The Cannabrand Solutions Episode

0:00BubblemanI haven't really used it much, so let's make sure we're live. Let's make sure we're live. I see me live on this one. Can you see me? Am I live? All right, let's try this out. It sounds like we've been live for about eight seconds. No. Okay. Yes or no. I hear myself now. I hear myself now. All right, that was a little bit of madness, but welcome everybody to Hash Church Season 12, Episode 12, the Cannabrand Solution Show.

0:41BubblemanAnd let me just figure this all out because I got things to do and people to see and screens to share. So we're going to start by shouting out Cannabrand. I don't have their logo because it was so small, so I'm going to show their page. And that is what we'll do for these guys. And then we'll go into my live stream here. Here we go. Thank you for your patience, everyone.

1:06BubblemanI'm very excited for this episode today. This week on Hash Church, we're going to be welcoming the team from Cannabrand Solutions for a deep dive into the evolving world of cannabis branding, product design, and the future of premium extraction presentation. Cannabrand Solutions has been quietly helping shape the way top-tier cannabis brands bring their products to market, from packaging innovations to branding strategies that actually connect with the consumers.

1:31BubblemanOn this episode, we'll talk about how thoughtful branding, presentation, and product design can elevate solventless culture and help authentic brands stand out in an increasingly crowded marketplace. We'll also be unveiling something special, the official release of the new Vision Box All-in-One for the Bubble Man brand. Sleek new device presents a major step forward for the brand as we prepare to launch Bubble Man brand products in Colorado and New Mexico later this month.

1:56BubblemanThe Vision Box AIO all-in-one is designed to deliver a single powerful and flavorful experience bringing solventless culture to a wider audience while maintaining the quality and authenticity our community expects. Uh, yeah. Future of solventless products in the legal market as always hash church will bring together growers, hash makers, industry innovators, and passionate members of the community for another lively discussion rooted in cannabis culture. So that is what we're gonna be doing today.

2:24BubblemanI also, of course, am going to be shutting out the press club and Puff Co. I just have to go to a different page for that. So bear with me. Lots of different pages for this today. Let me tell you, uh, there we go. Hop on over here and share. Yeah, I'm a mess. What can I say? What can I say? At Hash Church, we believe that how you make hash matters just as much as what you make.

2:55BubblemanCraft consistency and respect for the process are everything, and that's why we're proud to be supported by the Press Club. Press Club has become a trusted name in solventless production, creating well-engineered rosin presses, accessories, and tools designed for people who take this work seriously. Whether you're pressing at home or dialing in a professional workflow, from the precision-built press to their thoughtful accessories and hardware, Press Club helps make Makers focus on the makers on what matters most.

3:27BubblemanQuality in, quality out. Geez, I'm really fucking tongue-tied today. We're genuinely grateful for the Press Club's support of Hash Church, our guests, and the wider solventless community, and their commitment to education, craftsmanship, and accessibility helps push the culture forward. Support the companies that support the craft. Visit pressclub.co, check out their presses and tools, and take your solventless game to the next level. You can use the hash code hashchurch10 for a little discount.

3:54BubblemanAt Hash Church, we talk a lot about ritual, respect for the plant, and elevating the experience, and that's exactly why we're proud to be supported by Puffco. Puffco continues to set the standards for modern consumption with tools built for people who truly care about flavor, temperature, and intentional use. From the Puffco Peak Pro with a 3D XL bowl delivering consistent heat, bigger hits, and unmatched terp expression, to the Proxy redefining modular ritual-based consumption and the Pivot bringing true Puffco performance into a compact, everyday format.

4:21BubblemanThese aren't gadgets, they're purpose-built tools for hash insolventness, and we're genuinely grateful for Puffco's continued support of Hash Church, our guests, and our community. Their belief in education, culture, and quality helps us keep these conversations alive. You can support the brands that support the culture by visiting puffco.com, explore their lineup, and experience what intentional design really feels like. Elevate the ritual. All right, well, I managed to get that done.

4:45BubblemanWe got five people waiting in the room, so let's let them all in. Got a whole crew here, which is awesome. Love it. All right. Welcome, everybody. A whole crew of you guys waiting to be let in all at once. Now, where is my... Oh, there we go. Wouldn't it be funny if no one could hear a thing I was saying?

5:10BubblemanIt happens. Let me tell you. It happens. Welcome, everybody. Look at that. A whole crew. We got Steven driving around looking for bars.

5:20SpeakerYeah, my internet went out, so I had to find a strip mall with internet.

5:25BubblemanIt's great that you're feeling a little bit of the hash church vibe that I feel every single Sunday when I do hash church. There's always something that occurs like that. So stoked, stoked to have you guys in, stoked to have Danny in. Danny is, I guess, my main contact and a founder at Cannabrand Solutions and a fellow snowboarder. He's been supporting Legends of Hash and all sorts of different cannabis events and just been just a brother from another mother, dude.

5:56BubblemanSo it's good to see you freshly back from China.

6:01SpeakerGreat to see you, Marcus. China was awesome.

6:04BubblemanYeah, I bet it looked awesome. I mean, you sent me videos of you guys snowboarding indoors. That's something I've never done. Yeah.

6:12SpeakerYeah, it was middle of our trip and we're like, you know what? They have the largest indoor snow Thank you so much for joining us today.

6:45SpeakerYeah, after never snowboarding indoors, we had to do it. Why not? When in China.

6:50BubblemanI thought it was super cool. You guys even went full blown and had like the turtle bum pads.

6:57SpeakerFashion over function for sure. Yeah, the locals were loving it. I think Danny and I were might have been the top two contenders in there that day as far as skills go. But the fashion statement of the turtle butt pads and knee pads threw us over the edge. We were definitely winning.

7:16BubblemanAwesome. Well, it's good to have you here as well, Mark. We've known each other for some time, seen each other at shows and kind of two ships passing in the night, always having some good conversations about snowboarding. So hopefully you guys make it up to Whistler here eventually. Maybe we'll make it down to Colorado one day if they ever get snow again. Shout out to my Colorado team.

7:41BubblemanWe got Drew in the house who runs sales in Colorado and has been crushing it for the Bubble Man brand. And Daniel is my partner down in Colorado as well. So he was like, man, I don't like have any social media. I don't go on Instagram. I'm like, this is kind of a trippy thing. It's like, dude, welcome to the trippy thing. You're on Hash Church, Dan.

8:05SpeakerWell, appreciate it, Marcus.

8:07BubblemanYeah, for sure, dude. I'm excited to get into the conversation with you guys today. As always, it's always been fun. Everything we've ever done with Cannabrand Solutions, you guys are, I've always said it, you guys are just not your average vape pen company. You know what I mean? Like to me, a vape pen company is some Chinese woman who's picked a Western name and she's reaching out to me on LinkedIn and asking me if I need any vape hardware.

8:34BubblemanAnd that's all I really knew about Sort of the vape hardware world for quite a while until I met my friend. Oh, geez. Years ago now, I met this guy who was very serious into this designing of pens. And this was way back when if you opened up like a like a cart, it would have like some some little cotton insulation in there. It might have some some some Some wires that were soldered, right?

9:08BubblemanThat was the classic where you'd open it up and there'd be no more solder. And it'd be like, where did the solder go? It's like, I think you might have inhaled it. And then there was also the over top of the wire, there was like a color, like a plastic cover. You know, sometimes when this guy, Gary Bay, this was years ago, 2014, when I first did the Bubble Man Trinity pen.

9:32BubblemanBack in 2014, if you can imagine, it was the first time we put terpenes into a pen. And Gary was the guy that had designed this. And he originally went to China and he, you know, his story was that he kind of left a bunch of like, Adam Dizzle, Nick, Skully Vibes, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm,

10:07BubblemanYou didn't just wake up one day not puffing at all and decide you were going to start a vaporizer company. It seems like you kind of, there were probably some steps taken that led you into, you know, the convenience and the access of vaporizer pens. But I'd love to hear the sort of the origin stories of you and your company, Cannabrand.

10:32SpeakerYeah, absolutely. Excuse me, I caught a little bug. We accept coughing, it's hash church. I'm going to be smoking a ton of hash, so I'm also going to be coughing during this show. Right on. Steven, I see you're hitting on something, so that's good. Yeah, I grew up in Seattle, huge into the skate and snowboard scene, and I think I must've been 13 and they had an old skate park here in Seattle called a Seaskate.

11:08SpeakerAnd, uh, me and my buddies, uh, you know, I think I stole some weed from my dad, hid it in my iPath. If you remember iPath shoes that have that little stash pocket in there, hid, hid the weed in there and we rolled, rolled a joint in the bowl, uh, at Seaskate and, uh, smoked. And, um, I have, uh, Some pretty gnarly, if you want to really classify it and go there, ADHD.

11:35SpeakerAnd I think cannabis just kind of zoomed stuff out or zoomed it in and just it worked, right? And so from that moment on, kind of been in love with it. And then just the entrepreneur side of me, I'm like, this is fucking awesome. This thing grows from the ground and it makes you feel good. And You're not supposed to do it. And I could make money and grow this thing.

12:06SpeakerAnd although I didn't really start growing at first, I did steal a bunch of weed from my dad and sell it to my friends. Because that's what you do. Classic, dude. Yeah. And then from there, I don't know if you remember Errolwood World, Errolwood.

12:28BubblemanForest.org.

12:29SpeakerYeah. Yeah.

12:31BubblemanI don't, everyone pronounces it different. I've always pronounced it Euroid. I don't know why, but I've always pronounced it that way. It's probably wrong, but yes, of course we know Euroid. That's where John Indra released the BHO method in 98. Yep.

12:47SpeakerYeah. So, um, yeah, went on there and was like, you know, how do I, how do I grow? And, uh, I, I didn't really get past, uh, Finding lights, that's where I kind of stopped for a minute and read this form that was like, yeah, go to a construction site before they put up the HPS and unscrew them and then rewire them with modem wires. And so I was selling those and they had the ballast in them to my homies who were growing.

13:18SpeakerAnd man, they needed a lot of air to move out that heat because that ballast was like right on there. And then... My dad had a medical card and we eventually started growing together. Believe it or not, he had some bubble bags from back in the day. That's what's up. And we were making hash together with your bubble bags. So I think that really clicked when we first talked and I'm like, no fucking way.

13:44SpeakerAnd yeah, from there, I got a regular, you know, normal person job working retail. I actually worked at Zoomies managing a bunch of stores for them. I worked at Nordstrom for a while. And then when medical became a thing or really started taking off here in Washington, I worked with one of my buddies doing that and opened one of the first rec stores here. And then unfortunately, just out of the blue, my dad passed away.

14:18SpeakerThis was about 11 years ago. And I was I was gutted. Like, you know, I was running the store at this time. I think I was at Pemberton Music Festival, found out about this, just wrecked, took a bus down. And he owned this small business, really small business, bringing in labels from China. So like hang tags and appliques and stuff like that. And my grandpa took me into the CPA's office and it was a small business doing like maybe 200K a year.

14:55SpeakerAnd the CPA looks me right in the eye and he goes, there's no way you could do this. And just like me being- Challenge accepted. Exactly. I'm like, fuck you, dude. Yeah, I can. He's like, well, you've never run the business. You know nothing about it. I look at my grandpa. My grandpa's like, yeah, fucking do it. My grandpa's kind of like, fuck you. And so it took that business over.

15:21SpeakerBut I missed cannabis. I missed The crazy kooks and just being around weed. And so I had quit my job running this store. And then I go, okay, well, let me start talking to my dad's supplier who's doing like hang tags and labels and talk him into this industry. And so for about three or four months, I'm just like on WeChat, I think at the time it was WhatsApp because WhatsApp wasn't banned yet in China.

15:56SpeakerAnd I'm just pounding him for every night. Like, dude, here's the market. Here's how it works. You already have an offset printer. And finally, he's like, OK. And I didn't have any money. So he, you know, believed in me and gave me terms. And we started as a packaging company. And that was 2015. And that's right when vape was becoming a thing. There was these wick carts on the market.

16:24SpeakerAnd of course, I was like, already, you know, messing with that. And then carts, you know, started bringing in carts and filling those at our house and had a bunch of partners that were doing it. And I was like, Why the fuck is like 15% failure rates acceptable? Like people would be stoked. They're like, dude, only four out of 10 of the carts are, are, are duds.

16:52SpeakerLike, and I'm like, this is stupid. Like why, why? And, and just super curious and kept getting samples. And actually my, my partner who, um, I just saw his name's William over in China, uh, He's like, hey, my friend's friend owns this company called S'more C-Cell. And he told me the price. I'm like, yeah, right. Well, send it to me anyways. And we tested them, filled them, you know, 40 minutes later, 50 minutes later, a little hair dryer action.

17:31SpeakerWe're hitting it and we're like, dude, this fucking works. And I think three weeks later, I was in China. Because I was so amazed by that product and went to all these other factories I was buying from at the time was like, oh, dude, these are awesome. Like, look at all this. There's a bunch of people doing this. And then went into C-Cells factory and I'm like, holy shit.

17:54SpeakerHow are people even buying that? How is that allowed? Those other factories? Pretty scary. And we've been a C-Cell distributor since and went from my garage to... And three people to 10,000 square foot warehouse. And man, it's a journey. And I love it. And it's so cool to see where the industry's gone.

18:17BubblemanDude, I love that it started in a skate park for you. Like, what a great, what a great place to get turned on to herbs. I mean, that's that's pretty standard for like a 90s kid right there, like 90s, like 2000s, the skate park, you know, like for me, I'm a little bit older. So it was more like pool halls. But I still had the skate park experience.

18:38BubblemanWe did the pool hall first and we got, that's where we met the sketchy weed dealers. And then eventually Chornick in Winnipeg built a skate park, which of course was where all the chaos was happening. You know, kids getting hammered and kids smoking weed and blow torches with hot knives and hash. Like everything was going down at our skate park in a big way for sure. Yeah, it's interesting in regards to the factories.

19:05BubblemanI was talking to someone the other day about a big contract they had, and they were like, yeah, they're buying so many of these vape pens, but they're paying so much. I can get them for so much cheaper. I'm like, dude, the last thing you want to do is try and get a bunch of pens where you already have a customer buying millions of them. And just undercut the price so that you can make more money.

19:29BubblemanI don't think people realize how bad the bad pens are. I don't think they have any real understanding. And that was my buddy Gary's real trip was to take them in, get them cut open with like the water jet or whatever it was so he could open the cart and show people what was inside. He was the first one to ever show me all the shit that was in the cart and then to show me one, you know, After a year or six months of puffing on it with, you know, no more insulation on the wire, no more solder on the wire, you know, all of this sort of stuff that was just obviously convenience is awesome and people love convenience.

20:06BubblemanAnd, you know, I get a lot of the times where people are like, what do we care? You know, like we're just in a recreational market where alcohol and tobacco are being sold, which are, you know, between the two of them probably kill five or six million people annually. Why do I have to make my device safe? It's like, well, Thank you for joining us.

20:37BubblemanAs much as I love hitting a banger, as much as I love having my Puffco out in the world, I always have my pen. I always want to have a pen on me because it's just a different time. It allows me an opportunity to use the device in a way that none of the other devices can. Can fit into that timeline. Like when I'm ripping down the mountain on my snowboard, you know, I've taken my mothership on the on the mountain.

21:07BubblemanThere's videos of me opening it up and pulling out the torch and the dab ride and everything and setting it all up. It's ridiculous. It's absurd. And it was fun and awesome. But the amount of times and I have my puff go on the mountain, too. There's still times where I pull out my fucking my my pen and just hit that shit. Drew, our sales guy who ran a brand in he ran sales for a brand in Colorado called Eden.

21:32BubblemanHe has an enormous amount of experience selling these pens and understanding the marketplace and kind of the why people want them so much and how convenient they are. You've got another side of people who are all like, oh, we got to do better. We got to do better. It's like, well, let's do better. But just understand that we're never getting away from these. Would you say it's probably one of the top skews behind rolled joints and flour in the market, Drew?

21:57SpeakerAt this point, I wouldn't be surprised if it passed pre-rolls. It's a huge market and it's only getting bigger every day. And I mean, I've been selling pens now for, you know, seven and a half-ish, eight years. That's where I first met Mark, actually, was over at my first job at Spherix when we started selling Pax Pods and Mark was over there with those guys, you know.

22:18SpeakerSo we've watched the evolution of these things change. And, you know, I think you hit the nail on the head with that one that These are only going to get bigger. They're not going anywhere. And the market is enormous. So why not sell the best product possible with the best hardware possible? It's not going to make people sick. It's not going to kill them in the long run.

22:36SpeakerLike, you know, I think that's really the goal we're all shooting for here. But also, you know, you got to make a buck in the process too.

22:44BubblemanDo you guys think that live hash rosin had something to do with becoming more conscious in regards to the pens?

22:55BubblemanI don't know if that's the case or not. I remember live hash rosin coming out around 2014 into pens. That was when I first put it into a pen. And it seemed like And I don't want to throw the BHO guys under the bus at all, but the original OG BHO guys didn't seem to care as much about being exposed to gas, the potential of blowing up, all of these sorts of things.

23:22BubblemanAnd I wonder if you guys see it with rosin, that it pushed... The industry to do better. And I'm not making that as a statement. I'm more asking, do you see that that happened? Or do you think that that's not really the case at all? And that both, you know, BHO and I mean, live rosin, I guess you would call it, which is the more tasty of the live hash resins.

23:46BubblemanDo you guys see that at all? Or do you just think that it's been kind of... You know, because I kind of see that like nobody seems to be a bigger snob than the live hash rosin guys, right? They're all about like making sure it was dried properly, that there's no, you know, whereas the BHO guys were like, we'll just, and this is in the beginning, they literally take any material.

24:07BubblemanI used to get people going, oh man, you can just blast BHO if you have moldy material. And I'm like, ooh, I don't think you should do that. What do you guys think in regards to, you know, the effect that live hash rosin had on the vape pen market? And that's to anyone who wants to answer. Go ahead, Steve.

24:24SpeakerSure. I'll jump in on this. I think that live hash resin is a process that requires attention to detail to get a quality product. Whereas resin is a more mechanical, more defined process where you could put just about any strain, run the same parameters, and get a good product out with resins. But when you get into the mechanical extraction, it's a lot more contingent on the genetics and the little processes along the way.

24:52SpeakerThe shape of your ice cubes, the pressure of your plate, the temperature, the evenness of the pressure. There's so many little things that add up to create that quality that requires a lot of refinement of your process along the way and attention to detail, which is why we have that product. I also think that rosin has a unique characteristic for the smoker where it carries more chemicals than you would in resin, polar and nonpolar compounds in your media.

25:24SpeakerAnd along with trace compounds that won't get extracted by butane or propane. So I think that kind of raised the bar for extracts as they got better over recently.

25:36BubblemanWell, I love that you mentioned the shape of the ice because I've always been a big fan of a very particular shape of ice, a hardness as well. Obviously, I used to think The first shape that I got that I really liked was out of my buddy's fridge in Whistler, and it was the half moons. And they were as hard as a fucking rock. They were like the hardest ice cubes I'd ever seen prior to any ice prior to that.

26:02BubblemanNow, these days, I use cold draft, which is very large, one and a half by one and a half inch cubes. They're very sharp. Thank you so much for joining us.

26:38BubblemanYou just put anything in it, the parameters are going to come out very similar. Obviously, quality matters. If you put in something extremely high quality into a BHO, it's going to come out better than something that's not, you know, we're not saying that that's not the case, but you're right. There's an extra energy that is focused. I mean, I'm sure to this day, There's way more pens being sold with butane in them than there are live hash rosin.

27:03BubblemanBut we're working on catching up. You know, we're working on catching up. I see, you know, when rosin came out, Johnny B made a post called the death of BHO. And that post got millions of views, like four or 5 million views. Now, obviously, BHO did not die. I don't think BHO is going to die anytime soon. It seems like an affordable product that people are always going to want to have access to.

27:29BubblemanBut at the same time, the popularity of live hash rosin is growing. Someone sent me a picture the other day, and I don't know if I can find it because the problem is now when people send me things that there's 12 million different places to send me these things. But my buddy, Corey,

27:48BubblemanSent me a picture of a cart yesterday and it was all bubble hash, not rosin. It was a bubble hash cart. You guys ever heard of such a thing? I have. Not yet. I haven't. I've never heard of such a thing. I guess he decarbed it and liquefied the bubble, maybe poured off. You know, maybe there was some left that he wasn't able to use, but the cart was like clear golden oil.

28:16BubblemanAnd I just thought, wow, wouldn't that be cool if in the future, do you guys see us releasing one day the bubble hash cart?

28:24SpeakerI think shooting something unique out there is the best way to get ahead. So I would love to shoot a bubble ash guard into the market. Dude, how great.

28:32BubblemanI just, I'd never seen it before. And who knows, the conversation may very well start here and have these guys start working on something as such. I mean, obviously when it comes to anything that's smoking or, or heating up, there's just so many different variables. I got to have a conversation with Josh from, uh, raw, uh, And I'm sure that when we first started making rosin paper,

29:15BubblemanParts, you know, it was different. There were different products, very much like what Stephen mentioned, which is a very deep rabbit hole for those of you that are aware. Polar, semi-polar and non-polar components and the different polarities of the solvents used. This was a conversation that Jim Frayer, the chemist, I only knew him through Facebook. I think he's a West Coast guy. He was a PhD chemist and he went down this rabbit hole of why people were getting this nasally cough and sort of bronchitis and when they were smoking a lot of bho and this was prior to winterization uh and he went into the the the conversation of polar and semi-polar components and how you know these solvents if they're polar they'll pull out polar if they're semi-polar they'll pull up but they'll leave behind the other things and so he got into this dialogue that perhaps Some of the components that were being left behind from BHO were some of these natural components that when you smoke, they act as nucleation points in the lungs.

30:21BubblemanThey sort of stop the smoke from going too deep into the lungs. They sort of, you know, they close the lungs up a little bit. And it was winterization that came later that was required to remove the fats and the lipids and the waxes, which were actually affecting people's lungs by them smoking them because of these These compounds that were not being extracted by the solvent, which he basically called these nucleation points in the lungs that would stop these compounds from going deeper into your lungs than they normally would.

30:54BubblemanAnd I always thought that that was an incredible conversation. There's not a lot really discussed about it since Jim Brought it up. Winterization came along very soon after. And then it was like, well, we don't have to worry about this so much anymore because now we're removing the fats and the lipids and the waxes. Now, these components are still present in rosin, but so too are these nucleation points or these compounds that act as nucleation points in the lungs.

31:21BubblemanAnd that's why when you're smoking rosin, they're not going to affect you the same way as when you smoked non-winterized BHO. Do you agree with that, Stephen?

31:32SpeakerI think there's another point, and it's really key, is particle size. So building off what you said with the fats and lipids, some fats are good, some fats are bad. Not all fats are created equal. So one fat which is bad would be a triglyceride. So those are very big fat chains. They're very long. They have high boiling points, so they don't vaporize. And they do act as nucleation point for your aerosol to make really big particles and to make a really harsh burnt taste.

