining us.

33:57Etienne FontanBeyond grace. I mean, that's connected to the honesty that you're sharing with us, which nobody shares. These are things that are hidden. So thank you for exposing us to the uncomfortableness, as uncomfortable as it is. Thank you for lifting us up with you, for we will lift you up with us. And I love you.

34:20SpeakerYeah, you continue to teach, Wade. It's remarkable beyond words.

34:27BubblemanIt is very powerful. I had a whole bunch of stuff I wanted to say, but this is what I'm going to say, Wade. You are enough. You are enough. You have nothing left to prove. You don't have to try to... You already are, and you may feel that you've shifted and that you're not helping people as much as you thought you were, but I think that might be in your perception only, because for the rest of us, we feel that you're helping...

34:56BubblemanIt's kind of us more than ever. And it's really powerful, man. It's heavy duty. You're taking us on a journey that, like Ryan said, most people keep behind locked doors. They don't want to share. We're all heading to the same place. The journey that we take to get there, maybe some will have more pain, some will have less pain. I don't know why that is. I don't know why young people Children have to suffer.

35:21BubblemanI don't understand it, but I do know that watching you move through it with grace is important to the community. I mean, I hope you go back on these shows and you read the chat because it's been nonstop Wade, Wade. Someone just coined the term Wade over evil instead of Jah over evil. So now they're using your name Wade like Jah. So it's like, I just, I was like, Wade is the way.

35:50BubblemanWade is the way. And it says, give thanks. Wade's way.

35:56Collin PalmerYeah, dude. It's powerful. Thank you. Powerful.

36:00Etienne FontanNo, thank you.

36:01Collin PalmerThank you. And, you know, you're, I don't, I don't have much to add here other than you're, you're showing everyone how to show up. And that's really important and really, really special.

36:16SpeakerWell, as I said earlier, I have missed being able to be on the show with you all. And I'm really looking forward to having more opportunities to be here with you all. Because I do feel like my strength is coming back. I'm no longer giving up. I'm going to fight some more. Not happy about it. But life is too precious to give up just because you're in pain.

36:56SpeakerAnd one of the nurses told me there's a thing here where you, something along the lines of ask for what you want and take what you get. And I think that's been the lesson for me. Many of you made reference to how difficult these kinds of conversations are for most people. And I, I don't know. I feel like, oh, Well, I'm going to stop there.

37:26Dr Mark ScialdoneI feel deeply loved by each of you.

37:35SpeakerAnd I, yeah, I look forward to some lighthearted, fun conversation today.

37:53SpeakerBut yeah, I want to close by saying, yeah, I feel good. I feel able again. I feel willing to engage. I'm not giving up.

38:06BubblemanThere's a lot to be said for that.

38:09SpeakerI really appreciate this group of people and the way in which we relate to each other. It's a lot. It's a gift. So I'm going to mute and go back to doing my favorite thing, which is listening to brilliant people talk about cannabis. I love you guys.

38:32BubblemanAwesome, Wade. Very, very powerful stuff. I did want to tell you one thing, Wade. I have discovered this artist recently named Ren. And he's a young, he's in his 30s. He's from the UK. This guy's been sick for half his life. He suffered from autoimmune disease. He suffered from psychosis, a lot of mental health issues, but he wrote a song called High Ren. And it's this division of his positive and negative.

39:00BubblemanHe's got this darkness and this light that swings back and forth like a pendulum. And, you know, for two years he laid on a bed as a 20-year-old kid and he couldn't move. And it drove him fucking batshit crazy. And he came out of it with this beautiful, powerful song. And it starts, it might be a little dark, but it ends with such a powerful... I can't even explain it.

39:22BubblemanI've watched it 50 times. There's a bunch of people who react to this video. And it's just... To understand anyone that has never seen this song, it is performed live in one take. It's nine minutes long. He plays it on the acoustic guitar. It is so powerful, Wade. I think that if you can watch it for nine minutes and get to the end of it and hear, you know, he says a line in that movie, in that song, because prior to the line, he's The gentleman who he's singing as is almost like the devil, and he's singing like, I'm Mothopheles, I'm the chaos and the division.

40:00BubblemanAnd he's going through all of this negative, and then at one point he says, you know, I also go by many names. Some people know me as Hope. And when you said earlier that you had hope, I want you to listen to this song. I swear to God it's going to make the hair on the back of your neck stand up. Thank you so much for watching.

40:33BubblemanI very much want to welcome Dr. Mark Sheldon, our resident chemist to the room, Dr. David Allen, our resident MD, Etienne Fontaine, our resident badass, fatty smoking, bald ass, motherfucker killer, and Ryan Lee as well. And then I want to welcome some, oh, and Dutch Blooms who just popped into the room as I'm doing introductions. But I do want to introduce you guys to my new friend Storm from South Africa.

41:01BubblemanFrom the House of Extractions. And yes, Storm knows of Myrtle Etienne, as you introduced me to Myrtle this recent March in Barcelona. But yeah, I just met Storm recently. He's in South Africa. And I thought maybe it would be nice to have him come in, tell us a little bit about what's going on in South Africa and introduce himself and tell us a little bit about the House of Extractions.

41:25BubblemanI called this guy on Instagram out of the total blue. And completely threw him for a loop. It was awesome. I love doing that. So how you doing, Storm?

41:37DrHow is it, Marcus? Yeah, I know. Doing very well. Thank you. Thank you for inviting me. It's an honor to be here.

41:46BubblemanYou represent in South Africa for us, brother. Tell us how things are going. Tell us about the House of Extraction.

41:53DrYeah, sure. I mean, the things in South Africa, legally speaking, started changing in about 2017. Medically, like medical is full legal, but and then it's Well, it's full legal for cultivation, but not for distribution. It's complicated. So it all gets exported. And then the unlicensed market, the home growers and the larger cultivators are free to cultivate under the privacy of their own Thank you very much.

42:48DrTrying to make a legal business model. And so I'm a service provider for cultivators or members clubs who are looking to convert their harvest into whatever extract. Typically, I used to work with PHO and stuff, but these days we are full focused on the solventless hash washing and rosin pressing and all of that. So yeah, that's what we do. I work very closely with an education institute called Chiba Africa.

43:26DrSo we educate people on cultivating as well as

43:34DrExtraction and everything in between. The big problem in South Africa is education, just across the board, not just with cannabis, but then with cannabis specifically. So yeah, that's me.

43:53BubblemanThat's awesome. Well, listen, South Africa, send all the positive vibes from South Africa to our brother Wade Laughter. Who's just finishing up some days in the hospital. He's been fighting cancer. He's in the room with us today. We want love from all over the world being sent to Wade. And I don't know, Wade, if you have an email address or a contact information that you would like people to send messages.

44:16BubblemanI don't know if that would bring you joy to hear from people from around the world, but we certainly have enough of them watching at any given time. And I'm sure more than a few of them would be happy to send an email your way. With some positive affirmations.

44:34SpeakerI would be comfortable if you are open to sharing the email you have for me. I don't know that I want to give my email out right here in church full blast. I don't really have a sense of what's the right thing, Marcus.

44:48BubblemanYeah, well, I think what you feel in your heart is the right thing. And what you just said sounds like the right thing to me. So anyone that wants to send a lovely message to Wade, you can reach out to me at bcbubbleman at icloud.com. And I'll forward you Mr. Laughter's email and you'll be able to send him some positive affirmations. And then please let him know where you're from.

45:09BubblemanYou know, I'd love to see some different countries representing, you know, it's a big world out there. And, uh, I know that Wade has, you know, left a pretty good mark on it so far. So let's continue that journey.

45:22SpeakerPeople should let Wade know too how they are inspired by him and how he's touched them. And also keep in mind, maybe don't expect a response, right? Because these can be quite overwhelming and replying to a lot of emails can be a lot too. So, you know. I think that's well said. Don't expect a response. It can be overwhelming. His energy is precious. We all want to protect that.

45:56SpeakerAbsolutely. It really is.

46:00BubblemanI don't, it doesn't work out well for me when I forget to reply to an email. People will be like, hey, Bubble Man, you're so inspiring. You've totally inspired me. They'll be all positive. And I'll be like, I'll miss, I'll read it, but I'll be like, oh, I got to reply to that later. And then I'll forget. Like three days later, it'll be like. You know what, Bubble Band?

46:18BubblemanFuck you. I opened my heart to you, and you can't even reply, and I'll just be like, oh, shit. And then, of course, I'm like, oh, my God, this person's going to feel so bad when I actually reply and tell them what happened. And that's how it goes every time. They're like, I'm so sorry, man. I didn't mean it. I'm having a bad day. I'm like, dude, I know.

46:36BubblemanWe're all having a bad day. It's okay. I can take the odd fuck you here and there if it's followed by a quick apology. I'm very good like that. I get an apology. I feel better about it. If you tell me to fuck you and you don't,

46:47SpeakerAnd I'm hurt. It was either 2000 or 2001. I was at a cannabis cup. And at the end of when the milk leg would close, the people would usually end up with the dolphins down the road because they took their, you know, seven days or 24 hours that you can have per year in the cup week. So it kind of became the after party place. And I ended up there one night and sitting at a table with Arianne.

47:10SpeakerAnd Arianne just absolutely peaked on mushrooms like as high as you could possibly be. And someone came up to him and had clearly seen him in a High Times magazine and just wanted to have this moment with Arion telling him how cool he was. And Arion was so lit that he couldn't even speak. He couldn't even get out a reply. And this guy took it really personally in real time.

47:33SpeakerI watched exactly what he said, Marcus, unfold with Arion. And it was one of the funniest things I've ever seen. I never felt so bad for someone on Mushrooms.

47:45BubblemanSometimes you can't win, you know, sometimes you can't win. And you know what? Sometimes you're not supposed to win. So that's okay as well. Something I'm learning as I get older, and I did learn this from Marcus Aurelius' book, which is if you don't want to be annoyed in the world, then don't have an opinion on that thing. All you have to do is remove your opinion about a certain thing and it won't bug you anymore.

48:10BubblemanLike if there's something that's...

48:12SpeakerIt's perspective, right? And... You know, we can have the wrong perspective as people. Like, our perspective isn't always right. No. Right? And that's an important lesson to learn in life. Because we often get offended by things that aren't intended as offense. And, you know, like Arion peeking out on mushrooms, he wasn't being rude at all. He was just trying to survive. He was in survival mode.

48:36BubblemanThat's pretty funny, dude. That is pretty funny. I actually am flying to Montreal today in a couple of hours and in about 15 minutes I'm going to shift and I'm going to come into this chat room on my phone. This box is going to be empty probably for the rest of church just on my thing. I'll probably put it on I don't know if I'll put it on gallery view or speaker view.

49:01BubblemanWhatever one I put it on, it's going to stay on for the whole rest of church. And my wife is going to come in after she drops me and Ruben Valenveras at the airport because he's going to the Grow Op in Toronto and I'm going to meet Isan and Justin from Canara. Who came in to hash church a couple of weeks ago from that big giant facility.

49:21BubblemanSo yeah, this is the epitome of my madness. I'm going to leave in about 15 minutes and I'm going to drive to the airport and I'll just be on my phone, uh, doing church, uh, from my phone. And then my wife's going to be such an angel. My wife is the most angelic person ever. She's going to, she's going to shut hash church down. So everything gets preserved and recorded and saved.

49:43BubblemanSo it can go up on the podcast. How the hell are you doing, Dutch? What's going on? Like Minnesota, Minneapolis? I keep, where are you at again? Oh, is he like a picture? Yeah, they're the same place. Oh, there he is. What's up, dude? Good, man. How is life? How is life in Minnesota?

50:02SpeakerIt's good. It's warming up. The ever wait for, you know, the licenses, you know, it's an it's a new state and they're just doing all the usual things. But, you know, I have a little, you know, battle worn, you know, approach to it where some of these folks are just a little frozen. They're just going to fuck it up.

50:30BubblemanThey're just going to fuck it up. What I like to tell them is right away, you just say, listen, I just want to let you know, I'm a lifer. You're going to be working in a completely different sector and I'm still going to be here. So just keep that in mind when you're creating these regulations that gatekeep people like me who are in this for life. Why is cannabis being gatekept?

50:55BubblemanBy people who aren't in cannabis. Why is that? I have no understanding of that whatsoever.

51:01SpeakerYou know, what's also interesting is like, you know, I'm new to Minnesota. Minnesota is new to coming into recreational weed. And so people are coming out of the closet. And I keep meeting these people that are introducing themselves. Hey, I'm a breeder. Do you know what a breeder is? I make seeds in there. You know, they're telling me I don't like. You know, it's kind of weird, like, yeah, man, I am too.

51:23SpeakerThat's what I've been doing for the last 15 years, you know, on an acre. And but it's, you know, there's part of my ego that comes out like in that, you know, and then and then I sit back and I've observed like a lot of people are telling me this and I'm realizing the influence of like of the shows that have been going on, the influence of the cannabis scene overall has been influencing people and people are going after their dreams.

51:47SpeakerYou know what I mean? And so now they're here and the market's coming in there. They're there to represent themselves and say, hey, this is what I want to do. This is what I'm doing. And I know it's really cool. You know, so it's like kind of this this weird where my ego comes up like I'm Dutch Blooms. I hear Minnesota now. You know, my tears fire like when in reality, these folks have just are just passionate about weed.

52:09SpeakerThey've been doing it in the shadows for a long time and are ready for their moment. You know, so it's fucking beautiful. I hope the best for everybody. Minnesota has a very similar program to New York where they have the micro license, which is really cool. Until recently, it was supposed to be a 10% excise tax, which is a pretty good rate, but they just voted to bump it up another 5%, which is unfortunate.

52:37SpeakerUm, but you know, the lay of the land in Minnesota, it's, it's kind of a estate full of a lot of small towns, you know? And so I think that like the way you set it up, you could kind of be that old where you have eight lights in your shop and you could have a retail micro and not even like a store where people are coming in, but you're, you could, your, your buddies could call you and come over and buy legal weed.

53:05SpeakerYou know, you can pay your taxes and do other things. And so it's kind of cool just because people are spread out. There's these smaller communities. People are kind of already established. I'm just I'm seeing this different way of how it could come out. You know, we'll see. There still is the big companies that are fighting to come in. They've given a lot of We're in mid-license.

53:27Dr Mark ScialdoneWe've made our application.

53:31SpeakerThey haven't licensed a single person or business, and they're kind of changing the rules, which is really frustrating, right? Because you would maybe change which license you applied for if you knew that the medical combo license was going to be allowed to do everything and have unlimited canopy. So there's some weird things, as usual, but it's rolling out, you know?

53:55SpeakerI was excited a couple weeks ago. I was in... Oh, sorry. No, no, go ahead. I was just going to say I was excited a couple weeks ago. I was in New York for the New York Craft Pharma... I was in the trenches, but it was not just him. It was a bunch of people.

54:34SpeakerI got to see a couple of cool greenhouse and I met some retailers. I met some processors. At the event, there was a ton of people with clones. I didn't expect that, but there was probably seven tables of clones and genetics and there was Strawberry Cop and Piff and Blue Zushi. There was kind of the range of all the cool shit. It's a cool scene.

54:58Collin PalmerYeah, Dutch, you did a nice job on the panel. We did a breeders panel with a bunch of the Local farms throughout the state. And then we brought Dutch in to talk about regenerative and all the farms on the panel or regenerative practices. And it was cool. It was really neat to see everybody kind of come together and talk about the The things that they've learned through the journey that they've had.

55:23Collin PalmerAnd it was nice. And the breeders panel was great. We had Fang from Gage Green come on, who I think was, you know, it was really educational for those that were there.

55:36SpeakerSo that's awesome.

55:37Collin PalmerYeah.

55:38SpeakerAnd it's kind of interesting, like each market, even though The market as a whole, you know, internationally is growing and becoming more and more educated. Each market kind of has to go through its own growth phase. Like there wasn't a whole lot

55:58SpeakerThis event, I was surprised kind of because of what's going on in the market now. The money is still good for flour. And so they're all moving flour and they're all smoking flour. Not to say there are awesome hash companies. I know there are. It just was my observation. There wasn't a ton of hash yet. You know, I imagine next year will be full of hash, you know?

56:16SpeakerYeah, I imagine so as well.

56:19Collin PalmerSquare footage, man. That's really what it comes down to. And then most of it's outdoor that's not passing. So when that happens, you're limited to what you can make with it, you know? So most of it went to distillate and continues to do that because of the environment. It's really once the more greenhouses come online, I think that's when it'll change. But I still think most of that's going to stay within...

