Etienne Fontan's Legal Victory and Chrissy's Patient Story

0:00BubblemanHey, hey, hey everybody. Welcome to Hash Church episode 109. I'm here live from Toronto. Kicking it at my good friend Allison's place. Got a bunch of really cool people downstairs right now. We got Ramo and his wife Sandy. We got some good friends in from Montreal, John and Neil. Allison and her good friend Sam are down there and my partner Ashley. So we got it going on.

0:25BubblemanWe got it going on. That is for sure. Let me just mute this and send out the invitations. I hope everyone's doing great today. Go see what the panelists are saying real quick here. Let's just make sure I've done this correct. I want to make sure everyone gets invited in. We've got 191 people in the room. Well, that happened pretty fast. Sorry, 221. And I am here at the Karma Cup.

0:50BubblemanI'm not actually at the Karma Cup right this second, but I will be going after Hash Church very soon. And I hope, oh, right, Hillary Black and John Conroy are also downstairs. So we've got a bunch of good people in the house right now. And welcome to you, Mr. Etienne Fontaine.

1:05Etienne FontanHello, sir. Good morning. How are you?

1:08BubblemanYou know, I'm doing pretty good, man. I got to say, like, I just, I love Hash Church in the sense that I look forward to it. I don't get nervous about having Hash Church anymore. I'm really just excited to link up with everyone. I don't worry that it's going to be amazing because I can't imagine it not being amazing the way it's been going. And that's just awesome, dude.

1:28BubblemanI hope you're doing the same.

1:30Etienne FontanI'm doing very well. I got the awesome news this week that I beat the federal government.

1:36BubblemanOh my god, congratulations, dude.

1:40Etienne FontanI'm very beyond humbled. It's been a five-year process. And yeah, they contacted us last week, and I'm just waiting on the official signature and stuff to happen last week. There was, I mean tomorrow, there's some shenanigans that transpired with the fellow attorneys that we caught them in, and so... We're just going to play our final card and then they will dismiss with prejudice and then it's over.

2:08BubblemanDude, oh my God. Welcome, Todd. Just listening to Etienne's wonderful news.

2:15ToddIt is really cool, man. It's a long time in the making.

2:18BubblemanHoly shit. Life's getting good, man. I like it.

2:23Etienne FontanIt's a nice change in the paradigm, I needless to say, because, you know, five years of dragging through this is, you know, they called me crazy. They said we would never win. There was no way we were ever going to beat the government. It's bizarre to sit here today and to start to feel the actual feelings that this could actually start to finally end. So it's many years of sleepless nights and frustration and all these other things.

2:51Etienne FontanAs Todd knows, Todd's been with me through this entire process. Thanks, bud, and thanks to everybody who's Thank you so much for joining us today.

3:15BubblemanHey, did you notice in the new video by Lutan Fire, the Sweet Trichomes video, when they say the line, from the skunk to the full melt, it flashes to a screen on Hash Church, and it's your screen, Sam, that's open with the little Sam I am character.

3:34SpeakerSounds good.

3:36BubblemanYeah, dude. Yeah, that was a little super subtle shout out from Lutan Fire to the Skunk Man and then the boys Mitch and Tim Dub and whatnot who produced the video. I just, if you haven't seen it, I'll link it to you. It's called Sweet Trichomes. Wonderful.

3:51SpeakerGood morning. Good morning. Hi, Mark. Hi, ATN. Hi, Sam. Hi, Mark. Hi, Todd.

3:58BubblemanGood morning, Indra.

4:01Etienne FontanMorning, Indra. Welcome, Dr. Sheldon. Morning, Skunk Man. Good morning, everybody.

4:06BubblemanWelcome, Mark. I like the blue background, dude. You're like up there with Horatio for the killer light.

4:15MarkIt's actually purple or lavender, I guess.

4:18BubblemanVery well. Well, I appreciate it in all aspects. And I'm looking forward to a great Hash Church. I sent the link out to Dr. Natasha. She said she wanted to come and play today again. So hopefully we'll see her in here in a little bit. And we're just getting the lowdown from Etienne, his amazing news, how he beat the federal government in his case, which is, I mean, should we not start with a puff for that?

4:43Etienne FontanWithout a doubt. Well, Andrew's on it.

4:46SpeakerWhat was that case about, ATN?

4:50Etienne FontanThe federal government tried to evict me. Originally, they evicted me from my first location, 2747, because the five years of statute of limitation had passed, so the only way they could deal with me was by eviction. So they evicted me by going to my bank and saying, if you don't kick them out, we're going to take your bank. And so I was forced to lay off 50 people.

5:18Etienne FontanI closed down our initial location, became a delivery service, and within a few months found a new location, reopened up our doors, and then the federal government came after that property saying that I was within 1,000 feet of preschool and daycare centers, which is not part of the law. So we lawyered up and we took them to court. And after five years, they've decided to drop the case against us because thanks to Americans for Safe Access's Rohrabacher Amendment, which means the federal government cannot spend money in states where it's legal, that piece of history turns out to save my company in the end and the government had to drop my case so I can now continue to exist in my location without any federal interference in the future.

6:10SpeakerWell, if I was there, I would pat you on the back and give you a hug.

6:14Etienne FontanThat's good enough for me, sir. I'm just humbled to actually walk through the fire and come out on the other side squeaky clean.