32:01SpeakerSo you don't want those, but then you have your free fatty acids, little fats, and that can kind of give a creaminess, a nuance, a je ne sais quoi to your extract. So not all fats are created equal, but the particle size is really what makes you cough or sneeze. So I called it the Goldilocks particle zone. So not too big, not too small. When you have a very big particle, It hits the back of your throat like a baseball.

32:31SpeakerIt follows Newtonian physics and behaves that way. So it kind of irritates and you get this buildup on the back of your throat and you want to cough. When you have very small particles, we call that gas, they explode in all directions and kind of irritate the top of your nose and makes you want to sneeze. So we do particle size analysis at C-Cell where we're trying to find the right particle zone.

32:55SpeakerTo get deep lung penetration while at the same time minimize the harshness. So we've made some vaporizers in the lab that you could take a hundred hits in a bag and not cough. It's just like inhale it all at once. And it's all about just optimizing that particle size and making sure your extract is clean without triglycerides and all of that nastiness. So Yeah, pretty much spot on.

33:23BubblemanI definitely want to hear about your past and history and where you came from to get to where you are. I also want to know, it's amazing that you guys are working on this and have the understanding of the particle size. Everything is so subjective in cannabis. Like some people want to cough. Other people are like, I don't want to cough. Like the whole fresh frozen thing.

33:44BubblemanRevolution is all about coughing. It's all about saving monoterpenes. It's all about producing terps that the older guys are like, oh, what are you guys doing? And the younger guys are just like, this is awesome. I love like bending over and coughing my ass off kind of thing. Do you think there'll be a day where there's like right now we have pens that can go from 2.6 to 3.1.

34:05BubblemanWe can increase the heat. We can lower the heat. Do you think there'll be a pen one day that we can control the particle size?

34:12SpeakerI think we're going to optimize the particle size so you don't need to control it. I'm of the camp that you don't have to cough. It's not necessary.

34:21BubblemanGetting older, eh, Steven?

34:25SpeakerI want to be healthy. I don't want to be in pain when I smoke. And sometimes I'm in public and I don't want to make a scene. So I personally don't feel the need for coughing. I think it's a A legacy from in the olden days when we were smoking and we're coughing and now we're justifying it.

34:44BubblemanSo do you think that when people, cause I see younger folks all the time going, ah, the vape pens don't do it for me. I need a dab. And I'm like, oh, that's a, that's a coffer. He needs to cough. He needs that blast on the back of the throat. Like you said, the Newtonian physics, like a baseball and then cough, cough, cough, cough, cough. I also don't like to cough.

35:03BubblemanI prefer it over coughing all day long. That being said. Every once in a while, I love to rock my rock my head. So I just wonder, you know, is the group of people who don't cough as big or bigger as the group who does want to cough? And how do you feed both of those markets?

35:26SpeakerSo I think this is also a particle size issue. So when people are dabbing and they're taking like these big hits and you know ripping off the joints they're getting large volumes of smoke and we measure the volume of smoke with a metric called tpm total particulate mass so we want to see the weight of that vapor uh and how much they're inhaling so from a typical vape pen you're getting like let's say two to five milligrams per puff uh when you're getting a dab rig for example you could get like 20 or 30 milligrams in a puff And with a Puffco, for example.

36:06SpeakerSo when you're inhaling so much smoke, you have an effect called coagulation. The particles clump together and become bigger and make you cough. That being said, I got in this argument with one of the PhDs at our lab, and he was saying, You don't need THCA or dabbing to be high. You could get it from a vape pen too. The same high is just a matter of milligrams per second in your head.

36:34SpeakerSo if I gave you a vape pen that can output 30 milligrams per puff, you will feel like you took a dab. And I called bullshit on him. And then we did a test in the lab and he was right. So turns out it's all about milligrams per second. So we built a vape that could collect a hundred puffs into a bag like I mentioned earlier and you hit it and it rocks you you're down on the floor you know like you are high as a kite but you don't cough and you feel no displeasure it's totally smooth so it you don't need to cough to get high it's all about that particle size

37:13BubblemanThat's interesting. You know who would be great people to do the test for you, which would be beyond just getting high? I discovered this through my good friend, Johnny Burfellow. Johnny fucking B, as we call him up here in Canada. Johnny fucking B fell off a scissor lift like 20 years ago and broke like every bone in his body, shattered his spine and his neck and his face and his skull and everything, right?

37:36BubblemanHe fell 30 feet and on his way down, his head hit the second floor. So he was on the third floor and he did a cartwheel down, but his head like smacked the concrete and then he fell another 15 plus feet. And so he was utterly and completely destroyed. The guy ended up on like an oxycodone dose that would kill all of us, all of us in the chat right now.

37:57BubblemanWe'd all die if we took Johnny's dose. He was in big, big pain. And what I noticed about this guy when I met him, Was he was all about hot dabs. He hit these 900 degree dabs, turn red, cough like a motherfucker, which I thought was crazy because it was like, dude, isn't your neck and body like all like, isn't that like a lot? But he just always claimed that he got so much higher when he rocked himself off a hot dab.

38:23BubblemanI had a hard time disagreeing with him because the odd time that someone gave me a hot dab accidentally and I took the whole thing. I mean, it was almost a psychedelic experience. So I just wonder if there is something to be said when you get high that you have that intensely. Like for me, it's a negative experience. I'm not a fan of it at all. I've watched it happen.

38:45BubblemanI watched it happen in the beginning of dabbing. Before dabbing was a thing, my friends out in the Kootenays created this All right, so we're going to talk a little bit about what we're going to talk about today. We're going to talk a little bit about what we're going to talk about today. We're going to talk about what we're going to talk about today.

39:19BubblemanYou know, I just, is there a need for it to get to that point for certain people? Or really, are we all kind of brainwashed and not realizing that, you know, you could get that same experience without the 900 degree hot dab and just the certain amount of milligrams that's going into your body? I don't know what the answer is for that one, but I'd love to hear about your background, Stephen, and where you came from to get to Cannabrand Solutions.

39:50SpeakerSure. I was passionate about weed immediately coming out of college. It was kind of something I really jumped into. My father was diagnosed with stage four lung cancer and his oncologist recommended cannabis for his chemo and radiation therapy. He was a pharmaceutical engineer. So we worked together to develop IV cannabinoid solutions for him that he could plug right into his port. And that was a lot of fun, you know, working with my dad in his last years.

40:24SpeakerAnd after he passed away, the passion never really left and I wanted to keep going with it. So I started getting into extractions really early on. So websites like Skunk Farm Research really helped a lot. You know, the legendary gray wolf, From that website. Yeah, he did amazing stuff and Arrowhead like everyone else. And I got a, I started doing some extractions and getting into that well early on and then started my own vape company back in like 2012 or 2013, something like that.

40:57SpeakerShortly thereafter, I found a vape in the store made by a company called Vaporesso owned by S'more and it had the first C cell in it. And I bought it, and it cost 50 bucks in the store, put it up to my vape, and it blew it out of the water on every metric. So I said, that's the end of vapes for me. I got a farm and lab in Oregon, grew weed, extracted it, really enjoyed it for about six years, worked at Verano, and then I saw an application for C-Cell.

41:29SpeakerI was like, this is my opportunity to get back Into vaporizers, an industry that was shut out to all Americans because it's a Chinese owned industry. So I jumped on that. And that was some about a little over four years ago. I got a job at C-Cell R&D and it was a really tremendous privilege because I'm in a lab with the cutting edge equipment surrounded by PhDs.

41:54SpeakerIt was a dream. So I really enjoyed working there. And unfortunately, they moved their R&D to Manassas, Virginia. And they're focusing more on tobacco products now. So I wanted to transition and Danny offered an incredible opportunity for me where I can continue validating and improving and making products for the cannabis market. And he is a empowering boss. He wants his employees to do things. You know, he's not trying to lead with his vision.

42:27SpeakerHe wants us to lead with our visions. And I really respect that.

42:32BubblemanSo.

42:33SpeakerThat's how I got to Cannabrand.

42:35BubblemanAwesome. Well, glad you landed with the Cannabrand team. That's the way to do it, man. You definitely seem like an intelligent guy and that you know what you're talking about. I wonder how many of those PhDs that you were surrounded by at the C-Cell had cannabis experience?

42:54SpeakerNone. Jesus Christ. What an advantage for you. Yeah. Well, it's interesting because you come in with first principles approach. A lot of the cannabis knowledge we have is wrong and hearsay and bro science. And when you sit there and really challenge those first principles and those assumptions, you learn a lot. So I really appreciate that no one had cannabis knowledge, actually.

43:22BubblemanWell, we're glad to have you on the show today for sure. I'd love to hear from Mark as well. Known Mark for some years. Love to hear how you ended up linking up with Danny and the crew.

43:32SpeakerYeah, my my story is not quite as interesting as these guys. But, you know, going back to I think my college years, of course, like a lot of people in my snowboard experience way back then, I think it was just kind of synonymous with going to the mountain, ending up on a chairlift or in some hut somewhere on the gondola. On the ganja level, we didn't have one of those down in Arizona.

43:57SpeakerWe had really slow, cold stair lifts. So we had plenty of time to kind of figure out what was going on. But, you know, our options there were limited. It was either green or brown. And the green came from Cali and the brown came from Mexico. So we really didn't learn too much about cannabis until getting kind of out of college and moving to Utah just to try to be a...

44:20SpeakerSnowboard bomb or something, whatever you call it back then. But I met these two dudes, the department above me. One of his name was Tracy, who you might know from Pure Pee in L.A., a brand, cannabis brand down there. I know the guy named Jack, who opened my eyes on the stove. And that was kind of where it opened my eyes to, wow, OK, there's a different there's a different way and a different kind of kind of weed out there.

44:45SpeakerAnd That just kind of brought me to... I've met my wife and she's a migraine sufferer. Just saw her in pain two, three times a month with migraines and started finding a solution for her was, you know, medical cannabis. And shortly after that, you know, found my way up to Washington State via snowboarding because I worked in the snowboard industry for about 20 years. Started searching for solutions for her because at the time the medical side or just pharmaceutical side was just pumping drugs into you, right, just to get rid of your headaches with really no, End of that.

45:25SpeakerSo we just started searching for, you know, products in Washington state to try to give her some relief. So just at the time was medical, dark, dingy, dusty dispensaries and, you know, looking for things for her, but you can never find anything consistent. You know, you go into a store and they were just like, Brad Harkness, MD, MD, MD, MD,

46:05Speaker20 years or so. And I just saw an opportunity in the cannabis space where I thought these people in the stores and the brands that I saw that were represented on the shelves needed help. And I just started poking around and Found this Indeed posting about a vaporizer company in Washington State called Vuber. I'm not sure if you're still around, but did sort of a short stint there with some consulting to try to get their sales team and their product merchandising plan sort of And then it just opened my eyes to the vaporizer space.

46:42SpeakerAnd I learned about this company called Pax.

46:54SpeakerAnd then my background, I came from Burton Snowboards, which was a very well-established brand in snowboarding. And I wanted to align myself with a brand that was clean and had a nice product, had a lot of R&D behind it, that had a merchandising plan and a sales plan. So it was just sort of my background. And I thought PAX was much closer to my values as a person.

47:19SpeakerAnd really trying to find that next cool product to be a part of. And stayed there for about four years. For four years, actually, on the dot, I left. I think, Colin, we made a cross pass there. You know my good friend, Ross Kaplan. So good to see you. Yeah, we did.

47:35Collin PalmerIt's good to see you.

47:36SpeakerI was like, man, you look so familiar.

47:37Collin PalmerI was like, I feel like I've been on meetings with you before. It's really good to see you, man. Yeah, listen. We had a magical time at that company at a point in time where there was a major pivot. And I think we should both be really proud of that work because it was a big undertaking. And we did a lot of great work for them that still rides on today.

47:59SpeakerHeck yeah. And then Ross knows Bubble Man. I do know Ross.

48:04BubblemanI met Ross super randomly in Jamaica. He decided to like quit his job and like go to Jamaica and like just jump in. I think he worked at like the Defense Department or something too.

48:14SpeakerIt was like a while.

48:15BubblemanHe was just like, yeah, I'm at the Department of Defense. I was like, what? And now you're in Jamaica smoking bowls with me? He's like, yeah, dude, I made a choice. I'm like, all right, Ross, I like your style.

48:25Collin PalmerYeah, Ross is awesome. I just talked to him last week. He's great people. So yeah, it's awesome.

48:30SpeakerSolid, solid human getting married in the fall. I think maybe, you know, I'm going to make the journey out there. Oh, nice. Awesome. Yeah, I think I'm on the way as well. So yeah, kind of small world going full circle. You know, after PAX, I think company changed, right? And I saw an opportunity. With, you know, there's other vape companies out there and C-Cell, of course, back then was really nipping away at the entire vape industry.

48:56SpeakerAnd I got actually recruited. It was very strange. I forget if it was an email or LinkedIn, some Chinese person hit me up and I didn't think it was serious. I thought I was just getting scammed, that they were just going to steal my identity and my work resume and clone me and made the jump over to S'more. I didn't really know much about it, to be honest.

49:23SpeakerAnd I was like, whoa, this is like Steven, the scientists, the PhDs. And I was like, well, what does this have to do with anything? What I'm trying to do is I'm just a salesperson trying to sell products, but then you kind of realize like, okay, here's the story, right? And this is why this stuff is much more superior than most of the products out there. And so after spending about two years there, it was difficult, right?

49:54SpeakerAs a salesperson who has kind of a background of like many sales tools and programs, there's a Chinese company trying to really Thank you for joining us.

50:18SpeakerI started kind of poking around a little bit. I was next. I ran, actually met Danny through my, my s'more experience. I was brought into his office at one point in Seattle and I saw a snowboard on the wall and I was like, hmm, okay, maybe there's, there's something here. And I started, we started chit-chatting about life and snowboarding. And then sure enough, you know, about two years after that, him and I are having a conversation about what it's going to look like to come work for Cannabrand Solutions.

50:47SpeakerThat was a pretty short conversation. And then sure enough, here I am right now running The sales team for Cannabrand in North America. We're looking at other markets, of course, overseas. And we just got back from China. And bringing this whole thing full circle. Never been to China before. Of course, got to go see S'more. And there were some people that I had worked with there and were really embracing of seeing me and just looking at their factories and just the level and the R&D they're doing.

51:21SpeakerWe got to see the ceramic factory. Danny, am I correct in saying we're probably some of the first people to see that outside of their direct S'more employees? They're very quiet about this. They don't let anybody see anything. And we got to go walk through there. Got to go see some of my clients that I worked really hard on to create some ODM projects for like custom from ground up creations actually being assembled in the factory and took pictures and sent them to them and they were just like super stoked right like nobody gets to see that stuff so anyways that's kind of what brought us here today we just got back on Thursday night or I don't even remember what day it is but we're back from China with a whole new view of All of that is part of what we're actually doing.

52:07SpeakerAnd it just gives me some more ammo as a salesperson to go out and tell cool stories about our products and really be passionate about what we do.

52:15BubblemanWell, that's great that you guys went and saw the factories. I can imagine. I mean, listen, all those factories are pretty much in one little area, like on like just aren't they all like right next to each other? 90% of those factories.

52:28SpeakerI mean, they used to be.

52:30BubblemanYeah, go ahead, Danny.

52:31SpeakerYeah, they used to be.

52:36Speakeris where gosh 10 years ago 90 of global consumer electronics were manufactured and as that's grown um just kind of like any city right like the the real estate is is more important for corporate and so manufacturing gets pushed out pushed out pushed out so a lot of it in the jiangming uh area city um probably Butchering the pronunciation there. But yeah, a lot of like the factory we were at was about two hours drive from Shenzhen.

53:14BubblemanThere must be like a very long gap between cannabis knowledge and Chinese manufacturing.

53:20SpeakerLike, how do you fill that?

53:22BubblemanAre you allowed to talk about cannabis while you're in China?

53:28SpeakerWe are. Yeah. Nice.

53:30BubblemanIt's not illegal to talk about cannabis. You just can't have it.

53:33SpeakerYeah, yeah. Like, I think I spent about an hour shaking out all of my backpacks. All one up you, Danny.

53:43BubblemanI have a bin in my garage where I keep all the stuff I travel to America in, and I don't let it mix in with any of the rest of my shit.

53:55SpeakerI love that. I can't take the chance.

53:58BubblemanI can't take the chance. So how much do you think things could speed up if China was able to make hash and oils to test their units in China with?

54:11SpeakerGosh, I'm not sure. Stephen, for a time you were working because CISO has their SDR lab, right? Yeah. And Stephen worked there, which was like the bridge between China manufacturing and And us. And then they have us as distributors, which are, Stephen, what do you think?

54:30BubblemanLike, are you saying there was a Chinese company that ran like cannabis experiments in the U.S.?

54:37SpeakerYeah. So that's interesting. It's a U.S. company that is financed by S'mores. So that's the logistics of it.

54:46BubblemanThat makes sense. Because here in Vancouver, the Chinese government takes out ads and makes statements to the Chinese people that are in Canada to absolutely unequivocally not use cannabis as a medicine or a recreational drug. They impose that on them in a different country.

55:06SpeakerIt's interesting. So a lot of my coworkers, some of them had green cards and they would absolutely not want to consume cannabis whatsoever. And that makes sense to me. You know, like, you don't know what will happen. You don't want to break any laws and you want to, you know, follow the book. A lot of Chinese people just don't want to do it because it's stigmatized. That being said, in Kunming province, they have a high security CBD grow where they're allowed to grow CBD and extract it over there.

55:37SpeakerI saw the quality is pretty low. It's kind of equivalent to what we were making back in 2000. So they have a ways to go before they can catch up on American quality and genetics. But the main reason why SDR existed is so that they could learn about cannabis and understand it better and design devices better around that media. So we're trying to get the physical parameters, you know, the behavior, the mechanisms, the thermodynamics, everything about it.

56:06BubblemanIt's got to be such a catch 22 for them. It's like, do we give up the hundreds of millions of billions of dollars in sales? You can say it's a Chinese owned company, but I'd say 97% of the sales probably come out of the US and probably 50% of those sales come out of California. They're the real numbers. Millions and millions of pens. It's wild that they just can't embrace like, look, like this is good for us.

56:31BubblemanLet's just figure out. I mean, I do manufacturing in China, right? I do manufacturing for water extraction equipment. And it's the same thing. You can't have

56:45BubblemanSo it's like you got to design things there. You got to bring them over here and then you got to use them. And then once you find out all the things that don't work, that are usually connected to their lack of knowledge when it comes to cannabis, it's this back and forth sort of thing. I mean, the vape pen. I'm sure for them, even though they don't have cannabis on site in China, I guarantee you they've learned a lot over the last 20 to 25 years in regards to these oils and the fluidity of these oils, right?

57:17BubblemanBecause that has a lot to do with how, you know, geez, when we started, we weren't even decarbing. We just put shit in a pen and it would just turn into a crystal and just completely stop working. And we'd be like, oh... What did we do wrong? It's like, well, yeah, you need to decarb. And then even with the decarbing, there's so many different ways to decarb that will either destroy or preserve the resin.

57:41BubblemanDo you guys as a vape pen company ever look into decarb SOPs? And do you feel that it's important? To sort of share with your customers like, look, you can do it this way, but you're going to get this. If you do it this way, you're going to get this. And if you go this way, you're going to get this. For me, this is the rosin reactor.

58:02BubblemanIt's the only one that's sealed. It's the only one that refluxes the turps back into all the volatile organic compounds that go back into the material. For starters, it seems to be working just incredibly wonderfully. What do you guys suggest? I agree. It's such an important factor for your company.

58:21SpeakerAndrew's awesome too. Yeah, Andrew's amazing. Andrew's, yeah. I mean, marrying the oil to the coil in a sense is such a huge part of the journey and the challenge and the solution and what we're going after and a huge reason why Stephen's here. And so every time We're working with a client. That's the first place we go is, you know, Stephen's jumping on and Stephen, I'll let you take it because you've got a barrage of questions you're asking right before we even recommend a product, right?

58:57SpeakerAnd the tuning of it.

59:03SpeakerAbsolutely. And, you know, we look at the coil as like the engine of a car and you feed it different types of gas. You don't want to get a diesel engine and feed it, you know, 89 octane regular gas and you don't want to take your regular gas and put diesel in it, you're going to ruin your car. So and vapes are very much the same way.

59:21SpeakerSo we have some cores that are more optimized for very pure oils like liquid diamonds, stuff like that, where you're going to have a very homogenous particle molecular like composition that's feeding into your coil. Uh versus the rosin bar for example where it's designed to have a very wide tolerance of compounds and boiling points and uh that's how we designed that you know so that you have different heat zones and uh flowability and it it doesn't have to be pure it would just handle the gunk as well and just kind of not vaporize it so we we really need to design the coils around the media so first comes the media Then comes the oil and the innovation side.

1:00:06SpeakerSo we wait for producers to make new products, you know, new product classes, different types of oils. For example, you mentioned that hash pen, you know, that would be something kind of new that we would have to design around making a product or HTE vapes. You know, that's a new product class we see coming out where people want to vape HTE. So we have to look at what they're trying to consume first and then design around that.

1:00:29SpeakerYou know, that's the basic logic of it all.

1:00:35Collin PalmerI mean, it makes sense.

1:00:36SpeakerGo ahead.

1:00:37Collin PalmerIf I could jump in, you know, I think what we're talking about, and I think you said it nicely, is the decarb. And I had to do this in reverse for other companies where I couldn't change the inside, right? You have the amazing luxury of doing that. I just started being able to do that. So when you're talking about making a decarb product, you're talking about the viscosity, and viscosity has a centipal reading.

1:01:02Collin PalmerAnd the centipal readings... I have millions of data points on Centipa. It's the viscosity of the actual oil and how that interacts to your point in particle size, right? And the decarb dictates that. And then on furthermore, depending on the variety you have, what other chemical constituents that are part of that profile, let's say it's Superbu versus GG4, they're fundamentally different. So there, to your point, the particle sizes, because of the volatile organic compounds, because of the decarbrate and the need, the different needs of those two, call it varietals, you're going to have different particle sizes.

1:01:44Collin PalmerWhat I have learned through my time the past 15 plus 20 almost years, call it 20 years of doing this, I believe that there is a correlation between your decarb rate, right, particle size, and the actual finished good and how that interacts with any coil. It doesn't matter what it is, whether it's postless with a post, it just doesn't matter. So in that uptake rate, right, really dictates based on the saturation of those particles, right?

1:02:20Collin PalmerAnd I think we can all agree that dictates the flavor, right? So if we don't have that, and all those finite things happening together, you have a really adverse hit, and it's you're going to taste the build, you're going to taste the I call it the build taste where you taste the actual components of the of the of the device. And I think that happens more often than not.

