Community and Tragedy in the Cannabis World

0:00BubblemanAll right. Hello, everybody. Welcome to Hash Church episode 62. I am going to quickly send out the links as I do each day when we start this off. Boom, bam, boom. And wow, what a week. What a week it's been since Hash Church 61. All sorts of crazy shit has happened. We got Instagram closing down accounts. We got Facebook closing down Hash Church groups. I think DNA lost their Instagram account.

0:29BubblemanI think Subcool lost his Instagram account as well as his... Oh, let me shut that down real quick. Oh good, that is on mute. Subcool lost his Weed Nerds account on Facebook and all sorts of things have been happening. I think nothing more important than what I'm going to mention right now. You know, losing an account can seem like a real bummer. It can really be, you know, Thank you so much for joining us.

1:29BubblemanI read her letter and I share a GoFundMe page for her friend Harland.

1:34Etienne FontanHer friend died, I think she died in a car wreck that she was in.

1:38BubblemanYes, I'm about to read that right now and welcome Etienne and welcome Nick. Yeah, so I'm going to read this quickly. This is a support page for her friend Harland Ryman. It's a memorial fund and I'm going to put this page up. In the Hash Church group, so if you guys are watching Hash Church right now and you're not a part of the Hash Church group on Facebook, you're going to want to become a part of it because it's going to be how you can get in touch with this GoFundMe.

2:08BubblemanIt's easy enough. It's GoFundMe.com backslash Harland, H-A-R-L-A-N-D-R-Y-M-A-N. So I'm going to read this page real quick that Jen wrote on the GoFundMe page. Hello, for those of you who don't know me, oh actually this is written by Pat, Jen's story is right below. My name is Pat Emerson and we are raising money to help with the cost of Harlan's memorial expenses. I will be traveling back to Brooklyn to help his mom with the overwhelming tasks that lie ahead.

2:38BubblemanI am reaching out to all of you and asking you to please donate if you can. I thank you in advance. Peace and love be with you. Hug the ones you love daily. Harlan is an amazing soul that will never be forgotten. Below, I am attaching Jen Doe's story. Please take a moment to read it. Jen is my dear friend and sister, so this was written on the 26th of this month.

2:58BubblemanToday I am thankful for life, and especially Harland. I sure wish there were still here so I could hug you super tight and tell you thank you so much. I am beyond grateful for my littles, my family, and my friends. Without all of you, this life would not be worth living. I know everyone has been worried and wondering what happened, so I would like to share part of my story with you on this day of thanks.

3:19BubblemanHarlan Ryan saved my life on Sunday afternoon in the freezing cold waters of the Willamette River. I was going under the second we burst out of the submerged sinking car. My clothes were so heavy and cold they were taking me down. I knew I was going to die. At first my memory of that first 15 seconds in the water was fuzzy. It all just happened so fast that I couldn't put it all together.

3:40BubblemanBut now I see it clearly as day. I remember taking my last breath as the last few inches of air trapped inside the car disappeared. It just went down so fast. Harlan and I busted through the back as it completely submerged and found ourselves in the rushing open water. Pat barely made it out of the driver's side window and suddenly we were all free. I was gasping for breath, kicking so hard to try and get my head up and I remember him grabbing my jacket and pulling me up so I could breathe.

4:07BubblemanI couldn't keep my head above the water. My wet coat was too heavy and I was struggling to swim. As the car sank, he helped me fight the current and find my footing on the roof of the vehicle as it settled to the river floor. Right before he drifted just out of my reach. I have no idea how I was able to stay on the car in the current.

4:25BubblemanThe freezing cold water was still above my waist and pushing me from every direction. But somehow I was able to stay put. You saved my life, buddy. You gave me the fighting chance that I needed to make it out of that river alive. I so badly wished I could have done the same for you, my friend. I wish so badly that things could have come out differently.

4:43BubblemanIt was not your time to... It was not your time to go. I still owe you a hug and I wish that you were here so I could give it to you now. I'm so sorry I couldn't save you right back. Instead I am hugging you with all my heart and soul and will never forget what you did for me. My littles still have their mommy because of you.

5:00BubblemanMy parents still have their daughter and I am so blessed to have the opportunity to tell your heroic story because you are my fucking hero and I love you dearly. I'm so thankful that I'm able to still hug Pat and I'm so beyond thankful that we don't have to go through this unfortunate aftermath alone. I'm so thankful that we still have each other and we will carry Harlan with us in our hearts as the beautiful angel that he is for the rest of our days.

5:23BubblemanI thought I was going to lose them both and I will never forget the fear and overwhelming love that I felt for my friends that afternoon. Freak fucking accident. The universe was against us. We were in exactly the wrong place at the right time for a disaster disguised as a fast rising tide to change our lives forever. Could have happened to anyone. People drive that sandbar all the damn time, and I will always wonder, why us?

5:44BubblemanHad Pat not kept the vehicle above water as long as he did with his quick action, reaction, and gangster driving skills, none of us would have gotten out of that car alive. Things were fine as we started back across the rocks, but when we hit the halfway point, a small wave bumped us just enough to lift the back tires just a hair, just barely enough to lose traction and send our back tires spinning as they began slipping down the edge of the sandbar.

6:06BubblemanThe current was pushing us further into the deep water and Pat was able to keep the front tires of the rock on the rocks and the car afloat just long enough for fishermen across the way to see us struggling. Shortly before it submerged completely with all three of us trapped inside. Things could have been much different, but as I think of the possibility of all of us making it out alive, my mind quickly goes to the possibility of none of us being here today.

6:29BubblemanHarlan lost his life that day in the river, but he saved us, both of us. My heart goes out to his loved ones, family and friends. He was a special soul, is a special soul, and will forever claim a huge piece of my heart. No words can change the overwhelming loss that we feel, but we must carry on. We must not take this second chance at life for granted.

6:49BubblemanIf we allow this to change us, we make sure that it is the changing us in a good way, because that is what he would want. It is easy to forget that life is so precious and fragile and can be gone in an instance. Please, I beg you with all my might, please make sure you make every day here count. Love you, Pat. Love you, Harland. You're both forever in my thoughts.

7:08BubblemanLove you all and appreciate the support. We're going to need it. Enjoy your dinners. Say a little prayer for us and remember life is what we make it. Also need to send a special thanks to all the rescuers, the fishermen that pulled us from the water. Thanks to your quick response. Today, I will never forget any of you. Thank you so much for being there. Jendo Hendricks.

7:31BubblemanSo that is the story. That's what happened. Harland Ryman Memorial Fund. They've raised $3,470 of 12K. This is a good one, guys. This is something that's worth $5 or $10 or $20 of your energy. And it's at the GoFundMe.com. Harland Ryman. Check it out, and we're really glad that you're still with us. Jen, Pat, I don't know you, but I'm really glad that you're still with us, too.

7:57BubblemanAnd Harland, I never got to know you, bro, but thanks for saving my friends. All right, sad note. Now let's blow smoke towards the Vatican, as our good buddy Rob Clark would have us do every Sunday.

8:12Etienne FontanTo Harland and Jen.

8:14BubblemanTo Harland and Jen. And Pat. And Pat.

8:23BubblemanWelcome to Hash Church 62, everybody.

8:25Etienne FontanThat's a humbling start.

8:30SpeakerYeah, holy shit, Mark. Wow. My love goes out to them. You know, tragedy happens so quickly in such unexpected ways.

8:41BubblemanIn an instant. In an instant.

8:43Etienne FontanIn the blink of an eye.

8:45BubblemanYou know, I thought it could have just as easily been us bitching about losing our group or DNA losing their Instagram, and I just thought, you know what, that is just not even close.

8:57SpeakerNo, it doesn't even matter. You know, in all honesty, Instagram gave back Strain Hunters, which had like 190K, so I think they're going to come around and stop harassing us pot people so much.

9:11BubblemanI saw that as well. It made me feel good that Arian and the boys got their strain hunters back. That's, I mean, next DNA, it's got to be one of the biggest.

9:22SpeakerNo.

9:23BubblemanThe biggest. No, not even close. No, I just mean the cannabis ones.

9:28SpeakerWeedstagram had like 700,000.

9:30BubblemanYeah, but Weedstagram is like for quality.

9:35SpeakerI mean, strain hunters. He sold it. He sold it. The kid that started it was a bud tender at Greenhouse, and it was a hobby, and he sold it.

9:42BubblemanI knew him. I know him. But I'm just saying, the quality of the account compared to Strain Hunters, I mean, they have an impeccable photographer. He's putting up, like, just baller photographs.

9:55SpeakerThat's Oscar.

9:56BubblemanYeah, Oscar impresses me.

9:59SpeakerHe's one of my favorite photographers, honestly, in the whole world. I love his composition, his eye. It's beautiful.

10:05BubblemanYeah, it's strong. It's strong, for sure.

10:08SpeakerYeah, yeah, no, it's awesome. He is such a fantastic photographer. Mr. X on Instagram for those that are watching. You know, I want to bring up the fact that I didn't know until after that Rhode Island, people in Rhode Island put together like a viewing party. And that really blew me away. I mean... I'm kind of doing this because it reminds me of what it was like when we used to do rallies and we'd get out and we'd speak.

10:36SpeakerAnd a lot of why I started getting on stage is because I felt like, you know, as much as I love Jack and Chris Conrad and others, there was a lot that was left unsaid. And I felt like if you get on stage and you didn't go there and scream at the audience, but you talked to them and you communicated, that there could be a lot of thought that transpires between, you know, the rally and the crowd.

10:58SpeakerAnd that's kind of why I started getting my voice out there and speaking up. And Hash Church, in my opinion, does that too. And to see people gathering together and smoking together and turning it into a communal act is so satisfying to me because it's really all about the community. I mean, we're not always going to agree. And I think that's the beauty of it. I mean, one of the things I've always liked about you, Mark, is that when we disagree, you're so gentlemanly about it.

11:23SpeakerYou're so diplomatic about it. You know, where I would be telling people, you're like so gentle, you're such a dad, and I love that about you, you know. And it's one of the things that's kind of always turned me on to this forum, if that makes truly honest sense.

11:38BubblemanWell, it's my Canadian roots.

11:42SpeakerDude, every time I see your posts, all I hear in my brain is, meanwhile in Canada, Mark is standing on a snowmobile. You know? Sanity is somewhere in the world.

11:54Etienne FontanHeptor gave us a voice, though. I mean, it allowed us to speak out to those, because back in the day, for every person they said that was at a rally, there was 10 to 20 at home because of passing out of the flyers and everything else. So in the end, you know, only people who showed up at the rallies were the dedicated, the hardcore of the hardcore.

12:16Etienne FontanSo we were not just preaching, we were preaching to each other because there was no internet, there was no information, there was no Facebook, there was no way to get out to meet people except to show up there, hopefully someone smoking a joint, pass a joint talk. Or as we were able to do, go on the stage and speak out because there was one from our generation.

12:39Etienne FontanIt was Jack, it was Dennis, it was the old generation and we respected them, but we needed to connect ourselves as well as to feel that connection with the community and that was, I mean, you and I met on Hemp Tour in Virginia in 94, you know, and that's the beauty of it and that's why I also come to Hash Church because I feel we're back preaching to the converted, but the converted Have so much knowledge to absorb and we have so much to give now.

13:05Etienne FontanSo much more than we had 20 years ago.

13:08SpeakerYou remember Todd McCorea having his little meetings about the potential for the internet, guys. If we make alt groups and we talk about this stuff, it'll spread. You know, he would be glowing right now if he saw us all sitting in different, you know, states, countries, continents, having these conversations and sharing the information we have. Because really when we started off, all of us believed that if we share the information, that's it, man.

13:31SpeakerThe information's infectious, the truth will set you free, we just got to get the information out there and then the game's over for them. I still believe it to be true, to be real.

13:43BubblemanYeah, I do as well.

13:46BubblemanI mean, I don't know if I'd be gathering here every single Sunday and spending the amount of time that I do, you know, on these computers, with these cameras, with all this videoing and making videos and uploading and it's, you know, there's a real sort of connection involved in it that, and the timing is now, regardless of, you know, anyone that's been around for the last 20 to 25 years, you really get this feeling that like, There's this whole new group of people that have come of age, and they're just ready for it.

14:18BubblemanThey are 100% ready for it, and thank God that we were able to remove ourselves from The segregated areas that they put us, the overgrows and the cannabis worlds and the cannabis only site that basically kept us preaching to the choir and barely ever, you know, now we're on YouTube and Instagram and Facebook and everyone uses those social medias. Many, many people use those social medias that are not the choir, the people that we definitely, definitely want to hit.

14:51BubblemanSo I appreciate that as well. I built my community for years. My Full Melt Bubble, I don't even know what year I started it. It must have been in 2005 or maybe before. I can't even remember. But it never got built to what I wanted it to be built to compared to just this YouTube channel or my Instagram account. You know, any of those simple little things have just...

15:19BubblemanJust allowed for an open dialogue with a larger group of people, that's for sure.

15:28SpeakerI agree with you totally. Sorry, I was just marketing us.

15:34SpeakerYou know, I am a bit disgusted, I mean, with what happened to us on Facebook. I had to wake up, so to speak, with a Narcotics Anonymous message in my friggin' phone. Me, I don't even smoke cigarettes. It takes me a week to eat at your fuckin' bar of chocolate, and they're worried about me hitting... I was pretty brazen in the sense

16:19BubblemanI sent them a message right back and basically said, oh, you know, my group got erased. It's all legal. There's nothing illegal going on. It's all like cannabis and like a lot of people have been helped from the group. And I even said, and I've started another group since called Hash Church, and I'll gladly delete it when you give me back my old one.

16:42SpeakerDid Cartman from Facebook write back and say, fuck you, hippie?

16:47BubblemanWell, you know, I thought at first, I was like, I wonder if they'll delete the new Hash Church group right away, but I woke up this morning, and I was happy to see, geez, there must be 700 people in there already now.

17:02Etienne FontanWell, I added a bunch of people who had friended me via Facebook, I went and added, but if you guys don't realize, the Facebook page for Hash Church went down yesterday, so there's a new one up, people, so please go sign up and join up. And spread the word.

17:21SpeakerYou know, I've had a community now since 2009. I initially put it together for the THC Expo. But we are, you know, everyone listening can go to hemp.xxx. We're not going to get thrown off. You can post all the weed photos you want. You can fucking make groups, talk about hash making. No one's going to get mad. And, you know, that's the main reason I started my own community, because at the time it was happening on MySpace, Facebook was absolute bigots, and this is just common practice with these corporations, you know, that it's bigotry towards cannabis, where they'll allow alcohol, they'll allow, you know, all these other things, but, you know, cigars are cool, but cannabis joints not so much, and I'm just sick of it.

18:03SpeakerI think we all are.

18:10SpeakerMark, you're muted.

18:11BubblemanYeah, I know. I just went to talk and then I was like, oh yeah, I'm muted. I find, uh, I'm just loud. I cough, I type, I knock shit over and it's like nothing bugs me more than when other people do that shit, so I'm just muting myself like crazy. Okay.

18:28BubblemanOh, I have no idea when my rosin bags will be in stock. I've ordered them three times. The last time I ordered like thousands of them, and they just sold out right away. So I just can't even fucking keep them in stock. You guys are maniacs out there pressing.

18:42SpeakerAwesome. Hey, I want to bring something up. I was going to wait until Tony was on, but we can talk with Tony. People were saying that I was anti-sunshine, and I'm not. And the thing is, is when he made the comment, what he really was talking about was resin gland size. And when he said it, the thing I heard was, You know, basically a resin gland can't get to its full size if grown indoors, and I don't believe that.

19:04SpeakerYou know, I think that plants can express themselves fully indoors as much as they can outdoors under the right conditions. So when he said that, you know, I thought it was a generalization in a way. Some strains might have bigger resin glands outside than they do indoors. You know, most of the time plants develop the best under controlled situations, so, but shit, I mean, I still think a greenhouse with augmented light is the best way to go, you know, but then you're controlling the environment around, you know, all that natural light with the greenhouse.

19:37SpeakerSo, I love sun, just for the sake of conversation. Well, you do live in California.

19:43BubblemanYou do live in California and you're constantly photographing it, so I know you love the sun. And in fact, you know what, there were people that said, oh, Todd doesn't like the sun, but there were just as many people that were like, that's not what he's saying at all.

19:58Etienne FontanTrust us, we're all sun worshippers.

20:00SpeakerEven Tony at the end was listening to himself and I think he realized, you know what, things get pretty big actually, you know.

20:07BubblemanYeah. Hey, we should give a shout out to DNA Genetics. You guys go follow their new page. Let's get them back up to 150,000 where they were. They are at DNA under slash genetics is their new page. And welcome Horatio. Is your Instagram still intact?

20:26HoratioNow I got to go check my phone. Don't play around.

20:29BubblemanQuite a few accounts got deleted. Not mine, not Todd's, not anyone else's in here, but DNA got bumped, Subcool got bumped, I guess bigger accounts.

20:39HoratioYeah, I don't want a bigger account. I still got an account.

20:44BubblemanDude, I'd be so bummed. Just a bummer. Why do people want to go around and mess with people? It's like, man, leave those people alone. I swear it's an automatic thing where if you get a certain complaint or a certain amount of complaints, they just, like, cut that shit. Done.

21:01SpeakerOne of the reasons that I know... Harvestside had their account taken away and they got it back. And I know originally when they took away our Facebook accounts, they were talking about labeling... Items for sale and or listing a price associated with picture. So that could be something if they were trying to say that something was for sale. But Instagram really isn't used in that way. So I'm not really sure why Instagram's

21:28BubblemanWell, there's a whole program that works with Instagram that is exactly that same thing. You put your price, you put your amount, you put your limits, and basically you run it through Spreezy, and Spreezy basically monitors the account, and when anyone just writes their email in the account, Spreezy sends that person... A checkout page through PayPal or whatever you've got set up to sell that product, and it works in conjunction with Instagram.

22:00BubblemanI wonder if that's a problem, why Instagram wouldn't just shut down Spreezy and not allow them to do that.

22:12Etienne FontanAnyone?

22:13BubblemanAnyone?

22:13HoratioWas that Nick's response?

22:14Etienne FontanI'm sorry, I was going to get his voice back. Yeah, squishing, that's it, pressure. I will squish this, Bob.

22:22BubblemanIs that the Dewalt wireless version? Is that what's going to happen here?

22:31SpeakerCan we look down at Mark's dash one more time? Can you just put the camera back towards what the heck is to your right, Mark? All right, so we have...

22:40BubblemanSqueezed out chips. We've got some of Tony's terpenes. We've got all sorts of different cured rosins. We've got our rosins from the West Coast crew, and then they just give me hash. Those fucking guys are so generous. They've given me all these grams of hash. Beautiful, beautiful full melts.

23:02Etienne FontanYou don't have any choice there, Mark.

23:04BubblemanI have no choice. I actually invited them over today for Hash Church because I was like, man, you guys, you represent so hard in Hash Church and you don't even know. I'm puffing so much of your shit. Actually, one of the combinations from their rosin, which was, oh, it was this one. It was Master Scout Flower Rosin mixed with Tony's Jack Frost Terpenes. I'm not going to fucking lie.

23:32BubblemanIt is the greatest rosin. Fucking flavor. The greatest taste I've ever hit with cannabis. It is insane. Completely insane. That's insane. Man, I'm telling you, I have no words. Every single person I've hit it with, it tastes like candy in your mouth. And neither the Jack nor the Flower, the Master Scout, tastes like that on their own. They only taste like it together. It's the strongest form of synergy that I've seen in a terpene and a cannabinoid, you know, adding terps to cannabinoids.

24:12BubblemanI really, it blew me away, and I mean, I have all sorts of other ones here. There's eight other flavors here, and I have not even come close to one.

24:21Etienne FontanSo the snozzberry tastes like snozzberry.

24:24BubblemanMan, I'm telling you, snozzberry. And do you know that he wrote a book years later and he used that term to describe a dude's penis? No joke. That is a fucking piece of history you did not know.

24:39Etienne FontanIs that a pair of snozzberries or he whipped out his snozzberry? I think it was a single snozzberry.

24:47BubblemanWho wrote this? Who wrote that? Who wrote that kid's book with the snozzberry? Dr. Seuss? Dr. Seuss? No, I just read this recently. Let me look it up now.

25:00SpeakerYou're with me right now. I've read all these books. I didn't really run into any penis jokes.

25:05BubblemanOh, it was from, snozzberries were from, were from Willy Wonka. And so he makes a joke, and he says, you know, the snozzberries taste like snozzberries. So what he was saying was, those kids lick dick-flavored wallpaper. Because it was wallpaper, the snozzberry wallpaper. I just saw that the other day. I don't know why I know that but it's pretty useless.

25:32Dr Mark ScialdoneI'm not sure that's the intent of that, Mark.