6:21BubblemanI got a room full of people here that are happy for you too, Etienne.

6:29Etienne FontanWow, what a beautiful arrangement of people I can see. Is that Hillary on the left?

6:33SpeakerHi, darling. Congratulations.

6:35Etienne FontanThank you, babe. Thank you. Oh, wow. Thank you all. It's humbled and honored. What a great assortment of people there. Hey, beautiful people.

6:43BubblemanYeah, Hash Church. You know, I'm using the headphones. I don't want to create too much of a backlash where it starts reverberating. So just let me know, guys. And for those of you that when you're not talking, if you mute your mic, it won't do that as often when I don't have my headphones in. So yeah, I'll keep muted for the most part. Probably get to talk to a few different people in the room here.

7:04BubblemanBut yeah, awesome news, ATN. Awesome news.

7:08Etienne FontanWell, what are you guys and ladies and gentlemen up to there in Canada in the room there?

7:13BubblemanWell, we're all here at the Karma Cup. We've all been sort of running booths and speaking and running our different businesses and, you know, definitely just having a great couple of days. Sarah Sunday pulled it off and last minute without some permits and lost all her venues and had like 48 hours to find like three new venues and pulled it off.

7:34Etienne FontanThat's quite an undertaking.

7:36BubblemanYeah, it was definitely old school activist style.

7:38SpeakerThe city can't shut us down.

7:40BubblemanThat's right. The city can't shut us down. So excellent. So what's been going on with Todd McCormick? We missed you for a couple of days there.

7:50ToddJust one, I think it was. You know, as soon as I started this today, I got a message on Snapchat saying, can you go off on a hash charge and shut up all the greedy fuckers who don't want to see Prop 64 pass? I just laughed.

8:04BubblemanIt's definitely incredible that there's an argument going on about that prop.

8:09ToddIt's definitely sad that there are a lot of people putting out a lot of misinformation because they're trying to protect the profits of the few people that do serve to lose money. And the people that serve to lose money are the people that have small farms that won't be able to compete with no profit margins. That's really, the devil is the profit margin more than it is legalization because A coffee cup, a cup of coffee, a bong shouldn't cost much more than it costs to produce.

8:36ToddAnd when you have something trading for 100 times the cost of production, that's not something you can sustain.

8:45BubblemanSure enraged everyone in chat just by saying your own common sense, Todd. You got Cuban telling you to fuck off.

8:52ToddYou got... Well, I didn't finish the comment, but you know what's weird is the guy said, especially fucking Cuban, annoying as hell. And I didn't even want to read it out of respect for Cuban, but he's been one of the loudest, most disingenuous voices out there on Instagram, spreading lies, misinformation, and fear margarine, All because they're afraid of watching their $100 and $200 grams of hash drop to $10 and $20.

9:19SpeakerWell, there's a question that's being asked over there. People are asked, what about this potential ban of hydrocarbon extraction in California? That's bullshit. I've been talking to the state fire marshal, and the guy, I've been talking specifically to the state fire marshal who's in charge of code generation. Thank you for joining us.

9:59SpeakerThey came to me and asked me to sit in with them on the code generation as the only expert who's come forward. Everybody else who's talked to him calls up on the line where you can't see the number or who they are. They won't tell him their name. They won't come out of the woodwork. He calls them knuckleheads. They were very happy to... Talk to me. And I think what we're doing is we're going to create a safety standard that's going to save people's hineys.

10:31SpeakerAnd on a good note, a number of the companies who manufacture systems now, having been contacted by my attorneys, have returned wanting to either lease the patent and make amends in that way. But they're definitely... You were right, Mark. Mr. PhD, Mark, they're coming out of the woodwork now with all kinds of offers. One guy offered to buy it, and I just laughed at him when I said, you don't have that kind of money.

11:01SpeakerBut they're offering to buy. They want to lease. They want to know how to build the systems.

11:07MarkIt's amazing how a very well-written patent gets people lining up.

11:15BubblemanWell, didn't California just announce something new as well? Because I thought I saw some new thing there that they were going to allow gas extraction again.

11:22ToddYes. They did. It's a Senate bill. I was just looking it up. It's completely going to be regulated. You're completely correct, Mark.

11:29Etienne FontanAnd this was something that was spawned from us who were frustrated because patients like me, it's our medicine. And there were no protections. So we kind of kick-started things at the local level and they spilled into the state level. And the best thing about this is that new MRSA people, which is the medical marijuana law here in California, they're open and receptive to listening to us. They understand that they You previously ran the ABC for alcohol.

11:56Etienne FontanAnd the best thing is that they have been coming around, they're going around different regions of the state and they're listening to us. They actually accept our phone calls. They talk to us. They're willing to engage with us. And they want to know about what we've been doing so that they can actually regulate things medically properly. So we at least have some proper direction And people who are willing to listen and actively listen and are actively going around the state currently gathering information.

12:27Etienne FontanAnd from that, we got them to introduce this bill, which will protect hydrocarbon production for those who want to do it professionally.

12:36SpeakerLet me tell you, the State Fire Marshal Code guys were tickled pink about it. Their comment to me was, they knew how to fight a gas fire, but they'd never really had to fight a fire involved with legitimate places that legitimately use gas to extract. And my comment back to him was, that's because they're inherently safe and you haven't had to fight any fires out of them.