1:02:42Collin PalmerSo there's a real issue with saturation and particle size right now across the board. I don't care what manufacturers out there. And no one's been able to really truly solve for that yet. I think we're close, but there's a lot of work to be done. And I think we can all agree that it's getting there. Like we're getting really close. Like I have units here in my hands that I rip all the time and just tastes like the oil.

1:03:06Collin PalmerIt's awesome. So, you know, and I think we're getting to that point where everybody can enjoy something in their pocket. But it takes these conversations and these these these data points, you know, and incentive our readings to understand how to get to that that perfect inflection point, because it's it sounds like really easy to do. But man, I'll show you the data.

1:03:28BubblemanWell, the oil is ever changing. That's the thing. You can do everything you want with un-oil and then you'll get another oil and be like, oh, this one's so different. It's like, wow. It's from the same room, apparently, from the same extractor. And this is the nightmare. This is the Chad nightmare for all the Chad CEOs that started up cannabis companies and were like, You know, we're going to we're going to do this.

1:03:55BubblemanWe're going to stabilize everything. They're trying to shelf stable a volatile compound like that is a losing battle. You just are never going to be able to to to to sort of win that battle. You know, when it comes to testing vape pens to You know, not all the companies are testing. Like, I work with a company called Canara Biotech Quebec. And these guys, I've never seen anyone test vape pens like these guys.

1:04:25BubblemanThey have the smoking machines that suck the pens. They have... Pens that, that, that are machines that pressurize, like when it goes up in a plane, they have all these different things. They are testing tens of thousands of pens through their SOPs. And I just don't see very many companies, you know, doing that on that, on that level. It seems like a pretty important factor. Is this something that you guys are, are, are operating with C-Cell on the regular, having these like testing, just massive amounts of these things so that, you know, when people buy them, they're not getting like a, A 40% failure rate?

1:05:05SpeakerOh, yeah. I mean, they have tons of puffing machines in China. And then in our SDR lab, we had tons of puffing machines. And we were running every kind of media you can imagine through the pens, testing on the pads, collecting these Cambridge filter pads, which have 99.9% of the TPM on them, putting those into GCMSs, analyzing what's coming out of these vapes, We're a lot of analytical equipment and I can't get into all of it, but we're doing remarkable progress on safety, efficacy, and performance testing across the board.

1:05:43Collin PalmerAwesome. Do you guys have a toxicologist on your team that you work with on a regular? That's one thing that I really appreciated about working with PAC is that there is real due process that... We went through and we could stand on that. It made us all believe in ourselves and in the product. I felt good about that.

1:06:04BubblemanYeah, it seems like an important factor to have.

1:06:09SpeakerYeah, so all safety testing is always third party.

1:06:11BubblemanOkay. You just send it to a third party.

1:06:16SpeakerCool. Yeah.

1:06:19BubblemanWell, I think it's time for a little dab of doodle. We're super excited to release this product in Colorado and New Mexico. I think Drew bounced, but we still have Dan here. He's holding on. Oh, no, Drew's still here.

1:06:30SpeakerI'm still hanging out.

1:06:31BubblemanHe was like, you were cut off my screen off the top. I need to put it on gallery. I know you're not feeling too well, so we appreciate you showing up, Drew.

1:06:41SpeakerI appreciate you having me, man. I'm pretty stoked to be here. I've been watching this for years, so I was stoked to get the invite to be a part of it.

1:06:47BubblemanThat's it. We're all on hash church talking about vape pens, man. The all in ones, you know, like, listen, I'm a total. It's so funny how often people ask me, what's your favorite? What's your favorite? What's your favorite device? What's your favorite smoke? I'm like, man, like I have about 42 that fit into where I am at a certain time. You know, it's and I'll tell you.

1:07:09BubblemanWhen I'm in Colorado, hitting on that little all-in-one, I love how small it is. Just fits in my pocket. I must pull out my AirPods 50% of the time that I go to reach in for that little unit, which whether you tried to do this or not, it's a really good connection because you've got about... A billion people who have those AirPods, maybe 600 million, I don't know.

1:07:34BubblemanAnd it's a thing where they recognize it when it's in their hand, not to mention it was designed to feel good in your hand, which to many may seem like, what? Who cares about how it feels in your hand? Well, believe it or not, companies do care how things feel in your hand. And that little unit, Drew was the one that picked it. So he has the most sort of...

1:07:55BubblemanOverview knowledge of selling vape pens and using vape pens. And so Drew was the one that chose the vision box. We went through, fuck, I don't know how many samples of different units that we went through, but it was the vision box that caught his attention. That was like, yeah, this is the one. It's got a super nice taste. We can bring down that temperature reading on it so it doesn't have to hit as high if you don't want to get as big of a cloudy rip.

1:08:19BubblemanAnd personally, I just think it's the perfect cruising around little ripper.

1:08:26SpeakerDefinitely perfect for the mountain, perfect for on the go.

1:08:29BubblemanYeah, exactly. It's and who knows?

1:08:33SpeakerI love the go ahead. I was gonna say I love the preheat setting on it as well. The preheat setting and the anti-burn technology is it's an amazing unit. We're excited to roll it out in about six weeks in New Mexico and get the next round in.

1:08:46BubblemanYeah, and we're in Colorado right now. Drew's been working on Colorado for the last month and a half or so, getting samples out and just hearing back from people. Dude, I just love selling hash and live hash rosin. It's just the best business to be in ever. First of all, I also want to mention, because I didn't when you said that earlier, Danny, sorry for your loss of your father.

1:09:10BubblemanIt touched home for me because I also lost my father. In an instant, super sudden, I was at that Pemberton Festival, by the way, that you left to go deal with that. When you left, I was up there in Pemberton. I drove, in fact, I drove my father's motorcycle to the Pemberton Festival that year. And it was the motorcycle he died on. And I restored that motorcycle.

1:09:35BubblemanHim and his wife both died on it, as well as a deer that hit them. So three lives were taken on the night that my father passed. And I restored that bike. I bought it back. I sent the frame back to the Harley dealership, the main spot in Minneapolis, where they re-lasered the entire frame so that it was, I could build it again. And then I bought every single piece of that motorcycle individually and had them put it back together.

1:10:05BubblemanSo I was actually in the middle of my sort of dealing with my father's death and how I dealt with it was rebuilding his motorcycle. And that's kind of how I visit with him on his motorcycle. So, uh, Yeah, I feel that for you and I feel that for Mark as well. It's never easy to lose one's father. I lost mine 20 years ago now. And let me tell you, if you've ever seen the movie where the little Italian lady in all black throws herself on the casket at the funeral, that was me.

1:10:37BubblemanThat's how completely and utterly destroyed I was. It's interesting because now when I talk about it, I can smile Because that grief was literally just the love that I had for my dad, right? That's what grief is. And so I'm sure all of our dads would be proud. And if there is a place where they're all hanging out, they're probably meeting each other right now.

1:10:59SpeakerOh, that's your son down there? Oh, shit. Okay, right on. Yeah, my son did the bubble bags. That's right. Oh, you used to make bubble hash with your son?

1:11:07BubblemanWhich is also super cool that you used to make bubble hash with my bags with your dad, dude. That is fucking epic. Epic. I can't say I ever made any with my dad. I can't remember, but I definitely got my mom to make a batch while she was working for the Winnipeg police. In fact, I had my mom come visit me in Vancouver and I wanted to prove to people that you didn't need to be like a rocket science to make full melt.

1:11:33BubblemanAnd so I gave my mom some really great material. I gave her some basic instructions and she made six star bubble hash the first time she ever tried to make it. Now, this was before The narrative of, well, you got to be a really great hash maker to make full melt bubble. It was before that, right? That came in later when people were like, wait a minute, we need to own this.

1:11:53BubblemanLet's just convince people that it's really hard to do this. The hard part is the material. If you know a great grower and you're a hash maker, this is how myself, the Nicotese, the Matt Rises, the Frenchie Cannolis, all of these guys, we had one thing in common. We had exceptional starting material. And if you have exceptional starting material, it's very easy to sell the final product, whether it's, you know, in a vape pen or a piece of screen or whatever it is.

1:12:22BubblemanIf it's great, it's great. And that is that was the luck that I had when I started doing this about 30 years ago, 28, 29 years ago. And it seemed to be the thing that all the people that I met who were sort of bubble ambassadors They all had the same thing in common. They had exceptional material. And, you know, it was that exceptional material that's really kind of led us to this to this conversation of live hash rows and vape pens.

1:12:49BubblemanI mean, there's a lot of technology involved in properly decarbing, you know, the process of washing and pressing and all of that. There's a lot of labor that goes into the washing. If you don't get the right returns, it's a crusher. If you don't get the right I appreciate everyone on this call today for, um,

1:13:19BubblemanYou know, traveling down that that pathway of right and trying to get it right. And obviously, it seems like almost all of us have a love of snowboarding and mountains. I mean, most of us here live in the mountains. I was on Whistler Mountain yesterday. It was absolutely fucking horrific. Probably one of my worst days in a long time. The whole mountain turned to ice. I still found myself smiling and enjoying myself.

1:13:44BubblemanIt's like the fishermen say, even a shitty day fishing is better than a good day at work. And I would have to agree when it comes to snowboarding, even a shitty day snowboarding, as long as you don't break your collarbone. All right. I'm sure there's been a few broken collarbones in the room. How many collarbones have you broken, Mark? Be honest.

1:14:02SpeakerMore like separations, both of them several times. Yeah. Never broke it.

1:14:08BubblemanI broke them both.

1:14:11SpeakerYeah, I broke them both. Very common. Even a shitty day in a refrigerated building in China just brings a smile to your face.

1:14:20BubblemanI want to do a little technology deep dive because we haven't gone too deep into that in regards, you know, C-Cell to me is just a mystery, right? They're this massive company. They have these products. Like you said, when you got to go into the factory, we got to see stuff that like probably no one ever sees. Well, we don't see that stuff. We don't get to see the stuff.

1:14:39BubblemanSo for people who don't fully understand. What makes C-Cell technology really different from other vape hardware? Where are you guys standing out in regards to, I mean, is it the fact that you guys are super heady guys? Is that like a big factor that you use the product that you smoke? Or is it something else? I mean, I figure you guys work very closely with C-Cell. I can't imagine they're just designing things that you just sell.

1:15:05BubblemanYou must have a say in what they're designing.

1:15:11SpeakerAbsolutely. I think a good place to start, you know, we're talking about the launch of your hash rosin device in Colorado, the vision box. You guys spent a lot of time putting that thing through the ringer along with a bunch of other devices. And Steven, when he was at C-Cell, he's now With us at Cannabrand Solutions, but he actually helped design the technology behind that called the Hero Technology, H-E-R-O or Heat Rosin Technology.

1:15:40SpeakerA good place to start, Stephen, you should talk about that journey because that's fucking sweet. You were holed up for months in Humboldt, like, yeah, take it away.

1:15:51BubblemanHoled up for months in Humboldt. I like the way this story sounds already.

1:15:55SpeakerYeah.

1:15:59Speakerum it was a story all right so uh we were working on a whole bunch of projects and uh the big one was making a rosin bar at the time what was the name of it uh we wanted to make a device designed around rosin which it was a totally different media than everything else like a lot what we discussed in this earlier in this podcast so um I needed a lot of rosin, a lot of different varieties, a lot of different strains, a lot of different qualities and tons of it so we can brute force optimize through a whole bunch of different coils.

1:16:36SpeakerAnd there's not too many places where I can get that much rosin at a reasonable price. So I figured Humboldt would be the place to go. And we rented a place in Arcata. Everyone was super hospitable. We made a lot of good friends and we bought tons of rosin. And we just started brute force optimizing the coils, the voltages, temperature zones, the spacing, the diameters. And we kind of went in an interesting direction with the design of the HeroCore.

1:17:07SpeakerWe went back in time to those 2014 coils that you saw, where it was like an open coil. Because the ceramic was actually the enemy in this situation. That ceramic was trapping all those fats and all those Triglycerides in fact, and making that burnt taste that you get halfway through a cart. So we needed something that would have a free flow that allow in and out. So we, we put a stint in between the coil and the wick to make a tube, to allow it to go in and out very smoothly.

1:17:42SpeakerWe set up heat zones throughout the coil and kind of building on what Colin was mentioning earlier that like device taste, uh, we've introduced the anti dry burn technology. which would prevent that by regulating the resistance so if the resistance was going up too high it means that you're dry burning and it would auto shut off the device so it needed to be totally saturated in order to fire so some people find that a little annoying they're like why is my device not hitting and i'm like well it's saving your butt that's why so you know like let it sit for a little bit preheat it let it let it get nice and saturated so you don't get that device taste because unlike uh Distillate users, rosin users really care about taste.

1:18:26SpeakerThey really care about their product. So you want it to be fully expressed. And it was a really exciting journey. We met a lot of Frenchie Cannoli's old crew. They were helping us out. They were really cool. And we had a lot of fun out there. It was me and two colleagues from China who were first time in America. And their first time was in Humboldt, California.

1:18:50SpeakerSo I thought that was funny. Did they smoke with you? Oh, yeah. Yeah?

1:18:59BubblemanNice. Good. That's awesome. That's crazy. Yeah, there's a lot of work to be done. These things just don't kind of fall into place. It's funny because to the consumer, they all just look, they're all just vaporizers, right? They just all, there's so many of them. It's like, you know, you guys are probably one of the companies that I could sort of relate to in the sense that since I started Bubble Bags, I have about eight Thank you so much for joining us today.

1:19:57BubblemanCome on. How do you do it? Answer. I'm just joking. Yeah.

1:20:03Collin PalmerGo ahead, Danny.

1:20:05SpeakerHi. I was just going to speak from the, you know, just being in China and in the factory, we were in C-Cells factory for three days. And it, I think the most amazing thing is like, I go there year after year and just, they have more automation on their assembly lines each and every time. And Their economies of scale, it's just insane. And, you know, automation, consistency, right?

1:20:34SpeakerRobots make less mistakes. And I think the most, the just kind of mind blowing thing for me is how much goes back to their automation. They have a whole department that's building robotics to take away, yeah, mistakes essentially, right? And increase efficiencies. And every time I'm there, I see a new piece of modular automation that's been on the assembly line. And I think, I don't think there's many companies out there that are making manufacturing vapes that have an automation department that are going, okay, six months from now on this line, here's what we need to automate to bring down price, to increase efficiency, decrease, you know, Issues, increased safety and performance.

1:21:30SpeakerSo it's pretty epic. It's mind blowing. And I, like Mark even said, like he looked at me and he goes, I don't know if America could do this, right? Or it's just mind blowing.

1:21:46BubblemanSo I'm sure AI will have a big play in these factories in the future if they don't already as well.

1:21:54SpeakerYou know, the interesting part is the factory there, we were asking questions and, you know, the ratio of people that actually work in the factories and these R&D centers in China from like skilled labor to like, We've got a lot of great people here. We're going to see a major shift in that. And like Danny said, you know, it comes down to building stuff that's better, that has less failure, and it's safer because it's machines and they're robots and they're more consistent.

1:22:34SpeakerAnd from a sales perspective, right, as you guys Endeavor into launching a product and many products right in the future is one failure is detrimental to your brand. It's really hard to gain back that customer. You may not even know if you lost a customer. They might be gone and just never told anybody that they hate your brand because your hardware sucks. And so this is working to eliminate that and just provide more consistency.

1:23:01SpeakerAnd from a sales perspective, Cutting through the race to the bottom is really challenging because everybody can make a cheaper vape. I mean, we drove by the factories in China where they're just like assembling stuff and soldering things and they're just, it's all just so inconsistent and actually, quite frankly, dangerous. From a cartridge side, it's a little less dangerous. We still have solder and all these things and cotton, but then all on one side.

1:23:29SpeakerThe batteries, the toxicity of the battery and you're inhaling battery gas. That's when it's heating up. It's just people just don't know. Right. And so we do a lot of work in tearing down products in our own lab after and not our own products, competitor products. Right. And just trying to understand what others are purchasing so we can position our products a little differently to Show them the quality is worth paying literally five more cents for or 10 more cents for because you're just not going to be inhaling dangerous gases or like you said earlier, Marcus, bubble man, solder.

1:24:09SpeakerWhere'd it go? Well, you inhaled it all.

1:24:11BubblemanYou had no idea, right? The first time I heard that, I was like, oh. That's not good. Inhaling like toxic. And I get it. Like it's, you know, it's the recreational market and recreational drugs are not always safe. But cannabis can be. Let's not make a safe recreational drug unsafe for no good reason other than, well, I need to make more money off of it.

1:24:40SpeakerYou know? Absolutely. It needs to be safe. Yeah. I think that's something everybody on our team is super passionate about. Like I spent Black Friday, which, you know, it's a holiday for us, tearing apart devices. And just, I was the only one in the office just tearing apart devices. And some of the stuff I was finding inside Our competitor devices and like not to throw anyone under the bus.

1:25:05SpeakerI'm not going to do that. But like silicone glue right by the atomizer. And Stephen, I think I had sent you a picture of it. And I'm like, what is this? This is not safe, right? This looks like bathroom fucking pile caulking. And it's getting heated up and it's off gassing. And Stephen's like, yeah, that's that's like insane because there's a lot of units of that out in the market.

1:25:30SpeakerAnd

1:25:30BubblemanWell, and the companies that know can't throw anyone under the bus, right? You have to protect them. It's so bizarre to me. We just had an event here in Vancouver called Heady Happenings, and 20 plus percent of the entries failed. They had microbutanol in their product. And right away, the guy's like, well, we're not going to mention, you know, we don't want to throw anyone under the bus.

1:25:53BubblemanIt's like, no, no, no. Throw them under the bus, please. Let's throw them under the bus because what they're doing is completely fucked. Why wouldn't we throw them under the bus? And I get from your perspective, you're a vape company and it's bias and it's this and it's that. But who else is ripping these people's, you know, to me, I was going to ask you guys, actually.

1:26:12BubblemanYou know, what goes into designing a truly great all-in-one device from scratch? And I think Danny answered the question before I asked it, which was like, well, for starters, we rip open all of our competitors' units and find out what not to do. What a great way to find the path of what to do by merely looking. And it's, it's, companies make it very easy. Trust me.

1:26:34BubblemanLike it's no different for me. I can look at these bags that are $40 on. Thank you for watching.

1:27:00BubblemanIt's always the same in cannabis. I felt the same way when my company kind of went under. We weren't allowed to mention the people who brought the company under. It was like, oh, no, no, you don't want to do that. You can get sued. You don't want to be throwing people under the bus. It's like, why are companies protecting other companies? I guess because we're protecting ourselves.

1:27:19BubblemanWe don't want to get into it. We don't want to have the problem. But in my opinion... If a company is selling something utterly and completely toxic or they're doing something that's toxic, it's not a bad idea to... It doesn't mean calling them out is going to destroy them. Maybe calling them out makes them do better. Maybe they're like, oh, fuck, you know, we didn't really realize.

1:27:38BubblemanThen we got called out. It was a nightmare, but we just stood with it and we said, okay, we're going to listen to the words of the people who are calling us out and we're going to find a better way. Which is, you know, design a device that doesn't simultaneously poison the end user. And I get it. It's all bottom line. It's cheaper to use that caulking than it is to use the one that doesn't off gas.

1:28:02BubblemanIt's cheaper to use the battery that's off gassing. I understand the reason people do it. It's always a monetary reason. It just seems like, you know, something that should be known.

1:28:17SpeakerI wish it was a monetary reason because that would make sense to me. But sometimes I crack open these vapes and I find like weird chemicals. I'm like, that's an expensive chemical. Why would they put that in there? It would be cheaper not to put that in there. And I think what it comes down to is stigma, where in a lot of engineers in China, Don't have a relation to this drug.

1:28:45SpeakerAnd for them, they're just selling a device for druggies in America in their mind. And some of them have come here and have experience and they understand that, no, this could be someone's mother who needs it for their arthritis. This could be someone who needs it for sleep. This is not a drug. This is a medicine. And they approach it differently. And we don't have to reinvent the wheel because all of these standards are already set for other industries.

1:29:13SpeakerSo if we're dealing with pharmaceutical standards and construction and quality, you're not going to deal with these health hazards. As soon as you start making it like a cell phone, you deal with these health hazards. And these weird design choices are usually out of laziness, where someone just finds a fast fix that KPI set and they can move on. And they don't really think about it too much.

1:29:35SpeakerSo if you make them care, they think about it. And then you don't have these problems.

1:29:41BubblemanIt's easier to care when you're a user. You know, and it's easier not to care when you think your device is being used by druggies in America.

1:29:51Collin PalmerYeah, and here's the other thing, you know, I come from a kind of a weird hybrid background of like design and in designers, there's a whole new set of ego. I'll just openly say that all you designers out there, there's a whole new set of ego that comes to the table when you're dealing with design, engineering components. Thank you for joining us.

1:30:34Collin PalmerThat's what I've noticed is that we need a Dieter Rams of cannabis that can kind of come in and see what we need and really drive that forward. Because these are choices. Like you said, these are cognitive choices we're making. Just like we're as hash makers, there's a due process to get to that end. Thank you so much for joining us.

1:31:15Collin PalmerThank you so much.

1:31:36Collin PalmerI think five years ago it was a little murky, but now it seems like factories, to your point, are getting to the point where there is efficacy. You still have to watch out. You don't want to walk in and see aluminum being dropped into... You know, vats of acid that are then being attached to 510 thread carts, you know. So it seems like there's a lot of those things happening.

1:32:03Collin PalmerHow do you guys deal with that on your end when you, you know, you have a machine like C-Cell, so you're very fortunate to have the years of them already going through a lot of this stuff, but... You know, when you guys run up against challenges, what are some of the things that you see today that could be better from an efficacy point of view?

1:32:32Collin PalmerAnyone?

1:32:34BubblemanBueller?

1:32:35Collin PalmerGo ahead, Steven.

1:32:38BubblemanSteven, you got this.

1:32:39Collin PalmerCome on, I know there's something. You're holding it back. Yeah, yeah.

1:32:45SpeakerYeah, that's a tough one. All right. So I think we need to have more R&D in America, honestly. So it's impossible to really like what they have in China is incredible. They have incredible labs, incredible equipment, really brilliant people working really hard. But that's over there. And they don't have our media and they don't have our variety of genetics and Chemical diversity or material compatibility, you know, they can't do that.

1:33:21SpeakerSo they need to bring that here. And what Mark and Danny said, you know, we can't bring that here because that machine is too big. So that is the disconnect. So we need a way to be able to test these products either in China Thank you for joining us.

1:34:12SpeakerFor other divisions manufacturing, even in America. So I see them growing from a Chinese company to an international company. And that jump is going to really help us, but it takes time, you know, that, that growth. So we have to be a little bit patient in that regard for them to make that transition and at this and push them to adopt international standards rather than Chinese standards.

1:34:41Collin PalmerSure. Yeah, that's fair to say. That's well put. Is there any pain points that you see from components like a lack of, you know, let's say a certain component that stresses things out in terms of supply chain or anything like that? Do you guys run into any of those types of issues?