56:42Collin PalmerYou know, very small square, you know, you know, called 100 miles, 500 mile radius, you know. New York's a big state, you know. It's huge.

56:56BubblemanYeah, I've been going to a couple events these last few days as well with Ruben in from Barcelona. We went to the book club the other day, super mellow, just did a bunch of testing, tested a bunch of different people's rosin. I was impressed that John's bubble hash, John Hatch, Hatch Hash, his bubble hash scored higher than almost all the rosin. There was only one rosin that had higher numbers than his full melt six star bubble.

57:24BubblemanAnd it really just goes to show you that like nothing is competing with six star. It is top. This shit shined like diamonds when you moved it. Every time I opened the jar and put the flashlight on it, people would just be like, oh, wow. In fact, a funny experience happened. I was sitting with a couple of reps for this company called Green Mile. It's a cannabis company.

57:47BubblemanAnd we tested a couple of their cultivars. They had a Pakistani and another one I can't remember. I'd have to go back and look. And there was another young guy. He was an artist. He was a young 20-year-old guy. And he sat next to us. And he had his Puffco. I had a couple of Puffcos on the table. And I was like, you know what? I want these guys to smoke some foam out.

58:06BubblemanSo I And there was like four of us. So I poured out enough hash for like four people to get a nice dab. And I roll it in my hand really quickly. It just turns to caramel. And I'm like, you know what? I want this guy to have the full experience. I want him to feel the actual texture of the hash and how it feels. And You know, he was like, oh, wow, you can't do that with rosin.

58:27BubblemanAnd he was holding it and rolling it and touching it a little bit. Well, I stopped paying attention for half a second and Ruben asked me a question and I leaned over to him. And I kind of hear the 20-year-old guy say something like, oh, can I put some in my Puffco? And that's what I wanted. I wanted everyone. So he put the entire thing in his 3DXL Puffco, like four big dabs of full melt six-star bubble.

58:51BubblemanAnd then... Awesomely enough, he passed it to one of the reps from Green Mile, so he didn't even hit it. He wasn't being like greedy or anything. And he gave this fucking guy from Green Mile such an amazing experience. I mean, the guy was gone for 15 minutes. It took him 15 minutes to come back and he didn't pass out. He didn't like turn too white. He didn't leave the table.

59:14BubblemanHe didn't like jump out of his skin. Although I will say I did hear someone might have passed out later in the evening after we left and there was an issue with not calling the hospital or the ambulance and I heard someone that fell and hit their head and I'm praying that it wasn't this guy. But he got really, I mean, dude, I don't even take hits a bubble like that.

59:35BubblemanI don't take like four giant rips and put it in the thing and just take that first King's hit, but It was quite something, man. He couldn't even open his eyes for, I'd say like three to four minutes. He would like, he would try to open his eyes and they were just like fluttering. Like he just had to close his eyes. Like, do you know how good of a hit that is when you have to close your eyes?

59:56BubblemanLet me tell you. And it wasn't just two. I often said two thumbs up for two tears down. This guy had many, many tears. This was many more than the two tiers experience. It kind of makes me want to bring the trichome challenge back. And I don't know how many of you are familiar with Adam Dunn's trichome challenge that he used to do in Amsterdam. But he had this big, long, like two or three foot glass bong.

1:00:21BubblemanAnd he would get like strong trichomes. Keep in mind, he was friends with Rob and Dave even back then in the mid 90s. So they were having an influence on him. So I'm not sure the trichomes were ever Dave Watson level. But still like a whole big bowl of trikes that you have to sit in this chair, suck this huge bong rip into your lungs, and then Adam stands next to you.

1:00:44BubblemanOh, and by the way, there's a video camera on the bottom of the bong, and it's videoing your whole reaction to you taking this bong rip. We talked about it on someone's podcast recently, but... Yeah, it was quite an experience, the Tricombe Challenge. I think it might have a place in the near future once Vapor Lounges are more secure and there's good. I did go also to the Dank Club, which is where that guy got super high on the bubble.

1:01:09BubblemanAnd then I went to Jody Emery or Jody Ramghese now. Sorry, she's got her old name back. I went to her event. Her Fair Cannabis event was happening at the Cannabis Culture Vapor Lounge in downtown Vancouver. So we went and set up our thing there. It was really awesome to see all these old friends that I hadn't. I saw Jeff Tack from Afghan Bull Rider. I haven't seen him in over 10 years.

1:01:33BubblemanHe was married to, of course, the cannabis activist Michelle Rainey, who was one of the BC3 that was arrested by the DEA with Mark Emery and Greg Williams. I saw Dana Larson, who runs the mushrooms and coca shops in Vancouver now. He was Mark Emery's partner back in the day and one of the editors for Cannabis Culture Magazine. Just awesome dude doing awesome, incredible activism work still to this day, just pushing the ultimate boundary of civil disobedience to the highest level.

1:02:08BubblemanAnd I will say in everything everyone did, It seems as though nothing was more effective for legalization or pseudo legalization than civil disobedience. I didn't see anything else. I mean, definitely little kids having hundreds of seizures a day and then just not having a seizure for 11 days off a drop of oil. That was definitely like a strong nudge in prohibition side. They had a hard time Okay, who wants to stand up and argue that?

1:02:41BubblemanLike, my kid's having 800 seizures a day. Would you like to tell him why he... And he's taking every fucking poisonous medication you've ever given him. Medication for Parkinson's disease, medications for colon cancer. Like, they just throw the kitchen sink at these kids. So it's like, why can't they have an oil? So... I don't know where exactly I was going with that, but in a very short period of time, I've got to go to the airport.

1:03:04BubblemanSo I'm going to shift over to my phone. And I hope while I'm doing that, that some of you can potentially pick up the conversation. I'll be listening. I'll try to drive the conversation. But if anyone has anything they want to share, I mean, I'd love to hear more about South Africa Storm. Honestly, I don't know what else is going on there, but... I'm sure there's quite a bit going on there.

1:03:27BubblemanAnd Ruben keeps telling me I got to go to South Africa and there's this huge extract world going down. He says, yo, there's a lot of work for you in South Africa. Maybe one day I'll make it down there. We can make some hash together.

1:03:41DrYeah, absolutely, man. We actually work with Valenveris. They work with the school that I work at, that I work with. Chiba. Yeah, Chiba. Yeah. So, yeah, you must pull in.

1:04:01BubblemanAbsolutely. I'll bring my Valenvera. I'm telling you, this little scanner thing. Mark, Dr. Mark, you would love this little thing, this NIH scanning device that Valenveris has. It is so cool, dude. We were validating within 1%, less than 1% of the numbers that the lab reports had. And it just happened so fast. And it was like in the most non-lab setting that you could possibly imagine. The thing that freaked me out about this tool is, you know, generally I find...

1:04:36BubblemanThings like this, and definitely things like what Dr. Mark does, is you have to have an extremely high level of awareness and an extremely high level of understanding and executing the SOPs and the order of what's supposed to be happening properly. Because if you miss something, you can fuck the whole thing up. But what I noticed with this thing was that, like, I feel like I could train my 10-year-old son to operate it.

1:05:06BubblemanYeah, it's very, very, it's very simple.

1:05:11Dr Mark ScialdoneWhat is it?

1:05:12BubblemanIt's a it's a little neo spectra scanner. It's called it's like an NIH scanner. So it's my friend Ruben has, he's got a bunch of engineering degrees. And he's basically programd this thing for cannabis. He's doing some work with SC labs. I'm not sure exactly how much They're talking about it, but I know they're starting a big project together. They're going to be doing something with this.

1:05:38BubblemanI was surprised. It's kind of like Gemacert, Orange Photon, you know, all of these different sort of portable lab systems. But I guess what it is, is it's one that's gotten like substantial. I think we're in this part now, Dr. Mark. You know what I mean? Like, I think, I think we were here and I think we're now like in the hockey stick. Like it is going, the quality and the caliber.

1:06:02BubblemanYou know what happens with technology? I remember my first MP3, two Bob Marley songs. That's it. You know, now my, an MP3 player could hold like 10 million songs.

1:06:13Dr Mark ScialdoneSo it's an, it's a near IR scanner. Is that what it is?

1:06:17BubblemanYeah. NIH scanner. NIH, what does NIH stand for? I don't want to make a mistake and sound like an idiot. So I might call Ruben over. Hey Ruben, you want to come tell Dr. Mark about this device?

1:06:33SpeakerHello, everyone. How's it going?

1:06:41BubblemanCan you hear that? Yeah.

1:06:43SpeakerYeah?

1:06:44BubblemanOkay, perfect. So Dr. Mark wants to know about this little unit. And if you haven't met Dr. Mark, please meet him now. He's awesome. There's your unit. That's him right there.

1:06:54Dr Mark ScialdoneNice to meet you, Ruben.

1:06:56BubblemanHello. Hello.

1:07:00Dr Mark ScialdoneSo what does this little device do?

1:07:02SpeakerSo this is an NIR, Near Infrared Spectroscopy. It's actually using light. Yeah, a spectrometer. So it's NIR, not NIH. Exactly, NIR.

1:07:15Dr Mark ScialdoneYes.

1:07:17SpeakerSo yeah, usually we used to work with pencil units like the Brooker one or the Thermo Fisher one, which usually is a big device. It's not that portable and actually really way more expensive. And yeah, we were really lucky to partner with Cyworld and just start playing with this small tool. Even being portable, I think is, yeah, like a new step in this kind of technology. And what I really like is I think we empower, you know, all of us, we can empower ourselves being able to have these kind of technologies, being able to let us know what we consume, if it's cannabis, if it's mushrooms, or even what we consume at the end.

1:07:56SpeakerI think I would really like to see this You need one day here, which I think is going to be. And then imagine you being able to go to the supermarket and being able to choose the proper oranges according to the level of vitamin C you want or any other product you want to consume. So, yeah, we're really happy to be able to provide this tool. Actually, we've been facing that the plant issue analysis changing a lot the way that the producers are producing cannabis.

1:08:25SpeakerMainly you are able to analyze the nutrient intake of the plants with the macro and micro nutrients and that is changing the industry. And yeah, really happy to be able to travel around the world. So happy to be able to stay a few days here with Babelman and having fun around and looking forward to see how it's going to be grow up and see now how the evolution of this cannabis industry is going on here with all the experience you have in Canada, me coming from Barcelona, still in the gray area, And seeing how this is here and moving on, still not in the best way, but really so happy to be here.

1:09:00SpeakerAnd I think you should really appreciate as well having a regulation in your country. We still are struggling and I feel so comfortable here and having cannabis, even we're going to travel in a few hours and I'm going with the cannabis in my pocket. It's for me to be like crazy. So, so happy.

1:09:18BubblemanWhere can we smoke at the airport? I'm like right out front under the sign with the marijuana leaf. It says smoking area. This is where we will smoke. So, yeah, he's pretty stoked. And, you know, Storm from South Africa. Oh, he works with Chiba. Nice. Yeah, he was just shouting out.

1:09:36SpeakerSo good. Say hello to Trenton on the team. I really loved your project. I had a lot of fun last year. It's a pity this year you didn't have the traditional in Cape Town. And it's going to be, I think, next week in Johannesburg, which is a bit really next to the grow up. But how's it going there?

1:09:53DrYeah, it's going good. Yeah, we have the summit next weekend. It's going to be, yeah, it's going to be big. Yeah, looking forward to it.

1:10:02SpeakerSure, sure. I'm sure the Trenton and Chiba team will be bringing the unit as well. Yeah, yeah. I've got...

1:10:10DrI've worked very closely with that unit. It's fantastic.

1:10:14SpeakerThank you. This is something that I really love, especially like new countries or countries that are on their level up or they don't have that many tools, let's say, being able to offer technologies that can actually easily be accessible. And what Chiba did, I think, is still in the way of being able to have a Chiba Lab service in South Africa, which I love, you know? Being able to, yeah, anyone that want to know the potency, the terpenes or the nutrients in their plants, being able to analyze that quickly.

1:10:44SpeakerYeah, it's so good. I'm really looking forward to see the regulation of the cannabis industry in all the other countries. Like the other day I received from Pakistan and then like, it's really nice because people, especially new countries are contacting us to see how they can have this technology. And yeah, it's so, so, so it's, I think we are start germinating now. This industry is just, Just starting, so let's see how it's going to be.

1:11:10SpeakerI'm so excited.

1:11:13DrAnd Africa, Zimbabwe, Botswana have both legalized now. There's things happening in Central African countries. Yeah, it's taking over. It is, it is, it is.

1:11:29SpeakerSo it was NIH. I know, I was making, I knew it.

1:11:33BubblemanI told Dr. Martin, I said, oh, I don't want to make a mistake and sound like an idiot. I was like, you already did.

1:11:39Dr Mark ScialdoneNIH means something else. But so, so this, this device of yours measures, measures cannabinoid content. Is that it? Does it also measure terpenes or just cannabinoids?

1:11:50SpeakerCannabinoids and terpenes in flowers. In extracts, still only potency, so only like the HPLC, but we are training. I think Marco said something about SC Labs and yeah, we're going to be working with them. I cannot say how, but yeah, we're going to be increasing our database. As well with them, and the idea is to be able to fit the system with many more samples in order to have as well this terpene profile in the extracts, which I think is going to be easier for me.

1:12:17SpeakerUsually it's really difficult with NIR to actually detect less than 1%, let's say 0.1%, and basically in terpenes we have more, in extractions we have more terpenes, so I hope it's going to be easier. Yeah, it's going to be easier, I know already. We are already working on the model.

1:12:34Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, let's hope your collaboration with SC Labs is to validate the precision and accuracy on these measurements because if they're precise and they're accurate, yeah, it will be really useful because we all know that, you know, It takes a whole lot more in terms of having an HPLC or GC to do determinations. This looks like it's small enough that you could take it right into the field or right into the grow.

1:13:05Dr Mark ScialdoneSo that's always really valuable. And I think where these things have kind of fallen down previously is that

1:13:19Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, there's a lot of material inside cannabis, right? And so if you're looking at a neat, so near IR is what is where you're looking. And we call that the fingerprint region of the spectrum because there are very characteristic Thank you for joining us.

1:13:48Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd you're looking to say, okay, what's the level of aspirin in that tablet? Near IR measurement can be spot on correct with HPLC. Where near IR has problems is when there's multiple components in something. And you see that that's the problem in cannabis is that All the cannabinoids have different near IR fingerprint spectra, right? And so like where CBC's got a peak, maybe THC's got a different peak at a different wave number or different frequency.

1:14:28Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd so you could look at the intensity of those peaks and say, okay, In general, we have something called Beer's Law in chemistry, which basically says that the amount of the material giving rise to that peak is that the peak intensity is directly proportional to the amount of that material that's in there. But at small concentrations, and that's the important thing with cannabis, like if you're trying to distinguish Cannabis cultivar from say hemp, just that arbitrary 0.3%.

1:15:08Dr Mark ScialdoneSo can your machine tell the difference between 0.4 and 0.3 or 0.2 and 0.3? I think near IR starts to get a little noisy down towards that end of the concentration regime. So I think you can get good results on high numbers, but when the numbers get really, really small, There could be interferences from other components that are in there, like the CBD fingerprint could interfere with the THC fingerprint.

1:15:42Dr Mark ScialdoneSo what you think is THC is actually CBD, or maybe the peaks are actually shouldered with each other. So all this can be worked out because there's a lot of kind of, you know, number crunching and taking the data and looking at, you know, trends over different You know, if you do like a calibration curve with a standard amount of material in there and you know what the relationship with peak height is and concentration, yeah, over that concentration regime, you can get probably a pretty good number.

1:16:18Dr Mark ScialdoneBut I think at really low concentrations, you might start to lose some of your precision and accuracy. Is that fair to say?

1:16:26SpeakerYeah, you are right. Let me let me tell you, That's one of the important points. And this is a bit of a secret that I'm going to share here in the program. And you are super right, Dr. Mark, in what you are seeing. We call it bundle. That is when you have the bundle. So the vibration of this component is related with more or less the same window that we see the vibration or the absorption in another one.

1:16:51SpeakerAnd that could be actually just mixing up. And this is why we have a lot of samples. And this is like a system that you actually need to train, train, train, train, train, and being able to do it. So I'll, I'll share it on, or actually I encourage you to enter in Valenbedo's website and you can have there, we have our poster research where we show the efficacy of our system with a validation.

1:17:10SpeakerAnd actually we are, we already validate in SC Labs and we are going to have a bigger validation. This is actually what we are doing right now. Then what I want to say, and Yeah, any other competitor can have a look and see is that you can actually divide the models, that this is what we do. And actually, if you enter in the system, actually, Michael has a research account, he can look into that.