13:01SpeakerI said, you're fighting fires at all these private places. We're guys doing it in the garage, out in the backyard, in the basement, places like that that are all equally scary, dangerous, and dumber than I can possibly imagine. I can't even find a description of word to replace what I think about people who do that under those circumstances. But anyway.

13:22BubblemanWell, I think you put it perfect last time, John, when you said these guys couldn't pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were on the heel.

13:30SpeakerYeah, there's a number of those people who, well, hopefully, the only 300 people in California who were that dumb already blew themselves up.

13:42SpeakerRight. The rest of the people out there. And by the way, I just have to make one comment. A lot of people have been writing comments on my Google Plus site saying that because I don't give out more information, I'm part of a greed conspiracy that's going on here. And we're too greedy to let the information out. These would be the same people that have been making a living off my other information without so much as a buy your leave.

14:12SpeakerAnd Now they're mad because I haven't given them yet another way to increase their living. And so I do have something to say to all those people that I'd like to say now. I thought about it all night and I was writing it and it just takes me a second to say it and I'll be done with that. Fuck all of you assholes.

14:38Etienne FontanYou're the only man who could get away with saying that, sir.

14:41SpeakerHow poetic, how poetic, sir. Listen, I lost a lot of sleep writing those lines, and so.

14:49MarkIt's like herding cats, isn't it, John?

14:51SpeakerIt's worse. I mean, you give these people something and they're like, that's not enough. We need more. And then the ones that try to shame you, oh, you don't really know what you're talking about. If you did, you'd explain it to me and prove it all out and other nonsense like that. And what I have to say is what I already said. And hey, you're all free to do your own research.

15:13SpeakerNobody's pinching your head or stopping you from finding out on your own. You're just too... Fucking lazy I guess, isn't it?

15:39SpeakerHow are you guys doing today?

15:41BubblemanHey, welcome. Welcome, Chrissy. I guess I believe Tony was telling me a little bit about your story, and I'm very happy that you came and shared, are going to share on Hashtag.

15:53ChrissyWell, it needs to be said, so.

15:56SpeakerYeah, let me give you a little introduction, Chrissy, if you don't mind. I have, how long have we known each other? Four, five years?

16:05ChrissyYeah.

16:06SpeakerSomething like that. And we started, you actually have a patient story on the Act Now page. And I haven't really pulled in too many patients out. Do a patient story. So Mark and I were kind of talking about the other day. And Chrissy has, has a mother who's a nurse who... Yeah, that we've been working with on the program with Prana for about four years. And when I first met her, she was about 33 pounds, something like that.

16:42SpeakerAnd she was 11 at the time, I believe. 10. 10. 10. So she's 33 pounds, 10 years old. She had, I think about, I would say she was having 100 seizures a week. Um, Dandy Walker Syndrome, autism, non-verbal, she was on stem, uh, electric stem, what else? She was on a bunch of narcotics, different drugs, four or five different drugs. Her GI system was a wreck and I believe the moment that you and I connected was the moment that she actually, for the first time, actually looked at you and We started to see the light.

17:33SpeakerAnd in a, I'd say six month period of time, we were able to with just, I think it was like the P2 and maybe P1 at the time, but. The three-to-one non-active was very successful in her conditions in the sense that, oh, let's say what, six months we had started to see really significant changes in her GI and her system, but I'll let you explain all of that because This story has a twist, and that's why you're on today.

18:08SpeakerIt's not just a success story, but it's also a story of what the system can do to children when they enter back into the conventional world of health care. So why don't you tell the world the progress she made, where she was at, and then ultimately what's going on.

18:32ChrissyOkay, well, she went down to one seizure a month, and it was strictly based on hormone change. And she was like that for just shy of three years. We used the cannabis juice, and within a four-on-one time frame, we had actually healed it completely, made the system function on a, you know, drug-free basis. And, uh, she was, she's, she was progressing in communication skills, smiling, uh, like motor wise, she was doing fantastic building muscles.

19:19ChrissyShe got up to 66 pounds, um, and like over four feet in a couple of years. And then, uh, just last December, the, uh, Vagal nerve stimulator that she has. The lead started to disconnect because of her growth spurt. And the seizure started again. It's very slowly. She started to... How old is she? She is 13, almost 14.

19:49MarkHow old is she? I'm sorry, I didn't hear that.

19:51ChrissyShe's almost 14.

19:53MarkAlmost 14, thank you.

19:57ChrissySo we started to lose weight. Her menstrual cycle stopped. The seizures progressively started to get worse, and then she became status epilepticus, I guess is what they call it, where they were so constant that she never came back to baseline. So I made an executive decision to take her to Children's Hospital, the main campus in Denver. And after I had given her rescue meds, the ambulance drivers had given her rescue meds twice.

20:32ChrissyThey proceeded to give her enough for rescue meds to put her in a coma.

20:40ChrissyAnd they discovered that her VNS wasn't working. And so they agreed to replace it the next day.

20:52ChrissySo we went through a lot and I'm trying to put it all together, but they kept giving her meds. Every couple hours, and she never flinched, never moved, but she still continued to have seizures. When they went in to replace this vagal nerve stimulator, they just replaced the battery, even though the battery wasn't bad, and they never replaced the leads that were the cause. So everybody came out, doctor, anesthesiologist, they said everything went great.