1:35:00SpeakerWell, C-Cell is a vertically integrated company. They make everything themselves. And that's also a really important point when talking about competitors where none of the other ones are. So, um, you know, you may be getting a coil from one factory. You'll be getting your ceramics from another factory. They'll be assembled in another factory. The R and D and design was done in another factory. So like everything is hodgepodge then you, the likelihood of someone cutting a corner is really high because you know, it's going to someone else afterwards.

1:35:32SpeakerSo, um, in CESA, we have that full accountability. So if we did find lead, for example, in one of our tests down the road, You know, there would be hell to pay. You know, someone would lose a job. That would be a big deal. So, you know, that vertical integration allows for strong accountability in the company.

1:35:55SpeakerSo it's, you know, like what we're trying to do is avoid unintentional mistakes. You know, like we may come across a good example of silicone, for example. The silicone seals. I know, you know, that terpenes react with silicone. And every single vape in the world has silicone in them. I think about that every day. With very few exceptions. Yeah. Yeah, no, it's funny. It's a problem.

1:36:26Collin PalmerYeah, you're right. So, you know, with that said, you know, because I've thought about it, is that a lack of material? Understanding just just we could swap it out for this and not use that. Or is that a deeper dive in your.

1:36:42SpeakerI mean, let me ask you. Let me let me go for it.

1:36:47Collin PalmerYeah, I love it. Well, look, I would go on a deep dive on material change, right? That would be my first go, right? Immediately. I'd say, look, we have to start doing, you know, long-term tests and understand everything from the SDS all the way down and then see what leaches and what doesn't and be honest with ourselves and then make a material change and do, you know, invest in that.

1:37:13Collin PalmerBut again, that's easier said than done, right?

1:37:18SpeakerWe did that. So now I have the choice of two materials, a very chemical resistant variant of silicone, which will reach less than normal silicone, or a fluorinated polymer like Teflon. What would you pick? And you know, like, We're dealing with microplastics, permanent environmental damage, potentially, you know, like...

1:37:44Collin PalmerThe lesser of evils is really the question, right? It's like, you know what I mean? Because it's... That's the truth of it. I think for the audience, what we're saying is they're both not great options, but one versus the other, you know, pound for pound, they're kind of the same in different ways. You know, they're both pretty evil. So... So I think that's for the consumer to work with.

1:38:10BubblemanCan the loss be measured though, right? The reaction that's happening. Does it happen over the time that you have a vape pen in your pocket or is it like a six month stability test or a six month, like how long? Because that's what I always wondered, you know, when people put like, like for me, I got turned on to this very early, earlier than most. But I used to ask all my friends, like, Why would you put that over your weed?

1:38:55BubblemanDon't use that. Don't use this little. And I can't even tell you, this might have been almost 30 years ago that I started having this realization. Right when I met Skunk Man Sam, because he really opened my mind. I mean, I'd read the book, Hashish. A lot of it was sort of historical context for me, like, oh, where cannabis came from and the traveling of. And for me, like, all I wanted to know about was hashish.

1:39:25BubblemanJust wanted to know about hashish. And so meeting Dave was really the eye opener to learning more than I mean, he was just like. I don't know if I could have met a better person in the entire world to teach me about hash than that man. I got very lucky when you really think about it. It was like people talk about winning the lottery. I won the lottery.

1:39:46BubblemanAll of these people were like, oh, my God, this is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool. This is so cool.

1:40:05BubblemanI was like, oh yeah, about what? He's like, oh, I asked a question about breeding. I'm like, yeah, that would have been the skunk man. But he just replied to me. It's like, yeah, of course he replied to you. Like the way we move things forward is by having dialogue with everyone, not choosing who we have dialogue based on some mental construct of importance or whatever that you're trying to base it on.

1:40:26BubblemanSo yes, shout out to skunk man, San Bingo Lombardi. Always nice to be able to bring him up. I think it's a wild and interesting conversation. And it always goes back to the same thing with these pens is not that the people who use them ever have these conversations. I swear to God, the people who have these conversations are the people who don't use the pens. And the people who don't use the pens are very worried about the pens.

1:40:52BubblemanIt's like they smoke in glue and paper and plant matter, but they're extremely worried about the pens. I am not to say I've sat on both sides of the fence with my judgments and my opinions. But as I get older, I just kind of leave it up to look. These things are not going away. They are convenient and they are effective. And because of that, they're not going to go away.

1:41:14BubblemanSo then it I think that leads us to be, like your company, what you can do is make them as good as possible. Try to figure out breakthroughs, try to figure out new understandings. It seems like, and I think I'm right when I say this, that you guys are willing to uncover an expensive mistake. Not a lot of companies are. Do you know what I mean by that?

1:41:36BubblemanYou guys are looking to make sure things are safe, and if you discover something's not, Adam Dizzle, Nick, Skully Vibes, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm, Storm,

1:42:03BubblemanYou know, while like selling vape hardware. Like I said, when I first met vape hardware people, like you were the first people I ever met that sold vape, second, because that Gary guy was the same way. He just seemed intent on blowing off his own foot. He was just like, he was just going to find every bad thing that you could put in a vaporizer, expose it and make, and by the way, he had made a unit and I don't think I have one anymore.

1:42:27BubblemanOh. This might be it. This is a company that copied his unit, but this is exactly what his unit looked like. It's a completely reusable over and over. This was years ago. His company went under since, but he ran two kilos of oil through this pen. He ran two kilos of oil through a pen. Savage. Like savage, bro. But high integrity, low profit. He's he just do you know what I mean?

1:42:55BubblemanAnd I like how do we maintain an aspect of like, look, we have to like everyone has to get paid or the company goes under. We don't exist anymore. How do you measure the profit margins versus the you know, because in the cannabis industry in particular, it seems to be like bad if you make profit. Like people are like, what do you mean you made profit? It's like, well, I put in 80 hours a week.

1:43:18BubblemanLike I have to make profit, dude. Like, do you want to talk to my wife? She'll explain it to you. You know what I mean? Like, holy shit. All the married men smiled.

1:43:32SpeakerHey, we're competing against 60 cent carts. I mean, dude, it's impossible. You don't want to know what's in those.

1:43:38BubblemanDude, I know. I know. And I have people hit me up daily to tell me they have the 60 cent carts. I can get you 60 cent carts like you don't need to be spending all that money. And I'm like, oh, my God, dude, listen. The world has to stop taking the hit, okay? Businesses have to start taking the hit. You just have to make less, but it's a better product.

1:44:00BubblemanThat's it. It is a bummer. Trust me, I'm competing with $30 bubble bags.

1:44:10BubblemanSo it is what it is. And it's funny because it happens in all aspects. The live hash rosin market. I don't like to say we're competing, but the market is competing with like $10 distillate pens, you know, with, with botanical terpenes that are like, haven't even been distilled. So like, you know, when you buy like the D-Limonene, 5% of it is citric acids. You have to distill them out of the material.

1:44:36BubblemanThey're orange. Horatio and I went through this on a video we did years ago in his lab, the inner sanctum of Horatio Delbert. He was doing extracts with D-Limonene and they kept tasting like orange. And I was like, there's something going on, dude. And He just kept having these conversations with Dr. Mark and he eventually figured out that if he distilled it, he could remove these contaminants out.

1:45:01BubblemanWell, that's the thing, right? It's really about learning the knowledge of distilling, whatever it is, whatever it is you're in the middle of distilling. It all plays a part. And the amount of people that are smoking on these pens, because I had a moment early on, I did the pen and then I had no pen. And then I was like, I don't know if I want to do pens.

1:45:19BubblemanAnd I was like, of course I want to do pens. Like, why wouldn't I want to do pens? Seems like a no brainer because the purpose from my perspective, I used to want to teach everyone to, uh, And now I've shifted into I would very much like everyone to taste some of my hash, some of what we're offering out into the market. And it's been it's been a really cool experience getting back to the US for the first time in almost 30 years.

1:45:51BubblemanI'm so excited to be here today. I'm so excited to be here today.

1:46:08BubblemanIt's like every show. Hey, are you going to go to the show? No. Are you going to go to so-and-so's 60th birthday? No. Oh, are you going to come down for the funeral? No. It was just all a bummer. And now it's all so good. I'm allowed to go down there. I'm Thank you so much for joining us.

1:46:41BubblemanI can meet people in and around. I'm blabbering on, but basically all I'm saying is I appreciate you guys and I appreciate my ability to come down there. And I will appreciate being able to come down there and snowboard in the very near future if and ever you guys get snow again. Colorado. That was a weird time to go to Colorado for the first time. I was just like, is this normal, Dan?

1:47:03BubblemanAnd just you guys don't have snow. And he's like, no, bro, this is not normal.

1:47:06SpeakerYeah, it was the worst winter I think on record. Next year should be better. We'll get up on the slopes.

1:47:12BubblemanYeah, absolutely. Well, Ted was kind enough to and shout out to Ted, my other partner in Colorado, who's also friends with Danny, who there's just this super trippy, cool me and Ted and Danny trio there. So that's another person that kind of brought our groups together. I like when the groups get brought together in a very organic manner, like Danny making bubble with his dad using my bags.

1:47:38BubblemanDude, that is the greatest way for us to meet. Ever.

1:47:44SpeakerI mean, absolutely. So cool, dude. So cool. And the Ted story is rad, too. I think I met Ted at the Gorge. We were at a pretty light show. And he was hanging with some of my old buddies from Colorado. And next thing we know, we're talking about weed. And I flew out to St. Louis. And he had this nice little clandestine lab under his house in St. Louis under his cabin.

1:48:11SpeakerAnd And then we found out he knew you and he's like, oh yeah, I'm talking to Mark. It's just like, I love, I love that. The world and the energy, it just brings the good ones together, you know?

1:48:23BubblemanYeah, no, it really does. And Ted is definitely one of the good ones. He's hilarious, just an absolute character of a guy. But I drove back from Moffett when I was down in south of Colorado. I drove back with him and we ended up driving by all the big mountains like Keystone and Copperhead and I don't know, there was like five of them that we drove by and I was just like, yeah, I need to get back up here with my board and yeah, get on the plank.

1:48:52BubblemanFor me, it's my favorite thing in the whole world to do more than, my second favorite thing would be motorcycles, but snowboarding is my favorite. Like ripping down a mountain, just spraying powder and all you can hear in the background is your nut bar friends going, whoo! It's a woo-hoo day, we call it. It's a woo-hoo day.

1:49:18SpeakerIt sounds like we need to get to Nelson, my man, and do a little cat mission.

1:49:23BubblemanYeah, I think so. My buddy's trying to get me up to, what is it? Bald Face? Yeah, I think, yeah, it's actually, if you want me to send you the link, he's planning it right now, a cat trip up there. He went last year and said it was great.

1:49:40SpeakerYeah, please. Danny and I would probably have to make a R&D journey.

1:49:46BubblemanDude, those are important journeys. We could test the units. You know, Steve's going to want to know how they work in snow and temperature and elevation. And dude, we'll track all that shit.

1:49:57SpeakerI'll put a little barometer on it. Manometer. There you go. Mountain vape.

1:50:02BubblemanSomeone asked earlier, can you take that thing up to 12,500 feet and spend the day on the mountains? Like, I don't know, but I am sure going to try.

1:50:10SpeakerHave you guys tested filling carts at different elevations? Like you were saying, you were mentioning you were doing your R&D down in Humboldt. Have you guys done any R&D at higher elevations? I have not, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did some stuff in a chamber in China. You know, but not here, not in America.

1:50:32BubblemanI will say from going out to Colorado, it opened up my mind in regards to hash making because it's so dry there, like incredibly dry. The cold supply chain becomes even more important. It's like super hard to preserve and cure material because even if you do properly, if people keep asking to see it and you're opening it and showing it no matter what, no matter how well you cured it, it's just It just turns to dust.

1:51:01BubblemanLike it is the craziest and dry sifting. Everything is different there. I wouldn't be surprised if the elevation is causing differences as well, especially for filling pens. What have you noticed, Dan? Because you must have done it at a lower level as well as 12,000.

1:51:18SpeakerYeah, I think I like filling at a high level and it coming down to the city. We normally are at 8,000 feet here. We used to grow up in Alma and And yeah, that cold temperature from making hash out on the porch in 2010 was always awesome. And the dry, not having all that extra humidity, I think plays nicely at times, but then can also hurt, you know, during like flour, for instance, the curing process in flour sometimes in Colorado, you have to add humidity.

1:51:47SpeakerAnd, you know, Colorado, I think is kind of known for some drier flour, you know, compared to California.

1:51:54BubblemanYeah, it was definitely dry. The hash reacted differently. I had to kind of shift a little few things to just be like, oh, okay, this is different. Like I didn't really realize, I think, um, just for making certain products that I make like pre-rolled, uh, pure hash joints and some of the traditional hashes, like you definitely, things change in different places and, uh, It would be interesting as hash makers if we paid more attention to those variables, you know, the pressure, the height, the temperature, the humidity, all of these things.

1:52:32BubblemanHumidity is a big one, plays a drastic effect. Aaron Weissman, Chief Executive Officer, St. John's Baptist Church, St. John's Baptist Church, St. John's Baptist Church, St. John's Baptist Church, St. John's Baptist Church,

1:52:57BubblemanWe're going to take a short break and we'll be right back.

1:53:19BubblemanThank you so much for watching.

1:53:45BubblemanI was like, John, you are so lucky that didn't go into my eye. Like, I'm just not going to lie. Like, I can forgive you, but I don't think I would have forgived you if it got in my, like, hot, boiling hash on your eyeball. Crack, snappling, and popping all day long. I love you, Johnny B, but that shit was insane. That shit was insane. So back to the shout out to Corey and the rosin reactor.

1:54:10BubblemanWhat do you guys, are you, are you just telling your customers you should check out the rosin reactor or the Pele Porre or how are you suggesting people decarb their oil, if you are at all, for filling different carts? Do you guys have different SOPs or is it just kind of like, it's not in our, we don't have to deal with that. People can just do whatever they want.

1:54:32SpeakerI think at this stage in the industry, most established manufacturers have their own SOPs, but I get questions all the time on how to decarb. I'm always happy to help. We had a DSC in our lab, which is a really cool machine. It's kind of like a calorometer. And we put very pure THCA into it at 99.99% purity and ran through this...

1:55:03SpeakerThank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

1:55:33SpeakerUm, essentially, that's great if you wanted to go on a fundamental basis. In reality, people have equipment considerations and budget considerations, and you have to talk to them about like, all right, what do you got in your lab? You know, what are you working with? You know, what did you buy already? What did you spend $60,000 on already? And then optimize through that process. So, um, Some people believe in the low and slow process.

1:56:03SpeakerI think that's great if you have everything mixed together. My philosophy is separate your volatiles and anything that you don't want to be heated from the things you want to be decarbed. Decarb the shit out of it and then add it back together. That's my philosophy.

1:56:22BubblemanThat's a great philosophy, actually. Steven's just given out SOPs on Hash Church, Dan.

1:56:29SpeakerYeah, I love it.

1:56:30BubblemanThat's super smart. You just like spin the turps off of it, decarb the fucking THCA, put it back together.

1:56:39SpeakerI mean, there's a million ways to skin a cat. You don't have to spin it. You could crystallize it. I mean, all sorts of different things you can do. Yeah.

1:56:48BubblemanThe reason I ask the question is because it seems like it's so important that the more people get decarbing right... The more your product works, the way it was designed to work. You know, like if you're putting half, like 80% decarbed or even 90, but getting microscopic crystallization of THC, fogging out the cart and thicken up the oil and slowing down the combustion, It just doesn't, like you want people to use your product the right way.

1:57:17BubblemanAnd it seems like DeCarb, I see the Cannabrand Solutions, because you're a solutions company, the DeCarb Solutions, and it's based exactly on what you just said. It's based on tell us what you're working with. What did you just spend 60 grand? If not, it's like here. This is one of the cheapest ways you can do it. You know, the Pele Pore, it's about five grand. It's a pretty affordable way to decarb rosin.

1:57:43BubblemanYou know, I'm sure there's other varieties that you guys could come up with just because it seems like you it would be a nice little here you go. Customers like don't do this wrong. Because if you do, our product will not appear to be working as well as it was designed to work.

1:58:03SpeakerFor sure. For sure. That's exactly what we're trying to do. And we will help any customers who ask any recommendations on DeCarb. It's a very sensitive issue. A lot of customers really care about their SOPs and don't want to change their media. They're very sensitive to their products and their customers are receptive to that product. And once I start telling people how to do their product, You know, where does the uniqueness of their product come into play?

1:58:32BubblemanWe don't have to tell them as much as just this is just an offering that comes with our product. By all means, decarb however you want. Yeah. But, you know, there are wrong ways to do it. Whether people want to be sensitive about that or not, I don't care. It's just like, dude, if you're doing it wrong. Here's the thing with my SOPs. I always want to make them better.

1:58:54SpeakerYeah.

1:58:54BubblemanYeah. I'm not interested in locking them in and being like, this is what people are going to get and they're going to get it forever. It's like, no, I want to like I want as as time changes, as things change and as The way we consume and popularity changes, right? Like right now we're in this fresh frozen world of let's preserve as many of these monoterpenes as possible.

1:59:15BubblemanThey are more caustic. They are sharper on the throat. People love them. That could shift. We could shift into, you know, right now we have a lot of very young people that are into cannabis, a bigger group than ever. Well, maybe in 20 to 30 years when they're all in their fifties, they'll have this revelation that like, I don't know if I want to smoke the monos as much anymore as, you know, just using that as sort of as an example.

1:59:38BubblemanBut yeah, I mean, listen, I sold my product with very specific SOPs. And when people wrote me back and said, why does my hash not melt like yours? I told them exactly why. And let me tell you, nine out of ten times, they did not want to hear that they had to create a 20 year relationship with soil and plants and genetics. And they just didn't want to hear that.

2:00:00BubblemanThey were just like, oh, well, can I just blast it and get a gold oil? I was like, absolutely you can. And that's what 90% of people went and did. And that's why the full melt hash world grew so slowly, because there's only really the very few who were like chefs, right? It was a Michelin star. You know, who doesn't want six Michelin hash stars, right? You want the six star.

2:00:21BubblemanThat's what you want. And if you can't get it, it's a weird thing to give up on and be like, settle for like much, much, much, much, much less. BHO was a major reason why that happened to bubble hash, because there was this massive pathway for people to take. As BHO slowed down and more people blew up and burned themselves and only the hardcore is really stuck around.

2:00:43BubblemanBubbles started growing again and people were starting to pay attention to making hash and then Soil Grown pressed a bud. And once he did that, it was like people didn't need to grow great herb anymore because they could press mediocre bubble and make pretty great rosin. You know, so that's, I still look forward to the days where we find the pathway that is the six star, where maybe we have the six star, you know, Carts on the, you know, in the market, which is what I showed earlier.

2:01:15BubblemanI don't know if anyone remembered when I showed that earlier, but here I'll show it one more time. This was from Corey from the rosin reactor. And this is a Piatella no squish rosin cart. Like, how fucking insane is that? Like, dude, I want to I want to make full melt six star Piatella Carts. No squish.

2:01:45Collin PalmerI am so- This takes a ton of material, dog. This takes a ton of material.

2:01:49BubblemanDon't you have acres, Colin?

2:01:51Collin PalmerWe do, but listen, that guy, he probably, look, I know what that takes. And he took probably a lot of material for a little squeeze on that thing. And now I bet it's amazing, but we got to figure out a way to scale that now. Well, think about it.

2:02:05BubblemanIt's more scalable than rosin because he's using bubble. Is it though? Well, he's using bubble and you're using rosin. So what are your losses versus his? Yours have to be higher. You're squishing the bubble. So you're getting a loss there, right? And then you're decarbing. All he's doing is decarbing.

2:02:21Collin PalmerOh, you're saying, so he's going through a decarb process. I thought you were saying like true patella where you like pulls it off.

2:02:27BubblemanHe had to, he had to, he had to decarb it.

2:02:32Collin PalmerGot it. Yeah. Even patella because it's a solid. Yeah. So I don't imagine that's just a little thicker. Yeah. Now you're getting my brain working.

2:02:41BubblemanExactly.

2:02:42Collin PalmerExactly, dude. I got to do it. I'm going to go do it. I'll do it next week.

2:02:48SpeakerWhat's that, Steven? So like around the trichome, you have this cuticle, waxy cuticle. And in order, when you're making Piatella, that's going to be dissolved in your terpene mixture. Correct. And then you're going to decarb that all together. And you're going to have a lot of fats and lipids.

2:03:10BubblemanThe same ones that are in rosin.

2:03:13SpeakerMore.

2:03:14BubblemanMore, but they're also present in rosin. But keep in mind, the fats and lipids, when those proper components that cannabis has had for thousands of years, the one that keeps us from getting lung cancers and bronchitis and pneumonias from smoking and inhaling these resins, are present in both the bubble and... The rosin. That's true. Yeah. Fact. Yeah. So thank God for that. Because I remember my BHO buddies, like when it first came out, they were loving it.

2:03:45BubblemanAnd then they all started getting the drippy nose and the... And even like it took a while, but eventually someone was like, this isn't normal. And the minute they started winterizing and getting rid of that shit, it just wasn't an issue anymore. And I never seen that from anyone that I know that smokes rosin. No one that I know that smokes rosin is having like chronic bronchitis and pneumonia the way I did see with BHO.

2:04:11SpeakerI think the big problem with BHO was CRC and a lot of people CRC incorrectly and they're imparting silica particles into their media, which were then inhaling in small amounts or other weird chemical contingents that are getting into it through activated media.

2:04:27BubblemanThat came way after. This is early days when no one even knew, but you're right. And Jorge from Chemtech came on here and did a very good little conversation on CRC and how, you know, to use it right is to use very little of it. It's like, you just want to, it's like, we didn't want to get rid of the colors. We just wanted to like, just remove this, this layer.

2:04:51BubblemanAnd people just went crazy and was like, we want that white, white. It's like, okay, holy shit.

2:04:58SpeakerYeah, you can CRC safely, but a lot of people don't. That's the problem.

2:05:04BubblemanYeah, well, this is the problem we're talking about with everything, right, Steve? I mean, this is the problem that you guys are dealing with. You're competing with 60 cent carts that are not safe in any way, shape or form. And here's the beautiful thing generally about companies that undercut and sell dangerous things. They usually have like some of the biggest sales. Because people are just always willing to go down that pathway of I don't know what it is.

2:05:30BubblemanIt's just like we people choose shitty more often than not. And I guess we do it under the guise of our wallets. I mean, I certainly don't live what I would call like I don't drive a Rolls Royce. I don't wear like four thousand dollar T-shirts. And what do you mean, dude? Stop. You have the you have the super cruiser.

2:05:48Collin PalmerI've seen it, dude. Come on, dude.

2:05:50BubblemanI got this fucking race, bro. No, but you know what I mean? Like, for the most part, I'm in the mediocre. I'm like, not like I'm good with the mediocre. I'm good with like a $40 cap. Like, this is perfect for me. At the same time, I want six star and I want higher quality when it comes to smoking. Cannabis is this very strange, unique way of getting into our minds and making sure at least some of us, you know, and I'm sure we're a small percentage compared to the masses that use cannabis.