1:17:31SpeakerYou have, for example, for the THC, you have the low THC, medium THC, high THC, from 0 to 3%, from 3 to 10%, from 10 to 34, and we reach 33.7%.

1:17:44SpeakerAnd that's how we are able to read. So actually, the system is going to read the sample and it's going to ask you, which is the chemotype? Chemotype 1, 2, 3, or 4. Then it goes, chemotype 1. Okay, chemotype 1 is THC, low, medium, or high. It's THC low, go low. And then go low, say, okay, which is 0, 2, or 3, or 3. The last validation that we had...

1:18:06SpeakerThank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

1:18:33SpeakerAll around and suddenly one day the email came and right now we use email. So kind of a way. We always will need the HPLC and other techniques in order to see really specific small amount. With NIR we are not able to see pesticides and we are not able to see heavy metals. We can analyze in one minute and be really precise in other components, but that's the limitation.

1:18:55SpeakerSo we always going to need as well other techniques. But in any case, this will be a technique, I think, as an internal control to know how to produce properly and how to harvest and how to select the phenotypes. One of our really interesting tool that I think is going to change the industry.

1:19:09BubblemanLet's continue that in the car because we got to go to the airport right now. So I'm just going to shift this over. I'm going to turn off my... What was the name of the company, Marcus? My... AirPods. And then hopefully we can hear this one now. Here, why don't you take that? All right. And you can continue the conversation. And we are going.

1:19:33Etienne FontanWhen he free shifts, ask again.

1:19:36SpeakerYeah, I think you've got to ask already.

1:19:38Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, so they were asking what the name of the company was that sells this device.

1:19:48SpeakerYeah, Valen Veras. Valen Veras. I'll put the link up in the description.

1:19:55Dr Mark ScialdoneAll right. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. And how much does that thing cost? It's about $13,000 US.

1:20:09Etienne FontanThat's not cheap.

1:20:11SpeakerNo.

1:20:13Etienne FontanNo, but either is spending tens of thousands. Yeah. It's cheaper than a HVLC or a grass cabana, for sure.

1:20:22SpeakerYeah, GC, right. Those oranges are about that, 15 pounds.

1:20:27BubblemanIn Canada, we have to test everything through that anyway. So to have something like this, that you could just be doing the majority of your testing and only really have to go to the lab right at the end. Like when a company wants to like homogenize a product or something, they're doing an infused joint, they need to know the THC percentage. It's just really helpful.

1:20:46SpeakerAnd I saw it validate extremely, extremely close to what the lab reports from the labs were saying. Like, like I said, it was under 1%.

1:20:58Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, so I mean, that's really super important to do because if you're not validating the accuracy by like an HPLC measurement, then you can really see results all over the place. So it's basically giving you ballpark results, which may not be good enough to pass the muster for say like a COA, but it would be good enough if you're kind of like Just going through your grow real quick and just, you know, seeing where levels are, you know, if you got confused and got plants mixed up and you don't know what variety is which and you want to go through and look at cannabinoid levels.

1:21:42Dr Mark ScialdoneI'd be interested in like, so terpene levels.

1:21:44BubblemanIt also does macro and micronutrients of the leaf. We did that earlier today and it showed It showed like all the percentages of nitrogen and potassium and like it was really cool.

1:21:59Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, that is cool.

1:22:00Etienne FontanSo you could also do that after feedings to see what uptake is, etc. So you can also tailor your, if you're tailoring your nutrients, you can also, yeah, hit those points.

1:22:13SpeakerYeah, it's all your feed.

1:22:18BubblemanSorry, I'm going to be quiet for maybe 10 minutes while I get all my shit into the car. If someone can just somehow manage this conversation, that would be incredible.

1:22:26SpeakerNo, I like we all know. We all know that. The cool potentials, you know, and I think at the end, you hit the nail on the head. It's not not not to be rude, but for all of us to really get our hands on the technology, we need something that is a little more affordable. You know, I could see that everyone's eyes were like, come on, this is going to be four thousand bucks.

1:22:47SpeakerIt's going to be something, you know, that you love it. You know, I know it. I'm sure it costs a lot. You know, I'm not trying to doggone that, but just that's what my brain was doing, like something that I could actually afford and I could Use it house. And, you know, cannabis is unique in that it's been bred and changed in small, small groupings. You know, most agricultural crops are grown out in big things and have more money behind them and can do that.

1:23:14SpeakerBut As big as we try to go with cannabis, even the bangers still keep coming from the closet grow. They still keep coming from bag seed. It's, you know, so having something that more people can afford and get their hands on is, would be a really exciting thing.

1:23:31Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, if, you know, not to play devil's advocate here, but if you're, if you're measuring, if you're using this device to measure buds as is,

1:23:44Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's often, again, a problem to correlate that to potency on a dry weight basis, right? Because all bud is moist with water, right? So even if you're using this little handy duty device here, how does that correct for how much water is in the material?

1:24:09SpeakerIt measures active water and moisture percentage.

1:24:13Dr Mark ScialdoneSo that's how. Say that again now?

1:24:18BubblemanIt measures the active water percentage and it measures the moisture of the flower. So every flower we measured gave us a moisture content.

1:24:32Dr Mark ScialdoneOkay, so it calculates moisture as well is what you're saying.

1:24:36SpeakerAnd active water, AW. Active water.

1:24:38Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, water activity, right, right. Right.

1:24:43SpeakerIt's cool, man. I'm telling you, Dr. Mark, you would have a blast with this thing. And it's like, like I said, in Canada, the majority of what we test all has COAs.

1:24:53BubblemanSo this thing is just like ding, ding, ding, nail on the head nonstop.

1:24:57SpeakerLike, I totally doubt these things.

1:25:00BubblemanBut in Canada, we have COAs for everything, unless it's in the black market.

1:25:04SpeakerAnd even then, lots of the black market people have COAs for their stuff.

1:25:10Etienne FontanWhat's the cleaning and maintenance on this tool, right? Because we know that gas chromatographs, not easy cheap, UVH PLCs, et cetera, et cetera.

1:25:19BubblemanThere's no agents, super easy. Like there is no cleaning. You just keep the top device clean. You just don't ever touch it. You could wipe it with a cloth. The unit, the battery takes about six hours to charge, which is a long time. But then you can do like 500 samples on a six hour battery. So more than you could do.

1:25:38Dr Mark ScialdoneDoes it have a lens that you just hold a piece of bud or?

1:25:42BubblemanYeah, well, there's a little piece that fits over the top of it. It points up like a flashlight and then it basically, I'll drive, Char.

1:25:52DrBasically, it's got like a container with a clear bottom and then you just crush up the flower and you put it in and make it like an even bottom and then you put it on top of the lens. And then when you're done, you just empty that container out and you roll a joint and smoke the flower. Right. Exactly.

1:26:13BubblemanThat's why Ruben has like 28 joints in his pocket right now because everyone that gave a sample, it was a perfectly ground sample that... Of course you want to build it.

1:26:24Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, yeah, I mean, a limitation of anything optical in terms of optical spectroscopy is the path length that the near IR photon has to take to get to that molecule of THC. And you can imagine, you know, again, whether you're using a bud or whether it's ground up and everything, there could be a lot of inhomogeneity that would give you different results. Right. On what, on whether or not it's getting like a piece of flour that only has a bit of a trifone.

1:27:00Dr Mark ScialdoneThere's a sweet spot. Yeah. So there could be, depending on like how that sample is prepared. I mean, a nice thing about like GC and LC chromatography is everything's in solution, right? So the cannabinoids are dissolved up in a sample that has got everything in solution. Here, I mean, I don't know. I mean, it's interesting to think, again, that the... The THCA is in solution inside the trichome, right?

1:27:32Dr Mark ScialdoneSo you're not actually hitting the THC molecule itself. You're hitting the oil that's in the plant and somehow able to discern the absorbance in the fingerprint region of the near IR for THC over everything else that could be in there. Right. And there could be other things that can totally overwhelm that signal, depending on, you know, how that beam of photons is coming in.

1:28:04BubblemanIt's insane. So how how can it be hitting? How can it be hitting so close to COAs every time? Is it just lucky?

1:28:15Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, there's some statistics probably there. So you can like run it if you run. So if you grind up a sample, Marcus, like grind up like flower sample, and you run that 10 times, will you get the same result every time that you run it? Or do you get a different result depending on how the sample is? Uh, interacting.

1:28:39BubblemanIf we put in a flower, if we put in a flower, there's a certain way to prepare it just like there is with an HPLC. And if you change how you do it, you'll get a different result. Operated it differently. So big chunk power. And now you want it to be A. Dryer is ideal. You want to mill it into a fine, like small particulate, and then it gives them the closest, most accurate reading to the COA.

1:29:09BubblemanThat's what I saw. But I've only played with it for a couple of days. But yeah, hopefully you and Ruben can link up one day and you can play around with one. It's kind of neat as a little lab tool.

1:29:20Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, if he wants to send me one to play around with, I'll take it.

1:29:30BubblemanPretty fun thing for sure. Well, I'm taking mine to Canara right now. I'll be just over the border probably from not far from you.

1:29:37Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, you know, I can see Montreal is on the other side of the lake here. I think I can see it from my window.

1:29:42Collin PalmerOh, wow. Shit out there, man. Shit out there, Mark.

1:29:47BubblemanSuper close. Yeah, go to, yeah, they invited you anyway to Canara.

1:29:56Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I'll just go down to the lakeshore and scream your name and see if you can hear me. Oh my God.

1:30:03SpeakerI'll get my, I'll make sure I clean my ears out real good.

1:30:07BubblemanThis is definitely like, I can't remember the last time I did Hash Church on my way to the airport. This is definitely like one of those times. It's like a tenacious, like not giving up, must do Hash Church. Colin is a co-host, by the way. If anyone needs anything.

1:30:26Collin PalmerI'm here. I got y'all.

1:30:27BubblemanA little co-hoster. Yeah, so it should be good. Montreal for me, Toronto for Ruben. He's going to have fun seeing all the Canadian maniacs.

1:30:37SpeakerI'm sure Urban Remo will be there and a bunch of other characters. Johnny B with his medtainers is heading down to the Grow Up Conference. So it'll be good. And I'm going to be in Montreal.

1:30:50BubblemanIt should be very good.

1:30:54Collin PalmerWell, have a good trip, man. And we'll carry it on here. So Dr. Mark, you know, when it comes, I have a question with the device, you know, when it comes to measurements in terms of, you know, quite just really anything, is there, this device, you know, as Marcus, maybe the gentleman with him can answer this easier, but the device is something that exists already in today's world.

1:31:20Collin PalmerIt's something that's being ported over for this application. So with that said, there has to be some sort of data science going on or something to mimic these assays, right, to be able to get The measurements itself, you know, and, you know, the question really is like, what is, how are you creating those things? Because it's a real, it's extremely complex. You know, you're talking about a lot of data, you know, coming to an inflection point.

1:31:56Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, it's one thing if it's a single active ingredient, like I said, if it were just a tablet of aspirin or ibuprofen, right? And there's just a single active ingredient in there. And then you have The IR spectrum of the active ingredient, you could look down in what's called the near IR region, which is the fingerprint region and look for a unique peak that changes linearly as concentration changes, right?

1:32:24Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd so then if you have a certified reference material, so say it's Delta 9 THC, what you can do is you can do a bunch of serial dilutions, right? And so you put You put the full strength, say it's, I don't know, one meg per mil. Then if you do a tenfold dilution, it's going to be 0.1 meg per mil and then 0.01 meg per mil. And so you run those and you look to see how that peak shrinks as a function of concentration.

1:32:54Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd you look at the linearity of that calibration curve right so the calibration curve is looking at the the peak height or most cases the peak area so you're looking at so each peak kind of like looks like an isosceles triangle right so you basically figure out what the peak area is and they have mathematical programs that can do that so basically you look at the peak area Then you read your calibration curve and you know that at that peak area you're you know 0.05 mgs per ml so you can get a you can get a concentration out of that like for most testing that's going on at cannabis labs where you're using We're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back.

1:34:03Dr Mark ScialdoneAs you start to get really dilute in concentration, that relationship between concentration and peak area or peak height starts to deviate from linearity, right? And when you start to deviate from linearity, now you can't necessarily use that calibration curve because your peaks are off the curve, so to speak. So you have to kind of look at like what, Like if you're, if you're doing the termination between hemp and cannabis, you have to have a linear response on an order of magnitude on each side of that, of that curve.

1:34:44Dr Mark ScialdoneSo you gotta be able to read down to 0.03% and gotta read it able up to like Thank you for joining us.

1:35:09Dr Mark ScialdoneThank you. Thank you. Thank you.

1:35:39Dr Mark ScialdoneThe mass spectrometer is basically sensitive down to like, it only needs. So when I do an injection, Colin, I'm typically trying to get things right around 0.1 mg. Thank you for joining us.

1:36:16Dr Mark ScialdoneSo we do either a thousand to one or a hundred to one split of that 0.1 meg per mil solution. So do the math for a second. So if you're 0.1 meg per mils, what I'm saying is we only need a thousandths of that, which is basically, you know, 0.1 nanograms to basically light up the mass spectrometer. With this detector, with the near IR, it's not going to be even close to what the mass spectrometer is going to be able to do.

1:36:47Dr Mark ScialdoneSo that's why I think what he was saying and very accurately is that you can't use this for say like, You know, pesticides at like parts per million or parts per billion level, right? You just won't see them, right? Because you're just not enough signal in there. So for something like that, you would need the mass spectrometer to basically get that level of, or see something at say, you know, 10 parts per million or, you know, even lower than that.

1:37:18Collin PalmerBut yeah, but so, okay, so to even build off of that, you know, the, but it seems to me like it's possible to eventually get there though, you know, through data science, right? You could mimic it much like, let's say, for instance, in my world, I often find myself watching videos of people building and recreating older synthesizers, right? And then you see them play a note and it looks like another note and they're like matching whether or not those oscillators and those chipsets match that tonality, right?

1:37:46Collin PalmerYou know, I kind of think about this in that same realm where it's like eventually, you know, through data science, you actually could create a one for one, you know, you know, like digital analog kind of thoughts, you know?

1:38:00Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, I don't know. I mean, I think you're up against the sensitivity of the analytical technique itself. I mean, just the the the sensitivity in the of the IR is just going to be a Orders of magnitude different than the mass spectrometer. Like NMR, everyone always thinks, you know, when they hear about NMR and they understand like, oh, NMR is great. But NMR is great down to about 0.1 weight percent.

1:38:31Dr Mark ScialdoneBeyond that, You really don't have a notch. Well, it depends. If you're looking in the proton and the carbon, you just don't have enough signal intensity in order to see stuff that that's that's that's that dilute. Like I can show you a sample of like Steve Sorenson, MD, MD, MD, MD, MD, MD,

1:39:09Dr Mark ScialdoneThank you so much for joining us.

1:39:35Dr Mark ScialdoneYou might see something like 12.2% THC. Well, you bring that to an HPLC testing lab, and they're now going to tell you that that's actually 14.5. So you might, again, get results that are That are close, but not absolutely certain. What Marcus was saying is that he's seen the correlation, and I think that's important that they're working with SC Labs, who's got a rich history of being able to correlate These data points.

1:40:10Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd again, I'm not, I'm not trying to throw the thing under the bus. All I'm trying to say is that the reality of the situation is, is that the sensitivity of that detection is going to have its limits and it's only going to be good down to, I don't know, say like 0.1 or 0.2%. I think if you go down below that, I think this thing is 0.1.

1:40:32SpeakerYou're correct. 0.1. 0.1.

1:40:33Dr Mark ScialdoneOkay.

1:40:36BubblemanOK, well, it's not a proton NMR, but it does get like hold in your hand. And the idea is a lot of I'm excited to go to Canara and show us some like the macronutrients in his flowering plants and what's missing. What? Because when he sees that, he's going to be like, dude, that is that's insane.

1:40:55Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, I mean, there's a lot of power to that. It's giving you a water activity measurement. I mean, I need to do... Just in flour, just in flour.

1:41:03BubblemanIn extracts, it gives really like cannabinoid contents. That's pretty much what you get for extracts, whether you put oil in. He tested like BHO the other day. He tested like blocks of hash that he just like... Preston, the guy, the guy gave him a black hash. He said, this is 40%. He was an older dude and he put it in the machine. And like a minute later, it spit out like 39.2 or something.

1:41:31BubblemanAnd the guy was like, yeah, that's, that's, that's exactly what it is.

1:41:36Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, it would be interesting, like on an analytical reference standard, like something like for THCA, so you know it's like 99.9999% pure. What does the reading come back on that? You know, like how do the certified reference standards stack up to the data that the machine gets? It'd be just interesting to look at that, see how they correlate. Do you hear that question? I would assume at high concentrations, they'll correlate nicely.