21:31ChrissySo I go back when she's in recovery and there's a doctor waiting for me. And the doctor says, well, there were some issues. And I'm like, excuse me, this is news. Everybody said it was great. So they proceed to tell me that they couldn't keep her blood pressure while she was under general anesthetic because of all the other narcotics in her system. That the battery wasn't bad, it was the leads.

22:00ChrissyWell, they didn't replace them. So they said they were going to move her to ICU. The whole time this is all going down, I'm like, we need to do an MRI. We need to do x-rays of her GI tract because something is really wrong here. And they kept denying me and saying, there's no reason. We just need to give her more meds. And just more meds, more meds.

22:25ChrissyAt this point, they said, well, we need you to sign a... Release waiver so that you can continue to give her the cannabis so that they're not liable for whatever. So I signed a paper and we got moved to ICU and she never came back to the baseline at this point.

22:53ChrissyThere's so many pieces. I'm trying to remember it all.

22:57Etienne FontanJust take it step by step. You're doing great.

22:59ChrissyOkay. Along the way, the whole time, I'm continually saying, please check this, please check that, you know. Like the GI tract for her is, it stimulates her seizures. So they said, well, there's absolutely no correlation between the GI tract and the neurological tract. And I'm sitting here going, well, that doesn't make any sense because your vagal nerve runs from top to bottom. But whatever, have it your way.

23:30ChrissyOn the next day, which was Wednesday, they decided they were going to move her back up to a recovery floor. Now granted, she never changed. She never came back at, never at all. Didn't return to baseline, not even a slight bit. So they bring her up there, they hook her up to the machines, and I start to notice that like her heart rhythm is bad. It's going like really low, really high.

23:58ChrissyShe's having, you know, Moments where she's not breathing. They're still giving her seizure meds this whole time. And I start to ask them, I said, what are you giving her? You know, I know that we did, you know, certain meds as rescue, but what are you still giving her? And they list off like Depakote and Keppra. And I said, did you not read her chart? It specifically states, do not give these to her.

24:25ChrissyShe has a bad response to them. Well, their response was, these are the only things that are working. And I said, no, they're not working because working would be finding the problem. And they just, they fought me. They fought me the whole time. I'm battling with guns drawn and no one wants to listen. So Wednesday, you know, they did a CT and they agreed to a CT. That was all they would agree to.

24:59ChrissySo they did the CT scan and, you know, they're like, okay, well, we'll let you know when we find out. They didn't let me know anything on Wednesday. I go back in on Thursday, and as they're doing their morning rounds, the charge doctor or whatever, the doctor in charge of the blue team is standing there giving everybody the rundown of what's going on. And as they're talking, I'm listening intently, and she says, well, the CTs had some findings.

25:33ChrissyThat they chalked it up to movement. And I'm like, excuse me, wait a minute. My child is not even going to flinch, pinch her, try. She didn't move. And they're like, well, we didn't, we didn't, you know, account it to anything. And I'm like, well, that's unfair because you found something and you're denying it. So like the reason I'm pushing for this MRI is because Dandy Walker can cause edema or swelling of the, um, Sarah Bellum on the back of the brain and cause brain stem issues.

26:06ChrissySo they didn't want to listen about that.

26:12ChrissySo after they do their rounds, they all leave. And, you know, I'm still pushing for this MRI, but they left. And, you know, I had many conversations with some doctors and Fought them and they denied me and told me that they wanted to do more seizure meds and more seizure meds and this and that and they were ignoring the GI track and you know not reading her file and that this was a trigger and it was sad it was truly sad she was a vegetable we had to start doing suctioning on Thursday because she couldn't move her secretions anymore And there was risk for pneumonia because she just wasn't moving, could barely do anything, lost all of her muscle control.

27:05ChrissySo I went home and came back Friday morning. When I came back, there was significant swelling in her left side of her brain to the point where her head was deformed. And all of her left extremities were suffering from severe edema from top to bottom. And I called the doctor in and they saw it and they're like, well, you know, this is a possible side effect of IV fluids on all these sedatives.

27:44ChrissyOkay, fine. Then once I'm done talking to the doctor, I'm suctioning her and I'm venting her G-tube and I start to get blood, bright red blood. And I pushed the nurse call button and as soon as the nurse came in, she coded. And not in the way you would think where somebody would stop having a heart rate, but to the point where her heart was beating over 200 beats per minute and her respirations were in the hundreds.

28:17ChrissyThey pushed the code and no one came. And still no one came. It was probably 15, 20 minutes before anybody came in the room and they were in the next room down the hall. They didn't come. And when they came in, they were like, oh, this is bad. The house supervisor was like, why is this kid on our floor? She's in no condition to be on this floor.

28:46ChrissyShe needs to go back to ICU. You know, they start doing all these lung treatments on her. And they got her stable, but then they took her down to ICU again. And I said, I want the MRI and I want it now. And the doctor's like, well, I just, you know, we have to do it under sedation. I'm like, if you're going to refuse, I'm going to make you sign a letter of refusal to treat this child.