2:06:19BubblemanWhich is probably why brickweed was so popular for so long. It probably still would be today if it came on the market. Probably people would be like, yeah, this is great. I'm fine with this. I'm just rolling it in a huge, thick, export green rolling paper that's like cardboard. Oh my goodness.

2:06:37SpeakerI mean, there's people who drink Folgers. There's people, you know, that's it.

2:06:41BubblemanThat's it. There's always levels. So, you know, I find and I don't know if you guys find this because I are you able to fuel the entire market? Are you guys like you've got your podium products that you want to make, but you also are making products for distillate carts and whatever cart that people want to put in. You guys are just trying to make the sort of best version of each of those grades, correct?

2:07:06SpeakerYeah, for sure. Yeah.

2:07:08BubblemanYeah. I think it's a good way because what I notice about any market is that swag is always the biggest aspect of the market and it's like the easiest part to make better. And so for a while I was locked into this, I can only have the top podium product. And then I realized, well, no, I want to make sure that I get hash to all the different groups We've got people that are like newbies that are just starting to smoke and only want to spend like 10 bucks versus people that are like, I'll drop 60 bucks on a gram of full melt or whatever.

2:07:40BubblemanI want to be able to sell hash to all those different groups. The harder group is the top group, the lower group, because they're getting sold such crap. I find, and maybe you guys do as well, it's easier to make that product better. You know, not the best by any means because they're not choosing the $3 or whatever cart, but the one that's the most affordable for them that's still much better than what's, you know, currently on the market.

2:08:07SpeakerI mean, how much innovation can you put into a cart like that's a dollar or less? That's what I'm saying. Then you start cutting corners on... The manufacturing, the materials, it gets real dirty. The facilities are just not clean. I mean, when you walk into our factory, we're like wearing full suits, clean rooms, you know, there's just, that's not happening in most facilities there. So that's, it's all about cutting the corners on all aspects of the manufacturing, not just the materials.

2:08:37BubblemanWell, that's good. That's how it makes it more affordable, right? So I totally get that. yeah it is what it is you gotta you gotta put good products out there because people are willing to cut every corner look at corners on a circle and i don't even know how you do that well We've been going for a couple of hours, just over two hours here on our season 12 episode.

2:09:07BubblemanWe talked a little bit about snowboarding, talked a lot about vape pens, a little bit about the Bubble Man brand, which is what we're doing with Dan in Colorado and in New Mexico, and maybe Massachusetts soon. We'll see how that works out. But yeah, we're definitely excited to be releasing the all-in-one, the vision box with... From Cannabrand Solutions. I love mine when I'm there. I'm always stoked to get another one.

2:09:33BubblemanI guess what I really got to do is get some in Canada so I can fill my own and like have my own here in Canada. Because I will say in Canada, I am vape penless. I don't have like a vape pen in Canada. Is that not a crime?

2:09:48SpeakerWe can fix that. We'll send you some of the branded ones.

2:09:51BubblemanOh, that's what's up. Yeah, then I can just drop my own. You know, I just got like some big jars. Just... Brought that right in there.

2:09:59SpeakerLike three hour drive from. From your spot in Lions Bay. So I know I got to come down and visit you guys.

2:10:06BubblemanAnd vice versa, you guys should come up here. But I definitely need to drive over the border. I haven't done that yet. I've just been flying. I need to, you know, drive over and open that up to my mind to realize that I could just like be driving down anytime I want, which is pretty cool. I want to go see Logan and Wenatchee as well, which I think is about maybe five, five plus hours away.

2:10:29SpeakerYeah, yeah. Wenatchee. Wenatchee. Wenatchee. Wenatchee.

2:10:36BubblemanWhat about Wenatchee? Wenatchee Patachi, no? Oregon? Oregon? Oregon, yeah.

2:10:46SpeakerWashington, Washington.

2:10:48BubblemanWashington, really?

2:10:49SpeakerWashington machine.

2:10:50BubblemanWell, listen, if you think that's good, my wife used to take the train up to Prince George like three days a week. It was like a 15-hour train ride each way. And she'd stop in a place just north of Whistler called Lillooet. And she had an American dude on there, and he went between the carts outside, and he was smoking a butt. And my wife caught him, and she's like, hey, man, you can't do that.

2:11:15BubblemanAnd he was very upset. And he said, are you trying to tell me I can't smoke till Liliot Oot? And so he renamed Liliot forever for all of me and all my friends. We all call it Liliot Oot now. It's the greatest mispronunciation of a city or place that I have personally ever heard in my life. And he was so mad when he said it. Apparently, it made it even funnier.

2:11:38BubblemanMy wife burst out laughing. So shout out to her for mocking me. The Lillio Lute Passenger. Is everyone puffing on? I don't see you guys puffing on much. You got some pens filled with something?

2:11:53SpeakerGot a couple.

2:11:54BubblemanOkay. Wow. You got some big fancy ones. How big is that?

2:11:57Collin PalmerWhat did you... Ooh. Got some grapes and cream. Got some Superboof in our AIO.

2:12:07BubblemanIt's going to New York. I got some Bubble Up Full Melt Bubble.

2:12:14SpeakerI got some jet lag.

2:12:15BubblemanOh, damn, that's good. That's the good stuff.

2:12:20SpeakerYeah, I had some of that myself.

2:12:24BubblemanYeah, you just got back as well, ATN, not from China, but from Austria and Italy.

2:12:29SpeakerItaly, yeah, I just came back, was in Milan yesterday. So, yeah, opposite sides of the world, Mark.

2:12:35BubblemanAnd Chan was convincing the world not to execute people for cannabis in some countries that they still like to do that in, so...

2:12:45SpeakerIt turns out he's fighting the good fight. Kevin Sabet and the boys were out playing, so we had to go play opposite side of the field there and kick their ass. So, you know, it's what we do.

2:12:56BubblemanDude, good for you. I can't believe you saw that guy. That guy is like devoid of reality. He's just is not living.

2:13:03SpeakerOh, no, no, no, no, no. We saw him on the tram. And it was the look in his face was, oh, shit, we're off campus. And I just stood there at the doorway and just looked at him, just took pictures of him and just looked at him like the bitch that he is. It was just, oh, it's just, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, yeah, he was fucking with my boys, too.

2:13:26SpeakerHe was winking at one of my guys. I almost had to go to the UN and be like, hey, look, we have nothing against same sex marriages, but your boy keeps winking at my guy here. And, you know, if he needs to either put up or shut up, you know, don't tease my boy. So, yeah, it's just dumb shit. UN, you know, no, it's very professional. It's very civil there.

2:13:45SpeakerEverybody is very worldly. But yeah. They still want to kill people for pot, and we're like, stop that. Yeah, they're kind of, they're listening. I mean, we feel that we're making headway. Of course, we had an amazing side event honoring our friend Wade Laughter, who was a regular here on Hash Church, but he was also a regular with our Veterans Action Council. And yeah, people, writing our friend Derek Bergman from VOC in the Netherlands did a write up because he was there and he said there wasn't a dry eye in the house when Boris was showing, you know, the videos and pictures of those butterfly children.

2:14:35SpeakerNow, even those jazz pharmaceutical people in the corner were all tearing up. I mean, because they talk the talk about CBD and it's another thing to actually see what is done and what is needed. And they seemed rather humbled and human in the situation, but that's why we did it. We did it to honor a friend. When we brought Monica over and Forrest, Forrest presentation, Let me tell you, devastating to non-believers or anybody who doesn't believe in the aspect of medical cannabis.

2:15:10SpeakerYou cannot look at those videos and see those children and see the effect and the before and after and hold your shit together. And yeah, credit to Forrest, man. I mean, he puts together a powerful presentation, but that's because he's lived it. You know, he has had to raise his child. And this was the first time he was out of the country in 18 years, folks. Since he's had his child.

2:15:37SpeakerSo we were very honored to have him and gave him and Monica the chance to go enjoy Vienna where they could. But Forrest is like, where do you need me? And he was there walking the halls, talking the talk, educating various people to the point where for some historical context here, the side events that are hosted at the United Nations are usually midweek. For some reasons, ours was put as the last on Friday.

2:16:07SpeakerWell, most of the events are done Monday through Thursday. So there's very few people at the UN for the CND except, you know, major diplomats, etc. And I literally said to our people, I bet you we have maybe, what, five people in our room? Boy, was I very wrong. It was packed. Every seat was filled. And that was a shocker for me. I was humbled and happy about it.

2:16:37SpeakerDon't get me wrong. But at the same time, we were navigating the, of course, the room that we were in, the camera was out. So we had to literally figure out our whole Zoom thing on the fly, which we did. And yeah, we were able to get that going. So yeah. Yeah, it was just an amazing experience. It was wonderful to share it with Monica. She, of course, broke down in tears afterwards.

2:17:01SpeakerIt was just an amazing experience. And it sounds from people who were there, it came through that way. And We didn't intend it that way. We were humbled that it came out wonderfully. And more than anything, we were happy to honor and enshrine our friend in the UN forever. So that's the best that we could hope for. And it took us eight months of planning to do it.

2:17:26SpeakerAnd it literally came together the morning of. So it's a lot of planning, but a lot of happy accidents along the way. And St. Wade helped make it possible. Thank you, Wade. We love you.

2:17:41BubblemanHell yeah, dude. That's awesome. I don't know if you've ever met these guys at TAN before that are in the room right now. Mark and Stephen and Danny are all from Cannabrand Solutions. And Daniel is my partner in Colorado and New Mexico. Nice.

2:18:00SpeakerHappy to meet you. I think, Mark, you've been on Hash Church before, but to the others, I hope to meet you all in person and to blow a few bowls together, at least. Because fuck it.

2:18:13BubblemanAbsolutely, dude. Yeah, ATN started the Berkeley Patients Group and has been doing that for a very long time and is a veteran and How's this veteran council that he does once or twice or three times a week? I get those emails, dude, and I always feel bad that I don't show up, but I will show up.

2:18:31SpeakerIt's for you. You're welcome to any time, you know, but no. Yeah, we I I work my PTSD out from my worst shit from 35 years ago by helping and, you know, other people and moving the issue and driving it forward. And I work along a lot of great activists from around the world. And, you know, just happy to be a small cog in a big picture of things trying to make this move forward so that, you know, I look, I'm a patient.

2:19:01SpeakerI'm a provider. I've been doing it for 26 going on 27 years, you know, legally in California. So it's needless to say, it's I always have vested stake in seeing the improvements. And it's been just watching the carts from 2010 just to today has been a...

2:19:25SpeakerA learning curve for producers, patients, and providers all in all, right? Because it started off with questionable technology, right? From the old cotton and fusings and trying to figure out ways to then peg and other type of lubricants to until we figured it out that you could actually use the terpenes in certain percentages to lubricate so it would actually work in these pans. you know you guys struggle you deal with a you know these pens come from you know two factories in china so you struggle with maybe not anymore they they educated us a little bit apparently okay apparently things are changing a little bit but yeah better i mean it's been shitty i mean because my my point was how do you craft such a great product to put it in such a shitty delivery method You know, no offense to anybody, but I mean, when you look at the technology, we've been stuck on this technological kind of, you know, treadmill for a while of what you could put into to make it work, right?

2:20:28SpeakerAs opposed to you starting with something and, you know, crafting it from the beginning. It's exactly what Stephen said today.

2:20:36BubblemanStephen literally said you have to craft it around the oil. Yeah. So that's where these guys are coming from.

2:20:44SpeakerGood. Fuck yeah. Because the technology, I mean, I mean, it's been, it's been sucky because we in North America don't have the technological production or haven't had in the past. It has been classically, you know, limited to the China. And of course that led us to a whole series of, you know, having to go through different educational campaigns, right? To let people know that, you know, those pens with a hole in the center, you don't want to get because you're inhaling and off gassing the, you know, All the other stuff that you don't want to actually be inhaling, right?

2:21:17SpeakerSo this is part of where we have had to, as the consumer patient, as well as the provider, educate the consumer so that they don't do harm, right? Because we're dealing with patients and we're looking at harm reduction. And so what's your long-term goals then looking at harm reduction to finally arrive at a tool that you can finally feel 100%

2:21:45SpeakerThat you could believe in. Does that even exist right now? Yeah. You know, there's this very strong follow the leader, to call it very politely, culture in China, where as soon as someone does something good, everyone does the same thing the next day.

2:22:07SpeakerI hope that happens more with our company and that other cheap brands start copying better standards. Because right now, when I go to a dispensary and I want to buy a cart, I don't know what I'm buying. Is it a C cell? Is it in another company? Is it an Alibaba? You know, I don't know what I'm getting. And there's no there's no label on the boxes.

2:22:34SpeakerSo we need as a whole industry to raise our bar, not just, you know, like. I could talk how well we do, but that doesn't mean someone else is going to do that well. And if the whole industry doesn't rise, then we all get stigmatized. So distillate is a good example as a media. They have all this weird conversions and THCP and poisons out there. And a lot of people are scared of distillate now, but you can make perfectly safe good distillate.

2:23:05SpeakerIt's possible, but no one does because there's so much garbage out there. So it's a really hard market. And when you're going to these cheapest denominator carts, you're getting poisoned. And that's just what it is. So unless there is some kind of accountability for these companies, we're not going to be seeing any changes.

2:23:27BubblemanSo can you give ATN a little bit of a insight into how you guys go about like, you know, making sure components are safe, just sort of some of the R&D you did with the group full of PhDs in the lab, like some of how deep that rabbit hole goes in regards to surface areas and off gassing and all of these things?

2:23:48Speakeryeah so um like i said most safety testing is done through a third party so we would go for like icpms testing for heavy metals and we would want to test extractables and leachables to see if there's any uh material compatibility issues or leaching going on with different uh housings so uh recently uh uh There's been a lot of talk about PCTG leaching in oils, and we haven't used PCTG.

2:24:21SpeakerWe use PA-12, which is nylon. Now, when I worked in the lab, a lot of my equipment was made out of nylon because it's extremely compatible with terpenes and butane and a lot of the commonly used chemicals in the lab for hydrocarbons.

2:24:40SpeakerI was immediately like, that perfectly makes sense to me that PA-12 would be totally compatible with oils in a cart. And when then we do the testing, we see no leaching and it's relatively safe. The term harm reduction would be the legal term.

2:25:02SpeakerWhen we're obviously glass is the best, you know, there's no question. And then stainless steel is the best. But when you start decreasing the cost of products, you may have to make compromises on certain materials. So PA-12 is also much more durable than glass. So if you drop it, you don't risk breaking your tank. So there's trade-offs with different materials back and forth. But ultimately, we go through that Material compatibility, aerosol testing, and then performance testing.

2:25:37SpeakerAnd performance testing was the bulk of our job at our SDR lab and third party for heavy metals, because that would have to be submitted legally.

2:25:52BubblemanWell, thanks for the share, Stephen.

2:25:54SpeakerNo problem. I completely understand when we first, I understand your fear and where it comes from. When we first did testing of cannabis testing originally in 08 and 09 and we started testing people's stuff, when it failed, they just took it elsewhere. And that was a problem for us, right? Because then it was like, oh shit, well... I have no authority to destroy it, right? Nor do I have the money to buy it to destroy it.

2:26:19SpeakerHowever, it's unethical for you now to take that and go sell that, right? And they did. People did that shit.

2:26:27Collin PalmerAnd they did a lot.

2:26:28SpeakerAnd so I realized quickly that, shit, what do we have to do? Well, I passed legislation in my city that the other dispensaries had to have testing. And then I got legislation through Prop 64 that made sure that cannabis had to be tested in the state of California. So it has to start somewhere and you have to be that litmus. And sometimes you have to be the person that has to be that that steps up and shows people how it's done.

2:26:53SpeakerI've been that example. I understand the fear, but at the same time, quality, you know, Thank you for watching.

2:27:17SpeakerCarts and Carts Technology, this is a technology front that needs to be explored more for the safety and efficacy of the patients, right? For sure. So that they're getting something that you're getting Right. We want to you're trying to one create the oil that replicates right this as close to the plant as possible. It's replicating. Right. So then you want a delivery method that's going to get it there as well.

2:27:48SpeakerBut, you know, they're also expected to be, you know, recyclable and biodegradable and, you know, all these things that carts are not. Right. And that's the other big problem with carts is they're the Non-disposable roaches of our, they're our dirty laundry that we can't get rid of, right? No one can recycle them. We've talked to this many times over the last decade. There's no recycling these. There's no pulling the metals and all that stuff out of them.

2:28:19SpeakerSo, you know.

2:28:21BubblemanWell, in the defense of recycling, you can't recycle about 80% of the stuff you think you're recycling. So if you want to go down that rabbit hole, it might be more than 80%. It might be 90%. And that is, I'm not trying to like say it's better or it's worse. I'm just saying that, yeah, we do use a lot of things that are not recyclable.

2:28:41SpeakerAnd my whole point out of this is I believe we can craft something that's more ecologically or reusably sound. It just does not currently exist. And I hope that it's someday we're able to arrive there. So something that is the reusable, recleanable, you know, that is, you know, Thank you for watching.

2:29:25SpeakerYeah, I've just seen so much stagnation in that field. I'm happy to see that there are people who are looking at changing the stagnant paradigm, shall we say. I agree, yeah. I would love it if in the future, in the near future, because there's all this talk, right, about recycling, and there's a lot of greenwashing out there, and I'm, you know, I started this company on the packaging side, really passionate and trying to dive into how do I find compostable materials?

2:30:06SpeakerI researched PLA with cornstarch-based polylactic acid, you know, and a few problems with that. Number one, economies of scale. It's three times as much right now as regular polypropylene, polyethylene, et cetera, right? But in order to get it to the same price, you need economies of scale. But no one wants to. How do you get there? Right. So it's what the fuck?

2:30:37BubblemanThat's insane. I just looked up plastics and only 9% of all plastics actually get recycled into products. I'm like, that's so fucked up. My wife's got me fucking separating out all this shit into these boxes every Friday. And now, and I'm just like, I'm like, look, I want to do this. I want to believe you're right. This greenwashing and virtue signaling, like we got to join reality.

2:31:04BubblemanOf like, how do we do this? Like, I saw a woman recently and she was, I think it was in an American Congress. And she was like, we got to get rid of plastics. And the guy just decimated her. He was like, really? Like, what about your plastic eyelashes and your plastic phone case and your plastic clothes and your plastic hair extensions and your plastic? And he just kept going on and on.

2:31:23BubblemanAnd she couldn't deny any of it. She's like, holy shit, your plastic water bottle. Oh, no. She said, oh, no, her water bottle was glass, but her top was plastic. And then he asked her what he thought she thought the pipes were made of that brought the water from in the building to the tap that she got the water from. And it was just all plastic. It's kind of like the petrochemical thing, like we need to get away from petrochemicals.

2:31:48BubblemanI'm not a bad person in the sense that I love the idea of moving in the right direction. What I don't like the idea of, particularly since COVID, when people blew this virtue signaling up to a new level where they decided to police me and tell me I had to wear a mask and get a fucking vaccine that never actually worked. I just lost my shit on all of it to the point where now I'm like, I'd like to be able to do the right thing, but I'd want to follow what the right thing really is versus someone's version of it who might be virtue signaling more than they really care about whatever.

2:32:21BubblemanBecause, you know, it is a big problem here. I don't see anyone doing anything about it for the recycling thing. Nobody cares. The plastic, it just all gets burned on some other country or goes into a landfill. It would be nice, and I kind of wish for this almost, there's so much lying and dishonesty in the world right now, and there's so much bullshit that it would be, if I were asked what I would like to get out of AI, I would love for AI to be called behind the curtain.

2:32:51BubblemanAnd you have an AI that's released into the world and it just gives you the true story on everything that's going on about everything. This is what this is. This is what this is. I think we'd all be super shocked to find some of the things we don't support we maybe should be and some of the things we do support we maybe shouldn't be. And it's just all so confusing with the internet and so much information and so much data.

2:33:14BubblemanSo much of it isn't even real. I like to just look at the things people post nowadays and I'll either remove the story by copying and pasting it or I'll remove a photo and I'll just put it into like three or four different AIs because I'm sure they're biased too, but I'll go perplexity. I'll go chat GPT. I'll go grok, you know, a couple of different AIs.

2:33:34BubblemanAnd and it's amazing how often the AI knows immediately. No, this is a complete and total fabrication. But people are getting into big arguments in the comments section about it. And I'm just like, oh, my God, like. I love the idea of moving in the right direction that doesn't harm humans, that's good for the planet, all of these sort of things, but that's based in reality. And that is a hard found thing.

2:33:59BubblemanI think that's why the product doesn't exist yet at ATN, to be honest.

2:34:04SpeakerWhat do you guys think about hemp plastics as like a viable option for, you know, alternative products?

2:34:10BubblemanI mean, I always thought it was a cool idea. It always looked more coarse and more rough than the... That's exactly what I was going to say.

2:34:17SpeakerHigh tinsel. And so it cracks really easily. So you actually have to add a polymer to it so it doesn't crack. And so it has lower tensile. Yeah, you have to add the other chemicals is a problem. And then there's no there's no recycling company that will touch it right now. Does it mean that it is impossible? It's just this is where we need leaders to create and be those people who can afford to spend that type of money.

2:34:41SpeakerBecause, as you know, all this shit is hella expensive to try to arrive there at environmental standards. Proper packaging, etc. People I have watched try to do it from the outset and never reach their market with a product because they try to do everything right from the get-go that literally the cost just sucks absolutely every bit of profit right out.

2:35:03BubblemanWell, it's, we talked about that a little bit earlier too. And that's why I was saying, well, are you guys only trying to make podium products? Are you also, you know, fueling the rest of the market? And they're like, no, of course we're going to fuel the rest of the market. It's easier in a sense to fuel those lower ends of the market by making the product just slightly different.

2:35:21BubblemanYou know, just a little bit, because some of the products, like you say, are poison. They're so garbage. It shouldn't be that hard to make one that's a little bit better and obviously a little bit more expensive, but still hitting that part of the market that is the I don't care part of the market. And then ATN brings a whole other, you know, we're mostly talking about the And then there's the recreational market, which, keep in mind, sells alcohol and tobacco, which kill millions of people annually.

2:35:48BubblemanSo then it becomes this sort of moot point of like, are we really arguing about the type of plastic case that goes around this vaporizer while six million people are dying from these recreational drugs? But then ATN takes it to a different level, which is now the medical patient. I don't know if there's many vape companies, you guys could correct me if you're one of them, that is focused on the medical aspect.

2:36:10BubblemanI've heard of nebulizers and other types of sort of inhalers that are used in the more medical aspect, but I don't know too much about medical vaporizers.