1:42:07Dr Mark ScialdoneBut at the lower concentrations, you might deviate from linearity a little bit.

1:42:13Collin PalmerYeah, it definitely reminds me of early days of audio.

1:42:17BubblemanTake it, take it. Any other? Oh, is it on mute? Yeah. No, it's not on mute. We're good. We're good. You have to talk a little louder.

1:42:30Collin PalmerWe can't hear you guys. If you could talk a little louder.

1:42:32Etienne FontanA little louder, guys. We're trying. Can you hear me? Can you hear me now? Yes. Loud, clear. Leave it, Charlie.

1:42:43BubblemanOkay, okay. I can't tell if I talk into my phone. My wife's car has taken the audio, and because I'm on Zoom on my phone, I'm like a 90-year-old man. I have no fucking idea how to disconnect it from the car. It's awesome. Really stoked on that, actually.

1:43:01SpeakerIf you go in your settings and disconnect that.

1:43:03BubblemanOh, here we go. I found it. Here we go. I found it. All right. Here, I'll pass it over to Ruben and he can say what he was saying.

1:43:10Dr Mark ScialdoneIs that Bubble Mom I hear?

1:43:11BubblemanYeah, that's Bubble Mom.

1:43:13Dr Mark ScialdoneHi, Bubble Mom.

1:43:15SpeakerHello. Hi, Bubble Ma'am.

1:43:19SpeakerSo coming back to the question, Dr. Mark, I see you know really well how it works there because you are asking the questions, the more difficult ones, which are the ones that I really love. So once we start trying to have the validation in the GMP process, as you said, we should have samples to be sure that the calibration is done properly so the lines are aligned with the proper measurements.

1:43:44SpeakerBasically, all the units, once they are Thank you very much.

1:44:05SpeakerIf in any case we would need to have a GMP validation by this unit, we would need to have what you said. That is actually to have a reference every six months to be sure that we are aligned. All the tests that we have been doing during the last few years, it's super constant. It's really, really on that way. In any case, what I always ask to companies that are getting this technology is that we align with their lab.

1:44:29SpeakerAs you know, many of the labs, they have differences. It depends which is working, how you dilute it, Thank you so much for joining us.

1:45:00Dr Mark ScialdoneLike with HPLC, I mean, one of the, one of the short, well, I won't say the shortcoming, but, you know, an issue with HPLC. So HPLC, unlike this method, is separating out the individual components to quantitate them. So in the cases where you have difficult to separate isomers of THC, would this be So I'm like, can you tell the difference between Delta 9 and Delta 8 THC with this instrument?

1:45:36SpeakerWow. And this is the third more difficult question. Isomers. That's a super good question. NIR cannot differentiate isomers. Actually, we were talking yesterday with Bob Oman in a problem we had in Europe due to the fact that HHC was all around. And then suddenly we were seeing flowers of 11% of CBD, 20% THC. I was like, yet? That's not possible. Then actually we cannot differentiate isomers with NIR.

1:46:09SpeakerThat's a reality.

1:46:11Dr Mark ScialdoneOkay. Well, that's good to know. But maybe one of the things that you can look for is... Not just the ring isomers between Delta 8 and Delta 9, but maybe like some of these non-natural isomers like the Iso Delta 8, Iso Delta 4 8. I mean, those are completely different ring structures altogether. And maybe the instrument can discern between those non-natural isomers, the Iso isomers and

1:46:42SpeakerYeah, yeah, exactly. The non-naturals like the Nano 9, the new Nano 9 that we are seeing in Europe, we don't identify it as THC, which is so good. And yeah, it depends on each of the components. But yeah, luckily, the non-naturals, we are actually able to differentiate them, unless the HHC, which is an isomer of the THC. And It's so similar that the absorption is so, so similar than the THC.

1:47:10SpeakerBut THC is not that famous anymore. Actually, it's banned in Europe, so hopefully we'll not see it that much anymore.

1:47:15Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, I mean, again, HHC is not an isomer of THC, right? HHC is hydrogenated THC, so they're not isomers. They're different compounds altogether.

1:47:27SpeakerRight. You are right. Yes, yes. But they're very similar. Just similar. Yeah, exactly. Being that similar to that, that was difficult to differentiate. But in any case, the Nano 9, for example, not at all.

1:47:41Dr Mark ScialdoneNano 9. What is Nano 9?

1:47:44SpeakerOh, bro. Like, you know, like they van HHC and suddenly the next day it laps. They already have like three or four different synthetic THCs that are putting into the CBD flowers to be able to sell it because we don't have regulations or... It's only Germany right now having a regulation and it's not regulated. It's just decriminalized. So, as I said before, I wish that Europe will have the situation that you have here in Canada.

1:48:10SpeakerAnd I'm sure our quality wheat has instructions that are going to be way better once we will have this kind of regulation. But at least this is my thing. I don't know.

1:48:18Dr Mark ScialdoneLet's see. 909. I got to look that one up.

1:48:26Dr Mark ScialdoneIs that what it's called? It's called Nano 9? Yes.

1:48:29BubblemanI'm sure. I'm sure. Yeah. If you can't find it, I'll have Ruben send you like a link.

1:48:36Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah. I wonder what it is. Is it a phytocannabinoid or a derivative? I suspect it's a synthetic.

1:48:42BubblemanYeah, synthetic. Some spice.

1:48:47SpeakerI will actually send you the list of the people that give me all the new ones, if you want, so you can have a look.

1:48:52BubblemanOh yeah, yeah, he gets a list all the time of all the new ones that are popping up. Like he said, right, his country's a mess, there's no regulation, and people are just like, the minute one gets illegal, like an hour later they have six new ones that they're manufacturing by the ton to fucking dose the CBD flower to sell to the people. Oh my god.

1:49:12Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's crazy, right?

1:49:14BubblemanWell, it's actually, I would go as far to say that that's actually super fucked up.

1:49:24BubblemanI mean, holy Christ. Plus, who even knows what these molecules are doing? It's completely unethical.

1:49:35Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, when you said the spice compound, that's a completely non-phytocannabinoid synthetic that just has a super high potency for the CB1 receptor, right? It's a full-on agonist as opposed to just being a partial agonist. So that's the compound where people end up in the emergency room and

1:49:57BubblemanYeah, well, that was what the weight loss drug there, Robonibon. There's a whole bunch of other ones. They're full antagonists. Those are bad news, man. I think that was 2008. Dr. Allen and I did a show on Robonibon and how they had to stop it because people were, you know, it was bad. Suicidal ideation was definitely one of the big ones.

1:50:21Etienne FontanWell, three of the people committed suicide. That was kind of a big thing. So, yeah, we did a cross study in the master class because it was a study in cannabinoid and using a cannabinoid, which they thought would be beneficial, right? And when they blocked that particular receptor, it had detrimental results, right? And yeah, well, you're blocking homeostasis. Yes, absolutely. Shutting, literally blocking it completely and literally driving people insane.

1:50:51Etienne FontanI mean, it is a shame. And it was a weight loss drug, people.

1:50:55BubblemanYeah, that's exactly it.

1:50:55Etienne FontanIt was a weight loss drug. Holy shit.

1:50:59SpeakerWhat a crazy world we live in, man.

1:51:00BubblemanYeah. So anyone that wants to check it out, Dr. David Allen and I did a show on this. I think it's Cannabis Journal Volume... Eight or nine. It's one of the most recent shows we did. You can go check that out. And hopefully we're going to get Dr. Mark on there for an episode here soon. He's a little bit busier. It's just lucky that we're all available on Sunday morning, even though I suspect it's not Sunday morning for you, Storm.

1:51:28DrNo, no, it is far from Sunday. It's 8 o'clock Sunday night.

1:51:36BubblemanOkay, okay. It's not too bad. A little bit of a time difference there. Well, it's only 10 to 11 a.m. here in Vancouver, and I'm driving through the cosplay of Stanley Park.

1:51:51DrWow, that's spectacular, eh, York?

1:51:53BubblemanYeah, it's pretty wicked. Nice trees. Before you get to Vancouver, you drive through a park the size of downtown Vancouver.

1:52:08BubblemanQuite lovely. Quite lovely. What else is going on in the world of church and hash and all of these wonderful folks that are on the... Tam, we haven't really heard from you in a while. You went away on a boat cruise and I apologize because you came in on a hammock. It was just your feet and the background of your view. And I tried to sort of be like, hey, a chance on a boat.

1:52:33BubblemanAnd then, I don't know, I think we were in some deep conversation with Ryan and Dr. Mark. We didn't acknowledge you and I apologize for that.

1:52:42Etienne FontanOh, no, no, no stress. I was on vacation. I was gifted a cross Atlantic cruise. So I went from Miami to Barcelona with stops in the Canary Islands. I went to Morocco, which was fantastic. Fucking crazy. But I did get, I did get, I had a Sebsi glass piece that I had made years ago. Sebsi pipe is a traditional Moroccan pipe for smoking keef. It usually comes with these small clay pieces and the pipes are usually, they're two pieces and they fit into a bag and that's how people travel with them.

1:53:22Etienne FontanAnd it's used for, you know, it's a very small head. So it's used specifically for Keef. And when I was there, I was able to get one, a two-piece and a three-piece. Last ones I had gotten were in the Amsterdam. So it was, I figured, hey, if I could get something cool while in Morocco. But yeah, I went to Casablanca and then I went to Marrakesh. The gardens in Marrakesh, fucking amazing.

1:53:51Etienne FontanAnd then Barcelona, I was at La Crema Garcia. I was hoping to broadcast from there, but it was the Rob Clark Church. But I would love to at some point have Stefan on. Because his shop in Barcelona is to me a Mecca for anybody in cannabis because of the cannabis history from Mossy Giant that's completely projected on the walls. Amazing. Love Mossy. And then I spent three days in Lisbon, which was trippy because for people who aren't aware or who are aware, Portugal legalized all drugs, small amounts.

1:54:36Etienne FontanAnd there's no distribution points or spots. Lots of street dealers, lots of outdoor cannabis, more coke offers than I could possibly. I don't do white drugs except for CBD occasionally. So yeah it was a trip to see such an advanced culture around drugs have no distribution access points still so that was rather fascinating but there was a I guess a hemp expo that happened the weekend before I got there but I was surprised by Lisbon but Yeah, I was not wanting.

1:55:17Etienne FontanI was good. Thank you, Puffco. Things worked very well. And I highly recommend Virgin Cruises. There's no kids. So, holy shit, it was fucking sweet. So, I needed the R&R, and it was great to get away, but I missed y'all. I did pop up on the boat, but I was about to nap out because they have hammocks. On all the balconies. So it's wonderful to kind of chill in a balcony.

1:55:45Etienne FontanI mean, on a hammock. So yeah, when I checked in, I was about to nap out and I was napping out. So I switched out and kind of went on my way. But missed y'all. Happy to be back. It was fascinating to see, of course, great hash at La Crema Garcia. They have amazing rosins. And so it was rather surprising that there are no coffee shops or gathering spots, you know, like I've seen in Canada.

1:56:16Etienne FontanI've seen in other in the United States, you know, we BPG had, you know, on-site consumption. So I... I would hope something like that is happening and maybe I didn't find it in particularly there but I asked a lot of people including locals and nobody seems to really have you know it's it's mostly street dealers and street access so Rather surprising. So it's always fun to go into different countries and understand their drug cultures.

1:56:44Etienne FontanBe careful while doing so, people. Don't expose yourself or put yourself in any dangers. But it's always fascinating to see what's happening compared to what we've done stateside. I've been invited to South Africa and I will be there in October for an event there. So I'll be fascinated to see and meet you Storm as well as to see the South African scene as well as because the first cannabis I ever grew back in 1989 was Durban Poison.

1:57:14Etienne FontanSo I have a special affinity in my soul for South African cannabis and I look forward to trying the real deal in the real place.

1:57:24DrListen, yeah, I'm I mean, we'd love, yeah, we're looking, really looking forward to meet you, man. Yeah, we've got some amazing breeders. We've got some amazing hash makers. There's really some incredible stuff going on. And given our climate, you know, the African sun is quite a powerful thing. So we can grow some trees when we grow full term outdoor greenhouse. So yeah, looking forward to meeting you, man.

1:57:58Etienne FontanYeah, I've heard great things from Myrtle and everything that's happening there as well as we've also seen the hiccup recently by the government there in South Africa. They were trying to make edibles and other things illegal and fortunately there was enough of a rise up by the peoples to shut that down. But unfortunately the same shenanigans that happen in our countries happen in South Africa too. Thank you for watching.

1:58:44Etienne Fontandoing what they've done lazily in the past which is have state store model which for those that aren't aware alcohol that is high or even low alcohol used to only be available in the state stores in Pennsylvania which means you could not go to a store you could go to a bar but you could not go to a store and buy certain access points of liquor so the state of Pennsylvania tried to hijack Basically the enforced through a finally allowing adult use but only through the state store model and fortunately that was shut down.

1:59:22Etienne FontanBut again, it takes, you know, people being aware of what's happening and being active. One of my friends, Tony Landry, he's down there in Louisiana doing a really pushing for access for medical marijuana, especially for veterans. And they seized his phone because they're actually broadcasting legally those proceedings there for the state. But somebody didn't like him recording their conversations. And they took his phone. And so he's in the midst of suing the state of Louisiana over access to just being there so that others could see what's going on, which is legal.

2:00:02Etienne FontanSo there's oppression happening around cannabis as well as shenanigans all the time. So wherever you are, you know, be aware of what's happening around you. Don't check out. You have to be aware. Otherwise, you're going to be subject to, you know, the realities that are happening. So I'm glad, Dr. Mark, that things changed in Pennsylvania and That, you know, people are waking up to those types of shenanigans, but those legislatures are still trying to, you know, manipulate the scenes.

2:00:33Etienne FontanSo, you know, be aware, be alert. The world needs more alerts, as we used to say.

2:00:37Dr Mark ScialdoneSo you're absolutely right. But I moved from Pennsylvania back in 2022. I'm in Vermont now. Yeah. So I don't have to worry about it. But Yeah, what I can tell you down in Pennsylvania, you know, Pennsylvania has a rich history in cannabis and hemp and certainly was one of the states that, you know, moved their medical program forward quickly. This was back in 2014. They moved their hemp program forward.

2:01:10Dr Mark ScialdoneBut yeah, it seems as though the

2:01:15Dr Mark ScialdoneGOP holds the house and the senate there and they could never kind of come up with a good good bill that basically i mean the the commonwealth wants it people want legal cannabis and you know it's even more disappointing i mean here in vermont and other places like maine i mean cannabis has been legislated over the gold line in some of these states 18 but Even though like states have voted for adult use, The programs haven't been initiated and haven't gone forward.

2:01:52Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd really patients don't have any more enhanced access now than before the states voted for adult use. It's super frustrating. And yet in Pennsylvania, they have the state run liquor stores, you know, and yeah, there's a lot of people who make money in controlling access to liquor in Pennsylvania. And where we live, we were right on the, We have a state run liquor stores. That doesn't mean that that's a good spot to put cannabis dispensaries.

2:02:22Dr Mark ScialdoneIn fact, ATN is there an example where state run liquor stores

2:02:41Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd then putting dispensaries in have actually worked, right? I don't think that model.

2:02:46SpeakerWell, you know what happened in Washington was the, sorry, there's a little bit of an echo. But Washington was, in Colorado, we're one of the first two to come online, you know, at the same time. And what folks may not know is that a few years prior to cannabis coming on, Washington had state-run liquor stores. And that was voter removed. And so we had a liquor control board that had a lot of job vacancies.

2:03:14SpeakerAnd so when cannabis came online, it made sense to the to the government to give that new task to cannabis. No one had ever done this before. Right. There was no model like Colorado and Oregon came or Colorado and Washington got voted in the same year. And so that was just to just to point out that that was the beginning of where other states, when they would come online, they would look to Washington's model and Colorado's model and pick and choose what they liked.

2:03:42SpeakerAnd a lot of states followed Washington's model where they they brought in these these liquor control board agents and made them become the new cannabis. And now they now call it the liquor cannabis sport. You know, and there's now there's a new trend. Thankfully, you know, Minnesota New York and other states have their own state cannabis board, which I appreciate because there is a drastic difference. I've held medical licenses, hemp licenses, and recreational cannabis license in Washington.

2:04:18SpeakerAnd dealing with the ag folks on the hemp side of things, it's totally different. They're there to help you. They say, hey, do this, do this. Make sure you fill this out. Don't do this. You know, they give you the make sure you don't do this. Make sure you do it this way. They're not they're not trying to trick you or to catch you where it feels the opposite with the recreational thing.