29:15ChrissyYou know, I'm sick and tired of being told no. So far, you haven't figured out why this is happening. And you're telling me that I'm wrong and that your meds are going to save the day. As soon as I threatened her, she had a meeting with everyone and She's like, I want to sedate her. And I said, over my dead body, are you going to sedate my child any more than she already is?

29:40ChrissyShe's not going to move. And, you know, she's like, well, I just, I don't agree with them. I'm like, don't you remember what happened when she was in surgery on Tuesday? She goes, oh, yeah, I forgot about that. I'm like, yeah, so you're going to give her more sedatives. That makes a whole lot of sense. Why don't you just go ahead and kill her? I mean, that's what you guys are trying to do.

30:00ChrissySo,

30:03ChrissyThey did get the MRI done and it showed that her entire left side of her brain was twice the size it should be and that there was some pressure in her facial nerves and her brain stem from the swelling and so while we were in ICU you know I was like we have to stop these seizures and we can't use your drugs like you need to Look into the GI track and they were like, okay, fine, we'll do one x-ray.

30:35ChrissyAnd the x-ray tech said there was no significant findings. And so I proceeded to walk up to the doctor and I said, show me the x-rays because I call bullshit. And when I looked, there was so much stool in there and it was so hard from all the narcotics that they had given her. There was no way in hell she was going to pass it. Like, No way.

30:59ChrissyAnd she hadn't gone in a week by this point. And that can be devastating to her just in general. So I insisted on them doing back to back to back enemas. And as soon as they started to listen to me and they did these things, she started to come back out. And I'm like, all right, that's a good thing. And then they continued to listen to me and she got more stable.

31:27ChrissyThey moved us up to the recovery floor with her actually sitting up and, you know, open eyes and playing with toys on Saturday. So that was, it was a beautiful thing to see. They were still giving her the drugs and you could definitely see the effect on her and it was, it was tragic. But she was coming back. So I went home Saturday night, came back Sunday morning and everything seemed to be okay.

31:57ChrissyUntil she popped her foot out from the covers and I noticed this giant blister. And I asked her dad, I said, what happened? The nurse had used a heel warmer pack and one of the normal like pamper diapers. She got water in it and she microwaved it and wrapped it around her foot. Causing a second degree burn.

32:28ChrissySo needless to say, I made that a very short day. I went to the charge nurse and I said, I'm out. I'm done. We're going home. But shortly after, like two days after we got home, they called Child Protective Services on me because they said I was not giving her her cannabis medicine. They called on me because I wasn't giving her the medicine prescribed by all prescribing doctors.

32:58ChrissyWhich is absurd. But I dealt with that. Now she's suffering from pancreatitis very severely. Three causes for pancreatitis are pharmaceutical medication, fats and sugars, and alcohol. So which one do you think it is?

33:26ChrissySo, yeah. I don't know what else you want me to say.

33:31Etienne FontanSo you've been a very strong mother through this. How have you been able to find your inner strength to tow this road because you're going up against doctors, nurses, and establishment just trying to protect your child, which you have stated to us has only suffered abuse after abuse, pharmaceutical abuse, burn abuse, nurse abuse.

34:00Etienne FontanHow do you find the inner strength to go on and fight this?

34:04ChrissyI guess the way I see it is if she can do it, then I have to. I mean, she's my inspiration. She is stronger than I'll ever be. And I guess I take it from her. I have to be her voice when she has none. And there frankly is no other option.

34:28Etienne FontanYou're an amazing, tough woman. Much respect.

34:31ChrissyThank you.

34:34Etienne FontanWell, we never sometimes want the things that have been thrust upon us in life. And we have to find our own way. And you've had to find your own way. So where is your own way taking you currently?

34:51ChrissyWell, where's my own way taking me? I am going to... Try to take down Children's. Children's Hospital? Yes, and the nurse.

35:07ChrissyBecause it's not the first time they have almost killed my kid.

35:12ChrissyAnd it's going to be the last.

35:15Etienne FontanHave you found a lawyer and a counselor that will help you?

35:19ChrissyWell, I thought I did, but he hasn't contacted me yet. And I don't know if that's just because he's not getting a response. Or it's taking time. I mean, he said he was all for it, but you know, the hard thing is, is there so many foul play moves in this? And I can only focus on one because it's clear as a bell. Like there's no ifs, ands, or buts that the nurse burned my child out of negligence.

35:54ChrissyAnd you know, I'm hearing now, like working with the GI doctors, they're saying a lot of things that they're coming across. And this kind of baffles me as they're saying that they're hearing a lot of things of kids getting pancreatitis that are using cannabis. And I said, how does that make any sense? Don't you think my child would have had pancreatitis a long time ago, considering she's been on it for four years?

36:23ChrissyAnd they're speculating and stating that this is becoming a questionable cause to more episodes of pancreatitis in the pediatric world. And I don't understand that. I don't even see how that's even right because the human body has all the proper receptors and the systems to handle cannabis But then you have to factor in, you know, like, I tried to tell them, they gave my child a lethal dose of benzodiazepines.

37:01ChrissyLike, benzodiazepines, we all know, are one of the most addictive drugs on the market. And the withdrawals from it alone can kill you. And I don't understand.

37:16Etienne FontanWhere are you located, Kristen?

37:18ChrissyI'm in Broomfield, Colorado.