25:37BubblemanGoogle it, Mark. You're a scientist. Do your research before you open your mouth. Come on.

25:45Dr Mark ScialdoneI'll let someone else Google shit.

25:47BubblemanAlright, I'm having another hit. Oh, you know who can Google shit? Graham. Graham is a hash church watcher. That guy is the most professional Google researcher on the planet. So Google it, Graham, and post it up. We know you will, brother.

26:04Dr Mark ScialdoneIf there's a wiki page for it, he will find it.

26:07BubblemanIf there isn't, he will write it.

26:09Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, he'll wiki.

26:12BubblemanWiki that shit up, brother.

26:14Dr Mark ScialdoneIt just really sucks, though, that they deleted all that content. I mean, there's just a whole lot of Information other than just people showing off pictures of their stuff.

26:27BubblemanThank you for bringing that up because I would love to tell this to everyone right now. I know you guys want to represent in Hash Church, but I'll tell you. The best way to do it is not to post a picture of your bud or your hash or your rosin because we have rooms for those specific things. Team Dry Sift for Dry Sift, Water Extraction Hash Makers Group for Water Hash or the Water Extraction Drying Technique if you want to learn more about that.

26:56BubblemanTricomb Farming got closed but I'll be bumping it back up again today and starting that group again. But really what Hash Church is for is Is to share valid information that we can talk about on Hash Church. Not to show off your product, which is like collecting likes, collecting comments. Do that in one of the other groups. Don't dilute the group, because it's the way Facebook works.

27:18BubblemanAnd I know there are search parameters, but people really do like scrolling. And if we can keep all of the posts gems... Then, you know, and I apologize when I go through and I erase people saying thanks for the ad or when I erase people who post just a picture of a bud or a piece of hash. It's not that, you know, I don't want you to feel like you're in trouble.

27:39BubblemanI just don't feel that it's really helping the group. I think we could all elevate the group, the quality of the posts together by simply, you know, not trying to post to be seen. If that makes enough sense. You know, this whole internet day. You know the classic picture of the dude with his camera down, his phone down by his crotch and it's all girls and they're all like licking the phone.

28:03BubblemanIt's like Instagram likes. We don't want that. It's like post something that's valid, that creates a dialogue. It can be controversial. No problem. Just don't post a picture of your fucking hash or your rosin or your buds. There are other groups for that. There we go.

28:22Etienne FontanAnd I see people are already putting the knowledge back up. Unfortunately, people have archived some of that information, so thanks to everybody who's re-contributing that information again.

28:32BubblemanI still have a good feeling that we are going to get the old group back. There's nothing that we did wrong. I can't imagine. And I mean if the old group stays gone then they're just going to delete the new group too. So hopefully it all works out. I mean I like to think that we're not choking people out so badly that they're complaining about a group that really doesn't affect them in a negative way.

28:53BubblemanThank you so much for joining us today.

29:24Etienne FontanAt some point you can't tell me, you know, there aren't cops watching this and there aren't people who aren't upset and who don't watch this just to keep an eye on what the fuck we're talking about and what we're doing. So, you know, to think that everybody has, you know, wonderful motives in this world is a sunshine and lollipops kind of situation which none of us existed.

29:52Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, it's just a bummer because, um, You know, it was a convenient forum to have, you know, post-church discussions in more detail where, you know, you could share information and like the one example I remember was, you know, our discussion of the ensemble effect and how it's related to not just the mixture of cannabinoids but there's an interaction between the terpenes and There was a long post that had five different scientific references that had, you know, showed the interactions between cannabinoids and terpenes and how they do have a synergistic effect in mammals.

30:40Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd, you know, this is peer-reviewed literature that's out there on the web, and it's a discussion that just started in Hash Church but then sort of took on a life of its own in a thread on the Facebook page. And it makes me not want to add content onto a Facebook page if I know that pictures of kids hash are eventually going to get that page taken down.

31:04Dr Mark ScialdoneThen it's a waste of my time.

31:06SpeakerIt's not pictures of kids hash, though. There's so many weed groups. I mean, not to be rude. I think that it's definitely being targeted. I know.

31:14Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd Instagram plays a huge role, Todd, like when those hash makers in Colorado are posting their pours, Those end up being translated into lines at the dispensaries when those guys have their drops. And then that hash is sold out before it even is reaching the dispensary because of what's built up, because of what's being posted on Instagram. People are like, holy shit, I need to get that hash.

31:46Dr Mark ScialdoneWoo, they're trying to figure out. So it is a powerful marketing tool to get product into consumers' hands.

31:54SpeakerYeah, I know that. I wasn't speaking to it like that, Mark. I was just saying that posting pictures, I have put pictures of weed all over. I don't get, you know, my Instagram pushes through and has pushed through to Facebook for the past four years, five years now with HempXXX, and I've never had a problem. And I post weed and hash and BHO and water and you name it.

32:16SpeakerLook at my Instagram. There's like 2,000 photos on it. I don't think it's kids' photos going through our Facebook that's fucking with us. I think people are reporting it as popularity or content. And that's what caused the computer to trigger it.

32:30Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's the reporting that closes the pages down. That's absolutely right. I just wanted to mention that. So someone complained about something out there, Mark, and whoever is the administrator of the page is owed an explanation by Facebook on exactly what was offensive that shut it down or else we're going to have the same issue again.

32:51BubblemanI sent them a message, so I'm definitely on that point. I should mention as well, because enough people have asked me in the room, I do also have an online forum. It's at FullMountBubble.com. I don't use it too much. I tried to get it going, but if people are worried that their posts are going to get... Delete it off of Facebook. They're welcome to copy and paste them into that forum.

33:13BubblemanSo, you know, in my opinion, I just keep trucking forward. I'm not going to stop posting. It's exactly what they want you to do is to stop posting and sharing this information. And the bottom line, Mark, is the people that got to read that were helped by it. And it was a good dialogue. And people were, so many people have been helped. I saw a guy the other day, and I'm pretty sure he posted, Hashtag saved my life.

33:42Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, well, there was a great post the other day by a guy out there who, again, was at the beginning of his academic career who was asking about academic career paths, whether it was going to be in botany or biology or chemistry. And there was a lot of informed comments on that thread that were not just useful to that young man who's thinking about going to college, But useful for anyone who would be at that point in their career where they're thinking about what kind of academic training do I need.

34:20Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd that's all useful discussion that has nothing to do with people posting inappropriate content that should be removed from Facebook. That's all.

34:36BubblemanYeah, I just wanted to reply to someone in chat. They're asking if the site is down. It's not down. Fullmeltbubble.com. It's still up and running and active. So there you go. There's a few varieties, you know, between Todd and myself. There are those two sites. I'm always going to build up the Facebook groups unless they delete me right off of Facebook. I'll continue. I know for a fact what we're doing is not wrong.

35:03BubblemanIt's a good thing. We're sharing information.

35:06Dr Mark ScialdoneHey Marcus, I'm getting a text from Jen Doe. Can you send her the link? I did. It's in her... You know what?

35:16BubblemanCan we not interrupt people like that? It comes across as so rude. You can just post it as writing, like texting in the little thing there. Then I lose my train of thought. And I did indeed send Jen the...

35:31Dr Mark ScialdoneI just don't feel right sending you the link without asking you first. I'm sorry.

35:35BubblemanOh, weird. She's saying that it's not there. Someone else might have to send this to her. Let me see.

35:41Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I was just starting to respond to the comment that this morning's church is a sausage fest.

35:48BubblemanWell, I invited Hillary and I invited Heather and Jen had told me that she wasn't going to be able to make it. Church is generally a sausage fest. We've got to get more... You know what, though? I will say this. There are a lot more women involved in the cannabis industry lately, and it does put a smile on my face to see them just taking the... I mean, there's always been great women at the helm of the cannabis industry, like Hillary Black, and you've got Debbie down there.

36:20BubblemanYou've got... Oh, the... What was her name?

36:25Dr Mark ScialdoneThe... Carell.

36:29Dr Mark ScialdoneChloe Villana, who heads the, what, Cloverleaf University. Valerie. Valerie.

36:37SpeakerValerie Carell. Yeah, Valerie and Mike.

36:39Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, Valerie and Mike.

36:40SpeakerThose are my favorite.

36:45BubblemanYeah, lots of great women, and just lots more coming on board and moving things forward.

36:54SpeakerWould you like to have LV on one weekend?

36:58SpeakerMark? Yes. That would be fantastic. LV, for those listening, has been, she's the first woman to get medical marijuana from the United States government back in the 80s. They send her 300 joints a month. For her condition, they grow it at the University of Mississippi and they process it through Research Triangle Institute. And she uses it for her glaucoma. And instead of just being quiet about it, she has been the loudest activist I've known since I've become an activist.

37:27SpeakerShe's always out there pushing her story and trying to explain to people that they deserve what she gets. It's beautiful. She's such a hero to me.

37:37Etienne FontanShe is amazing. She was with me when we met on Hemp Tour. I did a tour in 93 with her and a tour in 94. And she's been through every United States telling people and showing her with her tin saying, hey, I sued the government for 12 years to get this because she has got glaucoma. And she basically lost one eye and she got busted in Florida, Hollywood, Florida.

38:02Etienne FontanShe got busted in And her local community then realized when she said, I'm a medical patient, I'm going blind, I need this for my eye. And the community was outpouring of love. And in fact, if I recall, when the cops busted her, she had just harvested her plants and they were in the freezer and they didn't look in the freezer and she was able to actually keep her plants.

38:24Etienne FontanBut this is back in the 70s, folks. I think she won it in 1978. But outpouring from the community said, hey, you know, You're sick? You need pot? Let us know. We'll get you pot. And so she then sued the government and then won that right. And she was the first woman to win that right. And she didn't rest on her laurels or hide like the original cannabis patient did.

38:49Etienne FontanAnd she went out and she yelled from every rooftop that she could to everyone to listen. And let me tell you, going on hemp tour with her was bulletproof because... You got one-on-one or you got a group talking to her. She was a mother. She was going blind while she was raising her children, okay? And there's no one, when she spoke her truth and whipped out her tin of joints and said, look, this comes, the DEA delivers this to me, there's no one that went, bullshit.

39:24Etienne FontanI mean, of course, they thought that in their head, but she had it in spades because she It blew everything out what they were telling us about the drug war that were just young, lazy drug users, et cetera, et cetera. This was a real-life mom. This was going out there. And I've got to give LV props because she stayed out there year after year, state after state, rally after rally, just going out and spreading the word.

39:48Etienne FontanSo if there is definitely a grandmother of cannabis, that woman deserves her place and respect in our community without a doubt. She's earned it in spades.

40:01BubblemanHow about Brownie Mary? There's no such thing as recreational cannabis use. It's all medicinal.

40:08Etienne FontanYou want to talk about a sailor mouth woman? Holy shit. I loved her, but man, she would make me blush. And I was in the fucking army. And let me tell you, her and Dennis together... That'll tell you.

40:21SpeakerStory after story. I had Mary and Dennis in my kitchen making brownies back in the 90s, 94. And she was talking to him, telling him to go get her cigarettes like unbelievably. I was like blushing. And he was like, okay, Mary. It was so awesome. Their relationship was so tight. And she looked great in the photo. She looked like Grandma holding brownies, but my God, when she would get up there, she was so crass.

40:51SpeakerI loved her, though. Brownie Mary was so rad. Great woman.

40:55BubblemanWe're shouting out all the great women in the cannabis industry. We've got to give a welcome to Tony V's in the house, and the Cuban grower just rolled in. Welcome, guys.

41:05SpeakerWhat's up, bro?

41:08BubblemanMan, we started it pretty heavy today with Jen Doe's story. You know, she damn near died, drowned in a car there, and her friend who saved her life actually passed away. So we mentioned him, Harland Ryman, and his GoFundMe. It's costing an arm and a leg to just put him in the ground and have services. They want to help sort of make that, just alleviate at least that one little, you know, part of this horrible experience.

41:41BubblemanOh wow, you know what, first Cuban, when I just saw, when I just saw that you were an avatar, I thought you were holding a ball of hash in your hand and like moving your hands around like a globe and then I opened it up and I was like, oh snap, that's his dog.

41:58SpeakerYeah man, she's very clingy so she wants to say hi and stuff, you know. Wicked. She's wondering what's up with all this weed I'm bringing up.

42:07BubblemanOh snap.

42:10SpeakerYeah.

42:11BubblemanHow do you break your weed up? You use your hands, you use scissors, you got a grinder, what do you do?

42:18SpeakerI break it up from, this is a string called mint chocolate chip, my boy X grew it, so it's a cookie phenol, right? A cookie cross, and it's like hard as a rock. It looks hard as a rock, dude. Yeah, so I break it up into pieces, you know, I break it down node by node and then I just grind it. Grinder. Yeah, it's faster. That's the finger grinder combo.

42:43SpeakerYeah, it's a little combo, you know, but I do it like the Jamaicans, man. I just puff to the face. I don't pass my joints, so it's my finger cells I'm smoking. I'm happy with it, you know.

42:54BubblemanYeah, no, exactly. I mean, I never pass joints towards the end either myself. It was really when I went to Jamaica in 95 that ruined me, because then I just started smoking these, like, three and four gram joints with these Lion of Judah rolling papers, and... I don't know, I just, I smoked so many joints, I got to this point where even my wife was like, are you even like, are there, do you feel the effects of that?

43:19BubblemanBecause I literally would smoke like, you know, 10 of these joints at least a day. Like it was on point with Remo, but I think Remo must be around like 30, 40, because he smokes 10 in like an hour. Like it's unbelievable. Never seen anyone smoke joints like Remo. Except maybe like some of my hardcore Rasta friends that like they smoke non-stop. They always have a joint in their hand, in their mouth, burning.

43:46BubblemanWhich is, that's pretty legit. That's the love of cannabis right there.

43:54SpeakerYeah, it's what pushes me and motivates me through the garden, being able to puff and listen to music, you know what I mean? But I alternate, man. I like smoking blunts because, you know, that's just what I smoked for like 20 plus years as a young adult. But sometimes they get a little annoying, so I do roll my joints. I kind of alternate. It depends how I'm feeling.

44:16SpeakerBut lately, I've been smoking a whole lot more flowers than hash. And as long as I roll, like, Todd over there, three and a half grams per spliff, then I'm on it, you know. Smoke it to the head and I'm feeling pretty good. You know, it's because I like the taste. I don't like the taste of paper and I just like the taste of a nice fat joint.

44:36SpeakerYou know, I've had so many people be like, oh, that's so wasteful, but it grows on trees technically. It does. Yeah, literally, literally grows on trees, literally.

44:47BubblemanPeople are funny. They see things, it's all perspective, right? Everything's a perspective thing. Depends on where your perspective lies that will sort of almost create the view that you have.

45:04SpeakerDefinitely. I mean, I think that when people start growing cannabis and getting their source to be Mother Nature, like, I told a few people this, and people can tell me what they think, but, you know, most of the time when we get jobs, you know, when we're 16, 17, 18, we start to work in the normal world, We can work our ass off, show up on time, bust our ass, and we don't necessarily get rewarded for it.

45:26SpeakerWe can ask for a raise. We can hope that there'll be attention on our good deeds. When we're gardening, we actually get rewarded instantly. Like Mother Nature is invisible and she's just watching. So if you go make 100 extra plants, you're going to get all that extra energy that you put out, you're going to get back. And it teaches you or it instills in us, at least in me, it instilled the way that we would work as hard as we could because we knew we would get rewarded.

45:54SpeakerWhereas most people, they would go in and get a minimum wage so they do the minimum amount of work. You know, a gardener goes in there and does the most amount of work because they know it's worth it. They're not going to have to wait for permission or wait for somebody to pat them on the back. Mother Nature is just going to straight hook them up. And I think that that lesson coming to me at 13, 14, 15 was probably one of life's greatest lessons.

46:18SpeakerAnd I'd love to know what other people think of that, especially employers who have to deal with a wage to effort ratio.

46:26BubblemanYeah, it's definitely part of the reason that I loved it so much, to be able to watch it grow from nothing, because of course when I started growing in the 90s, the early 90s, it was from seed. That's how you grew, you grew from seed, you got seeds, you went to Amsterdam and got seeds, and you were like, yeah, brought your seeds back and planted your seeds and watched them just on a plate with paper towel and were like, look, they're growing, like, I wonder how many will be females, and That was my introduction to growing cannabis and it was a beautiful thing to be able to see.

47:01BubblemanI'll say one thing though, my kids who have zero interest in it, it's my thing. I have a federal license so they are exposed to seeing it, plants, growing, they've watered them in fact. What it did inspire in them was to, they asked me both, hey, would we be able to grow something? And I was like, what do you guys want to grow? And they were like, I don't know, like peppers or tomatoes or like lettuce or, you know, so we got all of these seeds and I set up a little indoor area with some T5s and we sprouted all the seeds together and those seeds are even so much smaller than cannabis seeds.

47:34BubblemanThey're kind of trippy to plant some of those things and watch them actually come to life and grow into it, you know, like sunflowers are classic because they get so fat and thick. It's a Kind of a comparison to see that much biomass be produced from a small seed in that short of a time of period. Well, you learn the direct relationship of what you need to do, what you need to give that plant, water and the food for it to do that.

48:00BubblemanAnd it definitely opened their eyes to loving growing.

48:07SpeakerYou know, the other little thing I'd like to say is it taught me how to care for something, but not over care for something. You know, you can't put the fans on the little saplings, you know, the little seedlings, and you can't beat them to death with your concern. You've got to let things just kind of go. And, you know, it taught me really how to pay attention.

48:25SpeakerI mean, because if I didn't, my plants would just die. Their little silent protests would be, okay, you don't pay attention to me, I die. And you learn how to pay attention. I swear I learned more about how to run my life from growing cannabis because it was practical applications where you had to plan in advance, you had to figure out what nutrients you're going to need, you had to go into it with the right tools if you expected to come out of it with the good results.

48:53SpeakerYou know what I mean?

48:54BubblemanYep, 100%. I do 100% know what you mean.

48:58SpeakerThey just don't teach you that in school really, you know?

49:02BubblemanThey don't teach you anything really in school. I mean, they should be teaching you that, how to grow and take care of food, what organics is, the science behind what non-organics is, chemical compounds and how they interact and create synergies and how they can harm so much more than just in their singular sources than when you stack and pile them up on top of one another, or how to take out a mortgage on a house, or how to be able to pay for your rent and your bills and manage your Thank you for watching.

49:45SpeakerDude, I joke that my focus was underground economics in school because cannabis taught me all that. It gave me energy. It taught me how to balance budget money. I didn't have a choice. I had to because when I grew cannabis, I suddenly had money because all my friends were tugging on me going, can I get a little bit? Just a little bit. Come on, please, a little bit.

50:03SpeakerThat was nothing you could do.

50:04BubblemanI know. You're either the dick or you're the man. And it was way better when you were with your buddies if you were smoking your weed out of their stash.

50:16SpeakerBack in the 80s, I could always smell if they had my pot because homegrown was so unique where it had terpenes and you could smell the bag in the pocket and a lot of the stuff we would get was a bit more processed.

50:27BubblemanHomegrown. What a wonderful term, right? You're coming out of a time where almost all herb is imported from Colombia, from Mexico, from Thailand, from Jamaica, from all of these different places. Import. And then all of a sudden, yeah, this is homegrown. I swear, the first probably one or two years of homegrown, people were growing like land race sativas or narrow leaf drug cultivars for Sam and Rob, and just growing leaf and just never understanding why they weren't, these are like, these are some sparse motherfuckers.

51:05Etienne FontanYeah, there had to be a reason because that was a pervasive thought through, I mean, the cannabis community, you know, it's rather fascinating. How it's been perpetuated that, you know, when I first got into cannabis, homegrown was a dirty word. You know, and that really blew me away. I was like, wait, I've seen pictures in high times and homegrown marijuana looks pretty fucking better than this brown shit that I got with these black C's right here.

51:28Etienne FontanYou know, which I had back then.

51:31SpeakerThat was the insult everybody would give me. Oh, it's homegrown. You just got homegrown. Yeah, I heard it all the time, honestly. My retort was always, hey, everything's homegrown if you're in the home it's grown in, okay? True enough.

51:47BubblemanBut really, back then, that was all field pot. The OG pot was field pot. These motherfuckers weren't even growing it in greenhouses. And forget about supplemental light.

52:00SpeakerYou know who I feel bad for, bro? The people out in Florida that get all the outdoor that doesn't move in Cali. They get sent over there and they think it's homegrown and they move it for top dollar prices. That's crazy. Florida's totally that place, though. It used to be. I came from Florida, right? And I had home grows, you know what I mean? But the work that would get pushed was all indoor.