2:04:41SpeakerAnd I think it's because of the nature of where where they come from and that You know, my only experience, again, is Washington and Minnesota. But just to kind of comment on how shit just happens, you know, just remembering that, you know.

2:05:01Etienne FontanNo, we follow the same thing in California. You know, they hired in alcohol people to, you know, oversee because they felt that they had regulated. And of course, we have the distribution, right, set up and system, which is what they came from. So they went lazily and easily and went that direction and inadvertently. The law, I mean, California, I can only speak for, you know, we had it split into three different agencies that were finally consolidated back into one to oversee, and they're still rolling that shit out here in California.

2:05:33Etienne FontanSo, yeah, it's a cluster. So, you know, other states and countries can learn from our mistakes as well as from our foibles and, you know, seeing like the successes like New York and then taking up that mantle and doing things in a more proper professional way.

2:05:51SpeakerWhat's interesting in Washington, maybe the last year or so, they just started finishing the original license applications from 10 years ago. They had an open application period for 30 days. And it took them almost 10 years to work through every single last one of them. And there was about 1,300, 1,500 applications in Washington state and in Minnesota where the population is just about the same. But in Minnesota, there is about 4,000 applications.

2:06:30SpeakerAnd I just saw an ad where they're advertised for jobs for enforcement agents to come and do inspections. And I'm like, oh Lord, they haven't even hired the inspectors, you know? And we're all sitting here having paid our application fee, you know, it's May and in May, almost June, we're waiting going, when can we plant our weed? You know, and they haven't even hired the inspectors yet.

2:06:54SpeakerJust like, fuck dude, you can't even like, no wonder you haven't got back to me. I don't know. I don't know why we're going down this road. It's not a happy road to go down. Let's turn it around.

2:07:09Etienne FontanIt's a word of caution for people.

2:07:13Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I think just because you know how to regulate alcohol doesn't mean that an organization knows how to regulate cannabis. You know, I think that was the lesson that we learned from Washington, right, Dutch? I mean, I think that, you know, when they when they take people who are regulating alcohol and say, oh, OK, you're going to be on the cannabis control board. It's just a completely different thing, right?

2:07:40Dr Mark ScialdoneBecause there's no 280E

2:07:43Dr Mark ScialdoneThere's no, you don't have chain of custody issues with alcohol that you do with cannabis, right? And so, like, I don't think that one size fits all. Oh, it's a vice that gets people fucked up. Therefore, these people who regulate alcohol know what the hell to do. The thing in Minnesota Dutch that, you know, again, like, If you just look at trends on what's going on, you know, like the beverage play in Minnesota has really changed the game.

2:08:23Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd in fact, I wanted to shout out Hawaii Sustainable in the chat, who basically said that that Nano 9 is nothing more than nano emulsified D9. It's probably hemp derived D9 too, I would imagine. So, but yeah, I mean, that whole taking advantage of the fact that, so liquor and alcohol has got these distribution networks and supply chains, right? And so instantly, Right. When when Minnesota turned that thing on, now you can go to a party store or a liquor store and buy THC infused beverages.

2:09:09Dr Mark ScialdoneRight. Which gas station.

2:09:11SpeakerYeah.

2:09:12Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd the bar, you know, which is like like so just to go back to 18 was talking about Pennsylvania. So in Pennsylvania, if they were creative enough there, The beverages would go into these state run stores, right? And so like, so I think Pennsylvania was truly interested in getting those state run liquor stores involved in the cannabis market. Doesn't it make sense to start with cannabis based beverages, right?

2:09:44Dr Mark ScialdoneSo do what they did in Minnesota and other states now. So To big beverage, you know, cannabis is just, or, you know, nano emulsion, you know, if we want to just talk about nano emulsion, it's just a freaking ingredient, right? That's an ingredient. So they're already using different flavors, different sugars, different, different, you know, you know, sugar substitutes and all that. So to big beverage, it's like, oh, okay.

2:10:13Dr Mark ScialdoneSo now the state regulation says that we could have THC containing beverages in liquor stores. And you could see these liquor stores, right? You go to Total Wine, there's a whole display of like 50 different brands of cannabis drinks, right?

2:10:30SpeakerIt's more than the beer.

2:10:33Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, it's crazy. And so the trend in the market, from what I understand, I don't believe everything I read on the Internet, but I believe some of it is that actually there's double digit growth in the cannabis market. Sector in the cannabis beverage sectors where it's been kind of like flatline for for alcohol for years. And if anything, now they're starting to see those those numbers go down.

2:11:01Dr Mark ScialdoneSo alcohol consumption is going down. Cannabis beverage consumption is going up. I think that's in part due to these states like Minnesota that have progressive laws. But what it's also due in part to is the fact that, you know, Five or six years ago, there were a bunch of beverages on the market and they all tasted like shit. And they all lost their potency inside the can.

2:11:29Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, right. So like inside the can itself, basically you could put, you know, I don't know, Dr. Justin Marchegiani, MD, PhD, PhD, PhD, PhD, PhD, PhD, PhD

2:11:56Dr Mark ScialdoneThere's been a couple of companies that have figured this out. So not only can they make a stable nano emulsion that holds its potency, but now they can actually make one that actually tastes good. Or let me put it this way. It tastes neutral, right? So about four or five years ago, if you were using things like polysorbate and other Gross, you know, food-based synthetic emulsifiers. Yeah, your cannabis beverages tasted like, you know, Listerine.

2:12:27Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd I'm not talking about You know, the new Lister Mint, which is, you know, green and blue inside the bottle. I'm talking about the old Listerine that was piss colored and tasted like piss too, right? It just had a really kind of like medicinal kind of phenol kind of flavor to it, right? Tasted like Cepacol, right? Which is the stuff you take when you have a sore throat, right?

2:12:51Dr Mark ScialdoneIt almost like would So now they've kind of figured out how to use natural sweeteners and other natural ingredients to basically make nano emulsions that are stable and that taste good. So now for big beverage, this is a no brainer, right? Because for them, it's just another freaking ingredient. Right. It's just it's like adding a flavor. It's like, oh, you want to make these contain THC? Great.

2:13:29Dr Mark ScialdoneNow with the hemp derived things. So think about this for a second. They could bring CBD into the front end of the building, right? Or the back door. It doesn't make a difference as long as it's inside the building. Now they can chemically convert that into THC and now make natto emulsion and dilute it back down. Or just THCA. Well, when you're just like a 10 milligram in a 12 ounce can, 10 milligrams in a 12 ounce can, that turns out to be 0.028% THC.

2:14:06Dr Mark ScialdoneSo you're an order of magnitude lower than the threshold for hemp. And still in that 10 milligram beverage, even a THC user like most of us on the panel here, I'm telling you, I could feel the effects of nano emulsified THC when I'm halfway through a 10 milligram can. So what that says is that the nano emulsified form of THC is much more bioavailable.

2:14:37SpeakerIt's much more bioavailable and it doesn't wallop you in the head. What we're used to is like these higher potency things that once they kick in, they wallop you in the head. I didn't understand this when I moved here. Driving here, I was joking and I was like, this is going to be a Thank you for joining us.

2:15:17SpeakerBecause it comes on and doesn't wallop you, the average person can take it and they're like, oh, that feels good. And then they have another one, you know? And next thing you know, they're like waking up, they're like, man, I haven't slept that good in decades. And then they go, and I'm happy and I don't wake up with a hangover. And now they're like, that's what they're doing.

2:15:36SpeakerYou know, they're like, Skipping the beer, skipping the other stuff, you know, and it's been such a, and it's also like so palatable to the new consumer. Right. Who doesn't like the smell, is thinking of, you know, burning pipes and everything that you might, We're not a user. You're like, you can have a lemon lime drink that's low potency and I can just dip a toe into this water and see if I like this.

2:16:01SpeakerAnd they do.

2:16:03Dr Mark ScialdoneAt 10 milligrams, you're so dilute with the other components that you can barely taste them. It barely leaves like a bitter aftertaste or anything like that. And that's the that's the best thing for beverages is no aftertaste, no bitterness, no. Sometimes you can feel almost like a chalky feel inside your your your mouth, like You could feel that there's something in there, right? But I think that what happens too, I don't have any data on this, is that you get absorption of the nano emulsion in the oral mucosa and it doesn't go down into your stomach.

2:16:43Dr Mark ScialdoneLike if you're drinking the beverage, it's going to get absorbed into your oral mucosa, which if you think about it, is going to put it in the bloodstream in advance to being oxidized by the liver. And now you're in the bloodstream in the vicinity of your brain. So yeah, there is, you know, the notion that you're going to get a rapid onset of activity that you wouldn't normally get if you just took like a tincture or something like that.

2:17:10Dr Mark ScialdoneThe other thing like with gummies is that, you know, people tend to, you know, not suck on the gummy, just tend to eat it right away because it just tastes so good. And now that goes down into your gut and everything. And you might take a couple gummies. Oh, I don't feel anything. Take a couple more. Oh, I don't feel anything. You know, an hour later or two later, you're feeling like you got to take tomorrow off of work because you just got this incredible body high.

2:17:38Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd it makes sense, right? Because After this stuff gets digested in your stomach, then it goes into your liver and it gets oxidized in the liver. And now you're probably not going to get across the blood brain barrier, but what you're going to do is you're going to titrate your peripheral endocannabinoid system, which are your CB2 receptors that all throughout your body. Thank you for watching.

2:18:25Dr Mark ScialdoneIn one of those nano emulsion beverages. So I don't know. That's my experience.

2:18:30SpeakerNo, it's cool. And like I, I can drink a little bit more. You know, I have a pretty high threshold. So but I was going to say that's cool about it is because it is so acceptable and it's just a can. And it doesn't like have any skull and crossbones or anything scary on it. You know what I mean? You could take it to. Whatever event, pretty much, you know, family gathering, picnic, even places where beer isn't acceptable.

2:18:58SpeakerYou can bring these and like for someone like myself that needs to consume, you know, every couple hours to feel good, to go to a four hour picnic or whatever and not be able to smoke can sometimes be a drag at the end, you know, or I'm wanting to leave just because I need to smoke and, you know, These things just kind of, they do the trick in a way that I haven't experienced with edibles before.

2:19:21SpeakerUsually when I have 100 milligrams, 50 milligrams, 200 milligrams, I'm wanting to smoke. I'm in a different world. You know, this can kind of, Thank you so much for joining us today. We're going to get started in about a minute or so.

2:20:00SpeakerThank you for joining us.

2:20:22SpeakerBut these things that I'm trying are like, holy shit, this tastes like I'm drinking weed, man, in a really good way. Not in the green, nasty, bitter way, but like in the complexity of when you're like, holy fuck, what are these flavors? Like I was... I have been very thoroughly impressed by a few companies. I'll shout out this distillery who has just taken what I think is the lead in quality.

2:20:49SpeakerThey're Earl Giles in Minneapolis, and they do a sesh every Wednesday. You can go down there, and they have an upstairs. They have a distillery with alcohol, but they have an upstairs bar that's only THC, and they let you smoke on the porch, too, with a patio outside. And it's really dope. And these guys are making some incredible cannabis flavors. And so you kind of get closer to that entourage effect.

2:21:15SpeakerI mean, it's not really the whole deal. You know what I mean? It's not going to replace smoking for me, but it It's pretty damn cool. And I think that it's nice because as someone who really enjoys the flavor of cannabis, especially fresh, to be able to share that with people who don't necessarily get to see it, you know, it's really cool. You know what I mean?

2:21:39SpeakerLike even my parents who, you know, see my farm on many occasions, they're always impressed with the fresh cannabis. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:22:11DrNano emulsions, they use an ultrasonic emulsifier. So they just put the oil and the water together and blast it with the ultrasonic and it emulsifies. Fortunately, you don't get any of that.

2:22:29Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, that's one way of doing it. You could use a sonication. There's a couple of different ways of doing it. You could build a nanoparticle around the oil droplets once they're emulsified.

2:22:48Dr Mark ScialdoneBig Beverage uses mostly what's called a microfluidizer, which is basically just a, you're sending 12 lanes of traffic through a two-lane tunnel, so it forces particles to be small. There's a variety of different ways you could do it. You know, the other cool thing that you see all the time, you know, Well, you see this fast acting gummies, right? Have you seen this? So what they're using is they're using the nanoemulsion, which is a liquid.

2:23:24Dr Mark ScialdoneSo when you think of nanoemulsion, think of like milk, dairy milk, perfect example, because dairy milk is emulsified fat in a continuous layer of water. So when you take nanoemulsion and now add it to the gummy cook right away, You're above the boiling point of water. So all the water boils away. But what happens is those nano drop. So let's talk about the, so the nano emulsion itself.

2:23:52Dr Mark ScialdoneLet's, let's talk about this for a second. So, so what you're doing is, so we all know that cannabinoids aren't soluble in water, right? You ever tried cleaning your bong out with water? Doesn't work too well, right? Right. So you basically have to, have to take, Your cannabinoids and put them into. So cannabinoids are what a formulation chemist would call a hard oil. So when you look at distillate, you know, distillate is not it's not a soft oil.

2:24:24Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's a hard oil. You have to basically dissolve the hard oil in a soft oil. So typically what we would do is we would take our cannabinoid input, whether it's CBD or THC, distillate or liquid diamonds, whatever it is. And you take that oil and you dissolve it up in something like MCT. MCT is an acronym for medium chain triglycerides, which is basically just fractionated coconut oil.

2:24:53Dr Mark ScialdoneTypically MCT, the one you use is the liquid form. So coconut oil is a low melting oil, naturally occurring oil. And if you fractionate the liquid portion from the solid portion, that becomes what we call MCT, right? So you could take MCT, which is a great oil vehicle for cannabis, or you could use sunflower oil, soybean oil. I wouldn't advise it, but you could use canola oil, olive oil, other cooking oils, edible oils, right?

2:25:26Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd what you do is you add those oils To a rapidly stirring water solution, right? So normally, like if you just add oil to water, like an oil and vinegar, you're going to separate, right? Because the oil is not water soluble, so the oil stays on the top. But when you're making nano emulsion, what you're doing is you're spinning at a very, very high shear rate. So when those oil droplets hit the water, they're immediately going to emulsify because you have to have your emulsifiers in that solution.

2:26:05Dr Mark ScialdoneSo with my recipe, the one that I use, I have both an emulsifier in the oil phase. So typically what we use is we use sunflower lecithin. Lecithin is a naturally occurring emulsifier that's in plants and plants. People use it a lot to emulsify oil so what we also do is we have emulsifiers in the aqueous layer so when we're adding the oil or actually what we do is we actually add the water to the oil and we stir it so what happens is when you stir it it makes a very small droplet of oil Thank you for watching.

2:27:08Dr Mark ScialdoneThe emulsion is going to look white like milk. So notice how you can't see through milk, right? Milk is an oil and water emulsion. And in fact, butter is just the opposite. Butter is a water and oil emulsion. So when you melt butter, you can see through the fat layer. You can see through the water layer. But when they mix right at room temperature or when they get cold, They scatter light.

2:27:36Dr Mark ScialdoneSo what happens is the emulsifier keeps the oil droplets emulsified because it keeps the oil droplets from talking to one another. If the oil droplets talk to one another, they'd separate out and make a second oil phase, right? Like oil and vinegar, right? So like think of the creamy Italian, you're emulsifying The oil and the water layer by having egg yolk in there as the emulsifier. So you're able to emulsify the two layers together and make, again, just an emulsion, which looks like milk.

2:28:15Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd now when you drop that into your bright tank to go to make a beverage, yeah, it's going to look basically cloudy because it's basically a dispersion, a particle dispersion. But the cool thing is, is when you put that into your gummy mix, you boil off the water and now those oil droplets stay nano emulsified within the matrix of sugar. So now your oil and water emulsion is now oil and sugar emulsion.

2:28:44Dr Mark ScialdoneThank you for watching.

2:29:06Dr Mark ScialdoneProbably about five or 10 minutes, you could feel a psychoactivity come on from those fast acting gummies. So it's kind of cool.

2:29:18Collin PalmerYeah, no, it's good stuff. And it's, I think it's definitely chemistry, Colin. Yeah, I mean, it's at its finest, right? I mean, I think that's, that's what, you know, we've all been chasing in terms of just edibles and experience in terms of that type of delivery. And all the way to drinks. I think, you know, there's a there's a huge world to explore there that's kind of unfolding.

2:29:41Collin PalmerAnd as you pointed out, there's you know, there's a lot of people already paving the way here.