2:36:21SpeakerThere is one. There's a medical one that is being made. And of course, it is plastic. Its inserts are plastic. But the cannabis, of course, is not. However, what I have seen, but that's that this is a major patented product, et cetera. It's a big plastic blob. You know what I'm saying? So it's just unfortunately, the limitations of technology and then reproducing that technology at a medical level

2:36:50Bubblemaneffective level is a challenge right well because the most important part is access you can't make some stupid big blob and make it too expensive and not you can buy carts almost anywhere they are literally our sales guy earlier said they may be surpassing pre-rolled joints in colorado

2:37:07SpeakerSo to jump in here real quick. So that big blob, it's called a Psyche vaporizer. It's an Israeli dry herb vaporizer. It's a medical device that could be administered in a hospital. You know, that's the concept of it. And now we also have medical devices in CECL, a number of them. We have to separate the idea of a medical device and medical use because they're two different things.

2:37:35SpeakerOne is a regulatory issue and one is a consumer issue. So when we export to Europe, they may have a regulatory requirement for a quote-unquote medical device, which is paperwork. The device is the same as the device you would buy in America, one-to-one. It just went through the paperwork. And then you have the medical devices that are administered in a hospital and they have to be done on a metered dose.

2:38:02SpeakerSo that means that you know exactly how much you're consuming. And we're getting there as well on recreational side, but who really cares? So all of this, and you will never come into a situation where a hospital will say, give this man 200 cc's of cannabis, stat, or he's going to die. It's never going to happen. So, you know, I don't see the market for that. You know, I want that medical standard in devices.

2:38:31SpeakerThat's what I want.

2:38:35BubblemanWell, maybe you'll have to, you know, maybe you'll have to design it. Maybe ATN can help you.

2:38:40SpeakerYeah. Well, again, you said the economy, like how, how it's so expensive. It's economies of scale. Like they can't make it cheap enough, right? Even if someone wanted to make that device medical grade and have it, you know, be available in Europe and the US, they just can't make enough of them to make it affordable for the average.

2:38:58BubblemanThey make things for hospitals knowing that they are going to charge the most outlandish price ever. If you could get catch eyes on like a hospital order form for beds, for bed, for anything that goes to a hospital, it's literally worse than buying something for a boat. You know, like a barbecue.

2:39:17SpeakerWhy it's so expensive.

2:39:19BubblemanThat's exactly why it's so expensive. Hospitals charge an enormous amount. Oh my God. Oh my God, dude. Don't even get me started. But it's true. So it's a good reply.

2:39:28SpeakerYou can get the Storks and Bickles Volcano by insurance in the Netherlands and in Germany. So, you know, there's... That's fucking awesome. That's a medical device. Yeah. Right. So it's a medical device, right? And then it's what you put in that medical device. But it's a consistent, workable medical device, right? Yes, there has plastic in it. It has metals, you know, and things like that. But at the same time, it's reusable.

2:39:51SpeakerThat's what was my point. Whereas with the carts, right, you're only up for the gram, half gram, or I've seen the two gram bammers too, don't get me wrong, from Hitman or whatever. Yeah. You know, and others. But at the same time, it's only as good as much as what's in that cart, right? Yeah. And before we get the carts, let's work on AIOs. So let's get rid of those out of the market.

2:40:14SpeakerSwitch to something a little bit more sustainable on our batteries so we're not throwing them away after one use because that hurts my soul, you know? But that's what the market is demanding. So, you know...

2:40:26BubblemanIt's a tough thing. It's one thing to have the idea of what should be done. It's another... Thank you so much for joining us.

2:40:54SpeakerBut who's regulating it? And this is the thing of what you should consider is then if there are no regulators, then create the oversight organization that it should be that you want it to be. That's what we did with the NCIA and others. And this is where kind of greatness gets hoist upon you. And you have to kind of set the standards for everybody to come to the table.

2:41:15SpeakerRight. So do so. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:41:32SpeakerThe government doesn't regulate emergency rooms. There's an organization that writes the standards for those emergency rooms to be followed that the government says you should follow. You see what I'm saying? The government's not gonna regulate it. There is no one else to come and save us is what I'm saying. And if you know how to save us, then fucking you're the Superman. You have the cape, the S is on your chest.

2:41:57SpeakerThen fucking, then rally the, you know, Gotham around you is what I'm saying. You see what I'm saying?

2:42:05BubblemanNot, but actually, Stephen, go ahead, go ahead.

2:42:09SpeakerI was going to say, going back to what you were saying, Marcus, earlier on, like calling people out, right? Stephen and I were talking about this, about, you know, the silicone glue that's next to this. I pulled apart these devices. I'm like, this is bullshit. But I don't want to call the people out. And Stephen and I were discussing this, like, how do we call them out?

2:42:33SpeakerAnd Stephen brought up a good point. And like, you know, there are these organizations on the vape side of all these vape manufacturers. It's called Vape Safer. And they're saying, hey, we've started this committee. But then there's a little conflict of interest and a little bias, right? And a few of And so what me and Stephen were talking about is like, how do we find a third party?

2:42:58SpeakerThey're not connected to us. And we hire them somehow and say, hey, even check our devices. We don't care. But check everyone's. Give us honest feedback. We're not a part of this. We're not paying. So that, yeah, that would be like the golden ticket, I think. Steven, is that that's kind of what we were talking about, right? Yeah, it needs some kind of third party oversight. And it doesn't have to be government.

2:43:27SpeakerYou know, like right now, I know I have a friend, Mr. Darwin Millard. He's working with the ASTM over here in America, and he's working really hard to write standards. I wish I was more involved in the organization, but. It's kind of difficult to find time. But no, no, no, no, no. But you can write the standards for what you do and what you see and what you see needs to be cleaned.

2:43:51SpeakerYou see what I'm saying? So you you can create the standards. And then what you do is then you get others to sign on to that standard. You basically you call a, you know, contact the other companies, et cetera, and then you circulate it and you have a call to Jesus moment or what we would you know regular organizations you would basically just bring in a stakeholders discussion and have everybody agree to these simple things this shit's bad this shit's good this is cool this isn't fuck this we're cool with this everybody cool with this And everybody sign on.

2:44:29SpeakerAnd then you go out and you push that and you show that and then or rally around it. You create an organization around it. You write articles around it, white papers and circulate it so that there are people who will hold you your feet to the fire and hold the standards. Otherwise, there's nobody to hold you to the standards. There's nobody to hold anyone to any standards if there are no standards.

2:44:48BubblemanHow do you do it at BPG, Etienne? Do you just not sell vape carts? You guys just don't sell carts there?

2:44:55SpeakerNo, I sell vape carts, but at the same time, everything that comes through my store is tested.

2:45:00BubblemanLike the carts themselves or just the oil?

2:45:03SpeakerThe oils themselves.

2:45:04BubblemanBut how do you know if the carts are safe? Because the state has decided that is so. But you're selling carts at your shop.

2:45:13SpeakerYes, but the state has decided that these are legal selling standards that are available and these are the standards that are there. So therefore I conform to the standards that the state has set. They're not bringing, you know, five gallon containers of oil. No, they're putting them in these carts and that's what they have decided they are the delivery methods, right? Now, do I want to see do better?

2:45:35SpeakerYes. Do I get faulty fails all the time from people? Absolutely. You know, do I have a recourse, you know, behind that? Yes, I can then exchange those carts for other carts from my distributor, manufacturer, etc. Right. So, you know, there is a pathway for this industrial methodology. However, I'm not satisfied with this industrial methodology or am I satisfied with the system as a whole? It's why when there were holes in the batteries, I chose to educate my consumers about what that hole in that battery was doing, that you were therefore inhaling and off-gassing, and then I made the decision, Marcus, not to carry those batteries.

2:46:19SpeakerWell, I would think so. Right, because now I was educated and knew better, right? But I know many people who didn't and choose not to and chose to still sell those things and do that.

2:46:28BubblemanWell, because you're a patients group and they're selling recreationally in a market where alcohol and tobacco is sold.

2:46:34SpeakerAnd that's exactly it, because we're patients setting a standard. Right? The same way that these guys are setting a standard for what they want to see for. So we set our standard.

2:46:43BubblemanBut do you think the odd person who buys low-end vape carts gives a fuck about white papers and standards? Or do you think they're just buying out of convenience? It's a large percentage latter. It's a small percentage the prior.

2:46:59SpeakerYou know, there are educated consumers who see what their methodologies and accessibility are. There are people who chose to, you know, use this over these, right? You know, why? You know, it's, you know, it's the same delivery, delivery methods, methodologies, but, you know, this one tends to break more because it's a technology that, you know, can't necessarily fail. Whereas, you know, mm, This is pretty, you know, solid as long as I'm not throwing it against something hard.

2:47:29SpeakerYou know what I'm saying? Yeah, then it breaks. Right. In the recreational space, you're looking, you're talking to bud tenders, right? They're selling out of their pockets. They've got, they got 20 bucks. They want to grab oil. They're going to get the cheapest cart for 20 bucks. That's I mean, I live in Oregon, right? The reality is 20, 30 bucks gets you a cheap gram. They're not asking questions.

2:47:48SpeakerThey don't care about the solder and the heavy metals that are leaching off of the oil because it's been sitting in the tank for six months in some warehouse somewhere. That is our challenge, right? As from a, someone who's responsible for sales to educate our brands that produce the oil and do the filling and the extracting and the filling, then going on and educating the bud tender, right?

2:48:11SpeakerAnd then they have to go to the consumer. It's the phone game. It's, I mean, we all wish it was, Different and people could actually communicate, educate, but this is where we're at, right? It's just, it's why people buy cheap beer. They don't care how it's made. If it's the material, the input that goes into it's GMOs or sprayed with glyphosate, right? They don't care. They just have 20 bucks to spend.

2:48:33SpeakerThey want a six pack or whatever, right? So it is a challenge for sure.

2:48:41BubblemanIt seems to be the challenge for everything, or at least for the cannabis world in regards to almost every product, whether it's a gummy or a beverage or a pre-rolled joint or a vape pen or some bubble hash. It's always about these different levels of the product. And it's already so hard, the higher quality you get. I mean, I had a cafe years ago that was a raw food, vegan, organic and macrobiotic cafe.

2:49:11BubblemanThis was like 100% integrity and 0% profit. It was literally like you could not make profit doing this because I just had to pay so much out of pocket. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:49:47BubblemanI have my podium products where it's like full melt bubble, something beautiful and awesome that you can really be inspired. But I'm also happy to make, you know, traditional hashes. Actually, this puck I've got here, I've had it, man, this puck I've had for six months. I haven't opened this thing in six months and I'm going to show it to you guys right now. How's that for, how's that for a little glassy puck?

2:50:12BubblemanA little puck-o traditional. Yeah. Little Glossy Puck. Now, the full melt bubble heads would say this is swag. They'd be like, this is garbage. This is, there's no way. It's like, but honestly, it really isn't. It's just about.

2:50:27SpeakerI'll put that garbage in my pipe any day.

2:50:29BubblemanYeah, it's probably 35% THC. This was maybe a little more, maybe like 36, 37, but. How old is that, Puck? It's, I made it in September, at the start of September. And you're going to age it? I've been aging it for six and a half months so far. So I kind of think I'm going to get it to a year. I'll roll it into a nice ball and then I'll cut the ball in half at like one year and then I'll cut, you know, I'll leave the rest for like maybe another year.

2:51:00BubblemanThere's something to be said for hash that cures. You know, it's very different from oil in the vape pen. It's very different from live hash rosin in the jar. It's very different from flour in the bag. If you've got a traditional style hash and you press it up and you create that skin, it is very protective of the hash. It really allows it to cure and age.

2:51:22BubblemanAnd so, yeah, you know, maybe I'll cure it for a year and then bring it out to a legends party or something. I think that would be kind of a fun thing to pull out some traditional hash and a traditional smoking device like the Hubbly Bubbly and, you know, get everyone excited. Get everyone ripped on traditional trad terps. We call them trad terps.

2:51:47BubblemanSo what's the go in Colorado today, Daniel? Are you even in Colorado?

2:51:53SpeakerI am in Colorado. Yeah, I'm going to get into the lab here, pressing some more for the carts. We got this mind melt we're working on right now. Jesus Christ. What is that? That is the Mind Melt 73 to 159. That's going to hit the jars for Bubble Man Brands starting next week.

2:52:10BubblemanOh, that's the shit you ran through the CRC?

2:52:14SpeakerYeah, it's the CRC Silica. Dude, what the fuck? Runs one and two on a 73 to 159 pull. Yeah, really excited for this material. We got a lot of it coming through. So this is just the first cultivar that we're running and It's coming out great. It smells like a bouquet of honeysuckle. So I haven't really smelled that in a long time. And the high on it's really nice and relaxing.

2:52:41SpeakerAnd it's going to make a great cart. So yeah, I'm excited for that.

2:52:44BubblemanDude, that's so cool. That reminded me of like, how cool would it be to like brand your, your, your vape pens to the, like, imagine a little like honeysuckle next to the B. It's like, well, these only make, it would make filling a lot more of a pain in the ass, but yeah, dude, that hash is so white. What the fuck? That came out of the greenhouse?

2:53:05SpeakerYeah.

2:53:06BubblemanLike those are plants that we saw growing.

2:53:08SpeakerThose plants we saw. Yeah. Just the other week that was standing and yeah, I did a great job.

2:53:12BubblemanThose were mature plants. Yeah.

2:53:15SpeakerYeah.

2:53:16BubblemanLike they were in no way immature plants.

2:53:19SpeakerNo. Full term.

2:53:20BubblemanLike if, if anything, they were a little like past.

2:53:25SpeakerYeah. I mean, it took a long time to harvest, you know, with the crew that we had, but you know, it definitely came down looking absolutely fire. I'm really excited to get to the other cultivars.

2:53:35BubblemanDan took me down to this greenhouse when I was there last and introduced me to this guy, Aaron, who was a real interesting character. We'll have to have him on Hash Church one time. Just a real, one of these interesting grower characters that's just been like fixing and jerry rigging everything like since he's been going, like he just keeps it going. He's super inspirational dude. And he grows like really good resin in like in a situation that's not always ideal.

2:54:03SpeakerExactly. Yeah, he's really great guys. He grows really great outdoor too. I'm excited to see this outdoor material that comes through. And yeah, we've worked together for some years now.

2:54:11BubblemanI'm going to quickly take this hoodie off and give a shout out to the other dude that we met right down the street. One sec. Absolutely. This was... All right. This is the No Regerts.

2:54:30BubblemanI love that. No Regerts, bro. Dude, so check out the coincidence on how I met this guy. He says to me, oh, I hear you're coming to Colorado. If you're anywhere near where I am, I don't even know Colorado, dude. I know Denver. Now I know Boulder a little bit and I know Evergreen. That's it. I don't know anything else. So I'm visiting Dan's garden and I'm about to leave or not Dan's, but Aaron's.

2:54:57BubblemanWe're with each other at Aaron's garden and we're about to leave. We've done the whole tour. It's been great. We're about to leave. And I'm like, oh, let's check out to see, you know, if this guy is close by so we can stop. You know, we got like some an hour ride. Maybe we see him on the way. Dude, he was like one and a half doors down from Aaron's house.

2:55:17BubblemanLike he lived like we walked there in two minutes. It was a two minute walk. No regerts. Shout out to you, homie. What an awesome group of people. You got to reach out to them again and see how they're doing.

2:55:30SpeakerYeah, I've been talking to them. They got some genetics from Free World Genetics. Shout out to Sam. Ran a lot of his gear over the years. Our Lemonhead is from him, and they're running some of his gear this year, and I've had great success with it over the years as well. Awesome.

2:55:47BubblemanYeah, what a cool area, man. The whole area, all of Colorado, everywhere I went just seems to be full of cool people growing and selling weed. And if they're not, they're growing and selling mushrooms, actually. So that was the other. I just couldn't believe how many people. You guys are going to be designing the DMT pen? Is that part of your work, Stephen?

2:56:10SpeakerNo comment.

2:56:11BubblemanNo comment. He's like, dude, we just got China on board for cannabis pens. Like, please.

2:56:19SpeakerI mean, it's actually kind of a passion of mine, a sidebar. DMT pens are? Well, any kind of alkaloid vaporization, let's put it that way. Awesome. So, yeah, you know, I've been working on no heat vaporization technology when I was at CECL, and that's some really cool stuff, you know, using sound for vaporization, all sorts of technology. So, I could see... In the near future, we're going to see some shifts in the way devices are working.

2:56:58SpeakerI've already seen it on the nicotine side on a couple devices. Recently, I saw a Lost Mary all-in-one with a dual vaporization mode. One is ultrasonic and one is traditional. Traditional for the nicotine, ultrasonic for the flavor. Kind of a waste and not that safe, but... We can make that safe. We can make that kind of technology really cool and functional on the cannabis side and on the alkaloid side too, you know, because you're not using heat.

2:57:29SpeakerSo now you open up the doors for anything, not just weed. Yeah. It's a huge passion of mine as well. And I think that Stephen and I spent hours talking about different alkaloids we can vaporize and Yeah, we really bonded over that. And I was like, man, you got to join our team. We're going to do cool shit together. Yeah. That is awesome.

2:57:59BubblemanYeah, well, I mean, this is how you move things forward with conversations and concepts and ideas and with dreams. You know, my wife was saying something to me the other day. She's like, oh, I just I was I just had an unrealistic dream. I'm like, nonsense. You can't have an unrealistic dream. Your dreams should be unrealistic. They should be about as unrealistic as they possibly could be, because that is the only way to enter or access the impossible is by believing that it is possible.

2:58:28BubblemanAnd I didn't really understand that until I went to India. And when I went to India, I saw it. I saw Fakir's like doing impossible shit. I just saw really wild, crazy shit that made no sense physically that it could be possible. And yet there it was happening right in front of my eyes. I like the idea of, you know, not the concept of nicotine and flavorant, but When I first got my Index Lab vaporizer from, was that Kylie?

2:58:59BubblemanRiley? Kylie. I think it's Kylie from Index Labs. Are you guys familiar with the Index Labs? It's the big, crazy, like, And I'm going to give you a little bit of a briefcase vaporizer. It's this big round thing. It's like you guys should definitely like that is the place to start having conversations about because it's more it's induction. Right. So it's like but it's really good induction.

2:59:19BubblemanWhat I find about induction is it's so powerful that it starts at like a thousand on most units. And you want the real access is between one and one hundred. And I'm using the numbers as a metaphor in the sense that The heat can happen so fast and so violently with induction heat that that's easy. The harder part is what Kylie did, which is tuning it in to flavor profiles where you could literally vape the monos and then vape the sesquas, like literally vape things based on like their molecular weight in this fucking vaporizer.

2:59:53BubblemanWhen I first saw it, it was just, you know, the classic glass jar with the little metal piece that goes into the center and it's got the coil that's going to create the magnetics and I thought, oh my goodness, could you imagine a day where we have all of the components of cannabis isolated into their own jars in a machine like this that you then dial the cultivar's name that you want, which into the algorithm would show exactly Every component in every ratio that was needed and then vaporize it like all at once, like the ultimate medical cannabis tool.

3:00:28BubblemanI was probably tripping when I thought about it, but I just thought it seemed like such an incredible, like to be able to dial in flavor profiles, obviously impossible. You're not going to have like Thank you for joining us.

3:00:54BubblemanYou know, it's began the whole fucking full spectrum argument of like, people don't even know what that is just more fucking bullshit coming out of their mouths. But the value that I always explained to them was look, okay, I'm not trying to take away your full spectrum. But what I am saying is there's value in being able to deconstruct and reconstruct and a perfect example I always gave.

3:01:16BubblemanThank you for joining us.

3:01:36BubblemanAnd so for people like that, if you could find the right ratio of everything that worked and then created it just for them, I mean, it's expensive. It would be You know, different from the way other people access, but I always thought that's one of the values. I also think the value is taking things apart and putting them back together is always of a value, whether it's a mechanical engine or whether it's your psyche or whether it's whatever it is, right?

3:02:02BubblemanLike, that's why we take psychedelics, take ourselves apart, build ourselves back up. Why can't we do it with the plant that we love as well? It's funny how easy it is to take offense as a cannabis user when someone does something that you don't like with cannabis. I used to be the biggest like anti-BHO guy when really now I would fight for anyone's right to have use access BHO.

3:02:27BubblemanWhy not? Why shouldn't, why don't we just let everyone access everything and see what sticks to the wall and what continues down the road. It's time for me to have a dab.

3:02:39SpeakerWell, you know, Marcus, what you're describing is a pharmaceutical. The deconstruction and reconstruction is turning cannabis into a pharmaceutical good, and that could pass through regulatory processes and be sold as actual medicine that is prescribed. Or you can take the natural plant as is, which is considered gross, generally regarded as safe, and sell that as is. Or you could take the mechanical extract of that plant without chemical adding to it and sell that as is.

3:03:15SpeakerBut the resin will be a problem down the road because you're doing a chemical extraction and you don't know what's in it.

3:03:25SpeakerI see the future of medicine when we treat cannabis as a pharmaceutical will be either rosins or the deconstructed media that you're describing.

3:03:35BubblemanYeah, we'll see where it goes. I mean, they don't generally go to places we like. Usually they end up coming out with stuff that's like subpar and not what we like, but that is the route that that group sort of takes. And it's why I think so many medical patients end up going to recreational stores to access cannabis because they see what the pharma companies have done with cannabis as a medicine.

3:03:58BubblemanThey've made it way less accessible. And fuck, for God's sakes, I think you guys were selling hemp products in gas stations for quite a while down there. I'm sure people were accessing that shit too, which is insane because it's like a cesspool of toxic, poisonous shit that you... Like, sure, maybe you know one brand that's doing it right, but imagine not knowing and walking in and just looking at the wall of whatever's hanging there.

3:04:22BubblemanIt's... Yeah, it's, we didn't do hemp that way. We did hemp as a grain. Nobody in Canada does hemp as CBD. It just wasn't a thing here. You guys figured that out fast. And then somehow got that politician guy to like sign the ultimate fucking like farm bill. Like, holy shit. I wish I knew the true story behind that because that was insane. Holy shit.

3:04:47SpeakerIt was insane. And it poisons our market. Well, that's about to be modified again because it's modified every five years and it will be written out for sure. But at the same time, you know, yeah, it left a loophole that we're still... Struggling with the fallout from behind, needless to say.

3:05:07BubblemanRight? It was insane.

3:05:10SpeakerCalifornia won't touch the, you know, any of those products, you know, and then the governor, the current governor has punted on dealing with that stuff until 2028 when he's no longer in office. So, you know, they're, you know, yeah. So leadership, sometimes it's needed.

3:05:29Collin PalmerColorado did a nice job dealing, you know, dealing with the conversion leaders. And I feel like, you know, all the riffraff that I've seen kind of happen. They're a good example of what to do. You know, I think that's the reality of it. You know, for those out there that don't know. I don't really support converted leaders at all. I think that that's a construct of prohibition and something that we're playing mental gymnastics to create a business around.