52:25SpeakerBut a lot of the farmers, because of the prohibition, they just started leaving. Um, in, in Mass, you know, the West Coast or wherever else it was medical. And there was, um, like a deficit of growers, so they all started to, to, um, import the work from Cali. And it's, I didn't know it at the time. I looked at it and it looked fire, but yeah, when my boy went out there and he saw the work, it was just, you know, not, not the best work, for sure.

52:52Etienne FontanA lot of times when I would go to Hawaii, I would see the same thing. I would feel bad for him because all they had available was, like, Not very good outdoor California, not the best stuff. And it really surprised me that that's the prohibition on the island or in other places that they just shut you down and there's no other recourse except dealing with local sheriffs who

53:15SpeakerI just want to say we shouldn't generalize because a lot of it is if you know the right people, you get the right stash. And there was good stuff everywhere. You just had to happen to be in with the people that had the right stuff.

53:26BubblemanYes, but at the same time, guarantee the best herb in Cali or BC at the same time in the 90s, it was always going where the dollar dictated. And that dollar was Manhattan. Manhattan paid more than anyone. And so New York had the best weed. It was like literally like rock star, like, you know, like fucking the weed that Mark Goldberg or the fucking, you know, these fucking Hollywood stars would have or whatever, like 600 an ounce or more.

53:55BubblemanLike ridiculous.

53:57SpeakerCan I just add though in New York there was a weird mentality where people like to brag about how much their pot cost as if that made it better. I know that sounds weird, but when they paid 600 an ounce, it'd be like, guys, that was just sold for 400 like the rest of this shit.

54:14BubblemanOr less. It was less than 200 where they were buying it, dude. Less than 200 where they were buying it.

54:21HoratioDude, standard New York rap is like $800 a jar is what they would say. They'd be like, I'm twisting the lid on how much it costs. And when you grow up listening to that, it really fucks up your brain because you don't know what's value anymore. So I'm like, I've got to find this $800 a jar shit. It's going to be sex. It's this concept. I wanted to ask a question.

54:43HoratioNow, there was another term, like I remember Homegrown. Now, when the Chronic came out, was that just a fucking made-up term, or is that an actual defined thing, like when there was Hydroweed?

54:57SpeakerChronic was one slang, but then Serious Seeds named it a variety. Back in 1994, and it was one of their heavy yielders, like 600 grams a meter. So chronic was just another street term like for weed, you know, but it became an actual strain name.

55:19BubblemanWelcome Dana Larson to the room, and I do agree, Todd, we should try and pass the conversation around like it is a joint. Tony still hasn't said hi. Lola.

55:34BubblemanHow's it going? It's going pretty good, man. I mean, I'm alive. After reading Jen Doe's story, I feel like it's going better. It's easy to get in the dumps, but then you read some crazy story where people like almost lost their lives and other people did lose their lives and all of a sudden, there sure is context in death.

55:58Dana LarsonWow.

56:04SpeakerYeah, that was a crazy way to wake up to that story for sure. I'm glad she's okay and stuff.

56:11BubblemanYeah, she said she was going to maybe try and come and share some time with us here. She's got to build up her courage. She's feeling a little shook up.

56:23BubblemanWhat's up, Pops?

56:25SpeakerWhat's up, Tony? Say something about that, you know, Peter McWilliams and I were going to write a book because he wrote this very famous line of book called Life 101 and when he was getting close to death he wanted to write a book called Death 101 but we obviously didn't get around to it. But the conversation was about, you know, as cancer patients, two of us talking, you know, there was a certain Emancipation that happened when we both focused on the finality of our life, when we focused on the fact that life was very short and fragile and that we were all going to die someday, I almost feel like it was a beautiful lesson to be given as a child because whereas most people walk through life thinking, oh, it's inevitable, I've got tomorrow, I can make this up on another day, when you're focusing on the fact that you're going to die or the party's going to come to an end, You really do have a passion to go around and say I love you to people and to be more forgiving and to look at every second, every breath as much more precious.

57:22SpeakerAnd, you know, that was going to be the gist of Death 101, you know, dying with dignity. But obviously Peter passed away before we could do that project. But I still love the concept.

57:38Etienne FontanWell, it also gives your life purpose and, you know, like I always said, you know, once you walk away from the battlefield, the rest is gravy and it's unfortunately one of those survivor's guilt sort of things where you feel the need to, you either crawl into a hole or you climb out and enjoy life and it's your choice. We make that choice. So, you know, I fortunately threw the thing the worst in And realizing that, you know, I could have died as well.

58:07Etienne FontanI had three strokes in the Gulf and I was medevaced and all kinds of other ugly shit that happens during war. But it makes you realize that we're here on this planet and you can either contribute to sucking off of it or you can contribute to helping people out and making the world a better place. And I'm thankful people like Jen already have that knowledge and I hope she's able to continue and to push onward through this very difficult time and Find her solace in this plant and this community so she can move forward.

58:40Etienne FontanIndeed.

58:40BubblemanSo people are actually saying, and this sounds like a real stretch in the chat room here, that Snoop Dogg mispronounced the name hydroponic and called it hydrochronic. I'm not feeling it myself, but maybe one day someone can ask Snoop rather than read about it on the internet.

59:08SpeakerRight, but didn't Dre just name The Chronic after a slang term for cannabis in L.A.? I mean, he is a product of his environment, and I mean, not to say that rappers borrow heavily from the influences around them or anything, but I don't think he made up the term. I just think people were calling it. You know, same could be said with marijuana, to be honest. Same could be said with pot.

59:34SpeakerHmm. Hot, Chronic, Marijuana. I mean, when you go back in time, the roots to these are very, very questionable at best.

59:46Etienne FontanIt was always interesting traveling around the country, rallies and stuff like that, and hearing regional names, such as, you know, Chronic in one area, or in Florida it was the Crippy back in the early 90s, and just hearing different slangs for people's understanding, because they're only Okay, so I should mention that now that a thousand people have posted in the chat room that Snoop Dogg himself said that, that he mispronounced

1:00:28BubblemanI still don't believe it. I think he's rewriting history. It sounds suspect to me. Fuck Snoop Dogg. I'm just joking.

1:00:38BubblemanI'm just joking. Man, I swear a hundred people wrote. He said it. He said it. Snoop Dogg said it. He said it on his show.

1:00:44SpeakerI was like, all right, all right. Oh my God.

1:00:48BubblemanI got it. So that was said by Snoop Dogg on his own GGN network.

1:00:56HoratioIt's just sometimes I think rappers contradict themselves. Like, I heard a guy in a line go, we smoke endos and sativas, we ain't fucking with no hazes. I'm like, well then what the fuck is a haze? And are you just saying you don't like peppery turps or is it a stupid rhyme? There's so many things people just listen to and adopt and it was the chronic, no, no man, this is hydro, you don't understand.

1:01:19HoratioThere's all these lines.

1:01:23SpeakerThe thing is, Toray Show, that's like some L.A. mentality over there, man. They're straight up O.G. and nothing else, bros. Hayes probably on the bottom of the list to them. And I love Hayes, just saying.

1:01:40BubblemanMan, I love Hayes, too. It's definitely my favorite. If someone's going to ask me what my favorite Terp profiles are, generally it is those... Although I have to say, Tony, and I just mentioned this a little bit ago, this Master Scout Flower Rosin with the Jack Terps is the most unbelievable taste I've ever tasted. It's candy, bro. It's insane. Only this one, though. I hit it with all these different ones and it doesn't produce the same synergy that it does with this one, which I'm sorry to say is gone.

1:02:18BubblemanSo gone. So gone.

1:02:21SpeakerThat's a big statement. What was the hash that you used again? What was that?

1:02:26BubblemanIt was Flower Rosin from Master Scout. The taste was unbelievable, dude. It was completely insane. And every person, it was so insane that I gave it away to everyone, that I just hit like 20 people and then it was like gone. I was like, damn. Puff Wednesday, actually, quite a few people hit it. These one people, like, five minutes later were licking their lips. They were like, I can still taste it.

1:02:55BubblemanIt was funny. I'd love to puff it with all of you on the panel right now because I'm telling you, I do not say that lightly. It was ridiculous. Although, at the same time, I do worry about the potential ramifications of inhaling terpenes with hash. I mean, there's got to be safety protocols in place where we understand... What are the safe terpenes and what are the non-safe terpenes for inhaling in larger doses than they are presently available in the hash or the plant matter?

1:03:32BubblemanSeems like it'll be a good road to take in the near future.

1:03:35SpeakerYeah, I think when you expose the heads, if you will, whether it's in like a rosin Because if you're doing like flower rosin or you're doing hash rosin, you'll notice when you expose those heads, some of the terpenes are lost in that process. Some of them feel like they're tougher, like stronger on the nose, but maybe not so much in the taste. And those become volatile as well if you're trapping them in another state.

1:04:06SpeakerSo if they're like being preserved in an alcohol or being preserved in a solvent or even in water, They will also have phenols and different types of terpenes that are like phenols that can be toxic if you don't know about them and don't know how to release them and how to get them out of there. Not a lot of studies on it. I've looked for it, and part of the big reason why I was interested in terpenes, because in a sublingual it works, It seems to accelerate and work a lot faster when we added 1% terpenes to the sublingual.

1:04:54SpeakerSo if you're in a 1% to 3% range, that seems to be producing a lot more effectiveness with the medicine. So the obvious next step would be to try to take that into some kind of clinical or some kind of research Study, observational study or something. So that's like actually the next thing I was going to do and work on was getting a university behind it and getting some testing behind it.

1:05:27BubblemanIt's a good idea for sure. I like that idea. It's, you know, as we are, I've been playing around a little bit and I can't remember which one it was, but one of them definitely is. The way it touched my nose and the way I couldn't stop smelling it for such a long time but it wasn't like a good kind of like it was kind of like I just wanted it to go away and it was like this terpene that was present that was just it seemed like my spider sense said don't inhale that.

1:05:53BubblemanIt didn't give the right effects like at least for my particular system and I can't really remember which one it is because I've just literally been consuming the jack until it's gone. I'll be rubbing the inside of the jar soon. I'm not going to lie.

1:06:11SpeakerYeah, that one is a really popular one. Anything with the lemons is really good. A lot of the OG. I've actually been hit up in Oregon by a bunch of people that haven't heard I left Harborside, and all of them have mentioned how good that Jack Frost is and wanted more of it. So kudos to you, buddy. Yeah, I agree. Some of these, some strains and some things, they all, they really need, a lot of it needs to be, needs to be researched, you know, and like anything, if something doesn't sit right with you and it sits right with someone else, it's just really kind of character dependent.

1:06:48SpeakerBut it should be interesting because the fact, the whole point of trying to take the cannabinoids out of it so it doesn't have any detected is really important because then universities have opened up And I've reached out to them, have opened up to wanting to do those observationals and things. So now you could, since there's not THC present, there's not cannabinoids, and it's just like studying anything, you know, like a buckwheat.

1:07:23BubblemanAdam from West Coast Concentrate is like, he's like, I know, I said, He said, I'll get you more of that flower rosin. We'd love to have more people try the greatest taste ever. I was like, that shit was so tasty. He's like, man, I know. It might have ruined dabs for me for a while. Nothing is going to taste that good again. When I gave it to them, that's the video that I sent.

1:07:47BubblemanOh, no, that was actually the GG4.

1:07:50Etienne FontanThat wasn't the Jack.

1:07:52BubblemanAnyway, good fun. Nice to see some chemists maybe get on the ball and start doing research with the terpenes and find out... I mean, obviously, terpenes are essential oils, and essential oils are, you know, at least not directly inhaled, but definitely put into the air for inhaling. You can smell essential oils when they burn in those little, you know, essential oil burners or diffusers or nebulizers, whatever you want to call it, whatever you're using.

1:08:21BubblemanSo you've got to think there's some guys out there that have been doing pretty heavy work with terpenes and terpenoids. You know, some authors, some chemists. It'd be great to get in touch with those guys and be like, what's going on with this? Is this something we should be doing? It sure feels like it when you modulate your high and it uplifts it to the most positive, intense, like, this is amazing!

1:08:47BubblemanIt's like, it's hard to be like, how can this be bad?

1:08:50SpeakerIt's almost like, so the thing is, it's almost like the terpenes are the script for the actors. The actors are The cannabinoids, THC, CBD, what have you.

1:09:05SpeakerYou know what I mean? And so what happens is when you smoke pure terpenes, you go, it's almost like it's mimicking the expression of that strain that you're smoking because it's coming from flowers. So a lot of people think that it's coming from hash or something, but it's coming from whole plant flowers. So that's one important aspect, I think. Because if you're taking terpenes from something that's been extracted with a hydrocarbon or extracted with an alcohol and then you're trying to remove them after they've been through a process or they're in a hash or they're in oil, it changes it completely.

1:09:41SpeakerSo taking that from flowers in its full spectrum, what I notice is it seems to give you the expression or that feeling of the strain without this Like psychoactive high. And since our bodies produce cannabinoids naturally, it's almost like it's amplifying the receptors in how it's absorbing those cannabinoids. So smaller amounts of THC with higher amounts of terpenes seems to create a completely different feeling. And it's not like super, I don't even know how to explain it, you know?

1:10:25SpeakerExcept that way. That's what I've noticed with it.

1:10:30BubblemanI liked Horatio's original analogy, which was the gas and the direction, but I think the actors in the script is a little more multi-dimensional in the sense that it really is, once you start using them, too, once you start, because I don't hit every hit with a terp, that's for sure, but I sure do find that When I do, there's this like, just uplifting. That's what everyone kind of says.

1:11:02BubblemanIt's like an uplifting. It's that aromatherapy aspect. I remember when I started The Melting Point in 2002. I had the inhalation station of vaporization and that was in order to normalize the use of vaporizers without showing them or doing it with cannabis. People were able to come into the shop and use their own cannabis because at that time Canada had a federal law and it was certainly not within my rights to ask people if they were legally allowed to consume cannabis.

1:11:33BubblemanIf they came into my shop and pulled cannabis out, I allowed them to use any of the half dozen vaporizers that I had on display. To perfectly normalize it, I went and bought like a dozen or more herbs that we would vaporize with people when they came up to the counter. And so it was quite a lesson in how, especially when we got to the extracts, because we eventually built up, one time a guy came in and we were vaping mint and lavender and chamomile and Rose hips got my manager completely fried.

1:12:07BubblemanHis eyes were red and he was all like, wow, that was unbelievable. Vaporizing all these different herbs. And this guy came in and he had, oh, I have this really high-end peppermint extract. Not peppermints, mint, just mint extract. He dropped like half a drop of this shit onto some mint that we had in the volcano when we filled this bag up. And I'm telling you, It was the most uplifting, just the same way when someone goes and smells it and gets that little lift.

1:12:40BubblemanThat's like a multi-billion dollar industry, the aromatherapy industry, that's based on that very thing, our olfactory senses and how we receive those smells in our brain. It's an incredible way to remember things, to imprint memory through those smells. I'll tell you, when we hit that... Mint oil. There was about six or seven of us, and we were literally all floating like, that was amazing. It reminds me very, very, very, very much of hitting the terps.

1:13:14BubblemanAnd that was a pure mint extract, which is also mint, extracts its essential, or sorry, secretes its essential oils in glandular trichomes, very much the same way as cannabis. So it didn't really surprise me that these terpenes are Also uplifting in that sense.

1:13:36Dr Mark ScialdoneOkay, so can I add some chemistry? So you're asking for a chemist, right? Absolutely. You guys got one, man. Yo, here I am. What do you need to know? I've been working with terpenes for almost 20 years in my life, okay? So it qualifies me as an expert. I would certainly say that a lot of the things that Some times are mentioned. When we had discussed this, I think it was maybe about six months ago on Hash Church, I had followed up with a post on the Facebook page that had five different references on what's known with mostly terpenoids and cannabinoids and how they work together.

1:14:23Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd most notably is the fact that Thank you so much for joining us today.

1:14:50Dr Mark ScialdoneOther effects like the upregulation of those receptors, which occurs because terpenes basically increase the fluidity in the cell, meaning that they open up the cell for business. I think I used this analogy exactly on Hash Church about six months ago. It basically starts exchanging things between inside and outside of the cell. And so what has been known is that that can Thank you so much for joining us.

1:15:44Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, again, that was part of that one post that was on Facebook where we talked about all those different mechanisms. And one of them, again, is that these things bind to the same mechanisms or they have the same mechanisms that when they end up binding... Thank you so much for joining us.

1:16:27Dr Mark ScialdoneSo again, you got to remember that terpenes and the terpene ratios that are found in cannabinoids or that's found in cannabis extracts are very, very small. And so doing a much higher dose of terpenes is giving you a much higher dose, probably an order of magnitude. I don't know exactly how much, but it seems like you're getting a much, much larger dose of terpenes than Originally intended and that's one of the reasons why you might be feeling or having some of these effects.

1:16:58BubblemanWe got it from one batch though and I wish I remembered which one it was because the other ones don't do that to me and I should say this, my olfactory is off the charts.

1:17:10Dr Mark ScialdoneI smell shit that people do not smell. Yeah, you'd be a good chemist then because you need a good sniffer as a chemist. I mean, it's one of the things I rely on to differentiate different materials. I just want to go back to one other point is that, you know, terpenes, a lot of terpenes It depends on the dose of the terpenes. A lot of terpenes can be irritants, and I know that Horatio and I have discussed this too, especially with the exposure to limonene.

1:17:37Dr Mark ScialdoneLimonene can be a severe irritant, and it all depends on the dose that you're getting it. At a much lower dose, it's not an irritant at all, but these are the kinds of things, again, that I think that has to be worked out scientifically. There's an old saying is that the dose is The poison is in the dose. It really matters how much of these things you're getting at any one particular time, whether you're going to feel an adverse reaction or a tingling in your nose or just something that is just way overload.

1:18:06Dr Mark ScialdoneIn general, terpenes interact with cells to intercalate into the lipid bilayer, which just basically increases the flux of all kinds of things in and out of the cells. And one of the ramifications of that is the upregulation of the cannabinoid receptor expression, which is why you see this enhanced effect.

1:18:28BubblemanI just posted a link, a fragrant introduction to terpenoid chemistry by Charles S. Sell, for anyone that wants to Google that. It's a fairly expensive book, but it covers like, you know, basically the basic, the foundation for the chemistry of higher terpenoids, it says. The biogenesis of terpenoids, some of the history. It's worth checking out. It's $120, but I suspect that that is a pretty decent book to get your head around what's going on, what Mark is talking about.

1:19:04HoratioTo back up what Mark is talking about, remember Mark Richards. When I showed you the limonene and I showed you the orange stuff that was in the clear stuff, One of the categories of things that can go off in terpenes, and it's just built in, is they form peroxides, and that's, it's peroxidization, I can't say it right, peroxidization, that then starts to turn them red.

1:19:29Dr Mark ScialdoneHydroperoxide, so yeah, it reacts with oxygen in the air to make a, what's called a hydroperoxide, and those hydroperoxides, and sometimes actually with limonene, You can make what's called an endoperoxide. So the endoperoxide and the hydroperoxide, yes, are not things that you want to be inhaling deep into your lungs. Absolutely not. Or any exposure to biological tissue is a bad thing of those materials, yes.

1:20:03HoratioInteresting. Dr. Going back to that, is that like terpenes going rancid, going off, or just being kept improperly that they degrade, or is it just by strain?

1:20:14Dr Mark ScialdoneDr. That one in particular is one that I would only be really concerned about if it were in a high concentration. I think if it's in very small concentration, I really wouldn't be worried about it. I have no idea, Horatio, what happens when you Hit that at nail temperature. At nail temperature, everything changes. My God. Most hydroperoxides aren't going to be thermally stable, and they will decompose.

1:20:44Dr Mark ScialdoneThe hydroperoxide decomposition route that is of some concern in hash is the fact that Okay, so the envelope that the trichome exists in is basically a lipid bilayer, and the lipids are made out of these unsaturated fatty acids, and when unsaturated fatty acids are heated at like nail temperature, they do decompose in air and through a hydroperoxide type mechanism, and I think the degradation products ultimately out of those are aldehydes, and that was that scare We've got a question about a month ago that was on the internet saying that everything that's got aldehydes in it because it's got, oh, if you have a vegetable oil and you heat it up at this ungodly temperature and you oxidize the hell out of it, you make an aldehyde, so therefore all fried foods are bad because it's When you heat up this fatty acid, you're going to decompose it to this aldehyde.

1:21:48Dr Mark ScialdoneThere's a whole lot of crap out there, but the bottom line is that I think in hash, with a lot of these compounds that aren't stable to air… Especially when you heat them up on the nail, they're just going to do a myriad of different things, regardless of the terpenes that are in the plant or in your profile of your live resin. As soon as you put it on the nail, you have a completely different profile of compounds.

1:22:19Dr Mark ScialdoneThat doesn't answer your question, does it, Horatio?

1:22:22SpeakerWell, you also have that with anything you put on the nail.