2:29:46Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, you would think that 10 milligrams would work on someone like us. You'd like, hey, give me 100. But man, I would be scared to actually drink 100 milligram nano emulsified beverage that that would give me too fucked up. At least me. I don't know. Maybe other people want to go there.

2:30:08Collin PalmerYeah, I mean, it's going back to the taste and the flavor masking. I think Dutch, you brought it up. There's a lot of that going on with bad emulsifiers and, you know, it's either peppery or too acidic. You know, a lot of the case, I think a lot of that's a lot of what I hear is the acidity. So it's hard to formulate around and make something taste actually great.

2:30:30Collin PalmerYou know, you can't use like really naturally occurring flavors because you need flavor maskers to get, you know, even even the most simple ingredient in there to make it taste good.

2:30:41Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, they sell something called Bitter Block, which I think if you're using some of these older based like polysorbate type emulsifier. So polysorbate, yeah, well, you could make a good nano emulsion that's stable, but it's got that medicinal, you know, like when you drink it, you're like, oh man, is this medicine? It tastes like medicine, right?

2:31:06Collin PalmerYeah, right. It's like that familiar taste that we remember as children taking, insert here, whatever.

2:31:13Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, like cherry flavored antibiotic or something, you know?

2:31:18Collin PalmerYeah, but I think we are way beyond that. You know, I know there's a guy I work with has a manufacturing facility in Eugene, Oregon, and he's using stuff from the pharmaceutical industry that's way outside of the cannabis industry as an emulsifier. And it's it's starting to really, you know, he's starting to figure it out. It doesn't. I think we're starting to get there in terms of taste and just the ability to make the form factor taste good.

2:31:47Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, you know, a lot of those specialty ingredients for beverages come from China and Asia. So I don't know if they're going to be impacted by the tariffs and the trade war that's happening, but certainly availability of those things, a lot of those emulsifiers, the sucrose esters and whatnot, you got to buy in 20 kilogram bags at a time. And yeah, you're buying them from some guy over in Singapore.

2:32:14Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, it's like...

2:32:16Collin PalmerYou know, yeah, no, there's a lot to, you know, as you point out, there's a lot to still kind of figure out with all this, but it's. It's at least it's I think it's in the right people's hands right now. I think, you know, as my my buddy Adam said, I think a lot of the riffraff is starting to go away. And a lot of the people that want to be here and have been here are sticking around.

2:32:39Collin PalmerAnd as a result, the products are starting to get better.

2:32:42Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, yeah, well, it certainly tastes better. And I can tell you that they're definitely active and they don't. I don't, there's no weed flavor in there at all. So there's really no, the nano emulsion isn't bringing any flavor at all. So again, this probably is one of the reasons why the hemp derived version to make THC, which again is really cheap. And is not going to have.

2:33:12Dr Mark ScialdoneSo when you when you extract cannabis and you turn it into a distillate, you're bringing over all those planty distillate flavors. You know, if the distillates not or the precursor to your distillate isn't properly winterized, you'll get that that burnt rubber condom kind of smell. I don't know if you know that smell, but there's kind of like a A rubber smell, kind of like a condom smell that you can get to distill it.

2:33:42Dr Mark ScialdoneSo the beautiful thing about this, I mean, think about it now. Also, those nano emotions, Colin, nano emotion is like fucking 80% water, right? It's mostly water. So, I mean, when your inputs are mostly water, first of all, they're cheap, right? And so you're, yeah, I mean, that's one of the powerful value propositions of beverages themselves. When you buy a beverage, most of what's in there is water, right?

2:34:22DrTrue.

2:34:23Dr Mark ScialdoneWater with 10 milligrams of THC and some other wiffle dust in there to keep it from settling out and tasting good and looking good.

2:34:31Collin PalmerYeah.

2:34:32Dr Mark ScialdoneSo the margins on beverages are huge, right? Plus, if you're making your THC from the hemp derived thing, now your input is cheap as CBD at 350 a kilo, right? So you could be below a dollar a gram in your active ingredient formulation for that. So that just makes a really good Value proposition in terms of margin because your sales price isn't going to be dictated by your starting material costs.

2:35:12Collin PalmerWell, yeah, I mean, material costs, but I, yeah, I agree with that. I think there's some other things that bring the cost, you know, from what I know, at least at scale, it's why only doing a big launch with the brand makes sense in cannabis right now, because the cost of the pallet is still, you know, I think you're still making like 75 cents a can, right, when it's all said and done.

2:35:36Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, and once you've paid for the canning facility itself or the canning line, you know, canning lines can easily be upwards to half a million or $5 million, depending on what your productivity of how many cans a minute you want to make. But, you know, ultimately those machines end up paying for themselves, but you end up having, again, underneath one roof, Everything that you need, right? So if you're chemically converting your CBD into THC, then you're making nano emulsion, then you're putting that nano emulsion into a can.

2:36:15Dr Mark ScialdoneThat's all underneath one roof, right? And you're not, there's no regulation there at all because you're bringing CBD into building and what leaves the building is a can of seltzer that's 0.028% THC.

2:36:32Collin PalmerYeah. Yeah. I mean, some people are owning their lines. I mean, I know in their state regulated systems, they are. In other cases, they're just white labeling and using a co-manufacturer. And I know that like a co-manufacturer is just a little more expensive than.

2:36:45Dr Mark ScialdoneThe problem with the co-manufacturer though, Colin, is that now if you're doing that chemical conversion of CBD to THC, now that THC has got to leave the building, right? Right. So they would.

2:36:59Collin PalmerYeah, there's complexities behind that, I think. Yeah. But like, you know, for instance, the my part of my my buddy Adam partner, he they're all USDA, FDA certified under the hemp bill. Right. And they have all the certs to do all of that. And they're working with upwards to 30 to 40 brands, I believe. And, you know, he's got a canning line now that does 12 ounce and slims and whatever talls, whatever he calls them.

2:37:25Collin PalmerThat's really his what he does mainly is the conversion side of stuff for people and services them. So it's interesting to hear him talk about it when when we get together. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:38:06Collin PalmerIt's, you know, we're creating dangers where there really shouldn't be, right?

2:38:12Collin PalmerLike isomers are being created. We don't really know. Sure, there's clean conversions out there. And I guess if, but we don't have, we really tested for everything. I don't know. I can't answer that question.

2:38:28Collin PalmerSo in your professional opinion, we're not there, right? Like we're not testing.

2:38:32Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I don't know. I mean, Everyone's talking about hemp derived D9 and, you know, some people are dead fast against it. Other people claim that it's okay as long as it comes out of mother liquor. Other people say that, you know, we're not doing the chemical conversions, but, you know, the testing results basically tell another story. It's really difficult, Colin, because the chemical conversion is going to be an order of magnitude cheaper than getting THC from regulated cannabis.

2:39:08Dr Mark ScialdoneSo I don't know how you compete. We're in a commodity market where price and cost is going to win all day long. And especially for big beverage, they don't want to tolerate some extra cost because this comes from a different supply chain. They want the cheapest thing that works. And so, yeah, I would think, you know, in their infinite wisdom, What they were thinking was, is that, well, this is going to be so dilute in the seltzer or the soda that we won't see those non-natural isomers.

2:39:47Dr Mark ScialdoneBut what we know from Josh Schweider and Chris up at Pro Verde is that under typical screening conditions, yeah, you're at the ragged edge. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:40:36Dr Mark ScialdoneThank you so much for joining us.

2:41:04Dr Mark ScialdoneThank you for joining us.

2:41:34Dr Mark ScialdoneThe problem is, is that by HPLC, they co-elute. So like we were talking before about this near IR method, maybe the near IR method could help us understand how much of these products are in there because the non-natural isomers they could detect in the presence of these other things. But yeah, we just don't know because this is kind of an experiment that's happening today and You know, I think Texas, I don't know if you guys are paying attention to this, but I think Texas just banned all hemp derived cannabinoids.

2:42:14Dr Mark ScialdoneI think that's how I read that.

2:42:16Etienne FontanSo I think, oh yeah, they banned everything. Yeah. Yeah.

2:42:19Dr Mark ScialdoneThey banned everything. Yeah. You see doing, doing, you know, sweeping things like that, like, and what happened in California, ATN with, with Governor Newsom's thing, you know, I think the spirit was, is that, okay, These are intoxicating products that are high in either Delta 8 or Delta 9 or whatever. These should be regulated under the cannabis laws. They're not part of the hemp thing. The hemp thing was never meant to cover THC, but I guess, you know, again, in their infinite wisdom, I don't think they contemplated.

2:42:55Dr Mark ScialdoneIf you look at like how many acres of hemp were grown and you take that acreage of hemp And then you say, okay, on an acre of hemp, you could probably get, let's say a thousand pounds. And from that thousand pounds, if you're at 0.3%, ATN, that means you're going to be with last year's acreage of hemp. You made 62,000 pounds of THC, right? It's at that 0.3%.

2:43:29Dr Mark ScialdoneSo let's do some math for a second. So 63,000 pounds, take that, multiply by 454. That's how many grams of THC that 62,000 pounds is. And then take that and divide or multiply that number by two. That's how many half gram THC. Thank you for watching.

2:44:10Dr Mark ScialdoneWhen you take distillate from hemp, and typically some hemp varieties are like 40 to 1, but most of them are about 20 to 1, and you start crashing out CBD isolate, you now change the ratio of THC in that mother liquor. So like you might take that first 20 to 1 crop, right? You get a good 20 to 1 distillate. So when you start crashing out,

2:45:03Dr Mark ScialdoneThat CBD, you're changing the level. So like after you've done two crashes of CBD, that might be 10 to 1 or it could be as high as 8 to 1. So now you have, there's a lot more concentrated THC. And so what did, what did Congress think that people were just going to throw that THC away?

2:45:27SpeakerWhat about when you think about making rosin, right? From hemp? Yeah.

2:45:32Etienne FontanYeah.

2:45:32SpeakerLike which regular OG Kush that fits the bill because it's THCA and I make hash and I make rosin from that and I emulsify that and I math that down to 10 milligrams THC per beverage.

2:45:51Dr Mark ScialdoneThat's happening.

2:45:53SpeakerIt's not the mainstream, but that is happening and that is available. You can buy that, I believe, in bulk.

2:45:59Collin PalmerYou can, yeah, I've been seeing it online a bunch. I mean, you have to fraction it to get it to where it needs to be, but it's possible. There's also things happening though, but that are like blends of CBG, right? Into that are rosin and then they're calling it rosin, right? That's hemp compliant. So people have to watch out for that because You know names are now just it seems like in our in 2025 just used like however they see fit um without following the actual definition of it you know like what is rosin what is hash um so i think there's also things like that happening um in the solventless realm of the hemp world which is not great because it Thank you so much for joining us today.

2:47:06Collin PalmerThe, the, what I take away is like, you know, the, but I keep thinking about it like, well, what if, if the laws were different, we would all, it just would all, they would stop doing mother liquor, right? They would just grow plants. They would just grow the right plants, you know? But it sounds to me like maybe that's not the case from what you just said, you know?

2:47:25Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, it's interesting. There's this company out there. They're called 5CBD, 5CBD. And all their products are 5 to 1 CBD to THC, right? And so that's clearly, that's a mother liquor, man. It's like they're taking mother liquor and they're putting it in the gummies and milk chocolates and all kinds of different things. But, you know. The thing is, is when you concentrate that mother liquor, you're concentrating all the other extractables that kind of come along for the ride, right?

2:47:58Dr Mark ScialdoneBecause when you make that distillate, yeah, you can characterize probably like about 90% of that distillate, but 10% goes kind of like into the bucket of, oh, it's fats, waxes, or lipids, or things that, you know, just kind of came along for the ride. Well, every time you crash out more and more CBD, that number also goes up. So because you're basically removing CBD isolate from your, from your distillate.

2:48:28Dr Mark ScialdoneSo every time you remove CBD isolate, the concentration of everything else that's in there goes up. So that's why often mother liquor has got a real rank flavor to it. I mean, it's kind of like if you, if you just took a CBD distillate and made like a gummy or a brownie or a beverage or something like that, if you take that same Thanks for joining us.

2:48:50Dr Mark ScialdoneWe'll be right back.

2:49:19Collin PalmerYeah, but it's, you know, I think everyone wanders out there like, you know, we have a lot of little worlds in which we occupy, right? And there's so much to really pay attention to. And I know I'm guilty of it myself where I get stuck in my lab and I'm just making hash and that's all that the world exists around me is. But... You know, it's the hemp world's interesting.

2:49:43Collin PalmerI think, you know, what you're doing, Dutch, out there is, you know, you're just waiting on the laws to kind of just come into action right now. Is that there's already a bill on the table? Yeah.

2:49:55SpeakerApplications in rules are written or were literally just at the final step before they start. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:50:27SpeakerThank you for joining us today.

2:50:51SpeakerTo your door. And everyone doesn't really know that, but it is a huge thing and it's still legal. And there's rumors that that could change with the farm bill, but that just keeps getting pushed back. And as that's happened, more companies have invested more money and lots of money. I don't see it going away. It's interesting because, you know, in Washington, they, you know, they did the same thing.

2:51:17SpeakerThey said, oh, shit, there's all these D8 gummies in the gas station. The kids are going to get high. So they said no THC in any hemp products. California followed suit. Now we're here in Texas is following suit. Minnesota's answer to it was I will allow this low potency thing. You know, but they hadn't opened their recreational. And so that kind of changed the paradigm for everybody because before there was a recreational market in Minnesota, there was this, this can market, right?

2:51:47SpeakerWhere you could buy and they were everywhere and easy. And so it just, it changed the paradigm, the paradigm a bit. And, um, I don't really know what my point is other than, um, Fucking hemp is alive and well and it's not going anywhere really right now. Like it could in six months, it could in a year or two years, but I think that there's so much money behind it and so much lobby that it's just going to be what it is, you know, and

2:52:14Collin PalmerYeah, no, I mean, it's in, it's in, it's embedded in the alcohol system at this point. And from what I see, like I was looking at distribution the other day, just kind of like typing in like who carries what and where and what states and it's, I mean, I just said it out loud myself. Wow. It's kind of, it's happened. It's not happening. It's already happened.

2:52:36SpeakerAnd to the point where I have a hemp, sorry to cut you off, Colin. Yeah, no, go for it. I have a hemp license, right? And I use it just to hold my plants, really. But I could just start selling wheat online on my website because I have a credit card processor. Like you could say, hey, Dutch, I want some blackwap gold. Online, dude, 40 bucks. It ships on Monday.

2:52:59Collin PalmerYep. Yeah. And I think that you're not wrong. I mean, that's kind of what a lot of individuals I know have been legacy in Mendo, for instance, are looking at doing actually. But, you know, hey, it's it's there's a there's a lot of long way to go with all this. So it's why not see how you can touch more people? I encourage that, you know, like if you can and why not try.

2:53:22Collin PalmerIt definitely will, if done right, could open up more doors. You know, I think that's real. But hey, I'm going to have to jump here. I'm going to leave this on. And I really appreciate everyone here. Thank you, Marcus. Thank you, Ryan, ATN, Mark. Loved the conversation, Dutch. Amazing. Storm, nice to meet you, brother. I'll be around. Got to do some things around here.

2:53:46Etienne FontanWe'll keep it going, Colin. I'm going to actually, I'm going to do a share. I sent a request for a share screen, Marcus. I wanted to show. I got turned on. I put it in the hand. Let me put it in the chat too.

2:54:04Collin PalmerI just turned on multiple sharing, so you got it.

2:54:06Etienne FontanAll right. Let me put it on. Okay. So we just got made aware that after 50 years...

2:54:16Etienne FontanPlus, the Dutch have decided that Amsterdam has decided to kick off a collection of cannabis culture. And so the City Archives is creating a collection on cannabis culture in Amsterdam. A special part of Amsterdam's cultural history deserves a place in our collection. come to kick off with this project on the 23rd of may and think about how we can record this heritage so my dutch friends or those who are traveling that's actually happening the dutch government has finally decided that cannabis is actually part of the culture which is has actually been part of but they're actually documenting it.

2:54:56Etienne FontanSo yeah, they're they're looking for people to contribute. So yeah. If you're in Amsterdam, check it out. The local authority of the City Archives is attempting to gather historical information about cannabis on the 23rd at the Amsterdam City Archives at the Bodusplein, second floor, 1.30 to 4.50 p.m. Free admission, first come, first serve. So it starts with coffee and tea at 13.30 p.m. And then it goes on from there.

2:55:30Etienne FontanSo if you're in the Netherlands and want to help with the historical perspective or contribute to or have something to contribute, there you go, peoples. Which I thought is pretty cool and well past due, but glad to see that the Dutch in their pragmatic ways, they're like, okay, let's start, let's have this discussion. So yeah, keep that in mind. So I just wanted to share that because...