3:06:03Collin PalmerAnd really what we should be focusing on is taking all that energy into policy. And we might have just might have a shot at this. But I understand those that are super deep in it. You know, you're drinking a lot of Kool-Aid to be like, yeah, we're going to save this. We got to save this. I don't know. I think you're still doing mental gymnastics and you got to be honest with yourself because it's not helpful to the state system that we all fought for and created all those years ago.

3:06:31Collin PalmerWe're backdooring ourselves in a lot of respect.

3:06:35BubblemanSo backdooring ourselves. What do you mean by that, Colin?

3:06:41SpeakerHey, what a person chooses to do with his own back door is between him and his own back door.

3:06:46Collin PalmerListen.

3:06:49BubblemanNext on Ask Church.

3:06:53Collin PalmerI'll dab to a better path with drug cultivars only.

3:07:00SpeakerYeah. When Colorado started cracking down on those converted leaders, the price was at like $1.50 a gram and then jumped quickly up to Three dollars a gram once all that converted leaders went away. And then in New Mexico, you know, it's I'm still seeing it down there and the prices are really depressed on that. But yeah, those converted leaders start flooding markets.

3:07:26BubblemanThat's what regulatory framework is actually for. It's not to overregulate a bunch of bullshit and make things impossible for packaging that you can't even open if you're a grown man and all this other bullshit and taxes. It's actually for For that, to keep the market from being destroyed, right? It's a regulatory framework. All your job is in regulatory is make sure it's safe and make sure that no one can just come in and destroy the market.

3:07:54BubblemanWe saw it in Missouri when Oklahoma went legal. They started sending hundreds of liters of distillate over the border into Missouri. And at one point, some Missouri politicians got a whiff of it. And they closed the entire thing down. Like over 65,000 products were recalled, pulled off the shelf. And for like a year, they went through court and tried to find these people that were putting these beverages into the gummies and are these, this distillate into the beverages and gummies and all the products.

3:08:22BubblemanBecause Missouri was a state that you could go to like a restaurant and then just order like 100 milligram products. Thank you for joining us.

3:08:44Collin PalmerPerhaps we need to understand there's a right way and a wrong way. And I think that when you talk to Dr. Mark and others that are really deep in the chemistry side of it, and you ask them the question point blank, is this safe? And he says, I don't know. There's a real issue with that. And I think that's really the baseline for the argument here is really safe patient access and making sure that policy understands that.

3:09:12Collin PalmerBecause I think it's very confusing out there right now. Because you can go to the gas station, buy a gummy that seemingly says THC, and then go to the dispensary. And those two different things may appear to be the same, but... Fundamentally, they're not, you know, so that's the one thing I always wonder. But but anyway, back to the to the real heart of the question is like, you know, the hemp side of things, you know, we're destroying CBD in this other way that that there's there's other people out there that need this everyday access.

3:09:44Collin PalmerAnd the farm bill now in November, I think, will be fundamentally changed forever. And that access will be, you know, no more, you know, based on us wanting to convert leaders into whatever we can possibly think of to get around again policy.

3:10:04SpeakerAnd not all conversions are created equal either. So I purchased myself a really high quality CBN at 99.99% purity, which I would consume myself and I would buy that again, but that will be out of access now. And at the same time, THCP, which is a full agonist and very dangerous and could cause people mental illness or permanent damage, that will be illegal too. Thank God. You know?

3:10:35SpeakerSo... Yeah. You know, double-edged sword there. So I wish we had a little bit more reason. Yeah.

3:10:43Collin PalmerYeah, no, it's tough. It's a tough conversation. But I love these conversations because it's important for minds like ourselves and every other listeners out there to start thinking about these things because it's really the truth. It's a disguise in terms of how patient access is really granted. And I think ATN, honestly, out of anyone on this call or this show today, I think, you know, you see a lot of this, you know, because of the work that you do globally.

3:11:11Collin PalmerYou know, you see, you know, how the lack of patient access can be disruptive in You know, in this case, the access has actually been disruptive and changed the path to access.

3:11:26SpeakerYou know, we're dealing with, you know, we're dealing with people who are being executed for doing what they do. You know, our Rastafarian brothers and sisters down in, you know, the Caribbean. Just to produce their own medicine, you know, they can get shot and killed, you know. And so, yeah, access is a major part. And this is where we bring people like that to the UN so that world leaders can hear and understand because the UN understands culture and cannabis culture is its own culture, period.

3:11:58SpeakerEnd of the story. That's the reality that we deal with. And the UN wants to hear about our culture. So that's what we're trying to do is educate them That's why we did our thing on Wade is to educate them on CBD because most people don't really understand or see the medical access or what the benefits actually do. And when they do, what did it do? It brought them to tears because they saw that it actually does help.

3:12:24SpeakerIt's not a cure-all. Okay, he stated that as well. At the same time, it is a medicine that helps and it is medicine that there is legal access around the world since December of 2020. However, it doesn't mean the world is allowing that access and you and I should be able to travel freely with our medicine without fear of repercussions. So that's also what we're working on as well at the UN is Thank you so much for joining us.

3:13:17SpeakerI saw a friend of mine who was arrested, put in jail for life in fucking Oklahoma. I held his daughter as he was sentenced to fucking 90 plus years in fucking jail. Was that Will? Huh?

3:13:29BubblemanWill Foster.

3:13:30SpeakerYeah. And him to get let out And now he's back in Oklahoma growing his cannabis. So change can happen. I've seen it in my own lifetime. I mean, it was brutal to see all that shit go down, but it took those types of situation of people saying, no, enough is enough. This is bullshit. This is, this shouldn't happen. And laws changed. And he was here in California.

3:13:57SpeakerI was working with Will, you know, some grows and stuff here in California when he was, you know, Thank you so much for joining us.

3:14:28SpeakerAdmit to it. So they're going to go down the rescheduling path because now it has medicinal value, right? Because we outlasted that lie and misinformation by... That's a big one. Yeah, that's a big one. That's a big crack in the wall. By having science come out and say, yeah, FDA come out and say, yeah, sorry, it does. You know, I know we've been saying so all along, so...

3:14:53SpeakerThat's why we fight people. This is why we're out here doing change. This is why we're trying to change minds and educating because the paradigm shifts. These are all due to different shifts. It all happened at once. We didn't lose all our freedoms at once. We're not going to gain them all back at once. This is incremental clawbacks, right? And that's what we have seen in the sense of Laws, what you have in Canada is what we wish for we could have here in the United States.

3:15:22SpeakerYou know, what Colorado has, Kansas doesn't have. Right next to each other. You know what I'm saying? So there's a lot of unfinished business. And I got a lot of accolades this past week for the work that we did at the U.N., And I kind of got a post and I'm going to, you know, I'm going to read it to you all. Look, I truly appreciate all the kind words and support.

3:15:48SpeakerI do. It means more than you know. But if I'm being honest, we don't need more praise right now. If anything we've done has inspired you, that's great. But inspiration should lead to action. Join an organization, support a cause, make a call, show up, donate, speak out, do something, anything, now. Because while we're being congratulated, people are still sitting in jail. Lives are still being impacted. The work is far from done.

3:16:17SpeakerSo let's shift the energy. Less applause, more action. Your voice matters. Your time matters. Your dollar matters. No more paths in the back, only forward movement.

3:16:32BubblemanNice. Yeah, I read that on Facebook.

3:16:34SpeakerThere's still so much that needs to be done. And we appreciate the kind words. It keeps us going. It's nice and motivated. But get the fuck off your ass and do something about this shit you're upset about. You don't like the change that's happening? Go change it. These gentlemen here that you're watching, what do they do? They didn't like the status quo of what was happening with their cannabis, so they did something about it.

3:16:54SpeakerThey're constantly doing something about it. Marcus, you didn't be like, hey, I made a Thank you for watching.

3:17:25SpeakerAnd I thank you, Danny. I thank you, Daniel. I thank you, Mark. I thank you, Stephen. I thank you for challenging yourselves to step outside your comfort zones and doing something about it as opposed to just sitting on your ass and complaining about it and wishing something else was going to happen. You know, Colin's done it, gone out and done something about it, and he's still doing something about it.

3:17:46SpeakerSame way I am, right? And that's all we're trying to do is to inspire you who are watching to not just sit here and watch what we're doing. Go out and create something from these ideas. You know, let's be the spark. Go do it, though. You have to take the action. We can only be the inspiration to a certain resolve. I do the work that I do, but there's a lot more work that has to be done to accomplish the work that Everybody wants to see.

3:18:12SpeakerSo fuck you. Do something about it. Thank you.

3:18:16BubblemanI like it. It's a good message. I read it on Facebook. I was like, that's a boy. Just fucking awesome, brother.

3:18:23SpeakerAwesome. I want to connect with you. That's that's fucking inspiring. Yeah, just do something.

3:18:31BubblemanDamn it. Bunch of doers. I know what Dan's doing. Driving all the time.

3:18:38SpeakerYeah, bringing the medicine all the time.

3:18:40BubblemanHow much do you think you drive a week?

3:18:43SpeakerOh man, I don't know. Probably, yeah, I really don't know. 500 miles easy. Yeah, probably more.

3:18:52Collin PalmerYeah.

3:18:53SpeakerI'm with you, Dan.

3:18:54Collin PalmerI'm with you, dog. Yeah.

3:18:55SpeakerThe big state in New Mexico is huge too. We're getting out to Massachusetts where it's going to be a lot smaller and closer to get to market. But there's a market right now that there's an opposition out there trying to reverse the recreational laws. I don't think it'll pass, but there's definitely still a lot of opposition out there. Yeah, it won't.

3:19:15BubblemanBut I've seen cannabis prohibition grow. Cannabis prohibition is growing again. I see posts all the time, studies, the biggest study of our time, over 100 million people. And it's just like, obviously, you can go into the comments and just see it get taken apart. But There's a lot of people posting new like shit about cannabis that is absolute and utter complete baloney and just fully believing it.

3:19:39BubblemanLike, see, look at this. I told you it gives you brain damage. It changes your personality. You can't have kids anymore. It's like, are you talking about?

3:19:48SpeakerYeah, partly funded by a big alcohol. Yeah, well, they're tripping out, dude. They are tripping out. Yeah, watching their money just go down with the younger generations not drinking as much and smoking more. So, yeah, that trend's continuing.

3:20:03BubblemanYeah, well, the bottling plants will disappear and the vape cart pen plants will pop up in their place.

3:20:12Collin PalmerOr they just clean their lines and add THC that's been grown in the field and with the right plants and not converted. You know, cause that's really what I see is, is there's a big, um, you know, there's a real push right now in older demos and even younger, like they like to drink THC drinks. Like that's awesome. It wasn't a thing when I was growing up, but it's because it didn't really exist, you know?

3:20:40SpeakerYeah.

3:20:41Collin PalmerSo I wonder, I wonder, you know what I mean? Like, you know, as consumption changes as, as, you know, generations want different ways to access it. Um, You know, I wonder what the real choice is going to be. Is it going to be inhalation? I don't, I really don't.

3:20:58BubblemanWill there be kids one day going, oh yeah, I heard they used to smoke joints in the 1900s. Yeah, the 1990s, you know, 2000s.

3:21:07SpeakerBarbarians.

3:21:09BubblemanSmoking joints.

3:21:09SpeakerThey would take tree pulp and wrap it around herb and burn it. We might become those, yeah. I mean, it's true.

3:21:18BubblemanWell, where do you guys think it's going? Think about how far Where, where is it going? Like, you know, like obviously trying to make things better and do things differently and bring products to market. Where is, like, how did this even happen? It was just like, it was the tobacco industry that was mucking around with these pens and they sort of leaked into the cannabis industry.

3:21:35SpeakerIsn't that really kind of, I don't even think it was, it was big nicotine yet when the first big cards hit. Right. Because, um, what was it? Blue was one of the first e-cigs, right? It was that one stick and that had to be 13, 14. And at that same time, I think there was all these small, the nicotine vape industry was huge privately. There was so many players, right?

3:22:08SpeakerAnd Steven, you know, probably more on this, on the history of that. I mean, Joy Tech, I think, invented the 510 back in the day with those clearomizers, a fiberglass wick wrapped in a nichrome coil, delicious, you know, and... We were all inhaling those.

3:22:30BubblemanListen, I was smoking out of a Coke can in high school. And I'm telling you, if anyone came up to me and said, have you seen the white paper on what it does to your lungs smoking? We would have been like, dude, we're beating you up. I don't even know. We have to beat you up. We just smoked the Coke can. We threw it down on the ground.

3:22:46BubblemanWe went into class. We were baked.

3:22:49SpeakerI mean, the red, the red one got you higher. If you had, right, you get it on the red part. You just had to really smoke a lot of the paint. And then you get way more high. Yeah. I mean, I think it was like the mod scene with e-cigs when people were doing those big mods and they would wrap their coils with cotton in them and they would throw a dab on top.

3:23:13SpeakerAnd that was really the beginning of all this. And people realized that cotton got gunked up real fast and they wanted a ceramic for it. So, you know, like then they started inventing different ceramic wicks or quartz wicks and all this different shit. And C-Cell was the first company to package it in a really small You know, form factor where it worked really well with the ceramic core in the middle, a coil inside of that in a pipe up the middle, like they invented that concept.

3:23:44SpeakerAnd that's where we're at. You know, that's why They boomed to be the number one company really fast and had 50% of their budget into R&D and have been working ever since, you know, innovating on this kind of stuff. And there's a lot of followers, but ultimately it kind of went on its own since I would say 2016 is the beginning of it. 2016, right? Yeah. That's crazy.

3:24:13SpeakerRemember the WIC carts and people had like... Add in so much PGVG to it, like half of it. It was crazy. Yeah. Dude. Yeah. Yeah. There it goes. It's moving. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of products like viscosity changers. Some people were selling like mineral oil that they were mixing in with that stuff. And then eventually we end up with E-Valley, you know, vitamin E acetate and thousands of people sick.

3:24:46SpeakerAnd after that, they said, you know what? I'm too scared about all these additives. I don't want that shit. And the market pushed it out. And I had to be on sick, though, that that fight was also COVID that coincided with COVID because we were really worried about that Ebola really destroying the vape market potentially. And yeah. If COVID hadn't happened, I'm not sure that would not have happened.

3:25:11SpeakerYou know what I'm saying? Because it was a major thing. It got a major media and COVID stole all that. And it's really been dead since then. Just interestingly, just pointing that out. I'm sure a lot of people here were in the industry, including myself. And I was manufacturing cars at the time. And I was... My business was devastated by this whole thing. So I was very invested in figuring out what's going on so I can market the solution and tell my customers what's going on.

3:25:43SpeakerAnd I suspect it was one operator with one bad batch. And when you look at the size, the affected lot, It's about like 2,500, 3,000 people. That's like a five liter batch, maybe a three liter batch, something like that. And he put vitamin E acetate, which is a gross, generally regarded as safe additive that's found in just about everything. Your shampoo, your toothpaste, your food, like your burger you ate has vitamin E acetate in it.

3:26:17SpeakerAnd he put it in thinking with good intent that it's a preservative. And you don't need that because cannabis is a preservative. Naturally, the guy was an idiot. It happens. And an idiot with good intentions released a product that hurt a lot of people. And that's my theory as to what happened with that.

3:26:41BubblemanWas that Mr. Extractor?

3:26:43SpeakerI don't know who did it, but and I couldn't even begin to guess. I've heard whispers of a Some big company in LA, but who knows?

3:26:56BubblemanThat's where he was out of, I thought. He had the lab, Mr. Extractor.

3:27:00Collin PalmerYeah, I think at the time, looking back, I was just releasing oil, so I was just buying things, but I only released our solventless in Pax Labs pods at the time. And that, I think, was the reason why we could continue operating. And we, cause we could at least hang our hat on that.

3:27:24SpeakerYeah. Why was that? Because of the pod delivery methodology?

3:27:28Collin PalmerThe efficacy behind it, the, the, just the efficacy, just call it that at the time. They were, you know, they said at the time they were the only people that I believe, you know, and Mark, keep me honest here, um, That were really sourcing their own components and working with the factory and had their own teams and really had a thorough... Uh, you know, cross section of what they were putting into the general public, you know, and, and, you know, if I'm leaving anything here, Mark, please fill in.

3:28:01SpeakerBut, uh, no, you're, you're, you're right on. We were talking to our partners about what they're putting in their pods and not everybody liked that. That's for sure. But we were trying to do the right thing with making sure there was no added in. There were visceral reactions from people if you asked them what was in their pods. Mm hmm. Who me? No, of course not. Let's see a COA.

3:28:23SpeakerOkay.

3:28:25Collin PalmerYeah. Yeah. So I think that's the one thing, you know, that's, that's how I got through it. But I think if I was, you know, attached this five tens or all in ones at the time, I think we would have probably had to shut it down. You know, I don't, I don't see at the time it was so intense. So, and then we, of course we went right into COVID.

3:28:46Collin PalmerIt was like, yep. You know, and then somehow we all kept on operating through COVID. That was bizarre. It was like showing up into the lab with a mask on because we all had to wear, you know, it was crazy.

3:28:57BubblemanAnd then change it and put your other mask on when you got in the lab.

3:29:05SpeakerI made hundreds of kilos during COVID. I'm one of the reasons you became essential is because we helped get California get essential status for medical cannabis dispensaries because if they were going to open pharmacies, we demanded the same. And then what happened out of the bay spread to the rest of California, which spread to the rest of the country. So Yeah, I was proud of that fucking little fact during that fucking little chaos fucking shenanigans.

3:29:32BubblemanWell, in Canada, it's a federal it's you're federally allowed to grow it as a medicine. So they couldn't they couldn't deny that it was a medicine. The only weird thing was, was they also made alcohol sales essential. And the reason they did that was because they said the alcoholics would fill up all the hospital beds that apparently the covid patients were going to fill up. But that Never happened.

3:29:57BubblemanWe just ended up, we built this whole extra like 500 bed hospital area that no one ever ended up going in like two and a half years. So just another weird fraud and mass, mass money just getting moved from one place to another. But I also worked in the lab calling every day of COVID. That's when I had Embark going and I was just in the lab making hash and it was, we had to wear that fucking mask for eight hours a day.

3:30:23BubblemanSo when I went home, I was not wearing a mask. But when I pulled up to a red light and saw a person in their car by themselves with a mask on, I would just kind of shake my head and go, this is why the world can't get along because we are all just so different. We're so different. And although I don't have a problem with him wearing his mask on in his car, I can promise you he had a problem with me not wearing one in mine.

3:30:46Collin PalmerWell, I can tell you, I, I definitely flew. I was flying to California at the, at maybe the, you know, last couple of years of, of COVID where it was pretty empty. Like the planes were empty. I'd fly in and we were setting up our lab in Van Nuys at the time. And, and we were, cause we were doing the pack stuff and, uh, yeah, it was pretty, uh, it's pretty interesting, man, that we were so essential, you know, when, Yeah, who could have thought, you know?

3:31:14SpeakerSo wild, dude. We were like the pressure relief valve to society at the time. That's what I was thinking when we were pumping out good medicine. We had to sell weed at our dispensary out of a little window, and it was just nonstop. As soon as those checks would hit, it would be boom. I saw your COVID window. Yeah, he did.

3:31:41BubblemanYou don't even know how much product I sold through that window.

3:31:44SpeakerIt was great.

3:31:46BubblemanFacts, y'all. Facts. That's awesome. Yeah, Daniel has a dispenser down in Colorado called 111. That's his brand down there. So we went and visited his shop. I bought it. I got an all-in-one vape cart from him from the Cannabrand Solutions Team. Bubble Man branded one. Super stoked. Puffed that thing the whole rest of my trip. I found it to be the best driving across Colorado. I just didn't want to deal with loading bowls and cleaning bowls and like all of that.

3:32:16BubblemanI just because I'm with Ted, too. And once you start that, like you could be cleaning bowls for Ted.

3:32:22SpeakerI'd be like, I just need another bucket of Q-tips, Ted. Pull over for a second.

3:32:28BubblemanSo, yeah, we were just hitting the pens.

3:32:31SpeakerThey're so versatile. And my wife, as a busy mom, it's just so much easier for her to be able to use a pen than it is to go use anything else. And I feel like that versatility makes it broader of a market than just dabs. And so I'm excited for the rollout here in Colorado. Yeah, 100%. That is definitely another. Go ahead. What's your guys' favorite voltage setting on that?

3:32:56SpeakerI know, Marcus, I think you were saying low, right? Yeah, I like the two six, you know, I normally preheat, you know, before I get going on it. If it's like been in my pocket, I'll pull it out, hit the preheat and hit it at two six.

3:33:09BubblemanYeah, I was liking the two six as well. I was in Denver and it was 70 degrees the entire time, so I didn't have to use the preheat button. But that is a good option to be able to heat that resin up and make sure that you're, you know, getting a nice homogenized liquid there before you just take your rip.

3:33:31SpeakerBut I just especially if it's coming out of your pocket and it's like sitting upside down, you know, it's it's it's good to just press that preheat before getting into it. For sure.

3:33:41BubblemanHave you hit yours at all the temperatures, Dan? Have you hit it at the hot temperatures?

3:33:46SpeakerYes. Sometimes if I get like maybe towards the end, I'll bump it up a little bit. But I've been at two six. Pretty consistently, you know, I like, you know, tasting those turps as much as possible. And I think the hardware is amazing. It's the best one I've tried out of any all-in-one. And we're excited to use it in all the states that we are rolling out.

3:34:05BubblemanThat's the witty, the W-I-T-T-I, waste it to taste it.

3:34:13SpeakerI was going to say for you guys next round, because 2.6 is the lowest setting. Maybe that's the middle setting. And we have an even lower one because you guys both like that. And I know what we like is different from what the customers like, but if we can dial, get some of that data and just keep refining that product, right? For us, that's what it's all about.

3:34:36SpeakerThat's the fun part. I love that.

3:34:38BubblemanAnd for us, smoking it is what it's all about. So we're also, right, Dan? We're willing to create that data.

3:34:44SpeakerWe can help out with R&D. Cool. Absolutely. Perfect. Yeah. Buy our assays all day long.

3:34:51BubblemanOh, snap. Yeah, absolutely. I think it's time for another dab. We've got another 27 minutes. That was a three and a half hour show so far. Very good to talk with the Cannabrand team. I'm excited to actually come see you guys. How many of you guys are down in Washington? Are you all there?

3:35:09SpeakerWe got about half our team here. Steven is actually moving here. He's going to be here Shoot, next month.

3:35:17BubblemanSo you're going to go to a no moisture state to a full moisture state? Is that what you're telling me?

3:35:23SpeakerYeah, yeah. My hair is going to hate me.

3:35:28BubblemanBut you can leave your creams behind because your skin will be well moisturized out here without any extra. I can't believe how dry it is in dry states. Holy shit.

3:35:38SpeakerI'm actually not the biggest fan of living in Arizona. I like the Pacific Northwest a lot more. So for me, it was an easy sell. Yeah, no shit.

3:35:49BubblemanNo brainer. Like, just like, how about just foraging mushrooms? You're looking for alkaloids that you can vaporize? There's a whole forest full of them behind my house.