1:22:25Dr Mark ScialdoneOh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I had a chemistry professor who used to say we should have a chemistry textbook called Chemistry at 200 Degrees because God knows it's just different than chemistry at room temperature. Things just happen at elevated temperature because you're pushing all kinds of molecules up hills that they wouldn't normally go up, and where they land is not necessarily where they started.

1:22:53HoratioWell, I mean, even if I like, because I've obviously done terrible things to myself, if I take those three jars, the limonene you can buy, the thing I remove, and then the final product I make, at the same micro amount, they have completely different profiles of harshness. One is a death sentence. That's kind of why I'm like it only takes a micro amount to go off within the hole that once it's vaporized, that's where that harshness can probably manifest itself is you've got a strain that is literally chemically reacting with itself now that it's lost, it's balanced within the heads.

1:23:29HoratioIt's become soup and now the soup is reacting and if the wrong amount of air is present, those peroxides form and that's when hitting it on the nails can become dangerous.

1:23:41Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, I mean, you could keep peroxides from forming by just keeping it a little wet. If it stays wet, I mean, it has to sort of be dry for peroxides to form. But the thing is, again, if you're vaporizing at a high temperature, you have to assume that you're beyond the boiling point of water and that there's no water available at that particular point. And all you're really doing is accelerating thermo-oxidative degradation to sometimes pretty noxious Thank you for joining us.

1:24:32Dr Mark ScialdoneLike it should.

1:24:33HoratioThat's kind of the big thing I learned with limining is humans have a sensitivity in the parts per billions to that micro aldehyde and if it's not removed you don't even have a chance of making something like LHO.

1:24:48Dr Mark ScialdoneYep.

1:24:52BubblemanL to the H to the O. Past Church 62. 724 people watching us yammer on. How fun is that? Let's smoke. D420K was here. He'd say, bong rip. I'm certain of it. I am certain of it.

1:25:11Etienne FontanYeah, where's the bong rip mascot?

1:25:15BubblemanOh, I think he's on the road today.

1:25:22BubblemanI think he's on the road today, traveling. He's been spending lots of time in Vancouver lately, so that's been nice to be able to see him and go hang out. Went and saw them for Puff Wednesday the other day just at the end where we ordered the nasty deep fried Mars bar. How healthy is that, Mark? Is that good for you?

1:25:46Dr Mark ScialdoneNo, that's not good at all. But yeah, it's amazing what they deep fry these days, right? Like deep fried Twinkies and deep fried all kinds of deep fried shit. I've seen deep fried butter at the Maryland State Fair. I've never seen it before, but they take butter. They take frozen butter. They freeze it in liquid nitrogen so it's really cold and really hard, and they roll it in flour and dough and all kinds of shit, and they deep fry that motherfucker.

1:26:15Dr Mark ScialdoneDeep fried butter, man.

1:26:18BubblemanThat's fucked up.

1:26:21BubblemanThat is fucked up. I'm not sure I'd be dipping into the deep fried butter.

1:26:30BubblemanTodd's thinking about it.

1:26:33SpeakerJust because you can doesn't mean you should. Wow.

1:26:38Dr Mark ScialdoneTrying to tell Ned to do a bunch of rednecks.

1:26:42BubblemanTrue enough. Speaking of redneckery, man. What an amazing time I had on the mountain the other day. We set it to ourselves while we were out there, seven bowls deep, like literally like over a mountain into a bowl, over a mountain into a bowl, over a mountain into a bowl, and continuing on. And some of the climbs are so gnarly that it's like you get stuck, you use a lot of your energy, and it's like when you finally get to the top, You know, and it's basically like we have to turn around right now and it's still going to be pitch black when we get back to the vehicle.

1:27:20BubblemanI don't know what it is about that sort of threat to your very safety or your mortality, but it makes you enjoy life better. And I'll tell you, when you're hanging out with your friends and it's all just a given that if anything goes down, you're going to help save their lives or vice versa, it is... A good feeling. It's a good bonding experience. I definitely suggest people, if you have the ability to, get out into nature, you know?

1:27:49BubblemanWhether for a hike or a mountain bike or a dirt bike or a sled ride or a snowboard or a ski or a whatever, man, and you have the ability, get out and walk around and be in the trees, be in nature. There's something seriously amazing about it and I don't think it's only because mostly other people aren't there. That's a part of it. You got your small little crew and you get out there and it's just feeds my soul, I'll tell you.

1:28:15BubblemanIt feeds my soul.

1:28:22Dr Mark ScialdoneThat's what live music does for me. I mean, I could see just about any form of music. Whether it's classical or bluegrass, which I love, jazz, if I'm watching music, if I'm watching another musician play, even if it's just a young piano student, I get off on it because the musical mind is an incredible mind.

1:28:45Dr Mark ScialdoneMusic nourishes my soul like the outdoor nourishes yours, Mark.

1:28:50BubblemanI agree. Music also nourishes my soul in a very similar way. The outdoors just helps nourish my body simultaneously. And it's amazing. I push myself beyond my limits. I mean, I have done that at shows as well, push myself beyond humanly possible. But I'll tell you, when you're lugging around a 350-pound machine in deep, powdery snow and you're getting stuck and you're having to flip it and turn it and flip it right around, it's just unbelievable how much energy you lose.

1:29:21BubblemanAnd sometimes at the end of the day when I'm coming back, My hand will just want to close. I'll be like, no, no, just stay open for a little while longer. You get like the claw. Hurts. You know what? I ruined shows for myself too, Mark, in the sense that back around 95, I started taping. Once I got my DAT recorder, my first show I ever taped was actually in Missoula, Montana.

1:29:47BubblemanIt was a fish show. And from then on, I would go on to tape, record shows. It was a DAT recorder, so it was putting them all on tape. And I still have my masters. You know, some of my best live shows I've ever been to, I recorded. So it's, aside from people coming up to me and going, is that a mic? Is that a microphone? Wow, dude, are you taping the show, dude?

1:30:12BubblemanOh, man, I'd love to get a copy of that show, bro. It's like...

1:30:16Dr Mark ScialdoneOoh, taper section foul right there, right?

1:30:19BubblemanYeah, well there is no taper section at the majority of the shows I was taping. Like sure, if it was the Allman Brothers or Fish or String Cheese or a few other bands back then, there was a taper section. But everyone else, like MMW and Charlie Hunter and all these other great musicians, they had no taper section. They didn't even want you bringing it in.

1:30:41Dr Mark ScialdoneOh yeah, it was all stealth taping, yeah. I'm so old that I go back to stealth taping with the Grateful Dead before they allowed it. And we used to have to sneak our mics and our tape deck in in the late 70s and early 80s. They only started allowing taping section in 84 in Berkeley Community Theater shows, the first time they allowed taping. But yeah, it used to have to sneak everything in.

1:31:07Dr Mark ScialdoneWow. And all the Garcia Band stuff, they never allowed, there was never a taping section for Jerry Garcia Band, so if you have some tasty bootlegs of that, those were all made on the down low.

1:31:23BubblemanOn the down low, the Jerry Band. Some of my favorite bootlegs were the Jerry Band with Merle Saunders.

1:31:31Dr Mark ScialdoneOh yeah, there's some great, great stuff that's out there. Legion of Mary stuff from like 74, that's just absolutely rippin'. Awesome stuff. Such a great vault, rich vault of music.

1:31:46BubblemanI recorded, not Usain, but Zakir, Zakir Hussain?

1:31:54Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, the percussionist, right?

1:31:56BubblemanYeah, with all these other, the most famous flute guy and the fucking throat singer and the crazy Ravi Shankar, like it was just the most ridiculous thing and it was actually one of the first times I ever really was brought to tears by music. I couldn't believe it. It was insane and I taped it. I have the master tape of that show.

1:32:20Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, if you're not seeing music that brings you to tears, you ought to be seeing some better music.

1:32:24BubblemanMan, I'll tell you, that was insane. I used to go to the Montreal Jazz Festival every year for Canada when you can't get into the, you know, if you're not able to get into the U.S., The big thing was go to the Montreal Jazz Festival. There's literally like a thousand concerts in a 12-day period. It's just like dozens of venues all over the city, street venues outside.

1:32:46BubblemanIt's just so ridiculous.

1:32:48Dr Mark ScialdoneThey close the streets. It's just awesome. I've only been there once, Mark, and we had such a great, great time. Saw incredible, incredible stuff. Saw the James Carter Quintet there. It was just unbelievable. But yeah, they closed the streets. Was his sister there? Was Regina there?

1:33:11BubblemanSay that again? What year were you there?

1:33:13Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, I was there. We were there, I'd have to think, we were there like about three or four years ago on July 4th weekend.

1:33:22BubblemanOkay, okay.

1:33:23Dr Mark ScialdoneSpecifically to see the James Carter, because James Carter was playing up there. If those of you who don't know jazz and don't know James Carter, he's the most incredible... One of the most incredible sax players that's on the planet today. You should know about James Carter. He's incredible.

1:33:39BubblemanI recorded him back in 2002 or 2003. It's actually when I met him. I was staying at the same hotel, and I ended up in an elevator with him. That's how I met him.

1:33:49Dr Mark ScialdoneNice.

1:33:50BubblemanIf you stay at the Hotel Wyndham, this was gold back in the day, Mark. All the musicians stay there and they do an open stage every night. Whoever's around just goes. And that was the first time I saw him with his sister who plays violin, Regina Carter.

1:34:08Dr Mark ScialdoneOkay, okay.

1:34:09BubblemanHim and her together are unbelievable and also just, I can't remember who else was there, but it was absurd. It was like Ray Charles on piano and like, you know what I mean? Just like the most unbelievable musicians just in this little bar and you couldn't get into it. So that was the trick. Hotel Windham in Montreal, you have to go in, get in an elevator, and then go up to get to the main floor where everyone is.

1:34:39BubblemanThere's nothing on the bottom. You have to have your card to get up that elevator. So that was worth paying for back in the day.

1:34:51BubblemanJazz and Cannabis. Like what? Come on, that's like peanut butter and jelly right there. Jazz and Cannabis. Now there's a history.

1:35:01BubblemanToo bad we couldn't get some of those old school guys to come on.

1:35:07SpeakerHey, I got something to talk about.

1:35:10BubblemanThank you, Dana. I thank you.

1:35:12SpeakerYou're welcome. It's been an interesting couple of days in BC for cannabis dispensaries with a raid in Sechelt yesterday or the day before of the S&M Sweet Shop. They were selling cannabis food products and they got raided and had their van seized and all their money and product taken. And in Mission, there's the BC Pain Society got raided a couple of days ago and they've been shut down.

1:35:37SpeakerThey might reopen, I don't know, but they're having a hard time anyway. You might have heard about two weeks ago in Nanaimo, a cop went around to those ten dispensaries in Nanaimo. One cop went around with this sort of personally written letter he had done and warned them all they had one week to shut down or they were going to get raided. It's been two weeks, nothing's happened, but it doesn't mean it's not going to.

1:35:57SpeakerAnd in Vernon, where there are several dispensaries, including I think one run by the former mayor of Vernon, the cops just went to all of them and gave them a warning and said, you've got some time or we're going to come and shut you down as well. And so it's interesting seeing this pushback happening. In time there are a lot of dispensaries and a lot of towns in BC that have been doing the other thing and have been saying we're going to let this place continue to operate or we're going to give them a license and we're going to tell the police to stand down.

1:36:26SpeakerSo it's an interesting time right now in BC and ultimately across Canada. There's at least 10 new dispensaries that have opened in Toronto in the last couple of weeks and I expect there's going to be dozens and dozens more there. And I'm certainly encouraging people to, like, get more of these places open now so that we are here making legalization happen the way we want to see it happen rather than waiting for Trudeau and the government to make legalization happen the way they want to see it happen, which is likely a very different model.

1:36:55SpeakerBut just a little update there anyways because that's been more raids in B.C. than we've had in quite a while. Of course, there's a lot more dispensaries to raid, of course, but it's interesting times, that's for sure.

1:37:08BubblemanYeah, I mean, I'm pretty surprised to hear that, you know, it seems like weren't we supposed to be like getting a better situation here, like one that starts with not raiding people?

1:37:20SpeakerYeah, and the mayors are all, you know, some mayors are doing their thing and telling their police forces to stand down and saying that they are going to license these places and support them and other ones are like, ah, the laws, we can't do anything and we support the RCMP and And, but you know, it makes a difference when people get on the phone and call their local, call your government.

1:37:40SpeakerAnd I know that in Colorado and California, across the, that's where you get state governments that legalize it and some, but an initiative, random, still a lot of cities end up defying it and saying we're not going to allow it in our, in our town, you know, license them appropriately or, and government's really the place that listens to people the most, your local mayor and council and, And that can often have the biggest, how these things play out.

1:38:09BubblemanWell, that's not good to hear, not good to hear at all. I do appreciate the fact that the photo of yourself in the background looks like you're wearing the same shirt as you're wearing in the foreground.

1:38:20SpeakerIt's not the same shirt, but yeah, it's definitely a similar color. I like that. I feel like Stephen Colbert there with my painting of myself behind myself.

1:38:29BubblemanRight on, dude. Oh, that's awesome. Well, thank you for sharing that even though it's not the best initial news. It's good to let people know what they can do.

1:38:37SpeakerIt reminds me of the 90s, you know, when everybody was opening hemp shops and head shops across Canada and they were getting raided as well. And people were going to jail for the weekend for running a head shop and people were getting fined and then having quite some harsh stuff. One guy in Ontario spent several weeks in jail. They were raiding stores on a regular basis and they were shutting down and they still, head shops still get raided in Canada.

1:39:05SpeakerAs you well know, bongs and pipes and all this stuff is still illegal in Canada. They just don't enforce it much anymore. But at least once a year, two or three head shops will get raided somewhere across the country and people will go out of business and lose their investment and all this stuff. And so I want to see dispensaries the same way where most people don't even realize they're illegal because there's so many and because we've just defeated the police once again with another civil disobedience tactic.

1:39:31SpeakerAnd so I'm still encouraging people to open dispensaries. I think it's time. Some of us will get picked off as we go over the hill or we'll get raided, but I hope that these guys that are being raided will end up reopening as well and continuing to push forward. Because the way the law stands in Canada right now, we're really facing severe loss of liberty for getting busted for running a medical marijuana outlet.

1:39:52SpeakerYou're going to lose your money, you're going to lose your investment, you're going to lose your weed, you're going to have to pay a lawyer and go to court and all those things. You may not be able to go to the U.S. anymore. Those are the realiztic things. So if you're willing to face those kind of risks and you believe in what you're doing, then I think it's never been a better time to open a dispensary, even though some of them are having problems, a lot more are being successful and a lot of towns are saying they support this stuff.

1:40:20SpeakerSo it's an interesting time to be coming over the top here and our civil disobedience is what has gotten us this far. You know, it's great what Trudeau was saying about legalization, but politicians have been Following us, not leading us on this, I don't want to wait for Trudeau to do something. I want to do it ourselves and let them react to it or formalize what we've already done.

1:40:44Dr Mark ScialdoneWho funds the enforcement agency in Canada? I mean, is there a coal memorandum type approach that you can take by cutting off the funding of these law enforcement agencies to prosecute or to basically...

1:41:01SpeakerI'll tell you, we have... Sorry. Go ahead. It's weird, but we have a police force, the RCMP, the provincial police, because policing is a provincial jurisdiction, and so the province... With this federal force, I actually led a referendum in BC where we wrote a law that would have defunded the police for making any possession or small scale charges of cannabis. We didn't get enough signatures because it's brutally difficult in BC, but it could be done that way.

1:41:30SpeakerAnd we should be putting pressure on provincial and governments because a lot of cities have their own police forces like Vancouver. That allows the mayor to have an even bigger influence over what the police do and happen and why Vancouver is a good city in that regard. But the RCMP definitely respond to local pressure as well because there's a lot of cities that The mayor can't tell the police not to raid somebody because he's my friend or whatever, but they have a big influence, and every city where the mayor has said, be like dispensaries, the police have stood down.

1:41:57SpeakerAnd so it has a huge thing, and if the province...

1:42:15SpeakerHey, legalization is coming. Let's stop wasting money on a bunch of charges that are all going to get dropped in six months anyways. Let's just implement decriminalization now while we're waiting. That will be huge. And provinces should do that. But getting them to do it is hard because they're all... If they talk about legalization now, mostly they're talking about Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

1:43:04SpeakerAgainst that, but it's not where I really want marijuana to be sold or stored, but we'll take that if that's what's coming. But there's better ways of selling this safe substance and putting it next to this dangerous substance, right?

1:43:18BubblemanAbsolutely, man. It's not good to hear. It's not good to see that they're doing that. I just can't really believe it. But at the same time, as it grows and grows and grows and more people are like, let's open a dispensary, let's open a dispensary, and you get like hundreds of dispensaries... I mean, you've got to think that some of them are going to potentially...

1:43:38SpeakerThe good thing is, you know, they're opening faster than they're being shut down. Oh, yeah. Some of us are going over the hill, you know, and some of them are getting picked off, but we're going to make it to the other side, and we're going to win. And it's just like head shops in the 90s, you know, they were getting raided all the time. Mark went to jail a few times, like, and stuff for...

1:43:59SpeakerFor selling bongs and pipes. And now they sell them at Petro Canada stations, right? So it's coming.

1:44:07BubblemanYeah, Mark's gone to jail for like selling pipes, selling seeds, passing joints.

1:44:14SpeakerHe's got a criminal record for promoting vaporizers. That's one of the convictions that he got was promoting vaporizers, which is still against the law in Canada, right? Like these laws are still on the books. They're just not really enforced anymore. Except if you're in a small town in the north or you've got an asshole local cop or something, but, you know, Canada has a lot of laws.

1:44:33SpeakerComic books are a law in Canada, too. Any comic, any illustrated book that is about committing a crime is against the law. And it's like a crime comic, anti-crime comic laws, what it's called. And, like, under that law, Batman comics and stuff are against the law because they're about people committing crimes, right? And that's why they were written. This law was written in the 30s. To ban comic books like that, they thought that comic books and superheroes were turning kids gay and making them crazy and stuff, and so they tried to ban them.

1:45:01SpeakerI guess it was in the 50s, actually, where they tried to ban comic books, and we won't get into the whole thing, but the comic code came around then, and comics changed quite a bit, and a lot of the old horror comics and stuff stopped publishing. And those laws are still there, and cops still try to enforce that against marijuana stuff sometimes, too. They said our Cannabis Culture magazine was a crime comic in the 90s, and they had to stop it in one town.

1:45:24SpeakerWell, can I ask you, Dana, when I first met you, it was when you first got the job as editor-in-chief going way back when it was Cannabis Culture, when it wasn't Cannabis Culture, it was Cannabis Canada, right? Yeah. My question was is when I first got involved in this, I remember being told that literature like High Times was prohibited for distribution in Canada. So when did you get the ability to, which blows my mind, I mean this is how deep, and this is both a beautiful way to look at your progress in Canada in the past 25 years, to go from not being allowed to have literature to being like, you know, we're overgrowing them, you know, it's beautiful, but I was wondering did you get the ability to get like high times?

1:46:12SpeakerIt was Mark and other people breaking the law that did it because that law is still on the books. It was passed by Brian Mulroney in the 80s and it's section 462.2 of the criminal code. And it bans literature and paraphernalia for illicit drug use. And it defines literature as including movies and anything, any kind of media is included in that. And when they passed that law, they raided hundreds of head shops and thousands more shut down across Canada.

1:46:40SpeakerAnd there was a big pushback. And for about eight or nine years, there was nothing really available. And then in the mid-90s, Mark opened up Head BC. A few people had headshots here and there, but Mark did it in a really big way. He started doing wholesaling, and he got rated for selling bongs and pipes. Just before that, when we were just getting started, a guy in Ontario who had normal Canada, and the police, he was given out flyers about legalization, and the police raided him, took all his flyers, took his membership list, and charged him under 462.2 with promoting marijuana.

1:47:12SpeakerAnd they dropped the charges, but then he went to court and sued them, and Markel paid for the case, and he won in the lower court, the judge struck down the law. But the federal government never appealed it to a higher court, because they knew they were going to lose. So this law, even the literature law is actually still on the books. It's very unconstitutional and would be easily defeated.

1:47:32SpeakerIf they ever charged anybody, but because it never went to the Supreme Court of Canada, it never set a precedent, so technically that law is still on the books in Canada, even the literature law is. But people just stopped caring. We started caring this stuff, and when Mark would get charged for selling bongs, they charged him several times for selling bongs, And pipes. The courts would give them $1,000 fine or $2,000 fine.

1:47:53SpeakerSo it was nothing. And the effort involved was very great. There was a huge pushback. We would all protest. It would take dozens of cops, shut down the whole block. So they just stopped doing it because it was too much hassle and Mark wasn't stopping. And other people were getting charged across Canada. They weren't stopping either. So the police basically gave up and the courts gave up because the penalties weren't severe enough to threaten anybody to stop doing it.