2:55:57Etienne FontanWe're hash related. And of course, Dutch is hash related. And Amsterdam, of course, is very hash related because I was taught early on, you know, you go to the Netherlands for the hash. It's all about the hash. Isn't that the 28th, ATN? It's 23rd. 23rd. Oh, so that was two days ago. That already happened two days ago. Sorry.

2:56:25Etienne FontanBut that's happening is still pretty fucking cool.

2:56:28SpeakerNo stoners here. No stoners here. No, no, no, no, no. Well, I'm sure there's some things we can get them from Horror Farm. I mean, I know there's a couple of big tree branches, main stalks out there that maybe end up over there. Who knows? It's pretty cool that you're finally recognizing. I mean, how much money do you think cannabis has brought into Amsterdam?

2:56:52Etienne FontanBillions on top of, you know, I mean, I mean, look at it. Sensi Seed Banks has done their own, you know, museum there, right? Their own hemp museum. And Sensi's, you know, museum's been there for years until they, you know, he spent five years renovating that castle in Barcelona that is now, I guess, the premier collection is in Barcelona. But, you know, Ben Dronkers is, you know, I hope he'll be able to share some of that with them or they'll purchase some of, you know, the historical things that are available that have made, you know, Dutch cannabis, you know, world known, right?

2:57:29Etienne FontanWe all went migrated there. I met Bubble Man there. I've run into many people there over the years. cannabis cups and you know just visiting you know amsterdam itself so it's it's kind of always been a mecca and uh it's a shame that it's it's it's taken this long for them to acknowledge their historical model because we've seen them dismantle you know uh part parts of their cultural and their heritage so go amsterdam

2:58:01SpeakerInternational Hemp Association has been based at Amsterdam since its inception. I mean, like I said the other day with Rob, Amsterdam's kind of been this refuge, right? And even a lot of these important American

2:58:16Etienne FontanArtifacts ended up over in Europe because... Well, how many important Americans ended up over there, you know, as refugees over the years because that's just the reality of, right? You know, the prohibition here in America and Canada and others, there's a whole gathering of people I would run into and hang out with in Amsterdam that are, you know, including, you know, David. Right? I mean, he left, you know, the United States because of the realities and saw what was happening there.

2:58:48Etienne FontanSo to, you know, to go to his house, be invited to his house, etc. There is still an honor I will always cherish. Yeah.

2:58:57SpeakerTell me about it. Diana says hi, by the way. She just asked me to say hello to everyone.

2:59:02Etienne FontanMuch love, Diana. Big hugs and kisses to you and the girls.

2:59:12Etienne FontanSo it's just great to see that there's so much progression and change in hash over the years, right? We've been doing hash church a decade. And in this past decade, we've seen, we literally watched rosin be created right here and shared in it and watched it progress to, right, I mean, the quality as well as the mechanization, right, is more consistent, right? Back in 2017, right, we were using hair straighteners, right?

2:59:41Etienne FontanRemember that?

2:59:44SpeakerWell, the interesting thing, I think, is what's next, right? I mean, come from BHO to where we are now in 20 years.

2:59:52Etienne FontanNobody thought squishing something with heat was going to create a whole new concentrate line, which, oddly enough, is illegal in the Netherlands because it's considered a hard drug, right, Brian?

3:00:03SpeakerRight, yep. It's essentially, yeah, they consider it an oil or an extract, which is verboten, cannot do, so... Yeah, it's kind of bizarre. But in fact, well, you heard the same thing, ATN, yesterday from Derek. I mean, people want the traditional hashish because that's what people are used to getting. And so these newfangled high monoterp rosins are not, you can't use them. It's one of the funny things about cannabis is like, you know, we have these products and then we develop the right ways of consuming them and all the tools that go along with their use.

3:00:38SpeakerI mean, bongs and You know, dab rigs, obviously. So we were talking about the skillet the other day. And, you know, it's like the evolution of these these tools and they really suit the the type of hash. I remember I had a friend of mine, a guy named Redbeard out of British Columbia. He made me a nice double double bubbler piece that I brought to a distributor of mine in Italy.

3:01:03SpeakerAnd, you know, I showed up and I had this, this, this doubler and I gave it to him and he went and got some traditional hash and put it in. It just didn't work right. Right. It was like that tool was for a more modern hashish. And what they were using in Italy at the time was these are still using them now are these chillums, right? Where you take a bunch of tobacco and you pack it in the chillum with the hash and it burns properly.

3:01:25SpeakerAnd it's like that tool is perfect for the product. Right. But like, if you were to go and put a bunch of rosin in that, it's just not the right device for it.

3:01:37DrThe thing with a chillum, like if you don't smoke tobacco, it puts you on your ass. Yeah. Smoking that cigarette in one, in like one hit, basically. Yeah.

3:01:51Dr Mark ScialdoneOh, yeah. We used to do that at the Saitama's festivals.

3:01:56DrNo, I can't do that anymore. So I just exclusively dab these days.

3:02:02SpeakerYeah. Well, I think I almost vomited the first time I had one of those. It went white. It's not about the hashish. It's the big dust and nicotine. But it's... Yeah, it's just interesting that all over the world, like, we have the right device, which is, again, it's one of these funny things that I always thought when, you know, when the public companies came into cannabis and they were all kind of like, oh, you silly stoners, we'll show you how you should be taking your drug, right?

3:02:29SpeakerWe're going to put THC into drinks and that's what everybody will be using in the next five years. And, of course, that didn't happen and instead now the pharmacies have, like, vitamin C gummies in them. Right. It's like they've, they've not only did we not take their methods, but they've, they're now taking our methods and using them to distribute things like vitamins, which is kind of funny.

3:02:51SpeakerBut, um, yeah, there is an interesting thing where it's part of this, like, you know, cannabis leads to art or not arts and crafts. What does, yeah. Cannabis leads to arts and crafts. It's like the most dangerous thing that happens. Right. And people are making bongs and figuring out new ways to make sex tracks. I mean, And even, you know, like we were talking about last week, like even with coming down to like these deep analyzes that we do on the plants, that's now bleeding into hops, right?

3:03:18SpeakerAnd people are starting to really try to breed new hops using chemistry because they want to improve the beer, but they wouldn't have probably done that if we hadn't been doing it in the cannabis industry. So our little ways, you know, are always yielding new, new roads. So it's just, I wonder where we're going to be in another five years.

3:03:41SpeakerNot smoking skillets anymore.

3:03:45Etienne FontanNo, we went from males to females, right? And now we've got to electronic. So, you know, what's the next delivery methodologies, right? Yeah.

3:03:58SpeakerWell, my battery's about to die, gentlemen. So I have to, on that note, Good conversations. Thanks for talking, Dr. Mark. Appreciate you breaking down some of that stuff. And nice to meet you, Storm. Have a good day, everyone.

3:04:17Dr Mark ScialdoneBe safe, Dutch. Cheers, guys. Take care, Dutch.

3:04:31Etienne FontanLow on the conversation. Take one. Low on the conversation. Take one. Thank you. So Storm, what is happening currently in South Africa, right? We know that the government just tried to pull shenanigans regarding, you know, edibles, etc. So do you have an idea on what's happening regarding concentrates or, you know, flowers? Besides, I know people are allowed to grow themselves, but it's not like they can go and find, you know, clones or seeds immediately, right?

3:05:08Etienne FontanIs that a hard thing to do?

3:05:11DrEasily, easily. No, there's a members club in every shopping center, basically. You can just go to literally your closest shopping center and you can buy flour. The concentrates and hash thing is not so, like, it's a very flour-focused market. Yeah, people and people who dab, they're not then, It's a very, like, rosin is a very expensive thing, so people are typically more dabbing the BHO, the CO2 extract.

3:05:50DrIt's a really good ethanol extract. But people grow, and we do the members club things, and people grow, and it's like no one's stopping us, and it's...

3:06:07DrIt's insane. It's insane what's going on. And there's very little regulation. You know, where the regulation lies is in the medical side of things. But, you know, that's the whole, you know, big pharma mission. To get a license for that is like... Order of a million Rand just for the license and then all your compliance and everything to do it. So it makes it inaccessible for sort of a home-sized producer or a larger, you know, larger homes or like a homestead or a farm-sized producer.

3:06:47DrTo get that license is a bit of a mission. So there's no like agricultural body that's We're responsible for anything that's got to do with anything that's cannabis, only hemp. And so a lot of people are doing a hemp permit or a hemp license and then just growing weed and doing the whole thing under the guise of a hemp permit, which Works, you know, basically, our government is completely clueless.

3:07:28DrAnd unfortunately, so they, especially when it comes to cannabis, so they are not, they passed the law in 2017, but it needs active

3:07:42DrI think that's a really good question. I think that's a really good question. I think that's a really good question. I think that's a really good question. I think that's a really good question.

3:08:07DrIn places like the US or Canada or Europe. And there's so much corruption in our government system that any funding that goes anywhere just gets like pocketed so quickly. So it's like it's an uphill battle. It's like we're pushing a bolder uphill at the moment. So the rest, the general community kind of went Well, you can't arrest all of us. And now all of a sudden there's a weed shop in every shopping center.

3:08:44DrYou can get delivery services. Everyone's just advertising blatantly, selling pens and gummies. And it's a full-blown industry. And it's amazing. Clones, easy to get. Locally manufactured, high quality grow lights and hydroponic equipment, living soils, everything. It's exploded. It's beautiful. It's a beautiful thing to watch.

3:09:21Etienne FontanIt's always fascinating.

3:09:22SpeakerVarieties that are being grown down there. Sorry, again. I was just wondering what the varieties are that are being grown.

3:09:32DrI mean, anything you can imagine. Ethos is very popular. DNA, Genetics, Greenhouse Seed Company, a lot of the Dutch, but the all-time... The biggest, most widely grown, greatest goat variety in South Africa, a bit of a controversial one, is cheese, Exodus cheese or UK cheese or Dutch cheese.

3:10:08DrThat's probably been one of the most prevalent cultivars grown Since the early 2000s, there's a legacy cut that's been going around. And so cheese. But yeah, we've got some really, really talented breeders that are working with some more hash plant varieties like strains from Oni and

3:10:42DrFarmhouse Studios, shout out to those guys, and a couple of others. And basically, we're trying to breed. We're starting breeding projects to breed for hash and breed for yield and terpene production and solventless production. So, and then actually get data on these things, you know, wash these plants and establish cuts. But yeah, we've got guys that have really good nurseries and through tissue culture, we're importing some cuts from the States and from Canada.

3:11:24DrAnd so we're getting some breeders.

3:11:29SpeakerBye.

3:11:34DrYeah, there's for how things are being done in terms of regulation. So there's some guys that are doing things extremely well, like distributing genetics, but they're getting quarterly HLVD tests done or full panel tests done for all viroids and pathogens. So that, you know, and then there's guys that are not doing that. And so, you know, there's... Yeah, just regulation is the biggest challenge at this point.

3:12:08DrBecause it's such a gray area, everyone's just operating in a gray, unless you're a facility and you've got the millions and millions of rands to, you know, finance the venture. You know, people aren't really too concerned about regulation. So I think, you know, and in South Africa in general, we are a huge...

3:12:50DrCulture, like massive, big wine, just like there's a weed store on every shop or cannabis store in every shop, there's a bottle store in every shopping center as well. And so it's, it makes sense that the Cannabis industry would follow suit that the government will, you know, they haven't, it's just a pharmaceutical, pharmaceutically regulated, you know, and not regulated. So if there was a sort of middle ground where you could get a, get a permit, Like you can for alcohol production and, you know, you get the permit for retail and all that sort of stuff.

3:13:40DrBut at the moment, everyone's just setting up a private members club and they're leveraging the private members club model very much like they're doing in Barcelona, Spain and stuff.

3:13:59Etienne FontanAnd there's no over-regulatory agency, so it's a free-for-all for the most part.

3:14:06DrYeah, all the regulatory bodies are specific to the pharmaceutical, the big pharmaceutical cultivation operations. So then they're not, you know, they're there to make sure that the operations are compliant for the pharmaceutical compliance and GMP certification and all of that jazz that home growers don't need to, you know, That be too worried about and the home grow market or sector is what is supplying for the most part a lot of the members clubs are like larger grows I say home grows but they're not home grows they're like just independent independent farms that are not following um like pharmaceutical licensing But yeah, I mean, you know, steps in the right direction.

3:15:05DrLike I said, the fields of grief for all with Myrtle and the couple and Chiba are doing some really good things and Working very closely with government is for not only developing the cannabis industry, but using it and leveraging it for job creation in the more rural areas of South Africa. So, you know, job creation is a massive, massive Ongoing conversation in South Africa because we have such a large demographic of our population that is unemployed and it's just because the jobs are just not there for them to have.

3:16:02DrSo, you know, cannabis offers a bit of a light at the end of the tunnel in terms of Thank you for joining us.

3:16:30DrOur government loves putting shenanigans all the time and a lot of money goes missing a lot of the time. So, you know, if we want to create the jobs and create the industry and stimulate the economy, unfortunately, you know, the Gatekeepers kind of throttle everything. That's not a problem that's unique to cannabis. That's a problem that our country faces on another level. So yeah, these are my stories.

3:17:11SpeakerHow interesting that North America is corporate and across the Atlantic is the divide. And it seems to be that everything comes out from across the Atlantic is this association model, right? This members club model where they're kind of keeping the profit. Do they have to be nonprofit these member clubs or no? In South Africa?

3:17:38SpeakerStorm?

3:17:38DrYes. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. That's a, it's a nonprofit. Can you hear me?

3:17:44SpeakerYeah, I can now. Yeah.

3:17:47DrCan you hear me? Yeah, so they are non-profit. So the model is you set up a non-profit organization and that is the club and members come and pay membership fees and they pay cultivation fees and when

3:18:09DrAnd then you stay away from the word sell and sale and buy and, you know, typical words of trading.

3:18:24DrThen there's typically what they'll do is then set up a parallel business that will do like be like a coffee shop or a restaurant or something that's doing just perfectly legitimate business and so people come and buy the food from business the profit business for profit and then the members club runs through the non-profit organization so um It's a bit of a convoluted, like, you know, jumping through loopholes way to operate.

3:19:04DrAnd so much so that there are actually just some, there are, the dispensary model is quite prevalent as well. Like there are many, like, you know, I can go into a shopping center and I can just walk up to a counter and I can buy gummies. Thank you for joining us.

3:19:51DrYou know, we're not sort of policed by our state, but at the same time, it comes with the downside of, you know, the state doesn't really know how to run the country, doesn't really know how to deliver on services. And so as a result, crime soars and, you know, corruption soars and everything soars. And yeah. That's just another day in Africa.

3:20:23Etienne FontanAnd I take it most of it's outdoor, more than 99% of it, since I know electricity can be challenging, but I would anticipate the majority of it is outdoor.

3:20:36DrA lot of it is outdoor, but there are some very large indoor cultivation facilities and there's a large indoor Growing culture, you know, because there's a demand for indoor cultivated flower. In the end of the day, the market sees it as superior and more premium, although with light assisted greenhouse, climate controlled greenhouses. We're achieving virtually the same sort of quality that is achieved through an indoor grow.

3:21:10DrYeah, they are still indoor grows, but the electricity issue is an issue. We have what is known as load shedding, which is basically I know of cultivation facilities that were not able to get because they had to they were spending so much on diesel to run generators.

3:21:46DrIn backup power to get their plants through the flowering cycle, they weren't able to get the price to recover their costs. So they ended up just stopping cultivating cannabis altogether and just turned their space into a mushroom cultivation facility. And they started cultivating psilocybin and lion's mane and oyster mushrooms and reishi and every other medical mushroom. So, yeah, that's a lot of people are growing outdoors though.

3:22:23DrYou know, we've got a lot of space. That's the big thing. We've got vast space. I mean, where I stay, where I live, we've got eight acres of land, you know, which is not typical. We're very fortunate where we stay, but around where we live, all the properties are 8 acres, 8, 9, 10 acres of land. And we've actually got just, I mean, I'm pointing, you can't see, but just on the other side of the block where we live, a medical cannabis facility, just where we walk our dogs past it.

3:23:01DrYou know, that's indoor and outdoor. They've got two tunnels. Well, greenhouse, not outdoor. They've got two tunnels with HPS lights run in the tunnels. And then they've got an indoor hydroponic facility as well with HPS lights. So, yeah. You know. We have a long history of cannabis consumption in Africa. So, you know, people have been growing, you know, modern weed, you know, modern cultivars and growing it like professionally since the 90s here.