37:21Etienne FontanOkay, so you're in Colorado. So you're finding the Children's Hospital there in Colorado. So we need to find you. Hey, people, we need to help find her a lawyer there in Colorado to actually help her. With this case, do you have a co-fund me pager? Have you started anything like that for financial support in this type of litigation, which you're going to need? Because you weren't here earlier, but I just spent the last five years fighting the federal government.

37:48Etienne FontanAnd sister, it is not cheap. It costs a lot of money to actually fight the system, even when you're right. And in the end, I was right. But needless to say, it costs ungodly amounts of money. You're going to need some support beyond just the pat on the back.

38:08BubblemanPeople in the chat right now are asking if there's a GoFundMe or a way to support or contribute.

38:16ChrissyI don't have one yet.

38:17SpeakerI haven't even thought that far. This all started because we had great progress and then you go in for... You know, a routine on some hardware that's a medical device that's installed and now, besides that portion, now she's not, she's also not the same. She's not, she's not, she digressed. She's having, she's having quite a few seizures still and she only, you know, part of that story is where she got her, she got her child back and thank God that, Children's Hospital did not take her under, but now that she's back, she's not really the same.

39:02SpeakerAnd part of this conversation was sparked because they were trying to, if you heard her, they were trying to take her child away for not giving the cannabis to her. Because ultimately they realized, well, maybe this thing is really working for her.

39:17Etienne FontanWhich is the first time I've ever heard of such a thing.

39:19SpeakerYeah. Yep. And so they... Do you have a primary doctor which supports cannabis use?

39:28ChrissyOh, yeah.

39:28SpeakerYeah.

39:29ChrissyThat's the other thing. I got forced out of my pediatric office that I had been with for 13 years. They basically just stopped talking to me, won't transfer her file. They, between then and children, they're the ones that called Child Protective Services. And, uh, It's really like I just had to call the neurosurgeon who lied to me and I'd call him on Friday because the leads to her VNS that he didn't replace are starting to actually pull on her flesh and they have since he replaced the battery.

40:11ChrissyBut now that she's starting to gain weight, it's pulling even further away and she's at status again. But I refuse to go back to children's. I absolutely refuse. So I've had to weed myself out of all those doctors, including our ENT doctor, who is a phenomenal person. And she has a tumor in her ear that we're supposed to be watching every six months. He won't work with us.

40:36Etienne FontanChrissy, can you check your audio real quick and make sure your mic isn't hitting something? We're getting a lot of static on you. So just because you were speaking very clearly earlier, but the last couple of sentences have been choppy.

40:48BubblemanIs it better?

40:48Etienne FontanThat's much better.

40:50BubblemanBetter the minute Todd left. If everyone just keeps their mics muted, if there's a mic not muted while she's talking, we get that static noise. So we'll just make sure you're muted while she's talking. Thanks, everybody.

41:02SpeakerAnd one of the questions that she brought up, the reason why I wanted her on Hashtag One to obviously get some support, I told her I would contribute funds to this as well. And I think getting the GoFund would be good, but the doctors, and this is something that I really wanted to bring to the panel because we hadn't, we talk about different side effects of cannabis and different things.

41:24SpeakerAnd maybe this is a question for Mark or some of the other people on the Scaldone and some of the other ones that are on the panel. I don't know who we have today.

41:33SpeakerBut have you ever heard of cannabis causing the pancreatitis?

41:38MarkWell, one of the things I definitely have heard of, and I know that Naya had this, Naya was the girl who has Dravet's Syndrome in Pittsburgh and has to travel to Colorado to get her medicine. And we had Jessica, her mom, on Bubble Man, maybe like about a year ago. She had a very, very similar issue Thank you so much for joining us.

42:32MarkA Charlotte Figge kind of success story. This girl has got her life back again. Doesn't need the stimulators anymore to keep her from having seizures. But I know that Jessica went through that same thing where when Naya went through a growth spurt, and that's why I asked what the age was, that during those growth years, yeah, their bodies are growing so big that, yeah, I guess where they initially put the implants, it's no longer effective.

43:03MarkIs that what the issue is?

43:03ChrissyWell, they had it above her pectoral muscle before. And then because of her age and because of cosmetic or whatever, he said he put it in the armpit. And he didn't replace the leads. And the leads are the same ones from when she was like toddler size.

43:20MarkShe was young, yeah. And so that's, yeah, it's ridiculous, right?

43:24ChrissyAnd they're, I mean, they're so tight that they actually lift her skin. And I was like, well, that's probably why she's status again and never came back to baseline because I've been giving her the cannabis the whole time and she should have came back to me once that vagal nerve stimulator started working. And there was a little bit of time, like maybe a month where she actually did.

43:49ChrissyAnd she was still having, you know, one or two little seizures a day, but now she's nonstop, like nonstop. And they're different seizures. They're all in her eyes.

43:58MarkSublingual drops that she's getting here, or is she following a capsule?

44:05ChrissyShe's doing the sublingual.

44:07MarkOkay. And what are the ratios of these products, Tony?

44:15SpeakerShe's taking the non-active three-to-one, which is a raw blend of... She's got Lemon Remedy, Sour Tsunami, ACDC, Harlequin in that peak.

44:28MarkYeah, tell me what the cannabinoids are. That's all fine in there.