1:48:16SpeakerBut 10 shops still get raided in Canada. Thank you for watching.

1:48:40SpeakerIn terms of mandatory minimums for growing small numbers of plants and trafficking in small quantities, but at the same time, our culture is more free than ever before because we've just been defying all these laws, opening dispensaries. I got qualified for a couple of years, mandatory minimum jail sentence for my dispensary, as does everyone else in Vancouver. It's like real time. If they were to convict us, we'd be behind bars for a couple of years as a mandatory.

1:49:05SpeakerBut it's likely the court would strike that law down because no one's been charging dispensary under that. So it's a weird gray area situation in Canada and it's been getting a lighter shade of gray for a long time. But it's all through civil disobedience. The laws themselves are the same as they were when we started Cannabis Canada magazine. It's still illegal. It's just nobody really knows or cares anymore.

1:49:29SpeakerSo there you go. Civil disobedience is how we do it in Canada. Thanks for that, Dane. You know, I remember when you and I met was in 94. You were there for the first Cannabis Cup, right? Yep, yep. Was 94 your first cup or 95? Probably 95, yeah. I think 95 cup. I don't think I went to the, I wasn't, yeah, I wasn't with 94. All right.

1:49:53SpeakerThen that, 95 was the first year I met Mark. Right, right, right. And that was when it was Cannabis Canada. Yeah. Yeah, we actually went on and had a newsletter for the very first little bit, then Cannabis Canada, and then we were trying to sell copies in the U.S. and Americans weren't really sure what cannabis was and didn't want to buy something from Canada. So it was primarily to tap into the U.S. audience that we switched to cannabis culture.

1:50:17SpeakerI think it's beautiful what you did to realize that it was your instigation and perseverance in selling cannabis. Thank you for watching.

1:50:42SpeakerIt's that deep. I mean, you know, the greatest contribution I think Jack Kerra made to this whole movement was when a reporter called him on the World War II tape, Hemp for Victory, and said that it was a fake and a phony because he'd called the Library of Congress and he couldn't get a registry for it. And because of that, he said, this film's never been made by the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

1:51:02SpeakerYou're lying. So Jack flipped and went to D.C. and went to the Library of Congress and went Through what the microfiche was and couldn't find it and was really disgusted and walked back outside and was getting high. And someone else there actually asked, you know, well, what would we have done if we had come here in like 1941 or 2? And they went back in and asked, do you have books?

1:51:25SpeakerAnd they said, we do. And that's where Jack found the two entries of Pen for Victory, you know, Black and White, you know, Department of Agriculture. And then he had to photocopy it in their presence and then resubmit it to the fucking Library of Congress so they would re-add Hemp for Victory 14-minute agricultural fucking product of this into their own library. Because somehow when they were categorizing everything, they purged this.

1:51:54SpeakerAnd, you know, it's really amazing for me to think that, you know, Jack was able to go back and catch them on their slipping. And when you think about how far it goes in Canada that you weren't even allowed to have literature, you know, really up through the 80s. Things like Sentimelia Tips, High Times, Mel Frank books, all fucking illegal. You know, get you in as much trouble for distributing the information as it would now we're fighting for the plant rights.

1:52:20SpeakerYou know, like how crazy is that? I hope people really realize it, is what I guess I'm saying. You know, I've been working on a cannabis history of Canada for, well, probably for 20 years now, but especially the last couple of years quite a bit, and it's actually coming back from the printer on Tuesday. And while I was doing this book, I really could see in the newspaper clippings how the They would lie about stuff and change things over the decades.

1:52:43SpeakerIn Canada, in the early 1900s, there was a lot of anti-Chinese sentiment on the West Coast and a lot of single Chinese men that had come here to work on the railways and work in the gold mines and that and were a labor threat to the white unions and they preferred smoking opium to drinking alcohol primarily. And there was a lot of anti-Asian riots, and there was anti-Asian groups, and the Chinese Exclusion League, and all these groups that would go into Chinatown and beat people up and cause riots.

1:53:12SpeakerAnd the ban on opium happened because they wanted to get rid of the Chinese people, and so they banned opium to kick Chinese out of the country. And then I read in the papers like 20, 30 years later in the 1930s and they talk about these riots that were opium addicts that were rioting in Vancouver and that's why they had to ban opium because the opium addicts were rioting.

1:53:34SpeakerBut that wasn't what was happening. It was white racists rioting against Chinese people and how they changed history and these examples of how the media, like I can read the original stuff and I can read what they're saying later and they're lying about it or getting it wrong or whatever. The same kind of things repeated. And we also see in the media so much now about how it's a crazy new marijuana product.

1:53:55SpeakerThis oil or these dabs or hash or whatever it is. And all these things have been around for so long. And you can see in the media in the 50s and 60s and 70s and 80s and 90s, they're talking about the same crazy new products that are out there and the same stuff. And you can even see references to like the healing, like the anti-cancer. There's stuff, 60s and 70s, there's research and clippings talking about the anti-cancer benefits of cannabis and research being done.

1:54:20SpeakerAnd it's still the same kind of stories now, like 40 years later or 50 years later where they're still saying, well, we're just preliminary research and we've got to do a lot more work still and we don't really know. And it's bizarre sort of seeing how this stuff gets repeated over and over again and kind of purposely forgotten and ignored and then brought up again as if it's something new and strange.

1:54:41SpeakerI don't know, but I'm looking forward to getting this history book out there, and I think Americans might find it fun too to read about what happened in Canada, because our story is quite a bit different than the American one, and certainly Canadians know a lot more about American history, probably just in general, but our pot activists know a lot more about American marijuana history than Canadian because it hasn't really been put out there before.

1:55:02SpeakerAnd I'm excited about this book because I think it will help to change a lot of that and to teach Canadians about our own cannabis history, both hemp and marijuana and activism and punishments and all the different things that happened over the last 400 plus years of hemp history in Canada.

1:55:19Bubbleman400 years.

1:55:20SpeakerAsh Churchgate. A good part of the book is the modern activism and people that are shaping the cannabis culture, and there's a page on Mark, and I talk about the Hash Church in there a little bit, so I try to keep it, you know, it's a good guide for people who don't know a lot about the cannabis culture to find out about it, and for those of us that are part of it, I think it'll be a good learning experience as well.

1:55:46BubblemanOh yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing it.

1:55:51SpeakerMe too.

1:55:59BubblemanSo Cuban, how about those photos?

1:56:09BubblemanOh, you're muted. You're muted, Holmes. Let me see if I can unmute you.

1:56:16SpeakerI don't have you muted.

1:56:16BubblemanHuh. Oh, it's a bug. It's a bug. I was asking him about the photos that I took in Jamaica of that Kimbo Kush dry cyst, which was just... Nice. Yes. Perfect timing, which was just nice. That was awesome.

1:56:38SpeakerYeah, for some reason, it kept... That's the second time that when I get muted or I mute myself, I can't unmute myself. It's weird. But yeah, I really appreciate those pictures, man. I definitely wanted you to be able to smoke the dry sift. That Kimball was actually made by my wife, so the pictures and all the kind words that you shared and everybody on your Facebook and Instagram, it really gave her a morale boost.

1:57:04SpeakerShe's very proud of what she does. And I'm just thankful that it Got to you in that quality.

1:57:12BubblemanYeah, it was still powdery goodness and some of the last of it I got to smoke with my friend Kimbo. Tony was there too.

1:57:21SpeakerYeah, she was wondering if it was Kimbo Slice, the dude that... No, everyone asks him that.

1:57:27BubblemanHe's definitely not Kimbo Slice. He's just a dude that my uncle has known for years, that I've known for some time from Winnipeg, a friend that spends time in Jamaica, so... He quite enjoyed it as well. I think he damn near died when he took his first hit.

1:57:46SpeakerSweet, yeah. Hey, I can't believe that the Kimball didn't place and that the Cookies got third. I thought the Kimball was great. If anything, I thought my wife would have placed. But we're happy with the results regardless. And speaking of Kimball, the actual Kimball slice, just to give you a funny tidbit, we saw this on his Twitter. He's not very happy that X named the strain Kimball Kush.

1:58:11SpeakerReally? He's actually seeking royalties, yeah. Isn't that crazy? He took like a picture of a concentrate and was all upset about it.

1:58:19BubblemanHe should be happy, man.

1:58:21SpeakerYeah, I'm from Florida just like you, Kimball. I'm your fan. Don't sue us, man. I'll just spark you up whenever. Whenever.

1:58:29BubblemanJust send him some of that dry stuff. You know what? I'll tell you one thing, Cuban. If the judging was extended into not only like testing, but like say just even macro photography, if you were just going to macro photograph the entries, how the hell could you, like it blew me away, dude. I mean, to me the strain itself, I didn't find it to be like the most like knock me down potent strain, but the flavor of it was just like, So effin' tasty.

1:59:02BubblemanIt was definitely like the tastiest thing that we hit there without Terps. And I don't even think we even added Terps one time to it, did we, Tony?

1:59:16BubblemanOh, he's got the bug. Let me think about that. I don't think we did, bro.

1:59:22SpeakerNo. No. We left it unadulterated.

1:59:27BubblemanThe other one was nice, the Cookies and Cream, but it did not photograph as nice as that Kimbo Kush. That Kimbo Kush just photographed really nice.

1:59:36SpeakerWe did, though, dip the Cookies and Cream Sift Rosin.

1:59:44BubblemanThat's right. And who had that? That was like Kunst?

1:59:48SpeakerKonstantin.

1:59:49BubblemanYeah.

1:59:50SpeakerYeah.

1:59:51BubblemanEasy. That's right. I remember because I was just dabbing everyone down, and then I could see just your back to me, and I was like, That's never a good thing when Tony has his back to me, so I kind of peered over you. I was like, what's going on over here?

2:00:04SpeakerAt that moment, it was one of those things like at the kids in the yard, because you were so tired, you assumed that I was preparing this whole day, and you assumed the first one was for them, but the second one I was trying to prepare for you. And you were like, oh, yeah, that's fine. I don't need any of that stuff. No. You guys are all hoarding it around there.

2:00:25SpeakerI haven't even had a dab, and I'm like, nobody's had it yet. I'm trying to get you one first.

2:00:30BubblemanIt was the butter. It was the rosin butter, right?

2:00:33SpeakerOh, God. That was insane. Yeah. Yeah, it was so good. Nice. Yeah, man. But, you know, you take it how it is. I'm happy that the top three were actually all friends of mine in the first place. Dude Boondocks, I met him at Chalice and it was like in the beginning of his cup entering career, I guess you can call it. You know, he was asking me how I felt to win and all that stuff.

2:01:00SpeakerSo it's cool to see him win in first place. I know the grower that he's working with is exceptional. His name is Mass Genetics and they've just been killing it with that strawberry banana. It's a crazy terpene. And second place was Cushy Candies, which he's from Denver. And he was actually in the first place in Amsterdam last year. So to see him in second place and me get third, I mean, I'm happy with it.

2:01:25SpeakerYou know? But I'm gearing up for LA, man. I'm going to enter some different flavors than the Kimbo and the Cookies and Cream. We're starting to phenol hunt and take like the dry sift resin producing high terp strains kind of mainstream. That's X's goal this year. Our next year for 2016 is to produce more strings that have that type of resin quality, like the Kimbo. Maybe take an OG that can sift like that, breed it to the same male and keep it going.

2:01:59SpeakerBecause the Kimbo and the cookies has been good, but we've been ragging it out for a whole year already, you know.

2:02:17Etienne FontanBong, Rip.

2:02:19SpeakerYeah, you're muted, Mark. I had a question. Of course it's... Okay, go ahead.

2:02:25HoratioWell, it was about the Kimbo cushion, like these elite genetics that are producing this dry sift. I started watching a couple YouTube videos, and I've seen major trichomes on veg plants, clone plants. And it was like, the guy just kept going like, it's about the genetics, man. And I'm like, fuck. If you're going to show it to me like that, it is about the genetics. How much do you believe that the strains that you've pretty much built your brand with are genetically unique and you just can't hope to emulate it just because you've got clean sift?

2:03:02HoratioThere are certain things you can't do because the plant's producing it in a clone and not just a little trichome, like the full stalk and ball, like a 70 head. It's really abnormal genetics, I would think, that, you know, really make the difference. Would you agree? Because you see it.

2:03:20SpeakerWell, I'll tell you what, X, recently I was gifted the clones of Cookies and Cream 13, which is the cup winner, and Kimball Kush, the same phenol. In veg, because I have them little, they have no trichome production or anything. It's really just, I think it's that star fighter. Because the blackberry... In the Kimball Cross is not something you can sift. It's more water hash. You know what I mean?

2:03:46SpeakerIt's kind of low potency, very greasy. But that Starfighter, it just hit it off. It made it very dry, kind of like a haze. But the oil content inside those heads is so high that even when it's like 95% pure, that dry sift melts like a 99, you know, to the untrained eye. And it's really easy to get to 99 just because the heads are, are perfect for dry sifting.

2:04:11SpeakerIt makes it easy. I really think, I don't know, it has to be genetics, bro, for sure, because I've never sifted anything that has given me those results before. I have strains that sift. I have a sour that sifts nice, hazes that sift nice, right? But, man, nothing like that Kimbo in the cookies and cream. But the Kimbo, more than anything, I think is really like the best dry sift strain I have ever worked.

2:04:40BubblemanIt's all about the strain for sure. I can definitely say over the years from the things that I've seen when it's all on point, the slea stack that they crossed with that skunk back in the day, that was pretty ridiculous. Before that, just the skunk number one, skunk man Sam's cut, produced the most ridiculously potent and tasty and melty, like his dry sift just turned to water.

2:05:06BubblemanJust turned to water. Liquefied through the tightest of screens, it was insane. I mean, it was really truly the inspiration. You know, that was the first time when I asked him, can I just take a picture of this? And I felt bad because back in those days, you didn't really ask him things like that. You just kind of were happy to be able to hang out and be shooting the shit and learning and didn't want to push the boundaries too much.

2:05:30BubblemanBut one day when I was there at his house, I finally just said, can I please just take a picture of that? And he was like, yeah, yeah, take a picture. And that was of course the first picture that went up on the internet of like the 99.999% sift, which it definitely got people talking, I'll tell you that much. I think at that very moment the door was cracked for people to just want this.

2:05:56BubblemanAnd I mean people had acquired it before, not quite, 90% heads maybe if they got lucky with a little grinder or some trim bin. Or, you know, a quick trick through a couple of screens. But to be able to acquire, like, large amounts of it, to be able to get, like, 10 or 20 or 100 grams of it, that was the door that was cracked open that day.

2:06:21BubblemanAnd, well, hopefully one day, you know, it'll open even further and we'll see people having access to being able to just have jars of this stuff. Everyone needs jars of this stuff. Nice cans. Hazers and Sweet Skunkers and Congos and Kimbo Kushes and Cookies and Cream and every other variety that you love. It's like the best representation is really like if you can get it into its dry sift form, that will tell you what's going on.

2:06:52BubblemanHey, welcome Jen.

2:06:55BubblemanI would say how you doing, but my goodness, we told your story at the start of church today and it was very, it was a sad start to the day.

2:07:05JenYeah, I have better stories to tell. This isn't one of them, but it is all at the same time, so it's kind of conflicting.

2:07:13BubblemanYeah, it's unbelievable that, like, I don't really understand it exactly, but I guess you guys were kind of, went to, like, an island or something where they're, like, when the water goes down, you're able to drive over?

2:07:28JenYeah, I believe it's called Melbourne, what is it, Melbourne something. But basically, I think it's Melbourne Sandbar. Basically, it's this little island, and as the tide comes up, it covers the walkway just a little bit, and it can vary in depth. But for some reason on that day, the tide came in really, really fast.

2:07:55SpeakerAnd so, I don't know. I don't even really know where to start.

2:08:02JenYeah, I don't know where to start.

2:08:05BubblemanSo was the other guy that you were with, Pat, is he from Happy Daddy?

2:08:10JenYeah, that's Pat.

2:08:12BubblemanOh, so I do know Pat.

2:08:14JenYeah, Pat Emerson. He's an amazing, amazing person.

2:08:18BubblemanWow. Geez, Maliz. Well, it's just crazy. Terrible, terrible loss, you know? I mean, I guess sharing, again, the GoFundMe page of... Well, Harland is a good start, you know, telling us a little bit about your good buddy who passed on, you know, basically being a hero and helping save your guys' life.

2:08:43JenYeah. Craziest thing is, is the man that saved my life, like, I met him that day, actually. Pat and I weren't having the best day, and we kind of talked, and I was like, I really just need to get out. I'm stressed. And he was like, me too. So I went over there and that's when I met Harlan. Harlan is Pat's best friend. He just moved him out from the East Coast to come out and experience the cannabis life and get to work and start his life out here so that he could bring his mother and hopefully his daughter.

2:09:18JenSo I went over to Pat's that morning and Harlan was just the sweetest person. Him and I just hit it off and chatted and joked and he was just the kindest. Kind of soul, like, just one of those people that the second, I was like, hi, I'm Jen. He's like, Marlon. I was like, cool, let's fucking blaze and talk about you. And so I got to learn quite a bit about him in a very short amount of time.

2:09:47JenAnd it still just blows me away right now that this person that I literally knew for

2:09:57SpeakerSeven hours will always be such a huge part of my life.

2:10:02BubblemanYeah, that's a serious experience that you guys went through together.

2:10:11Etienne FontanWe love you, Jen, whatever you can get through.

2:10:14SpeakerWe love you guys. I owe it to Pat and Harlan to be able to come on here and tell our story because this was just such a freak accident. I wish that there was some blame that could be put anywhere, you know, anywhere at all.

2:10:32JenLike, there's just not. There's not. This shouldn't have happened. The tide that came in is kind of a rare occurrence. It's not unheard of, but it was 2 p.m. in the afternoon, and the water rose. In 10 minutes, it rose probably at least a foot. Like, there was no indication whatsoever that That any of this was going to happen. And so, you know, there's no fault or blame to put anywhere.

2:11:02JenIt's just the universe just put us exactly where we should not have been. And I don't know.

2:11:17JenI'm still trying to just wrap my fucking head around it. I can't go 10 minutes without just crying and

2:11:25SpeakerIt's just so hard. This just really shouldn't have happened.

2:11:30BubblemanYeah, it's definitely terrible. It's definitely terrible. Death is such an intense experience and it seems to be so, you know, so eternal. It's just like, what? I never get to see this person again. We've definitely, I'm sure we have in this room, I know I have for sure, lost people that just were so close to me and And it just shattered me in such a way that you just, you lose a little bit of yourself when you lose people.

2:12:01BubblemanEven if you only knew them for a day, you know, the fact that you met them that day and had that experience and that all went down that way, you guys are definitely linked for the rest of your life.

2:12:11SpeakerAbsolutely.

2:12:12JenI'm happy to try and kind of like walk through the story. I know everybody's just really interested in what happened and honestly, like I'm having... As much of an outpour as we've had for people to help and donate, I'm kind of having this whole, like, heavy heart on, I guess, like, how overused GoFundMe and stuff is and how, just how kind of numb people are to real-life circumstances that are affecting other people's lives.

2:12:43JenLike, it's so easy to just hear about something like this and scroll through it on your timeline and be like, oh, that's sad, they need help, oh, that's sad. Like... And then continue on, you know.

2:12:56JenI don't know. If I could ask everybody here today if they could just literally take five minutes right now. I don't care if you have a dollar. Everybody has five dollars in two minutes. But it seems as though people kind of want to wait and they think everybody else is going to step in. I have a lot of followers. I have a shit ton of people that constantly tell me how much they appreciate me.

2:13:19JenAnd if just every single one of those people would just take The two minutes that they could to just throw a donation on there, it would be overwhelming for the people that it actually affects. It's such a little task for everybody out there that's watching. Such a little task. It's two minutes. Put your fucking credit card in there. I don't care if you have 52 cents to your name that you can spare.

2:13:45JenThat adds up. And we just really want to get him home to his family He's from back east and he had just moved out here a week prior. And so, you know, we're finding ourselves in a circumstance where now we have to send him home to his family and we really just, I can't express how much we need everybody's help right now to just pull together as a community and help, you know.

2:14:13JenHe was helping his sick mother when I spoke to him before we left for Our little four-wheeling adventure. He told me about his mother and about his daughter and how his mother's struggling. He had full plans of settling his feet here and being able to bring her out here so that he could take care of her. I just can't express enough how much that two minutes for you guys to please just take that time and anything that you can possibly throw at it.

2:14:51JenIt would It would mean the fucking world to so many people.

2:14:55SpeakerBut it hurts my heart to see how numb this world is to just tragedy, you know? Like, everybody's so sorry, but they don't understand. Like, if you just help a little bit, you know?