3:23:49DrAnd it's been going, you know, people... Yeah, South Africans know what we're doing.

3:23:59Etienne FontanWell, you also have a love for the plant and have for, you know, decades, as I said, you know, first through in the 80s was Durban poison. And, you know, it's a known cultivar and it's even won Cannabis Cup because it's, you know, the quality of African genetics has always been something many cannabis connoisseurs have appreciated because there's just something about that South African sun and the You know, the dry, everything, you know, it's all that uniqueness that is the terroir, right?

3:24:35Etienne FontanSo...

3:24:36DrYes.

3:24:39DrYeah, I know. It's exciting times, exciting times. And next week, we've got the Chiba Cannabis and Hemp Summit. So...

3:24:55DrAnd Cannabis Expo in collaboration with the Cannabis Expo. So that will be a big B2C and B2B sort of conference style event that will take place next weekend. And that's just another way in which we're trying to stimulate this industry and grow, you know.

3:25:22Etienne FontanNo, I can't thank you enough for taking the time to educate us about South Africa, because there's, you know, there's a lot of changing, you know, aspects of, you know, we just saw with, you know, Germany allowing for, you know, home consumption, I mean, home cultivation. And we know that that's allowed there in South Africa. And so it's, Do you see any, you know, like the Emerald Cups and the High Times Cannabis Cup, do you see cannabis competitions rising in South Africa or is that something that's outside of the realm?

3:25:59DrNo, absolutely. No, there are competitions. There actually are too many competitions at the moment to the point where it's sort of diluted which ones have more prestige and which ones don't sort of carry that prestige. But Yeah, we have the Amber Cup, which is Fields of Green for Myrtles and NEMS event in October. But that is a concentrate exclusive competition kind of cup. And then we actually had full moon sesh.

3:26:47DrThey came to, they did a Cape Town takeover. So I live in Johannesburg City, sort of inland north of northern South Africa. And then right in the southern tip in the Western Cape is the city of Cape Town, Marcos.

3:27:10DrAnd so, yeah, we had Full Moon Sesh come through and they did a takeover. We've got some incredible hash makers down in Cape Town that hosted the Full Moon Sesh. And yeah, we've got an incredible hash making culture. The flower, everyone grows a lot of weed. Like I said, the cannabis flower competitions are... Very many. So the prestige kind of gets diluted. So yeah, I think that we're moving into a stage of bringing international events to South Africa.

3:27:56DrSo we're always looking at bringing whatever

3:28:04DrYou know, or whoever wants to come and bring their event to South Africa, we can do a takeover here, you know?

3:28:12BubblemanLegends of Hashish South Africa edition.

3:28:18SpeakerDude, it's so good to hear you share. I'm so glad you came. Yeah, of course, of course. I'm actually on a plane right now. First time I've ever been on a plane doing Hash Church, so that's kind of different. Well, I just pulled my jar out and actually I kind of was like, Ooh, that's actually pretty stinky. So I put that right back. Um, but I am, uh, yeah, I am definitely, uh, On a plane.

3:28:45SpeakerChurch on a plane. Church on a plane, man. It's nice to hear you guys. I've just been listening to you guys talk. It was great to listen to you, Dr. Mark, and the whole conversation that led in with Joshua earlier, Dutch Grown, and Storm coming in and sharing everything that he's doing. It's really good to hear, you know? It's nice to see that we're making waves in one country after another.

3:29:09SpeakerI love... I love that we're kind of falling behind ATN in the sense of like visiting countries that are popping off. It's like, Jesus Christ, I don't have the ability to travel for nine months of the year and just go see cool people in cool countries. But that's the mission. So I am going to pretty much sign out because I'm on a plane. And I'm going to keep Hash Church going probably for the next 20 or 30 minutes until my wife shows up at my house and can turn it off.

3:29:37SpeakerSo you guys are free to continue the wonderful conversation. We have about 20 minutes left and I'll just be on the plane here listening.

3:29:46DrThanks. Marco, thank you so much for having me. Very grateful. Happy to have you, brother. Yeah.

3:30:00Dr Mark ScialdoneHe's going to get high on the plane.

3:30:02SpeakerYeah, I was going to say, have a safe flight. My safety meeting is in the bathroom.

3:30:08Etienne FontanRight? Safety briefing.

3:30:14SpeakerI don't want to hear that a man got thrown off an Air Canada flight tomorrow. This is the trick. Go into the bathroom with an open jar of the stinkiest resin you have. Close the jar. Come out of the bathroom. Tell the lady the bathroom smells like marijuana. She'll come in. She'll confirm that it does. Now you're free to go on with your business.

3:30:36Etienne FontanThe genius of Bubble Man, ladies and gentlemen, you now know how to fly Air Canada.

3:30:41Dr Mark ScialdoneI got a better one. Bring an inflatable neck pillow. And fill it with vapor into the neck pillow. There you go.

3:30:53Speaker10 dabs. What is that? A 10 dab neck pillow you got there? Right.

3:30:57Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd then when you get to the airport, you could open the neck pillow and exhaust.

3:31:01SpeakerNow, listen, the funniest thing in the world is if that was a real thing and you were in the airport and you saw Skunk Man Sam with a fucking tractor tire tube around his neck.

3:31:11Etienne FontanOh no, there'll be a mothership one, right?

3:31:15SpeakerDeppie will make one, right? Specifically for you, so. I just need a tire that's the size of a tractor tire. Yeah. Sam couldn't get enough. One of those donuts that you can put behind your butt. Exactly.

3:31:32Etienne FontanI don't think you want to be seen blowing into your butt tube, but yeah.

3:31:40SpeakerScrewed. Oh, I'm from Canada. You speak French? I don't speak French.

3:31:49Etienne FontanPlease stow your hash in the upward.

3:31:53DrRight. Under the seat in front of you.

3:31:58SpeakerSecurity pulled my Puffco out. He's like, what's this? I'm like, that's my Puffco. She's like, well, what's that? I'm like, well, it's an electric pipe. And Ruben is on the floor laughing. He's like, it's like you thought she would know what the Puffco was. I was like, well, I don't know. She must have seen one before me.

3:32:15Etienne FontanIt's for quantifying water lilies. Don't you know, ma'am?

3:32:19SpeakerI went down to Barcelona the other day and I took, I didn't disassemble the bowl. But I took the glass part off the bottom and they made me take it out of security. They just wanted to see that it was a, what do you call it, like an inhaler or something like that.

3:32:43SpeakerSo, the new world of traveling from non-regulated zone to non-regulated zone with equipment.

3:32:52Etienne FontanWell, again, it should be legal worldwide. I mean, medicine, I mean, it is medically legal worldwide, right? You know, at least from the UN's perspective, you know, so everybody should be able to. Now, whether that country is going to allow it or not, that's where everybody has to test those, you know, proverbial waters.

3:33:10DrBut, you know, not everyone's in the UN either, you know, not, you know, like, yeah, BRICS countries are, Not the most cannabis friendly, although we're a BRICS nation, but like Russia, China, you know, not really the most.

3:33:39Etienne FontanNo, we saw a guy detained this past week, I guess, an Indonesian-American basketball player who was playing and he brought edibles with him. Why he thought that was a good idea and of all places where it's executionable, no, but he did. And so, yeah, now another American basketball player has been caught with cannabis and this one is potentially looking at execution. So, again... This is why I'm working with Myrtle and our friends at the Cannabis Embassy in the fields of green for all.

3:34:10Etienne FontanBut for the simple fact that, you know, people are can still be executed for cannabis and it's absolutely horrible. Nobody should be able to should die for a plant, you know, especially a beneficial plant. And that was this guy's medicine. He brought it with him. However, there is a way for countries like that. That you can fill out paperwork and declare and bring in your medicine. I know people like Ben Dronkers.

3:34:37Etienne FontanHe lives in a country where he has to bring his own medical supply and it has to be checked. Otherwise he could be hanged for necessarily doing that sort of stuff. So there are ways you can do that, but you have to be very serious and proactive about such things and countries can't deny you.

3:34:57SpeakerI've also found over here in Europe, just different conferences and stuff at different times, Americans are nuts with what they do. I mean, they bring way too much weed and I was in my CRS meeting once and it was getting to the point where there was more commercial people in there. She had like half a pound and like, you know, 56 grams probably at least in pre-rolled joints and Edibles and everything.

3:35:24SpeakerAnd it was just like, what do you like? She had to come through this. It was in Bovano, Italy. It was like 2015, I think, or 2014. And you have to come through Milan airport if you're flying in. And just like bringing that into Milan is just, it's death wish. It's not death sentence, but it's like, you know, you really have to be. And she just, she just didn't know, I guess, that it was such a heat score.

3:35:48SpeakerAnd she got lucky, but, um, You know, you're really, you're playing a game with people that are not fucking around, right? And sure, when it goes well, you're fine. But when it goes poorly, you're really not in a good condition. So I just, you know, I always find, you know, maybe it's not the best quality, but there's always weed where you go. And for me, if it's not good enough quality, I just don't consume it, and that's cool.

3:36:18SpeakerYou know, but it's like, the way I see it, it's like, if I get caught for having some kind of silly problem, it just jeopardizes my ability to do work in the future, and I'm not willing to take that risk.

3:36:30Etienne FontanYeah, the same, because, yeah, you know, Interpol and all that's something you want to fuck with, you know, and, yeah.

3:36:38SpeakerWe had a friend, someone showed up, I met him on a barbecue a week ago or two, ten days ago maybe, He got on a plane to go to Greece the next day and went through security and he hadn't properly stowed his stuff in his luggage. Yeah, they found a bunch of THC crystals, I think it was, like diamonds. And it caused all sorts of problems. They messed their flight and, you know, multi-thousand euro lawyers and it's just starting.

3:37:09SpeakerI don't know if they've let them off or what, but it's just not worth the headache.

3:37:17SpeakerBe smart. Be smart, people. Put your shit in your fucking carry-on. You know what I mean? And try not to do, like, you know, it's one thing within the European Union, but bringing stuff in and out is, you're kind of asking for a problem. Dude, I don't even know how much I'd have to have to have a problem. Like, I jokingly told the lady my carry-on bag was full of bars of cash, and she just, like, chuckled and didn't even look in my bag.

3:37:46SpeakerYeah, I remember when I had my, like I had a medical license in Canada and I was traveling with a significant amount, you know, 2,500 grams. I was taking samples back east to show a facility and this was pre-legalization. And in fact, the only thing on my rolling bag was my computer and a bunch of containers. And my license, of course, right on top. And I went through security, and the guy was like, I need to go through your bag.

3:38:15SpeakerAnd I said, yeah, my medical marijuana's in there. And he opened it up and checked and made sure, and he was okay with it. But they can definitely be, you know, like, for example, on the other end, I guess my carry-on bag, but my larger knapsack that I was traveling with at the time also had a bunch of flour in it. And it must have stuck out the bottom of the plane.

3:38:42SpeakerAnd they got quite bent out of shape about the whole thing.

3:38:48SpeakerHey, Ryan, want to hear something awesome? Yeah, I do. There was a lady coming to sit next to me and the stewardess ran over to her and said, no, you can't sit in that seat. It doesn't work fine. I'm sorry. And she had a long conversation. Then she sent the woman out the other direction. And then she looked at me and she said, You will be sitting alone today, sir, with a smile and wink at me.

3:39:08SpeakerIt's a full plane, and I have three seats. Good for you. I had that the other day. Dude, that's why I'm telling you, because I saw your feet laying on the fucking chair. It's the best way to fly. You put those middle arm rests up and kick back. Dude, I just got a free pod. Yeah, you did.

3:39:34SpeakerThat's great. I'm glad you're going to have a comfy flight back to Montreal. You fly direct to Montreal? Absolutely. Nice.

3:39:47SpeakerWell, you're going to have some fun. Montreal's a great city. Well, I'm looking forward to seeing the song and Justin. They came on Hash Church that day from Canara and Go check out their facility. Their facility is just absolutely and utterly ridiculous. I'm excited to show them the NIR to test their nutrients in the plants and kind of talk hash and maybe do a little bubble man brand deal with those guys if all works out.

3:40:14DrAmazing.

3:40:14SpeakerYeah, got to keep it going, guys. Got to keep the hustle going. My wife is really close to home, so what's that go ahead, Storms?

3:40:25DrI'd love to get the Bubberman brand in South Africa, man. We definitely would love to help that hustle go.

3:40:42SpeakerYeah, well, man, well, you're definitely the guy I'll be talking to you. I'm sure you'll be the reason I get down there. Ruben was telling me we got to go down and visit you guys. So I think Ruben and I are going to make some good little tours here. We might go to Mary Jane in Berlin next month and we'll see where we're after that.

3:40:59DrAwesome. Absolutely. Yeah. Thank you so much again for having me on. I hope to be on again in the future, man. But I do also need to bounce. It's almost 10 o'clock at night. So it's been a late, been a late hash church for me. But yeah, thank you very much. It's been wonderful meeting you guys. And yeah, blessings to everyone. Thank you very much.

3:41:25SpeakerThanks for joining us. Thanks for joining us for the South African Past Church Late Night Edition.

3:41:33DrATN, Mark, Marcus, thank you very much. Cheers, guys.

3:41:39Etienne FontanLooking forward to it in the future, man. Be safe out there.

3:41:46Etienne FontanYeah, I need an airport. I need every airport to replicate exactly what Canada Airport does, have a nice smoking section outside. Yeah, that's kind of needed. I'd love it even inside, but, you know, I'll take the outside.

3:42:01SpeakerIsn't that nice?

3:42:04Etienne FontanYeah, I want to experience that someday. That's amazing. That's amazing.

3:42:14Etienne FontanI mean, doing it legally, doing it.

3:42:20Etienne FontanSo what's going on with Vermont, Dr. Scaldone? What's going on with the, there are distribution points and areas and legalization. Is it on point? Do you have the ability for home grow there still or no?

3:42:38Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, yeah, we do. You know, it's a small market. I mean, there's not a lot of, People who live in Vermont, right? I think it's like, you know, less than like half a million people live here, but like we get 13 million visitors a year. So a lot of out of state money comes in, you know, a lot of people, you know, vacation up here in the summertime.

3:43:02Dr Mark ScialdoneWe're right here on Lake Champlain. Oh, it's so beautiful in the springtime just to see the lake come alive. Actually, the lake froze over this year from one side to the other, so you could walk from Vermont to New York. Actually, I could walk probably to Canada, I think, from here.

3:43:25Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, yeah, so that, you know, we had a nice, you know, quick spring, kind of like a quick transition between winter and spring. And then the lake just comes alive. You know, we're next to a marina. So you start seeing the boats come in the water and see the sailboats go by and all the fishermen go by. So the whole lake comes to life. And yeah, we do get a lot of, you know, vacation kind of people up here, you know, Bring their boat up here, put their boat in the lake and boat around and whatnot.

3:43:59Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, yeah, you know, the market up here, I don't know. I mean, seems like prices are kind of high at the dispensary, you know, you know, eighths are around, 40 bucks, $50 an eighth. Seems like a lot for three and a half grams, right?

3:44:18Etienne FontanWhat about a gram of concentrates?

3:44:20Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, actually concentrates, you know, Vermont's in the chat here. He'll tell you. We have a stupid potency cap. I'm on concentrates. It's supposed to be six because you border Montreal. Yeah.

3:44:38Etienne FontanWhat's your tap? Because Kevin Sabet got to your legislature is why that happened.

3:44:44Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah. Right. Yeah. There's potency caps.

3:44:47SpeakerBut it is interesting that he borders the old. It is interesting that he borders the only province in Canada that has a potency cap on.

3:44:57SpeakerListen, not to shut this down, but my wife is at my computer. This is my only opportunity for her to shut it all down. So I just want to thank everyone for coming out today. We'll hit you guys up another time. I want to thank Wade, of course, for sharing his journey with us. Thanks everyone who's watched. Thanks to our sponsors, Puffco and Grassroot Fabric Pots and Puffco and the Press Club and Bubble Bags.

3:45:21SpeakerAnd we will see you at the same bad time, same bad place next week on Sunday. And we'll all be back for some wonderful conversations. So thanks, everybody. Appreciate you. Char, if you're watching, you can shut her down. And now we'll wait and see how fast my wife can get it done. All right, everybody. Bye. Love y'all. Getting high on the plane. Yeah, buddy. That's right. That's right.

3:45:48SpeakerHere, one last visual of the bubble man on the plane. Recording stops. Oh, perfect. Next up, she stops the YouTube video. Thank you, sweetie. You're such an awesome person. Way to go.