3:35:59SpeakerPsilocybin, cyanescence, baby.

3:36:01BubblemanSome wavy caps. Psilocybin, cyanescence.

3:36:04SpeakerWhat about this one? I lived in Southern Oregon for about six years with my farm and lab and loved it out there. I mean, it's absolutely stunning. And it's being out in the hills is great. So, oh, yeah, I do miss it. I pulled this. Yeah, the growing condition out there in Southern Oregon is amazing. Were you in Southern Oregon? I was in the Applegate Valley. OK, perfect.

3:36:27SpeakerYeah. Yeah. Look at that, Marcus. Here's some. Here's some. What is that?

3:36:30BubblemanThis is a giant reishi mushroom that was growing in the forest behind my house. This, this, this, you need alcohol and water to do the different extractions because it has different types of alkaloids that are present. The Chinese call this the immortality mushroom. Nice. Yeah.

3:36:51Collin PalmerIt was crazy to just see it.

3:36:54BubblemanYou taking off, Colin?

3:36:55SpeakerYeah, man, I got to go.

3:36:57Collin PalmerIt was lovely to hang with all you guys. Mark, good to see you again, brother. You too, man. As always, thanks everybody out there. ATN, Danny, nice to meet you. Daniel, as always, brother. Yeah, nice to meet you. Take care, Steven. Peace.

3:37:10SpeakerPleasure, Colin. Colin, I'll hit you up on your cell.

3:37:14Collin PalmerYeah, definitely. We got to wrap. There's so much. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

3:37:18BubblemanAnd Dan, you should link up with Colin when you're out in Massachusetts next.

3:37:22Collin PalmerYou should. I've been already operational here. So like I was really early. I had a license. I got out of that license. That's when I actually joined Pax Labs right after that. And yeah. Yeah, it's a big state, man. So let's just talk. There's just so much I can help you with for sure. Yeah.

3:37:40SpeakerDude, you might be out there in a couple of weeks.

3:37:42BubblemanYou might have been with me, Dan. Were you at that party in Vegas when we were in that giant room that had the wraparound deck? Were you with me there? Because that was the old group that Colin worked with in the past.

3:37:55Collin PalmerI started that whole project with the, I was, yeah, I was one of the founders. So, you know.

3:38:01SpeakerNice. Yeah, I'll be out there in a couple of weeks. Are you out there now?

3:38:04Collin PalmerYeah, sitting there right now. What part of the state? North Shore.

3:38:10SpeakerNorth Shore. Okay, I'll be out on the western side, but I'll definitely hit you up when I'm out there.

3:38:15Collin PalmerYeah, so you'll see how big the state is. That's like a world wide.

3:38:18SpeakerNo, it's small. Yeah, I mean, for me, it's small compared to Colorado. You know, it's like two and a half hours right across the whole trek. Four.

3:38:26BubblemanDude, this guy drives all day, every day. He's just like, I'm driving up north, I'm driving down south, I'm going to New Mexico, I'm coming back up, I gotta go back down, then I'm coming back up. It's like, holy shit, I've never had a Zoom call with him where he wasn't in a car driving.

3:38:41Collin PalmerThat's awesome. I believe he's not driving right now. So yeah, I love your hustle, man. Yeah, so you'll love it out here then. It's, you know, it's cool. It's great. Absolutely.

3:38:50SpeakerI love it out here. Hell yeah. Eat some lobster.

3:38:55Collin PalmerLobster. Eat whatever you want. You gotta eat lobster.

3:38:58SpeakerAll kinds of good food.

3:39:00Collin PalmerAll right, guys.

3:39:01BubblemanTake it easy, Colin.

3:39:02Collin PalmerI'll talk to you soon, Marcus. Peace, man.

3:39:05BubblemanI'll light up another dab real quick here because it's that kind of day. It's Sunday and it's almost over. So soon, who knows what I could end up doing? I have a young child. He could pull me in any million directions right now. Recently, I took him to a place called Fun Park. Let me tell you about the Fun Park. Not only is there go-kart riding and mountain climbing, like indoor climbing on the walls, They have a giant arcade that has like two different mini putt, mini golf putting stations.

3:39:35BubblemanIt's got a laser tag, bowling, like every video game you could possibly ever know, including all the pinball machines. For like 40 bucks US for each of us to do like five hours.

3:39:51SpeakerIt's a great price for some family time.

3:39:55BubblemanDude, I might take them there today to be honest. That's how like stoked I am on Fun Park. It's like a 50 minute drive, but I'm telling you that is good fun. There's nothing more fun than having fun with like your 11 year old son. You know, when you first have a son, you don't realize that he's not really gonna be able to do shit till he's around eight or nine, but you really don't know that he's not gonna really be able to do shit till he's about 10 or 11.

3:40:19BubblemanAnd then the whole world just opens up and they can suddenly do everything. That's the time that you, when I've had my first son, I was like buying Lego shit when he was like four months old. I was like, oh, we gotta get the Hot Wheels. It was like, dude, he's like, he can't even move. Like he's out, I was like, when's he gonna move? I'm like, well, he's a boy.

3:40:37BubblemanMight not move for a couple of years. My daughter's like nine months old, walking around. My boy's like... You know, 18 months still not walking. It's wild. The differences, the people that try to tell you there's no differences between boys and girls have definitely never raised boys or girls. It's insane. Like there's a difference. It's just a thing. Like I didn't like train my son to be a boy.

3:40:59BubblemanHe was like five months old and we drove by a construction site and he started flipping out and we figured out if we parked the car and let him watch the machines, he would calm down. And my wife couldn't drive by a construction site for like the next two years without him just like watching the trucks. And my daughter was like, what the fuck are we doing?

3:41:20BubblemanDid not want to watch the trucks.

3:41:24SpeakerDon't take them to an airport.

3:41:26BubblemanOh my God, seriously, dude. Holy shit. Well, he's older now. So that's not a worry. So let's finish it off. We've got about 20 minutes. What's in the works for you guys for like the upcoming year or so for Cannabrand Solution? What is the plan? Where are we going to see you guys?

3:41:48BubblemanShows, events, sponsorships?

3:41:53SpeakerNew products. Shows, you know, your Hall of Flowers, MGN Pact. We're going to be kind of everywhere. We've got a team spread out across North America. We try to either attend or do some sort of sponsor or exhibit at I would say most shows, there's some small, small regional ones that we just can't get to, but we just try to be involved in the community, take a different approach and try to do things that are meaningful versus just kind of slap our name and logo all over the place.

3:42:26SpeakerSo kind of everywhere. Launching some new products, of course, C-Cells Roadmap, their product roadmap innovation, we're following that, but... We develop our own custom products for our customers. So we're working on a lot of projects like with that, unique and different. And us going over to China last week allowed us to really tighten that relationship and C-cells, really their objectives too, I mean, to really have a We've got to hit economies of scale.

3:43:04SpeakerSo that makes it a challenge for some smaller like extractors, but we're starting to kind of pool, combine resources and allow so that we can use that production line for multiple customers. And so we're really focused on trying to create more unique products for like, you know, bubble man, right? For, for your, maybe it's not the vision box, maybe it's the vision box plus something else. Well, yeah, we're busy.

3:43:30SpeakerWe're growing and bringing Steven on is going to really help us kind of move that initiative forward with the innovation side and the, you know, extraction expertise. And, you know, his experience for four years working in the C-Cell lab. One thing that we didn't mention earlier was we actually bring our customers to the lab in Phoenix. They can either bring their oils with them or we can have they can send them there.

3:43:58SpeakerAnd we'll, we'll, we'll do some testing on their oil to figure out, you know, what, what oils work best with what products or if just troubleshooting their own devices, right? That they have, maybe they're C cell, maybe they're not. So we bring customers there. We have a real active plan to do that and also bring some of our team to China just to see kind of, I mean, it's, it's eyeopening.

3:44:18SpeakerSo we're, we're, we're busy. I mean, it's almost April already and we're just going, well, we don't have enough time for all this stuff.

3:44:25BubblemanYeah, time can get away from me, that's for sure. I still don't know how I managed to do this for four hours every Sunday while there's so much else going on. And all of it is below like raising my son and spending time and hanging out with my kids. So then that's even crazier because he'll take it all. He'll just be like, I need it all, Dad.

3:44:46BubblemanI need all of your time.

3:44:49SpeakerI have three kids, so I know the feeling. Me too. Yeah. It's a lot of, yeah.

3:44:56BubblemanBut my kids are people now. I've got a 25-year-old and a 23-year-old. They're older. They're like, you know, they're still got to deal with them to a degree, but nothing compared to our 11-year-old who, yeah, takes more time.

3:45:11SpeakerRules the roost. Oh, yeah. I got a 10-year-old who's... Probably waiting for me to walk out the door right now.

3:45:17BubblemanWell, the less attention you pay to them, the more time they'll spend on Roblox and iPads and other nightmarish things. 70 million children on Roblox. Mine's one of them. Yeah, of course. All of our kids are one of them. So where do you think the sickos go to fish?

3:45:37SpeakerThey go to fish where the fish are. Scary.

3:45:41BubblemanWe limit his time so he can't be on there for, you know, more than an hour. He gets an hour a day and if he wants to spend it doing that, then that's it. He doesn't get any more time and that way he's not being groomed by anyone. He's not being like hit up in private messages. Hey, I'm going to give you this skin. Here's some Robux so you can buy a skin, right?

3:45:59BubblemanThe way they do it. There's a... Scary. Yeah, there's a guy, Ryan Montgomery, I believe his name was. I think that's his name. And he is a hacker, an ethical hacker. And he's the one that exposed these Roblox predators. And he found they're like, they've got names. They're a group of people. There's apparently 30,000 of them on Roblox. And they have a long manual, a big manual that he downloaded that teaches them how to groom and trick young children.

3:46:30BubblemanIt's super fucking twisted and sick. So if your kid is on Roblox, don't let them be on for too long and definitely monitor that shit. Because giving these devices isn't necessarily giving your child access to the world as much as it's giving the world access to your child, which is definitely... It's hard because your kid requires so much attention that you can't possibly give all your attention.

3:46:56BubblemanAnd now we're living in a time where kids don't know how to be bored. They're not allowed to be bored, which is super dangerous because all of creativity stems from boredom. Creativity is born of boredom. And now the kids aren't allowed to feel boredom anymore. So it is what it is. Hopefully the pendulum shifts back. Hopefully we can... Take back the focus of our kids because right now it's being stolen.

3:47:25BubblemanBut yeah, we do what we can.

3:47:29SpeakerSo I think sports and, you know, getting them out hiking and snowboarding and fishing and learning how to grow food and, you know, all the important things they're going to need to learn, not just these phones.

3:47:41Bubbleman100%. That's like the key right there. The sports is amazing because they get involved with a team and they learn what it is to be accountable and responsible to your team. That's a huge, massive accountability lesson that you get in life. There's a shame that goes along with letting your team down. That's another thing apparently we're not allowed to feel anymore is shame, which come on, like when you've done wrong, it's okay to feel ashamed about it.

3:48:08BubblemanIt's like it's an important emotion, but you know, they don't want kids to feel like they lost. So everyone gets a trophy and you can't shame. But like there was a thing to be said for fucking up and having your team shame you a little bit and being like, I'm not going to do that again. Like, holy shit, that was the worst feeling ever. I grew up playing hockey.

3:48:27BubblemanIt was a big part of my life. I was the captain of my hockey team. I loved the leadership aspect of it. And, you know, learning the leadership role with a team is not about bossing your team around as much as it's about listening and sort of try to herd everyone into getting along because everyone's not always going to get along. But sometimes the value is if you can find everyone's unique sort of perspective, that's how you build a proper team.

3:48:56BubblemanAnd you're definitely not wrong about that dude, hiking and playing. If my son's not playing outside for like nine plus hours a day, He's not himself. He needs to be outside, you know, on the trampoline playing badminton or football or soccer or any other, you know, sport mini sticks in the living room. Sometimes he'll play that for a couple hours a day. Bought me a really nice mini stick for my birthday, which isn't till next week, 31st of March, but he bought me an early, I was, I was about to buy one on Craigslist and he's like, dad, you can't do that.

3:49:28BubblemanAnd he comes into my room and he's got this little, Thank you for watching.

3:49:54BubblemanAnything else you guys want to share in regards to Cannabrand or individually yourselves? I mean, it sounds like Stephen's going to be moving up there pretty soon, so that's got to be pretty exciting for you guys. What about what's in store for Danny or Mark?

3:50:11SpeakerDanny, go for it. Yeah, I mean, on the personal side, I think It was kind of funny. You're like, man, if my kid's not outside for nine hours a day, he's not himself. And I'm like, well, what about us adults, right? And I'm like, that's a huge part of my, I'm like, okay, what are my goals this year? What do I have? And it's to be outside more, right?

3:50:33SpeakerLike just grinding and grinding. There's a snowball effect where you're like, oh yeah, I worked eight hours, but it's like, how much, What we're too productive. And so I need to get up to the mountain more. I need to get in 20 days. I think I'm at 12. 20 days on the mountain snowboarding. And then figure out just that Danny's passion and energy exertion slash getting energy balanced with work.

3:51:06SpeakerBecause the word's not meaningful or fun without that. Man, I wish I could be outside nine hours a day. Wish I was a kid.

3:51:15BubblemanHell yeah, dude. That's a good way to do it too. I thought I had more, but I've got 15. 15 days on Whistler Mountain this year so far. Look at the list. Let's go. 73. Let's go. I got the 73 on there. I didn't realize that.

3:51:30SpeakerWork strike balance is pretty good over there.

3:51:34BubblemanI shredded all day yesterday and we shredded two days before that on Thursday. It was like a rainstorm. It was atmospheric river raining all over the mountain. But at the top, it was like a blizzard. It was a blizzard up top, but we could only get to the bottom of the top. So it was like we kept getting up there and being like, holy shit, this is an epic blizzard.

3:51:52BubblemanAnd then we'd have to go down. And so we deal with it as we do. The mountain is it's, you know, it happens the way it happens. And because it couldn't happen any other way. Because it didn't. So I just accept it and I'll go again probably this week at least one or two times. And yeah, just it's a good thing to make sure you get out as often as you possibly can.

3:52:17BubblemanIt was definitely my favorite part about being in Colorado was going outside.

3:52:21SpeakerYeah, getting outside where I live is like outdoor Mecca. So Mount Bachelors, 30 minutes away, rivers, lakes, hiking, biking. Like you guys, I need to get my 20 to 30 days on snow. It's a little easier when you drive 30 minutes than having to drive an hour and a half or whatever. But yeah, that drives me, right? It drives me trying to get in shape in the fall.

3:52:46SpeakerThey stay fit all summer, incorporate as much cannabis into that process as possible. Definitely not while mountain biking, but probably everything else. But yeah, we travel a lot. Danny and I travel a lot together. So we share a lot of the same passions. And yeah. Yeah, we're looking forward to, you know, bringing this year home and having a successful 2026 because 2025 was good. But we learned a lot.

3:53:16SpeakerWhen you grow fast, things, things break. And so we're, we're gonna grow, but we're not going to break things this year. Right, Danny? We're going to break some things. We'll break some things, but not everything. That's awesome, dude. But we're going to build more systems than we break.

3:53:34BubblemanThere you go. And spend more time outdoors than you do indoors.

3:53:39SpeakerAnd we don't answer to anybody, right? Danny owns the company. I break a lot of shit. Danny lets me off pretty easily sometimes. But yeah, we don't answer to anybody. So we can do whatever we want, which is really cool. I mean, not a lot of companies can say that. Yeah.

3:53:54BubblemanYeah, no, that's important. Sometimes the answering to people lead country companies down very poor decision roads, you know, especially when the people making the decisions just don't have a fucking clue like whatsoever.

3:54:09SpeakerYeah. And they're like, pay me, pay me now. And then you're like, oh, we have to change our values and how we operate and treat people to make short term cash. And then you're like, oh, why aren't they in business anymore? Right. Exactly. Oh, the wrong people money.

3:54:25BubblemanWell, the wrong people money, the story of many, many cannabis companies, that is for sure. We've, we watched a lot of it happen here in Canada. It's kind of seemed to mellow out a little bit. It seems like the people who are standing now are going to be the cannabis companies of, you know, this time. Many, many, many, many companies went bankrupt and disappeared, like beyond many.

3:54:53SpeakerWell, Daniel, I got to get out there and visit you guys, right? Absolutely. Yeah, I've got a lot of connections in Colorado from my PAX days and prior, but yeah, I want to come out and see you guys, see what you're up to, see if we can help you guys launch your products, because we have a good team here to be able to kind of get you guys, your crew, up to speed on everything, including Steven, who was, of course, very integral in developing that vision box, so can definitely spit some knowledge on your team.

3:55:24SpeakerThat'd be great. Yeah, we would love that. And we'd love to show you guys around down here in Southern Colorado and at the facility down in Denver. Awesome. I would love to see you too. Yeah. Go ahead. When do you guys get out to Colorado? Anytime. Just, you know, I, yeah, we can, I could travel anytime. When's Ted out there next? I think it'd be cool if we could get Ted and Marcus out there.

3:55:53SpeakerYeah. I think May, right, Marcus?

3:55:57BubblemanYeah, if it doesn't happen in April, it'll definitely be May. Exactly. Maybe like the middle of May, the first week of May.

3:56:08SpeakerPerfect.

3:56:09BubblemanAll right. We have an incredible space for throwing events as well at my buddy Kyle's place, The Reserve. It is the most pimped out, epic downtown Denver, right in the Milk District place that you, like, you just can't even believe it. It's so fucking ridiculous, dude. So it's amazing. We'll make sure we gather there and do some puffing.

3:56:31SpeakerDid I smoke all that hash? I don't remember.

3:56:38BubblemanNo, look, look, I found it. Nice. It was, it was missing, but there it is. My one last dab of full melt bubble. I always used to call this poster hash because you could put a poster up with it.

3:56:55BubblemanExtra sticky. Extra sticky. I mean, honestly, if I had enough, I believe I could put a car on the ceiling.

3:57:04BubblemanProbably take like three or four kilos and we wouldn't want to waste the full melt doing that. Although I'm sure if I had a YouTube channel with videos like that, I'd probably have, oh, he's wasting 20 kilos of bubble. Oh, I'm going to watch this. It's like sharing epic information about cannabis. Nah.

3:57:22SpeakerBrought to you by your sponsors, Cannabrand Solutions.

3:57:26BubblemanThat's right. All right. Well, I'm having a dab while we close it out here. Last five minutes of a wonderful Sunday with the Cannabrand Solutions Team and Daniel, my partner, first time coming on social media and exposing himself to the whole world.

3:57:42SpeakerAppreciate it. Yeah, I wanted to say you can check out these all-in-ones in Rocky Road, Aurora. Shout out to Malik and George down there. And also at Rocky Road, Thornton, Joya, GBD, Green Valley Dispensary, with Drew, and Rocky Mountain Cannabis as well. And that's just the beginning. A lot of people are sampling it out. A lot more to come up down the pipeline. And I'm really excited to use this vision box.

3:58:07SpeakerIt's definitely my favorite.

3:58:09BubblemanYeah, thanks for shouting those guys out. I get so many people hitting me up on Instagram and then I'm like, fuck, I don't know the names of all the stores that have it. And then you kind of got to, we're going to try and build like an updated website where the brand, you can go on the brand and you can find out who has stock where live because otherwise it's like, and then people are like, hey, where are your pens in Colorado?

3:58:31BubblemanAnd then I'm like, well, I don't know. Like, are you in the North? Are you in the South? Are you like Denver in Colorado? Are you in Boulder? Like where are you at? Like tell, you end up telling them like someplace that's like five, a five hour drive away, which is never ideal for sure. All right. Well, I'm going to pop this little guy back in my bong.

3:58:52BubblemanDo one last rip before we say goodbye. Thank you guys for coming on. It's good to chat with you guys on a hashtag.

3:58:59SpeakerYou're welcome. This was super fun. Yeah, dude. Super fun.

3:59:05BubblemanGood hanging out with you guys outside of some event that we were at, you know. It's a hash church. Better than church. It is much better than church. We don't like impose our will on anyone here. Although I do think that Etienne's message was good and you should let it impose on you a little bit. People out there that are sitting back and listening, be imposed. It hit the heart.

3:59:35BubblemanIt hit the heart for sure. Shut up your ass.

3:59:37SpeakerYeah. Yeah. Thank you for keeping up the good fight. Yes.

3:59:45SpeakerWhat I do. I have a tattoo on my forearm. God bless you. Daima Senshi, which is Cannabis Warrior. Nice. That is for decades. Fuck yeah.

3:59:57BubblemanAre you sure that's what it says? What if that guy was playing a joke on you? No regards. Chicken. No regards. No regards.

4:00:10SpeakerNo regards. Hey, Mark, it could say Minsau. Possibly. You guys know what Minsau is in Mandarin? I can guess. What's that? Low-key hoardy. Low key horny. I don't know why someone taught me that. That was on your prior trip.

4:00:34BubblemanPrior as in before or prior the snowboard company? Prior trip to China when I wasn't there. Well, shout out to Chris Pryor anyway, who had a wonderful company. It still exists. Chris is unfortunately not with us anymore, but he started Pryor Snowboards. Awesome. Awesome snowboards for the Whistler backcountry. Very, very good stuff.

4:01:00SpeakerAll right.

4:01:00BubblemanWell, thank you guys so much for coming on. Thanks to the Press Club for sponsoring Hash Church. Always there are annual sponsor as well as Puffco. Shout out to you both and huge shout out to Cannabrand for spending the whole show with us and just being an awesome fucking group of homies that I'm always happy to see. Whenever we get to bump in and more so now that I can come to the US.

4:01:27BubblemanSo we'll see. Maybe, maybe it'll be Colorado because if you guys go in May, I will definitely go in May. I'm going to go there. In fact, I've been talking to Levi from Low Temp and we're thinking of maybe doing a bubble man, low temp horse, like a one day, like come, you know, spend the day making hash with, with me and probably Dan will be there as well.

4:01:49BubblemanDan, if I do come up for that and we set that up with, Thank you for joining us.

4:02:22SpeakerAbsolutely. Let's do it.

4:02:24BubblemanAwesome, guys. Well, thank you all for watching. We had a schwack of people watching the show today and we appreciate you guys always. Thanks to Bingo Lombardi for holding down the chat. Boro Josh and Booth 9666 and Baker B. Drew, all of the above. Thank you guys for watching. Thanks to the sponsors. Thanks to the Cannabrand team. And thanks to me, because fuck, if I wasn't doing this, none of you would be here.

4:02:49BubblemanJust joking. You probably would be. Etienne would be hosting it. You don't need me. I just wanted to pull the Snoop Dogg there for a few minutes and be conceited. Atomic value. It was funny, right? All right, everybody. May the full melt bless your bowl sooner than later. And we'll see you next time on Hash Church. Peace out, everybody. Thank you.

4:03:09SpeakerSee y'all.