2:15:08JenLike, it can really help this out. And so we're appreciative for everybody that has stepped up.

2:15:15SpeakerBut I hate to say it, but I need more, guys. I really, I need more, you know? We need more. We need to appreciate this.

2:15:24JenI guess I'm kind of finding myself stuck in this weird circumstance where I'm watching this amount go up and I'm as fucked up as this sounds.

2:15:32SpeakerIt's like that's how much my life is worth because without that man and what he did, I wouldn't be here today.

2:15:46SpeakerAnd I just really hope people understand that and can just take that extra time. Like, I know it's the holidays. I know it's hard. I know everybody's tight. But it's just so important what such a small contribution can do as a community. Like, so many small contributions coming together can really help the people that are hurting through this hard time. So I just really hope everybody out there has a heart in a minute that they can fucking help us out.

2:16:18BubblemanAbsolutely. It doesn't take much, especially when there's hundreds if not thousands of people. You know, a few bucks, five bucks, ten bucks, something is more than nothing, that's for sure.

2:16:30JenYeah. I don't know if you guys can help walk me through it. Like, if you want to hear the events of that day, I guess they're just still so fresh in my head that it's really hard for me to know where to go with it because the pain...

2:16:48SpeakerAnd the sorrow that I feel right now, I guess it's almost hard for me to share this story because I know how it affects the other people that do care about Pat and I and Harlan, and I know it's been hard for so many people.

2:17:03JenBut yeah, if you guys want to kind of help walk me through it, if people are interested in the story, it's definitely one that deserves to be shared as hard and as painful as it is, so.

2:17:18BubblemanI mean, just, I guess, start while you're driving in the car, I guess.

2:17:22JenSo, Matt drives a Suzuki, what is it, a Suzuki Sidekick that is just awesome. It's all ready for four-wheeling. It's got the tires. It's got the lift pack. It's got, I mean, shit, we stopped and we had a conversation when we were in the mountains about all the safety gear that we had in the back. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:18:11JenThe sad thing is, is like all of that safety shit in the back of his truck sunk to the bottom of the river. And you never think that something like this is going to happen. And even when it does, like as much as you think that you're prepared for a circumstance, you're just not. You can't be prepared for something like this. So I guess the best place to start would be, we had the most amazing day ever.

2:18:38JenWe We went four-wheeling on our way back to Pat's house. We were like, oh, we feel so relaxed, so refreshed. Like, God, we needed this. And Pat had a snorkel on his truck, and I was really interested in that. I was like, that's really cool. Do you ever get to use your snorkel? And he was like, there's this place down by my house. We're going to go see if my friend's down there, and I'll let you check it out.

2:19:07JenAnd so we all went down. To the shore by the river and we stopped and we talked to the man in the truck that was sitting right by where we actually went across to go to the island and we kind of chatted up with him. He was throwing a ball to his dog and stuff and we're like, yeah, how was it? He's like, it's a little deep but you guys have fun.

2:19:32JenKind of waved us on our way and so off we went. And we went across and the water came up to just barely below the door. Because when we got to the island I actually was so shocked because it looked a lot deeper from inside of the car when we were going across. So I was examining the mud on the car to see like how deep was that water.

2:19:55JenAnd it was just barely to the bottom of the door. Like nothing to be concerned about. We stayed on that island for about 10 minutes. Smoked a cigarette. I hate to say it. Yes, I smoke. I'm sorry, Hash Church. I've been concealing that, but welcome to my life. We smoked a cigarette and had some really good conversation and shared some jokes. And we decided to head back over.

2:20:24JenAnd we got in the car and the stuff was buried. When we stopped at the very end, right before we went in the water, we noticed that the dog was swimming in the current. And we waited for the dog to get out of the river because we didn't want it to get in the way. So once the dog got out of the river, we noticed how strong that current was, and it was just like a passing thought, like, wow, if that dog just swam to the left a little bit, it wouldn't be fighting so hard.

2:21:05JenPassing conversation that did not cross my mind until it was too late. So we headed back across the river, and everything seemed perfectly fine. And out of nowhere, there was just this very small wave, maybe like this, a small ripple in the water. We noticed the car getting deeper, and as this ripple hit us, it lifted the back of our car up a little bit and just bumped us just to the side.

2:21:34JenAnd it's flat, but then it drops down. And so, it actually ended up pulling our tires down the side. And... As Pat tried to get the traction back to keep us on the sandbar, we realized that we were in a lot of trouble. And he just kept flooring it and flooring it and trying to just work our way back up and just keep any traction that we possibly could.

2:22:07JenAnd so as he did that, the current was coming because we were right where the current was. The current started to take our car and turn it sideways. So now, Rather than all four of our tires being on the pathway, only two of them were on the pathway. And the back end of our car started going up. And we thought that maybe we had hit another little sandbar.

2:22:35JenAnd that maybe if we changed directions, we would be able to push ourselves back up. Well, as all this was happening, I looked down at my feet and I realized that There was ice-cold water up to about halfway up my ankles, and it was just pouring into the car from underneath the glove compartment. And I was just screaming, Pat, what do we do? What do we do?

2:23:03JenAnd he was just trying his hardest to keep us on that sandbar as long as he could. And as the car sunk down, my side of the car went down first. Pat was driving. I was in the passenger seat and Harlem was in the back seat. And as we started to sink, we could feel our tires sinking into the rocks and it was kicking them out and we were going down and the water started coming over the hood and the water was about six inches over my window already and our back end was kind of up.

2:23:40JenSo I didn't know what to do because If I opened that window, I knew that the water would start pouring in faster and we would sink. So as he continued, we thought we hit that sandbar and he put it in reverse to try and catch the grip on that to try and give us a chute to go back forward again. And that's when we had the horrific time of figuring out that we didn't hit a sandbar, we were just sinking and the back end of us was floating.

2:24:12JenPat's window was open because he was looking out the window trying to see if he could see the edge of that sandbar and trying to get us back up to safety. And as the car pushed itself off of that sandbar just enough, our top end started going down and water started pouring in Pat's door. And I just remember screaming, get out, get out, everybody get out. And At the same time, I knew that it was going to be an incredible struggle for us to even get out of the car at that point.

2:24:50JenPat was the only one with an open window, but there was rushing water that kept him from being able to escape, and his seatbelt was still on. And so as the car sank, Pat struggled for his seatbelt, and I struggled to get my door open as the water rose up to my knees and then to my waist and then up past my chest. And I just remember trying to roll the window down.

2:25:20JenAnd I remember knowing, I don't know when in my life I had this conversation, but I had the conversation about, wow, you know, like if you're stuck in a car in the water and How do you get out? Because the pressure, just the pressure alone on your car makes it so that there's no possible way for you to open that window. You cannot open the door. You're just trapped.

2:25:42JenThere's nothing that you can do. You're just so helpless. And so as the water started to pour in, I tried to open both the door and the window, and I realized that it just wasn't going to happen. And the water came above my head. And I remember stepping on the dash and basically fighting the water to try and get to the last little breath of air that I could see because it just filled in so fast that it was a split second and I was just underwater.

2:26:18JenAnd so I pushed my way to the back of the car and right as the last four inches of water at the very top corner of the car started to disappear, I took a breath. And I remembered that earlier in that day, Pat had told me that there were snaps that were broken. He had one snap on the back of his Suzuki sidekick on the cover that was broken, and so it flapped when the window was open.

2:26:47JenI remember very clearly, as I took that last breath of air, I saw the tiniest pinhole of light coming through where that broken snap was, and In my head I just, I heard someone yell to me, snaps, and I took my last breath and I shoved so hard through the back of that thing that Harland and I were able to unsnap it and push through right as the car was probably about three inches underwater.

2:27:18JenAnd I remember kicking out and being able to see that Pat got out, but then it was freezing and

2:27:28SpeakerIt hit me that I was sinking, and I was actually wearing this coat right here, which I haven't been able to put on until today. But it's an Amsterdam coat. I got it at Barney's, and you guys know how nice those coats are. They're really nice, thick hoodies. And I had another sweatshirt under it.

2:27:56SpeakerAnd as soon as I realized Pat was out, I realized that I was going under, and I was trying to fight so hard to get up, but my clothes were so heavy, I just, I couldn't, I couldn't, and I remember seeing the top of the water, and I was probably like three inches under, I just remember this vision of opening my eyes in that river and not being able to see the sky except through the water, and I was just kicking and kicking, and All of a sudden, Harlan grabbed the back of my hoodie and pulled me up so that I could get a breath.

2:28:35SpeakerI just kept kicking and I was fighting and he was helping push me towards the car because the car hadn't settled to the bottom of the ground yet.

2:28:45JenIt nosedived so it went down like this and then it took a minute for it actually to settle flat on the ground. So we're in the middle of the current and

2:28:56SpeakerI was just trying to stay above and I just remember saying, I can't swim very well, I can't.

2:29:06SpeakerAnd he helped push me so I could find the footing on the car as it settled to the ground. And I remember just barely being able to find where I could stand and the water was still anywhere from like

2:29:23JenThe middle of my waist to a little over my chest depending on the waves that were coming in.

2:29:29SpeakerAnd as soon as I realized that I had something to stand on and I could breathe, I turned around and the current had just taken him just out of reach.

2:29:42JenAnd I saw Pat was still swimming next to the car and he had tried to work himself around to the back because the current was just so strong right then. We carried them around to the back and Harlan kind of floated off a little bit more, but we all thought we were going to be okay. We all really underestimated the power of cold water.

2:30:09JenHypothermia sets in so fast and when it does, there's nothing you can do. It literally shuts down your entire body. It starts shutting down your organs. It shuts down your ability to move your limbs. It shuts down your ability to think and to process situations. And so, when we all got out of that car, like, we really thought that we were okay. You know, like, you make it through something so intense as sinking in a fucking car to the bottom of the river, like, you thought we were going to be okay.

2:30:44JenWell, Pat... Swam around to the side and was fighting to stay up because his pants were falling off. He was wearing a pair of sweatpants and we were all in sweatshirts. We were just up in the mountains four-wheeling. It was cold. Pat was fighting really hard and I just told him, just take your pants off, dude. Just kick, kick. You've got to stay with me. And she kept going under and it's just...

2:31:11JenSo fucking surreal to just look at it like I can't even look at it but every time I close my eyes it's all I see is my friends just stuck in that water and there's nothing I can do. I tried to reach for Pat and I told him I'm standing on the car and if you can just swim to me and I remember reaching For the bottom of the car to try and hold on to the frame or to try and hold on to anything that I could so that I could reach him because he was just barely out of reach and he was fighting so hard to try and swim against the current.

2:31:48JenWhen I reached for the frame of the car, my head went underwater. And I knew that there was nothing I could do because I about fell off the car at that point. It's a soft top. It's slippery. It's soft and Under my feet moving and I was basically balancing on one of the bars that held it. And I just couldn't reach him and he just kept going under and finding his way back up.

2:32:17JenAnd all I could think of is to just try and tell him, float on your back. You guys have to float on your back. If you can just float, you're not going to sink. And so Pat was able to flip on his back and float and just kind of ride the current. And Harland... I was probably about 15 to 20 feet away from Pat. He was trying to do the same thing, but the water was just so cold that your body just starts shutting down.

2:32:51JenAnd so as all of this chaos is going on, we're just screaming for help and screaming, stay with me guys, stay with me, you've got to just fucking stay with me.

2:33:06SpeakerI saw a fisherman boat came around from the other side and looped around and I just remember pointing at Harland and watching him go under and screaming, he's right there, you have to get him. And I pulled up right next to him and I tried to grab him.

2:33:32SpeakerI'm sorry, this is so hard.

2:33:40SpeakerOne of the men on the boat reached over the side and they grabbed his arm and they were so close like I thought they had him. And I had to watch his hand just slip out of that man's hand.

2:33:59SpeakerAnd I just remember screaming, no, you have to get him.

2:34:08SpeakerAnd I remember hearing him on the boat say, he's gone, he's gone, we have to get the other ones, we have to get the other two.

2:34:18SpeakerAnd so the fishing boat quickly came over to Pat, thank God, because he was going under.

2:34:27JenCraziest thing, I talked to Pat the other day, and him and I have such a different memory of the occurrences. As far as the time that he was in the water, I had to watch. And he thought that he was okay. He was like, I was fine. I was okay. And I had to tell him, no, you weren't. That was your body dying. That was your soul trying to leave your body because of the hypothermia.

2:34:59JenYou weren't okay at all. And I guess that brings me a little bit of comfort just knowing that if Pat was in that state of mind where he was fine and it was just kind of slipping slowly away like you can only pray to whatever the fuck that Harland had the same experience, you know, because Pat kind of found himself almost at peace for a minute as he floated there in the water.

2:35:32JenAnd so the boat... The boat went for Pat, and they were able to pull him out. And I was just standing on the car screaming at them, I'm fine, I'm fine, please go back, please, please, please go back. They wouldn't, they just kept telling me, he's gone, there's nothing we can do. And so, after the boat pulled Pat in, they came full force at me in one of the, in one of the, uh, News clips, the fisherman actually says that he almost ran me over and he really truly did.

2:36:10JenI didn't remember this until I saw that news clip but he had to fight the current to get to us and so he had to put it in full gear and gun it towards me and I remember him telling me to brace myself and the front of the boat came about Two feet from me, like full speed ahead. And then he slammed it in reverse and the wave that the boat created actually like almost washed me off the car.

2:36:43JenIt went over my head. And then as he threw it in reverse, it like pushed me back and then it pulled me back forward. He was able to swing around and grab my arm and drag me on the side.

2:36:58JenSo they were able to pull us in, but Right as they pulled me in, I just kept telling them we have to go back and all they could tell me is you just need to calm down and all I could think is how am I going to be calm? You know, there's only so much time that a person can be in the water. But as they pulled us into shore, we saw the rescue boats coming and they pulled us into the ambulance and it wasn't until A couple hours later that they actually told us that Harlan had passed and that they were able to recover his body and it's just, I just can't stop reliving that moment, you know, and I can't, you can't explain how anybody could be more grateful for life right now than I am.

2:37:58JenIt's just, So much.

2:38:03SpeakerI just don't... I don't know what else I can do other than everything I can to just help his family, you know?

2:38:12BubblemanWell, I think that's a noble thing for sure. It's a heavy thing. You just have to be thankful for your position and all of it and understand... I'm a firm believer that every decision we make in our life leads us to that day. It's like every decision you make leads us to that day. I had to overcome that thought with trying to understand my father and his wife's death and how sudden it was on a motorcycle that I had purchased for them.

2:38:43BubblemanI had to go through all of these different thoughts in my mind and I really came to the conclusion that That you won't be late and you won't be early. You'll just be right on time when you make it to your death as we all will. It's just a little scary when you get close to the veil, when you get real close to it with some other people and they don't make it.

2:39:04BubblemanYou know, that's a very intense experience that, I mean, how do you even make sense of it? There's no sense to be made of it.

2:39:14Etienne FontanHeavy. Jen, tell us a little bit of what you're thankful for.

2:39:19JenI am thankful for every single fucking person that has ever been kind to me, that has ever told me that they love me, that has ever been there or not been there for me. It doesn't even matter. I can't even begin to say what I'm thankful for because... It's just the craziest realization. It's like the world is really almost in a different light.

2:39:52SpeakerI'm just so fucking thankful to come home to my kids. My poor parents are in Utah and they're flipping out. They want to be here so bad.

2:40:03Dr Mark ScialdoneI'll bet you're thankful for that fisherman.

2:40:10JenI am very thankful for those fishermen. I'm thankful for the man on the dock, you know, before we went in. In the midst of all this shock, somehow my brain thought that I would be able to call 911 or call my children from the top of the fucking car in the middle of the river. I remember having my phone in my hand in the last... The last glitch I saw from my phone, I was hitting the send button to try and call 911.

2:40:41JenAnd it's just crazy because that's so asinine to think that that would actually work. But in that moment, it's just crazy where your head goes. I don't think there will ever be anything in my lifetime that I'm not grateful for, good or bad, because... Even the bad shit, guess what? I'm fucking here to experience it and grow from it. You know, it's not just the good that brings us to center with ourselves.

2:41:15JenIt's kind of like that balance and just appreciating the fact that we're here to be able to acknowledge that balance.

2:41:24BubblemanIndeed. Well, I appreciate you coming and sharing your story, Jen, and we'll definitely, we'll We'll be donating some money to that GoFundMe.

2:41:36JenThat would be fabulous because at this point there's not much else we can do. But Harlan left behind his sick mother and also an 11-year-old daughter. And I look at my children and I'm just so grateful for

2:42:01JenBasically a stranger, but not helping me come home to my kids because without what he did, I would have been the first one down. I'm 150 pounds soaking wet.

2:42:19JenMy body wouldn't have been able to last in that water. It's just a fact. I looked it up, actually. I started researching hypothermia and all this stuff. It doesn't take long at all. And yeah, even if I was able to swim without sinking in my incredibly heavy clothes, I wouldn't have made it out of that river because it was too cold.

2:42:45BubblemanYeah, it just grabs you. You can't even breathe when you're in cold water like that.

2:42:49JenYou can't breathe. You can't think. You literally can't move. Yeah, so I will just... Let's just say I appreciate life to the fullest more than a lot of people will hopefully ever have to. I know that a lot of people that survive these tragedies and death and these really close calls, you know, like, it really does change you.

2:43:21BubblemanDefinitely helps define who we become, that's for sure. It always has. It's why we've always pushed it away as well. We push death. We don't talk about death too much, and it's sort of pushed to the outer limits of human experience. Some cultures acknowledge it more than others, but here in North America, we definitely don't seem to acknowledge it too much until someone dies, and then it gets acknowledged for a little bit, and then it's sort of...

2:43:49BubblemanSlowly wears off. I definitely feel for you, Jen.

2:43:56Dr Mark ScialdoneThe most dangerous thing that most people do every day is drive a vehicle. It is, you know, again, the clue is that the buoyancy of the vehicle was played out in Jen's story here. And the first thing that set alarm bells off to me is when you see that that water level is damn near close to the doors, If you're inches away from being swept away as heavy as you think your vehicle is, water is heavier and it'll have a bigger force to basically sweep that car away.

2:44:33Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd so I know like when rivers overflow their banks and you're tempted to drive through a bridge or something that's sort of being washed out, I mean you should really think twice about it because You can't compress the water and exactly the way Jen said, the reason why the back of the car went up is because of the buoyancy of the air in the trunk, right? And so the heaviness of the engine is going to be the force that's acting on the water to sink the car and if you do see that water level damn near close to the doors, that should be the first thing that you need to get the hell out of there because there's no match Any, the biggest vehicle is no match for a rushing river like the Willamette or the Columbia or any of those big tidal rivers out there out west.

2:45:29JenYeah, and the fact that we were only there for 10 minutes, that's one thing that I read about the Willamette River is that they have these really odd tides. It's similar to tides in the ocean, but obviously different timing and whatnot. But I was reading somewhere and it said that the Willamette River can actually raise up to eight feet in two hours.

2:45:58JenWe were on the island for ten minutes. Yeah, in ten minutes you wouldn't think that that water would be able to raise a foot.

2:46:10BubblemanSorry about the interruption there. Johnny B just got here. I was saying hello to him.

2:46:14JenHi, Johnny B. Hi, Jim.

2:46:18BubblemanJen was telling us her story. There we go.

2:46:27JenYeah, the scariest part about this, and I think Pat and I are both in agreeance, we're really hoping that they do choose to close that sandbar down. Because people drive across that all the time. If you look at some of the news footage from the very next day when they're actually pulling the car out of the water, There is a Toyota Camry parked on the fucking island driving across.

2:46:53JenLike that's how common this place is for people to go and I'm actually really fucking upset that they didn't have more signs or something. Like one sign posted on the dock from what I hear that just says warning and that's about it. But three years ago somebody died doing the same goddamn thing. Why wouldn't the city post that? Why wouldn't they close it down? You know, I just don't understand.

2:47:21JenSo, I know both of us are really hoping they close that part down because we had zero indication. Zero. Like, Pat is such a very cautious driver.

2:47:33BubblemanWell, I was just kind of mentioning even in the chat, in the YouTube chat, that, you know, in the Pacific Northwest, and I'm sure in other parts where there's epic nature, um, When you spend time in epic nature, things like this can happen. They're not as freak as we think. It's just that nature's always a tripper and a freak and does whatever she wants. I spend a lot of my time in the backcountry mountains.

2:48:07BubblemanSnowboarding and photographing skiers and sledders and snowboarders and I go sledding into the tops and bases of deep bowls on mountains and I can say that it's every year we hear multiple stories of people perishing in those environments and it seems as though really wherever humans choose to be we will We'll die there as well. So you can question and say, oh, it was so dangerous and, you know, you shouldn't be doing this and you shouldn't be doing that.