44:32SpeakerThree to one. Three to one. Three to one what? I don't know. Three to one what?

44:35MarkCBDA to THCA. Okay, CBDA to THCA. Okay, so it's not activated in a sublingual drop?

44:45SpeakerNo, and then she also has a P5, which is an activated CBD that we use to blend. So it's the same three-to-one now that this has been activated? No, no, no. The three-to-one raw has been the same for four years. This is the one that's greatly helped her. And then I gave her also a fully activated pure CBD P5 to blend with that because we were trying to, Trying to find a different balance, and I think that there's a serious complication with the hardware that's in there, the medical device.

45:25ChrissyI know there is. That's why her dad and I made an executive decision. We're going to take her to a different pediatric hospital tomorrow. With different neurologists and neurosurgeons because I can't go back to children's. The way that that neurosurgeon treated me on Friday once he realized who I was, I've never wanted to hurt someone so bad before in my life.

45:49MarkYeah, Chrissy, someone was saying in the chat, you may want to reach out to Warren Edson, who's an attorney in Denver. I know he's also a faculty member at Cloverleaf, but I'm not sure what his office is in Denver. Tony, do you know where he is?

46:04SpeakerUm, yeah, no, I think actually Christy knows Warren, don't you?

46:08MarkOh, okay, okay. Have you ever, I thought you did, I thought you knew him. You were looking for legal representation now? Yep. Yeah, so Warren might be, that's a good discussion to have.

46:22SpeakerIt's a very good idea. It's a very good idea to seek a second opinion. That's what you're doing now. What about the pancreatitis? That's what we wanted to know.

46:34MarkThat's very odd to me because, again, I think we all know that the fat-soluble antioxidants that the cannabinoids are actually protect the pancreas. This is sort of like that delicate biological switch that we were talking about last week

46:52MarkWhat was her name? Dr. Natasha, yeah. So again, having activity in the pancreas and certainly, I mean, the pancreas is one of those organs that typically when you find out that there's cancer or there's something gone wrong there, sometimes it's too late. And there is, again, a role that cannabinoids play in protecting the pancreas. So the pancreatitis is interesting. I don't understand. That and I'd have to go look in the literature at what's known about that.

47:28SpeakerHas anybody checked the baby's blood sugar?

47:33ChrissyEverything has been checked very thoroughly. We did extensive blood pull, all kinds of panels. Everything is good. The pancreas is actually starting to heal slowly. It's been eight weeks now.

47:49MarkSo does she have any other GI symptoms?

47:53ChrissyWell, I mean, she has a horrible GI tract. She was born with a diaphragmatic hernia and has malrotation, which has all been beautifully repaired. And it's as good as it's going to get. And it's really healthy. So I know that the cannabis has, you know, been doing its job because I'm using the juice, plus I'm using the sublinguals, and everything else is beautiful. The only thing is like when we went into the hospital in the beginning of September, the pancreatitis was, you know, like the normal range of numbers is from like 20 to, what was it, 203.

48:36ChrissyShe was at 1780. And they said, this has been going on for months. So that tells me that when they gave her all those meds, that's what irritated her pancreas.

48:49MarkMm-hmm, mm-hmm.

48:51ChrissyBecause it was severe. It was very severe.

48:55SpeakerThey're trying to pass the blame on the cannabis for that. And I mean, everything I looked at was, you know, the use of exact narcotics that she was using.

49:05MarkDoes she have a well-rounded diet? I mean, what else does she, I mean, is she normally and everything else is normal in terms of what she intakes into her body?

49:15ChrissyThe only other thing that I'm suspecting as a culprit that adds to the narcotic factor is that she's on a GMO owned Nestle product. That's her high calorie formula. It's a supplement, but when she eats by mouth, when she's allowed to, I puree everything myself. And I was starting to add whey protein isolate into her diet, calcium, magnesium, you know, vitamin supplements in like the best purest form I could.

49:49ChrissyAnd now I can't do any of that until the numbers are better.

49:53MarkSo she's not getting any animal protein, any animal protein at all?

50:00ChrissyThe protein that she's getting is in the formula, and I can't guarantee it's good stuff at all.

50:04SpeakerYeah, talk about that formula, because that formula was really interesting when you told it to me.

50:10ChrissyWell, it's a peptamine, and it's made by Nestle, but it's 34% peptamine.

50:20MarkCan you tell me what it's called again?

50:21ChrissyIt's peptamine. Okay. It's 34% fat.

50:29ChrissyAnd the sugar content is through the roof. It's like 86 grams of sugar. Fuck.

50:38MarkJohn.

50:39ChrissyYeah, I've been trying to get it out of her life.

50:42MarkAnd how often does she get this?

50:44ChrissyWell, that's all she's getting right now.

50:46MarkThat's all she's getting right now. Okay, okay.

50:49ChrissyYeah, but it's not going into the stomach. It's going into the G, into the small intestine.

50:57ChrissySo we had to bypass her stomach completely to help her survive.

51:06SpeakerSo they tapped this in past the pyloric valve, did they?

51:10ChrissyYeah, it's in the duodenum or something.

51:13SpeakerDuodenum? Duodenum. Duodenum. Duodenum.

51:16ChrissyThere you go.

51:16SpeakerIt depends if you're in England, they say it the other way, but okay.