2:48:38BubblemanBut it's like it's beautiful and it's nature and it's how we bond through those moments. And, you know, it's terrible that the tragedy occurred. But at the same time, I like the idea of you celebrating Harlan's life and doing good for him rather than focusing on, On, oh, you know, the negative aspects of how he came to, his life came to end.

2:49:07JenYeah. Well, I know that that's not what he would want. He was such a positive person and from all the outreach that I've had from his friends and family, he's just a good guy, you know. He wouldn't want us to be letting this affect us in a negative way. Like, of course it's going to, of course, but He would want it to be better. So I feel like I need to take this opportunity to just not only better myself and make sure that I'm making my time worth something, but also hopefully encourage other people to do the same because you don't want to go through a near-death experience in order to realize how precious life is.

2:49:51BubblemanTrue.

2:49:54BubblemanYeah, exactly. Exactly, Johnny V. Johnny V says he's been there.

2:50:01SpeakerBeen there a couple times, and you know what? It gives you a whole change on life, and it really makes you think, and it makes you get perspective on what you see with other people. When you see someone lend or hold their arm, and it makes you think of what they went through, and how they... Yeah.

2:50:21JenWell, if you guys have any awesome inspirational stories to lighten the mood for me a little bit, I would love it.

2:50:29SpeakerInspirational stories. Inspirational stories. Well, let's see.

2:50:37SpeakerJust for what you've gone through, what you've experienced, and what you're about ready to embark on life, you're about ready to tell people and share your story, and just your experience is going to help so many people understand about what someone We're all grateful for that. Grateful.

2:51:17Etienne FontanGrateful to have you here as well as, you know, the past is the past. You can create the future that you want to see. So, you know, you've been helping others. I don't think that's going to change anytime soon, is it, Jen?

2:51:31JenNever.

2:51:32Etienne FontanNo. So, you know, just keep on being the awesome inspiration that you are, you know. We've all had our tragedies. We've all found medical cannabis in our own way, you know. Mine was through war, you know, I have other experiences, so nothing inspirational in war. But surviving and coming out the other end and after seeing the worst that man can do, I've tried to do the best that man can do.

2:51:59Etienne FontanSo, you know, always find in that darkness, that lightness that brings you out. Look, it's going to take some time. It's okay to mourn. It's okay to deal with. You know, that's a lot of stuff to happen in a short amount of time. And you're going to be okay. You know, there's going to be times, you know, survivor's guilt, all that shit. It comes with the territory.

2:52:22Etienne FontanYou ever feel down? Just be around people. Be around those that you love. You know, call your tits. Remind yourself why you're here. You know, you're here for a reason. We don't know what. But go create it. Be it. Be the awesome person we know that you can be and have been.

2:52:43BubblemanI just drove an hour and a half for this bong rip. John did just drive an hour and a half for this bong rip. He just took some of his Dennis Hopper flower resin and I dipped it into the lemon turps.

2:53:02BubblemanWow. The lemon turps.

2:53:06JenSo... Can we take a much-needed fucking bong rip in memory of my goddamn hero?

2:53:13BubblemanYou took the words right out of my mouth, Jen. I shit you not. That is what I was just about to say.

2:53:17SpeakerI was just going to say that, too. That's super... super emotional, like, probably the most emotional hashtag we've ever had. My skin was, like, crawling as you were describing... Your story, I think, I mean, I would have been in a complete panic attack and just ran out of air myself. I don't know. Like, that's, like, super scary for me. Just, I just don't like anything with water and the breathing and things.

2:53:47SpeakerJust not being able to have control.

2:53:49JenI still plug my nose when I go underwater. So... So are we taking this hit? Do a group hit? Group hit. I just want to say I love you guys. I really appreciate you guys being so supportive.

2:54:08BubblemanFong rip for Harlan. Fong rip for Pat. Fong rip for Pat and Harlan.

2:54:14JenI know Pat is watching right now, so I just want to say, Pat, I love you, brother. I got you, bud.

2:54:21BubblemanSorry to hear what you're going through, Pat. We're taking this one for all of you guys. So here we go. Love you, Jen. Vote them up.

2:54:57BubblemanHey, I wanted to welcome Chris Bennett to the room. He came in with the intensity of the story, and we never got to welcome him, but... Welcome, buddy.

2:55:07Dana LarsonGreat to be here. Cannabis has a long history as a drug for grief. It was part of Scythian funerary rites, thought to be the Nepenthe, which eased grief of lost ones. I think one of the ways I think the spirituality of cannabis really comes out is you kind of like get high with everybody who ever got high, you know? And it's a great plant for like, you know, much better than the Irish Wake, that's for sure, for going into that and getting through it.

2:55:44BubblemanAbsolutely. I would agree with that for sure. That the Irish Wake is definitely not the way to go about morning and that, you know, smoking cannabis could, just seems like the opposite of the Irish Wake. And I'm Irish. There you go. I'm Irish.

2:56:01SpeakerWow. I'm Irish, Scottish, Dutch.

2:56:04BubblemanWow. I'm Irish, Scottish, French.

2:56:06SpeakerIrish, English. Awesome.

2:56:09BubblemanJohn looks like a new Dutch king.

2:56:13SpeakerI'm growing hair out.

2:56:14BubblemanYou just got to get the suit with that big thing there that he wears. And the thing, he's got the other thing.

2:56:21Etienne FontanYeah, you got to get that, man.

2:56:24BubblemanWe'll go to Holland with John. I don't think people are going to Holland next year, though. I have to say, after the Jamaican Cannabis Cup... If there was one in Amsterdam and in Jamaica, I really might have to go to the one in Jamaica.

2:56:41SpeakerI'm going to have to go to the next one.

2:56:45BubblemanI would suggest it. I mean, there's probably going to be 20 of them between now and... Oh, here, Todd's back. There we go. Boom. Welcome back, Todd.

2:56:54SpeakerIf they have one in Barcelona, then definitely...

2:56:57BubblemanWell, I don't think they do. I think the Barcelona one is Spanibus, and I guess Mila throws her party. Who's going to come to Spanibus in March? Would Spanibus be a good place to have a little Legends? Because, man, I'd start planning that shit right now.

2:57:10SpeakerBarcelona is the new Amsterdam for sure.

2:57:14BubblemanIt is. We could probably get a great place to do Legends of Hash.

2:57:21SpeakerA lot of those smoking clubs are really beautiful now. They've put a lot of money into infrastructure and they've really stepped it up. I mean, Strain Hunters comes to mind and others.

2:57:32BubblemanYeah, Strain Hunters and HQ for sure come to mind right away.

2:57:35Etienne FontanHQ is without a doubt, HQ rocked it, man. I mean, I appreciated the hell out of that as well as the Strain Hunters spot. I mean, I joined four different spots in Barcelona. I appreciated the hell out of Barcelona. They're fucking awesome.

2:57:51BubblemanYeah. I also love Barcelona. I have fun. I think this year I'm going to bring my family for a little vacation before or after or a bit during but definitely make sure that I like this pattern of having my family around when I'm about to go into these events.

2:58:11BubblemanDo legends in BC, Analytical Mike says. I did legends in Vancouver for three years when I had my gallery and I guess I could by all means do it. I just don't see enough

2:58:24BubblemanI don't know if 50 people could bring me a piece of hash that was like... I mean, it could be... Here's the thing, too. Legends of hash, in my opinion, does not involve people bringing rosin and saying, here's my full melt. Because to me, rosin is just oil that you've squeezed out of your bud. Not just oil. It's oil that you've squeezed out of your bud or your hash.

2:58:48BubblemanAnd that's great. But I don't think that it's hash. I think that it's oil.

2:58:57BubblemanJust my perspective. What do you got there, John?

2:59:00SpeakerI got some hash. What kind of hash is that? That was the LR Kush that we brought to the Legends last year.

2:59:05BubblemanThe LR?

2:59:06SpeakerLR.

2:59:06BubblemanThe Larry... Romulan. The Romulan.

2:59:09SpeakerLarry OG Cross Rom.

2:59:11BubblemanLarry OG Cross with Romulan. Ooh, that must be a tasty viddle.

2:59:15SpeakerYou named it LR Kush. I called it number two for so long. You're like, why don't you just call it what it is? What's up? All right, well, let's put some on the nail. So we have some 90, 73, and then we have 90, 73, 120. 90? 90. 90. Oh.

2:59:28BubblemanWhat the hell?

2:59:35SpeakerDude, it's almost impossible not to. I'll put more in there. Yeah, yeah, I was just going to say that. Let me just say, come on. There's two of us. There is two of us. There is two of us.

2:59:49BubblemanWell, we're getting back to some hash here on Hash Church. I hope everyone has something nice to smoke. What do you guys think about hash and oil? Not to say one is above the other, just do you believe that they are different things or do you believe that oil is hash?

3:00:09SpeakerHere's a 45. Anyone? Nobody?

3:00:14SpeakerWow. What? No one's commenting.

3:00:16BubblemanI know, not a single person is talking. It's like not even a single person. They're just like, fuck this, I'm not talking.

3:00:23JenHey guys, I have to go because we have a memorial at 3 o'clock and today is actually the one week mark.

3:00:35Etienne FontanOh my gosh.

3:00:38JenYeah.

3:00:38Etienne FontanWell, happy one week birthday on your new life.

3:00:41JenThank you. So yeah, if you guys are still session around 2.15 Pacific Northwest time, that is the exact time that we were in the water. So you guys could definitely lift a bong for us. I would appreciate it. And everybody could definitely please just push home on the donations. And the sooner we can help him get home and buried, the sooner I think Everybody involved will be able to start kind of piecing our lives back together.

3:01:16JenSo I really appreciate you guys a shitload.

3:01:22BubblemanWe appreciate you, Jen. Thanks for coming and sharing your story, and we will absolutely raise our bongs.

3:01:28SpeakerThanks, Jen.

3:01:29JenThank you.

3:01:30BubblemanThank you, Jen.

3:01:32Dr Mark ScialdoneBye, Jen.

3:01:33JenBye, guys. I'll see you. I'll try and pop in next week. I'm actually... In the midst of all this, I'm in the middle of moving as well, so hopefully next week I'll be all settled with my new house. I'll see if I can't pop in. If not next week, the next one. I'll see you guys soon.

3:01:59BubblemanWe'll see you soon. Thanks for coming. You've been too many things at once here. You've got 80 things. I do have 80 things.

3:02:09SpeakerI'm looking at all your cool shots.

3:02:11Etienne FontanYou can have those. You were asking the question, and I wanted to let Jen finish there, but I definitely find a difference between the high difference between rosin, BHO, CO2, including old school hash oil extractions. Each one is a different high and a different experience depending on what you're going for. You know, to say what works one well for the other is, you know, different depending on the individual still.

3:02:38Speaker100%. I can definitely say that the difference with the dry sift, with the bubble half and the rosin, even though this is all the same strain, they all have different effects.

3:02:52Etienne FontanAnd this is all ingested the same way, same temperature, etc. Varying effects, but still, carboxylization.

3:03:00Dana LarsonHuh. One thing you're not seeing here in Vancouver is the CO2 oil that much. Every time I go down the states lately, everybody's got the pens with CO2 oil, and that's such a nice product. It doesn't have the flavor, but it's such a clean, instantaneous high, and I can't imagine too many contaminants with that CO2.

3:03:25Etienne FontanHey, Todd has my, I got a grasshopper the other day. It finally came in, the actual grasshopper pen. Yeah. I actually got one, and it actually, I tried it, and you know, you just put a little bit of cannabis in the tip, right out of the box, clicked it on, and it turned from red to blue in a matter of seconds, and it hits just like a volcano.

3:03:48Etienne FontanIt's a pretty amazing piece, and I love the simplicity of the little magnet back on the end, but... I was very skeptical that this product would ever come out, and I left it at Todd's, and Todd's been using it at his place, needless to say. They put a little rubber tip on the end of it, but it's about the size of a pen, and it's kind of what we always wanted an herbal vaporizer to be, solid, sturdy, you know, something that was easy to charge.

3:04:15Etienne FontanOn top of that, it has its own replaceable battery, so you can actually switch out a pre-charged battery. It's solidly good for a good 30 hits, you know, finely granulated cannabis. I wouldn't put that unless, you know, you sandwiched it real well, but it's definitely a unique new way of ingesting flour because I rarely ingest flour so much because like you guys, you know, how often do you, you know, you John actually, you know, smoke flour per se.

3:04:51Etienne FontanAs much as smoke, you know, a bubble or...

3:04:54BubblemanI haven't smoked flower in 14 years.

3:04:59SpeakerHave you seen this, Mark? It actually is pretty smart. It's just mostly... It's brilliant, really. So this little part is the switch, which is really quite small. It has a click to turn it on and off. Oh, yeah. And then brilliantly enough, it has a magnet That connects to charge.

3:05:22Etienne FontanOkay.

3:05:23SpeakerThe battery is here. So this is mostly battery. And then when this is together, the bowl is down here. Can you fill it up? It's really clean. It's just there's a screen through the other end, there's a screen through this end, and it's convection, so there's no real heating element that you can... Oh, there's grass in there. Sorry, I was actually using the thing. Hold on. No, that's cool.

3:05:55BubblemanThat's what I wanted to see, that it was the herb one, because I don't use... I think the last herb one I used were probably these two right here, which is the Mighty from Volcano and the little... Herb Trippy Stick 1.

3:06:11SpeakerI don't, you can see it's just, it's just literally just a hole with screens on each side. And you can put, I put concentrates in with the herb in there and it's easy to clean out, you know, Q-tip tech shit, so. But this thing just slips over, heats up, and when you turn it on, it goes red for a second, and then it goes blue, and right there it's done, it's hot, and it goes.

3:06:35SpeakerAnd then this little thing is a twist temperature, and it goes from like 200 and something to 460, I think. That's pretty cool. In five steps. It's got to be the nicest vaporizer I've ever seen in my life.

3:06:47Etienne FontanIt's the smartest and the best handheld herbal vaporizer I've ever used, without a doubt.

3:06:53BubblemanWell, I might have to give them a call and check them out. I did recently get a bunch of different things. I got this dipstick. I don't know if you guys have ever seen this.

3:07:01SpeakerYeah, yeah, I love them.

3:07:03BubblemanYeah, the dipstick's pretty solid. It feels like a good product. I like the magnetic cover, and it just gets orange hot real fast. You push the button, and it's just like...

3:07:11SpeakerThe guy, the owner is a glass blower out of Texas. I met him at one of the shows. He was really, really nice. We met at a show. He got an idea for it, and I think it's brilliant. It's... We're on the go.

3:07:23BubblemanI got this like the next day in the mail from Kyle Cushman. We were hitting it. We didn't have power for our nail, so we were putting dabs into the bowl, and then he pulled this thing out, which is called the glow stick, and it just has a simple little switch on top. It's battery operated. You push the start button. These little blue buttons start blinking, and within like five or so seconds, the tip just turns orange hot, and so...

3:07:52BubblemanYeah, you can just, I guess, use it to ignite bowls of hash. It's just another great way to do something on the go, but it gets pretty warm, gets pretty hot, and then it's easy to turn off and just cover with the little cover. So all these different little tools.

3:08:09SpeakerWhich one? I showed you it wasn't a vaporizer.

3:08:20BubblemanYeah, Tripper. So yeah, there's all sorts of different products. It's neat to see. Like I said, maybe I'll have to try that herb one because these two both do herb and I just find it like, I don't know, like not only bulky but just like I'd have to vaporize like 20...

3:08:37SpeakerWe've tried probably every pen.

3:08:40Etienne FontanWell, that's also is that you know, for us to really smoke herb, it doesn't work so much. But for those that smoke herb, I think the Grasshopper is the best on the market handheld herbal vaporizer. But again, we all have tolerances higher than the normal. We're the 1% of the 1%, you know what I'm saying? But it hits great, and I was rather surprised, right out of the box, ready to go.

3:09:05Etienne FontanPut it right in because I waited like two years by it. It was one of those Kickstarters. And it took two and a half years or something, but they came through and they're in production now and it's smart.

3:09:19SpeakerVery good.

3:09:21Etienne FontanI hope somebody applies that to the pens for, you know... Oils and stuff like that as opposed to people are still doing half-assery. I think there's still a lot of better things out there and we still haven't arrived at that technology yet.

3:09:39BubblemanTrue enough. I'm sure the technology is only going to get crazier with the amount of money that's being put into this industry right now that... So many people are focused on selling and distribution and growing and all of those things, but then, you know, the product and like the, especially like a medical grade product, like a product that would look like it's not out of place in a hospital.

3:10:10Etienne FontanLike that little grasshopper. Have your doctor come in?

3:10:14BubblemanPlease take three puffs on this.

3:10:16Etienne FontanOh, wow.

3:10:20BubblemanPerfect. What are you puffing on over there, Dana?

3:10:27SpeakerI tend to just get a random bag of all my different strains from my dispensary and everywhere else, and I put that together. I have a couple of different kinds of hash that I'm not sure exactly what they are, but they're good bits of hash that I grab. And then I got some oil in this vial, and And I put all that into this joint, and then I'm smoking it.

3:10:46SpeakerSo I don't really know the strains or anything I've got, but it's all really good being blended together in one thing.

3:10:55BubblemanSo not really a one-strain guy. You're just like, I like to hit everything my dispensary is carrying on all the extracts, on all the herbs. I call it a full-spectrum blend. The full spectrum. You should call that the full dispense.

3:11:09SpeakerEveryone is different, right? Because everyone's got a unique blend of everything. But I used to try to keep all my strains in little different baggies and organize it. But I like mixing them together into joints anyways. I'd go a little bit of the kush and a little bit of the haze. That'll be a good mix. And so I thought, well, why am I just going to, it's just that I get all the best weed, I put it in one bag, I go to the hash, and I'm good for the week.

3:11:31SpeakerEvery joint is awesome, every joint is different, and will never be recreated, so that's how I like it.

3:11:37Etienne FontanI do that with my hash, where I will actually, I call that, you know, cannabinoid concentrate, where it's basically the full, I call it the full spectrum of cannabinoids, because, you know, it works for me, it won't work for everybody, and it's not necessarily the tastiest way to do it, but, you know, I don't have to worry about, eh, I kind of feel this, that way or the other, I get everything I want in one fell swoop.

3:12:00Etienne FontanI feel, yeah.

3:12:02SpeakerI still smoke roach joints. I don't know if people make fun of me because I keep my roaches and I smoke roach joints. And I tell you though, I've rolled roach joints and I've given them to people who say, hey, guess what strain this is? I'm just curious what you think about it. No one has ever said, oh dude, this is a roach joint. They've always said, oh, this is really good.

3:12:18SpeakerThis is a this or that or guessed all kinds of stuff. But like, so people make fun of me because I have a lot of weed. Why are you Dana Larson smoking roach joints? But like, no man, my roach joints are awesome. Old school. That's awesome. When was the last time you rolled a roach joint there, Mark?

3:12:37BubblemanYou know what? I used to roll roach joints. I wanted to get to the seventh generation roach joint that took like four million joints to roll to get to. At one point I had like two and a half pounds of roaches saved up. Two and a half pounds of roaches. That was a lot of roaches. And then I stopped smoking herb. I ended up giving those roaches away to a guy who literally said, he said, this is like Christmas and my birthday on the same day.

3:13:09SpeakerSo like Jesus then? Two and a half pounds of roaches. Because Jesus' birthday is on Christmas, right? Just like Jesus.

3:13:19BubblemanNot the one that, yes, Jesus, exactly. That's it. You know, the potentially non-existent guy that definitely existed.

3:13:30SpeakerNo, he existed and he was getting everybody high and using his cannabis tinctures and oils to cure everybody. I'm sure Chris has got a thing or two to say about that, but yeah, he was real.

3:13:42Dana LarsonYeah, my view is it's like, I don't, you know, if you really look into what scholars have to say about the no G's is, Thank you for joining us.

3:14:18Dana LarsonInteresting information and I think a revelation for our modern age. I think that's true of cannabis and a lot of these different traditions. If you don't really know the history of this plant and how long we've been involved with it and its story around the globe, you're really missing a big part of the picture and the relevance of this modern day renaissance that we're seeing in this plant because people have been using it and enjoying it like we are right now for thousands of years.

3:14:47Dana LarsonAnd, you know, it's great. You know, I'm still learning stuff. You know, right now we're working on a book about cannabis and the occult. And there's some really interesting stuff here. I'll post in the thread there a thing from the Picatrix. This is from the 1050 AD. And they're talking about cannabis oil in an incense recipe, you know, so. It's just incredible how long people have been doing this, how long people have been extracting cannabinoids from the plant, and yeah, it's an incredible history.

3:15:22BubblemanIt's pretty damn awesome, there's no doubt about it.

3:15:25SpeakerAnd you know, we're in a time right now where there's a lot of hate, as I guess there always is, hate between different groups and demonizing of different religions and stuff, but it would be nice to have that rich tradition of cannabis through Christianity. Thank you so much for joining us.

3:15:56SpeakerThank you for joining us.

3:16:16SpeakerSo I kind of think that this cannabis thing that's happening right now and this global change is going to have a lot of good, not just in terms of not putting people in jail and just in terms of the environmental benefits of more hemp and all that, but also in terms of the consciousness change and maybe the unity it can bring us.

3:16:32Dana LarsonWell, you know, like go to any sort of vapor lounge or cannabis club and people are chill and then go to any bar in town at closing time and And witness the violence and hostility and bad behavior that takes place. And that speaks for itself right there. You know what I mean? I think that these prohibitionists really need to go spend a night in a paper lounge and listen to people's intellectual conversations because oftentimes cannabis does produce.

3:16:59Dana LarsonThat's probably one of the things about this show is getting high and people get kind of intellectual and philosophical and have new associations between ideas. And the things that Dan is talking about, that theme is a common theme through history, through unrelated groups and unrelated people coming to the same conclusions about this plant. So it's not like something that he's just noticing. It's something that people have always noticed about this wonderful herb.

3:17:27Dana LarsonAnd I think the more people, like Bob Marley said, the more people smoke ganja, the more we have peace on earth. You know what I mean? And it's, you know, like I think if you could show Islamic people this great history of cannabis, Sufis and Thackers and other stories, you know, and Jewish people about cannabis and the holy anointing oil and incenses of the temple and, you know, Hindus about Shiva's relationship with cannabis and Chinese about the Taoist, that that really creates an even bigger bond, you know, it ties you back to your history as well as your present day.

3:18:00Dana LarsonBut, you know, I tell you what, man, somebody smokes cannabis on the planet, I'm going to share it with them. And that's a common thing. You know, I don't care if I'm down in Africa and it's pygmies, man, it's like, yeah, I'm going to hoot that dagger with them, you know, wherever I am. You know, it's a bonding thing and, you know, it widens your scope. And that was a big thing about the jazz era, you know, blacks and whites mixing together because all of a sudden they're smoking herb and their tunnel vision of reality is opening up to see a human being across the table for them.

3:18:31Dana LarsonAnd empathize with that human being and that brotherhood and sisterhood of this plant. And that's the real big thing that I think that this movement is generating towards too. You look at these medical clubs and places like that. They're like community centers, man. People are feeling good about being there and they relate to the people there. And it's like a new sense of community that a lot of people haven't really experienced before this movement.

3:18:59BubblemanIt is a beautiful thing. Well said, Chris. Well said.

3:19:11BubblemanI think we need to have a little bit of a bong rip right now. Step things into the next gear here on Hashtag 62.

3:19:18SpeakerGear... Gear 3. Gear 3.

3:19:27SpeakerThis is one of my favorites. Which one's this? That's the Dennis.

3:19:31Etienne FontanOh, the Dennis.

3:19:32SpeakerIt is tasty. What is it? It was named Dennis Hopper. Through the people I got the seeds from. Background of the genetic?

3:19:45Etienne FontanQuestion mark?

3:19:46SpeakerUm, no. A gentleman up here on the coast we call the golfer. The golfer?

3:19:54Etienne FontanDennis and a little hopper.

3:20:00BubblemanYeah, a little bit of Dennis crossed with Hopper.

3:20:05BubblemanWe were going to call it the Dental Hopper, but it was a lot less dental and a lot more Dennis, so in the end we went with Dennis.

3:20:16BubblemanThere's no...

3:20:17SpeakerIt's just a name. I had nothing to do with it. I had absolutely nothing to do with it either. But how was it? I just grew the seed.

3:20:25BubblemanIt was very lovely. I mean, it was by no means...

3:20:31BubblemanYeah, it was nice. It was strong. It was a strong rip.

3:20:35SpeakerIt's tasty. It's got a nice...

3:20:37BubblemanI've been hitting these terps and they've destroyed me for taste.

3:20:40SpeakerThat's what happens. I hit some of those OG terps there last weekend. It was so tasty.

3:20:46BubblemanToday you hit the lemon terps.

3:20:47SpeakerYeah, that was tasty. What was your favorite taste? You had lemon terps mixed with something?

3:20:52BubblemanIt was the jack with this, the one that's gone now, the master flower, this one.

3:20:59BubblemanThis one, wasn't it? It was this one that I pressed your hash in. I remember because I ripped the... I liked it so much I ripped it apart.

3:21:10Dana LarsonWhen you say lemon turps, is it like turps from like lemon haze or actual lemons?

3:21:15BubblemanFrom... I think it was lemon... Tony, maybe you could reiterate which lemon is this? Is this like a lemon pie or... That's from lemon pie.

3:21:23SpeakerSo that's from flowers. So that's derived strain-specific Cannabis-derived terpenes, so that would be from the flowers of lemon pie. How about that hits you, how it opens up? Oh yeah, it's like aromatherapy. Yeah, it's aromatherapy. It's just how those terpenes modulate things.

3:21:46Dana LarsonI think one time I met Horatio in the lounge, and he was actually using actual citrus terps mixed in with cannabis. Is that correct, Horatio, or...?

3:21:56HoratioNo, were you dabbing or were you smelling?

3:22:00Dana LarsonDabbing, yeah, dabbing. It was some sort of citrus.

3:22:02HoratioWell, that's LHO. I don't know from what era, but that's limonene hash oil itself compared to using butane as a solvent.

3:22:13Dana LarsonOh, yeah, because that added a real flavor to it.

3:22:15HoratioWell, that was in the preliminary development stages. It's gone a long way in the last two years. Before you got the orange out of the clear. Pretty much. That was the big discovery, the aldehydes, and then discovering how to do it without using other toxic chemicals, which would defeat the purpose of using lumenine.

3:22:38BubblemanInteresting.

3:22:43Dana LarsonSome of these CO2 extractors they have down in the States, they take out the terps and a different thing, and so you've got little vials with all this different stuff in it, but It seems like you must need about 250k to even get started down that road.

3:22:58BubblemanI'd say a little bit cheaper, but definitely 250k is a pretty good unit.

3:23:07BubblemanNot too shabby. Everyone's so quiet. Everyone's just so quiet.

3:23:17BubblemanOkay, why is it called hash oil if it's not hash? Okay, Kavelin, I'll tell you. Because hash oil is to differentiate between weed oil or herb oil, which is made from herb. Hash oil is made from hash. You take hash and you make oil, which is why often you'll see the word R-H-O, rosin hash oil. Because they made it from hash. This is like, Rob Clark talks about this in, not the rosin aspect, but just the differences between what an oil is versus what a hash is, and then what hash oil is versus what just oil is.

3:24:03BubblemanDepends on what they made it from. I guess it all becomes perspective at that point.

3:24:12HoratioSo, Bubble Man, would he be basically saying that all trim is like a, like that's hash? Like, that's where I was like, what does he mean by hash, or does he mean like I make bubble, then I would make oil out of it?

3:24:23BubblemanBecause that would be... Well, back then it was like, often hash oil, I think, probably happened like in India and in Nepal when oil, or sorry, when hash would spoil, they would often turn it into oil. And it was like, it was this Nepali hash oil. It was crazy shit, actually. It was dark, dark, dark. The first time I met Rob in 95, I believe, or no, sorry, I met him in 95.

3:24:49BubblemanThis was the first time he came to my house, which was about a year later. Hillary brought him over, and I had Nepali hash oil. And Rob was hilarious. He's like, oh, yeah, I'll smoke anything. It's probably nasty, dirty, made this way and that way. And But it was made from, you know, Nepali finger hash, and it was potent like you would not believe, especially for that timeline.

3:25:12BubblemanWasn't seeing much like it. But it got me interested in the key terms of, okay, so hash oil is hash made from, or oil made from hash, which, you know, they definitely do. I think for a while, too, it was almost before Soma came out with the jelly hash, which was Rez Dog showing him how to blast, Thank you for joining us.

3:25:59BubblemanTo hash, to make it look gummy and to make it look like, you know, the cleanest of the cream, you know, that uber, uber cream that you only get at a certain time of year during a certain harvest when you didn't have any drought and all the variables lined up perfectly and then you get that cream but in the smallest numbers. There's never like a ton of that cream available.

3:26:23BubblemanYou know, it's just like, yeah, give me like 2,000 pounds of that cream. Nope. Maybe one day.

3:26:33HoratioNo, that's weird because I've watched a lot of the Strain Hunter stuff just to see what... I saw the handmade gums and I'm like, okay, now is that heated to make oil? Is that squeezed to make oil? Is that cut to make oil? Basically, when is it traditional good versus traditional bad? Like stepping stuff into the ground to make it red. Like... What would you define as the difference?

3:26:56HoratioBecause there's definitely lots of oils that were just cut with alcohol to make it runny, but when was an oil really, like, was it ever pressed through screens, like, and heated? Like, when, you know, they talked about the stone, like, there's so many ways to say oil. Some is a stretching agent and another is a product, like rosin.

3:27:20BubblemanWas that a question directed at me?

3:27:22HoratioYeah, like both you and Chris. Like, since it's historically coming out of 20 years ago, I obviously can't tell you what HashRaw was like. That would be illegal. I'd be a child. But... In the old school sense, when was oil really a good thing? Like finger rub was a good form of hash oil. But when is it bad? Like when it's just putting alcohol in a bunch of shitty hash and selling oil.

3:27:46HoratioLike oil is a very loose word. That's kind of why I was like, what's the definition of a good old school hash oil versus a bad one?

3:27:53BubblemanWell, I guess with any of those processes, if they were done correctly and, you know, Well done without leaving massive footprints, then they would be all accordingly good in their own way. Back in the day, I can only go back to say the 70s and the 80s when oil was kind of like only really a certain person did it. It was always very like in his garage, nobody got to see, and it was just like you get this You know, I remember first seeing like dark oil, which turned into eventually green oil, which eventually turned into red cherry oil, which eventually turned into honey oil.

3:28:31BubblemanAnd once you climbed all those little steps, you never went back. You never were like, okay, like I need to get some of that green oil, man. Like that was the stuff right there.

3:28:42HoratioI hate to say it, but green oil is still killing. People say it gives them... I always study why people like certain things that I'm like, that's bad. Are you addicted to a side effect? Because a lot of side effects are addictive. And there's a strain of people that want green oil, and apparently I've seen it on the market. It's back. We did go back. And Black Ash is back for $10.

3:29:10HoratioIt's... Apparently people love it all.

3:29:12BubblemanWell, I think that there's still people starting their journey, so it's not that we went back, because I'm not buying it, and I damn sure know you're not buying it. I think a bunch of new people just got turned on, and they're just like... I like how you said it.

3:29:28Dana LarsonYou know, 19th century oil, at least in the Islamic world, they were making it by boiling it in water. I think I sent you a little piece I found on that a little while, a couple weeks back, Mark. And they would boil it and then they would collect the oil drops at the top of the water. So that was a pretty clean method of extraction. I don't know what kind of returns they would get on that.

3:29:52Dana LarsonThey probably had larger amounts to play with, although people today, you know, maybe it's a better return than these rosin methods. I don't know. But it was done via water and heated water.

3:30:05BubblemanI bet the sizzle is strong in their oil.

3:30:07Dana LarsonYeah, I bet, you know. And then they just dry it out after, you know, like lay it out. Collect it and let it out.

3:30:14HoratioSo Chris, that's like a, pretty much a pot decarb tech. Like were they adding like a coconut oil and then pulling off that layer or are they just taking the turps?

3:30:24Dana LarsonJust take off the oil. Yeah, like, you know, boiling it up, I guess, same way it's making the oil come off of the leaf matter and then collecting the oil on the top of the water. And it was pretty potent. They would mix like a drop of that, they would say, into some yogurt and take it that way. And it was the beverage of unity among Sufis and stuff like that.

3:30:45HoratioThe beverage of unity. Because of the prohibition numbers, we can't do that anymore. Every time I remember, before this it was just a fucking plant. Of course I have a bushel for our tea today. It's like no problem. It's like cutting food for a cow or just one animal. Fuck yeah, there's a cauldron with, you know... Well Todd was saying earlier that it grows on

3:31:35Etienne FontanLittle trees. Not always so little.

3:31:40BubblemanBig ones too.

3:31:41SpeakerThey get awfully big for one season.

3:31:44BubblemanI don't think Remo actually knows how to grow a small plant. Even his clones are eight feet tall. He goes directly into an eight foot.

3:31:54Etienne FontanOh my gosh.

3:31:55Dana LarsonYou know, oil in the 70s, there was that green crappy oil that everybody made. Then there was like a red kind of ash oil. And then there was this really nice stuff called honey oil. And it looked like honey. And it was a pretty pure product. I don't know how they were making it. There was a lot of different, it was a much less refined thing back then.

3:32:14Dana LarsonBut the honey oil that was around, I think it was probably as good as a lot of the oil that we're seeing today.

3:32:20BubblemanOne frightening way that they were making it, especially if it was the red oil, is they were taking naphtha, which is camping fuel, and hopefully if they were at least somewhat smart, they were running it through a still and collecting out the rust and the lead inhibitors that were placed inside the naphtha. Although back in the 70s they didn't have that in there. That came in, I believe, in the 90s when they started putting rust and lead inhibitors into the solvents.

3:32:44BubblemanBut they would run that solvent, if they were smart, very cold, cold solvent, washed quickly over the material. And you could get this very almost red, light red to golden oil. And then if you wanted it to be pure gold, you could run that liquid solvent and the oil through carbon filters, carbon crushed stone or whatever. And it would filter out the red color, and you would lose quite a bit of weight, but you would end up with a very honey-colored substance.

3:33:18BubblemanAnd if you kept going and kept running it through carbon filter, you could eventually get an almost clear oil. And my friend only did it one time. He said it took him like 10 grams of the red to make the honey.

3:33:37BubblemanAnd then the honey was like another, you know, 10 grams. It was a ridiculous amount of red oil to make like a single one or two gram dram bottle of this oil. I have a picture of it on one of my hard drives. I'll have to look it up and check it out.

3:33:56Dana LarsonI remember when green oil gave way to water hash. Do you remember Ozzy James that was around on the Sunshine Coast around 2000? He was the first guy I met that was really making the water hash. And what had happened with him is he fell in with some bikers who were using a lot of their seconds to make that green oil that everybody was making around that time.

3:34:16Dana LarsonAnd then all of a sudden James showed up with the bubble bags and the guy that was making the oil, he was making a killing because he was getting everybody's trim and shit like that to make the oil. He was ready to take a hit out on James because all of a sudden everybody was like, wow, what's this stuff? This is so much better than that green oil.

3:34:33Dana LarsonAnd he was walking around with like baseballs of bubble and stuff like that. But yeah, the guy was ready to kill him over it.

3:34:42BubblemanDude, James was quite a character. I don't know whatever happened to him, but wow, like the last time I saw him, I traded him a bunch of bubble bags for just this giant rock of black opal. Literally like a five or six pound black opal stone.

3:34:58Dana LarsonYeah, he gave that stuff away like nothing, you know what I mean? It's like I know a few people that got opals from him and they're just worth a ton and He was such a character. He was out of the Wild West. The guy probably weighed like 140 pounds. He would go up against anybody, man. He was ready to drop down with anybody that hassled any of his friends or anything like that.

3:35:19Dana LarsonHe was such a character.

3:35:21BubblemanYeah, he really was. I don't know why we're talking about him like in past tense. I hope he's still alive.

3:35:26Dana LarsonI heard that he was discovered at the bottom of an opal, or that his remains were at the bottom of an opal mine. I tried tracking him down through people in Australia a couple of times, and that was the story I heard that he was at the bottom of an opal mine.

3:35:40BubblemanThat makes sense. He did have a connection to opals. Well, that's too bad. He definitely didn't leave when he left. It was like he seemed to be like, I think he had to get out in a hurry. Damn. Well, you know, sometimes I can catch up to you. Yeah. James with the deaf tech. Someone in chat. Poor joke, but everything's a tech nowadays.

3:36:08BubblemanTake a Q-tip and wipe the inside of your bowl and it's the Zamboni tech. It's the Q-tip tech. I invented that. Just check out my Instagram. It's on there.

3:36:21BubblemanSo there. What's going on? You writing a story or a book, Tony? You look like you're deep in... Deep in thought. Deep in thought.

3:36:36SpeakerYou're funny. No, I'm just finishing up this Blue River extract website.

3:36:42Etienne FontanBlue River.

3:36:48SpeakerYes, sir. I was typing. You caught me.

3:36:53BubblemanYou know what, I'm having like a good problem right now. Two people now have said that there are spammers in the room. Analytical Mike was one of them and I can't remember who the other one was. So without even questioning it, I just blocked these people. Both of them have since texted me, did you seriously just block me for saying, I don't even know what he's saying, for asking what limonene hash oil is.

3:37:16BubblemanI was like, I would never block someone for saying what limonene hash oil is. I suspect I blocked... It's just funny. I can't even keep up. I'm going to have to be a little more, you know, make sure three or four people say that someone is being a spammer before I, because I'm trying to just keep up and I cut corners and now I'm blocking people that are like both like.

3:37:37BubblemanThey're both pissed off.

3:37:39SpeakerSee, as in someone who's sitting here watching you with like six screens going, I can't do it, so I'm not home and chatting out. It's easier. My mind doesn't work like this.

3:37:48BubblemanDude, this is insane. I know. People hit me up.

3:37:51SpeakerI don't send you messages over here going, hey, block this person. I send it to you privately.

3:37:55BubblemanOh, lots of people do. I know. Look, this guy's writing me again in a separate place. Kevin Mills is choked. Okay, Kevin, I'm sorry. Yes, I apologize. It's someone that I did trust. Coming down and sharing your knowledge.

3:38:40SpeakerHey guys, I said love. I've got to go do a few things myself.

3:38:43BubblemanAll right, Todd. Thanks for coming out today.

3:38:46SpeakerWe'll see you next Sunday, of course. Yeah, hug somebody. That was the message today's hash church.

3:38:54BubblemanYes. That's Michael Franti's song, right?

3:38:58SpeakerI think it is. Everybody's got to hug somebody at least once a day. Yeah, I didn't think of that, but now that you say it.

3:39:05BubblemanYeah, man.

3:39:05SpeakerThat's a great tune. Franti. Alright everybody, I hope you have a great day. Alright, peace.

3:39:15SpeakerChurch.

3:39:19BubblemanWell, it's pretty nice out. I kind of wish I didn't have the boat in storage. One of those days you could get out. It's probably freezing though.

3:39:27Dana LarsonFreezing. It's cold out.

3:39:30BubblemanI spent eight hours, eight days, eight hours on the mountain yesterday. Kevin Mills is still sending me messages. How about I apologize, Kevin, and we'll sort it out, okay? Is that okay? Let's just chat. We're almost done. I'll make sure it all works out next time.

3:40:06BubblemanI don't even know how to unblock people from the YouTube chat.

3:40:09SpeakerI was going to say, I don't know how to unblock them. I don't know how to unblock them. I think once the episode's done next week, you guys will go.

3:40:19BubblemanIt must be. People think that I block them all the time. They're like, I can't comment on the YouTube chat, but it's because they're on a phone or a tablet, and apparently you can't chat on Post. When you're on one of those, you've got to be on a computer. So if you do really take this shit seriously and you want to be able to post and stuff, just go on a computer.

3:40:41BubblemanIt's easier. It's better. And if you don't have one, then just do the tablet and don't be able to type.

3:40:53BubblemanI don't even remember blocking the name Kevin Mills, to be honest.

3:41:05SpeakerWhatevs.

3:41:16SpeakerMore curbs than the boat. Long rip.

3:41:29SpeakerReally flavorful rosin right in front of me. Now, are you finding it different with the temperatures with the rosin press? Like, what temperatures are you pressing at now?

3:41:38BubblemanI'm not, you know, I'm just kind of running the, I'm more excited to get full melt dry sift and full melt bubble hash. I'm not as obsessed with rosin as I was in the beginning.

3:41:51SpeakerOh, no, no, I'm doing hash and bubble dry. I mean dry stuff basically.

3:41:55BubblemanYeah, in that sense, this has been cool for a while. I haven't pressed much in a while. And keep in mind though, I pressed like 40 or 60 grams, so they're just now starting to get down into smaller piles. I like having it in my stash, but I think I'm going to focus my attention on producing that.

3:42:14SpeakerThat's the 45, and once I can pull on that, I can make it pretty stable.

3:42:18BubblemanThat snappy snap.

3:42:25BubblemanN Church, Fuck Kevin, Bong Rip. That's hilarious. Don't block me, bro.

3:42:34BubblemanHey, I make mistakes just like anyone. I guess I'll have to be careful who I listen to when they say someone's spamming.

3:42:47BubblemanAll right, Kevin's good. He's good to go. He's going to be back next week. We do apologize, Kevin, and... Thanks for watching!