51:21ChrissyYeah, however you say it. The small intestine, that's where it's at.

51:27SpeakerWhat does she look like and act like after you feed her that? How does it change her demeanor or how she is reacting?

51:39ChrissyA lot of times, well before, when she used to drink through a bottle, the same formula, and she would always get extremely tired when she was consuming it. But when I would feed her pureed foods, she would be Okay. Okay. Okay.

52:27ChrissyI'll research it myself too and see.

52:33SpeakerThat word's kind of a misnomer. They say blood panel, but actually it just means they're going to look at a certain number of things which makes up a panel. That doesn't mean that they're going to go over every possible aspect of the blood. Yes. Unfortunately.

52:50ChrissyWell, and I did have them do like kidneys, liver, all of that. Like I made sure that we did a process of elimination through blood testing to see if anything was elevated, like the thyroid or, you know, the renal function, if there was any indication of kidney failure. I had them test for diabetes just in case.

53:14SpeakerWell, you know, metabolic syndrome is a couple of steps before diabetes. And the thing that set me off on it was when you said she gets tired when she's taking it. And that means that her body is using the energy to deal with it. And it's taking it away. It's taking circulation away from her brain area and to digest this stuff. And so she's getting tired and wanting to go to sleep.

53:41SpeakerSo I'm just saying I would be suspicious that she might be also suffering from metabolic syndrome, but all the other stuff is overwhelming it and they're not looking for that because they're so focused on all the rest of the other stuff. And that's something that happens in hospitals. People get blinders on and they start finger pointing and looking rather than reevaluating what's actually going on. And unfortunately, also in Western medicine, they start reacting by trying to suppress the symptoms rather than to find out what's underlying cause.

54:25ChrissyThat is truly the worst thing about normal medicine. That's what the benzodiazepines that you're referring to are exactly doing. They're short-circuiting the pain mechanism in the brain.

54:36MarkMm-hmm.

54:45SpeakerWell, and they think once they've anesthetized you, they sort of walk away from it. I mean, you're quiet now, so you're not complaining anymore. Look, my dad died from bone cancer in the hospital, and I was there with him for the last 16 weeks. And I caught... A couple of times a night nurse coming in and he had a port in his chest that they were giving him morphine in.

55:10SpeakerAnd I was always there during the day modulating how they gave him that shot. But one of the night nurses came in and stuck that in the port and pushed that needle as hard as she could. But dad just instantaneously lost consciousness. And I went right down to the hospital office and told the guy, I says, hey, you've got a... Florence Nightingale up there on the fourth floor that gave a shot in a manner that scared me to death and put my dad under immediately.

55:40SpeakerAnd, you know, it was one of those angels of death type nurses I felt. And unfortunately, there's people like that as well. And a lot of them are there doing a job and you don't have that many who are healers there. You have people who are doing a job. You got to look for somebody who's a healer. You got to look for compassion and understanding to help deal with this baby's problem.

56:02ChrissyAnd that's pretty hard to find nowadays. I did come across two people in the children's hospital experience and that was it. Just two.

56:12SpeakerThat's just one. Well, I give you my best possible wishes and I hope for the best and forget the rest.

56:24ChrissyYeah, that's kind of my motto too, but I expect the worst and hope for the best.

56:30SpeakerThis is also a mother who's learned how to grow cannabis in her backyard in Denver for the juicing as well. Just very motivated. I'm going to end up sending her some bubble bags because she was trying to juice, but she's got a 10-footer.

56:46MarkTony, do you know Alan Shackelford, Dr. Shackelford?

56:52MarkMaybe send, maybe Chrissy her, his contact information. I mean, Doc Shackelford is again one of, you know, John, you spoke about the, you know, the angels of death. He's an angel of life, Doc Shackelford. Maybe Doc Shackelford could help you out, Chrissy. I don't know. I feel bad about your story. It's a condemnation of the whole medical system. It's horrible. I'm Thank you so much for joining us.

57:45SpeakerAnd they keep, otherwise they tell you if you get involved emotionally, it'll tear you up. And so you have to distance yourself from them that way. And it's sad because can you heal somebody if you distance yourself from them emotionally? I just don't, I don't understand the thought at all myself. I worked in free hospital in India for years. And the people come and they need healing.

58:12SpeakerThat's what they're there for. They don't want to go through anything else. Your baby deserves the best that every single person who sees her can possibly give. And it certainly doesn't sound like that's what's happened to you thus far, which is why it's a really good idea for you to go someplace else. Because that'll give you a contrast about what's going on. If you go to the second people and they gave you the same exact story that the first people did, at least you will have done the best you can to find out what's going on.

58:48ChrissyWell, I tried to tell the neurosurgeon that I had a gut instinct. And he said, well, I can't do anything for you based upon your gut instinct. And I said, it's never been wrong. And you were wrong.

59:02SpeakerHe was wrong. Those guys don't admit to being wrong. It's a dangerous spot for them to say I was wrong. They don't really admit it very often.

59:14ToddNo, they don't.

59:15MarkAnd a mother's instinct is usually correct.

59:20BubblemanYeah, I said that earlier to Hillary. The mother's instinct. It's amazing that the hospital doesn't put more importance in that instinct of the mother instead of alienating them and undermining that instinct by being like, we're the doctors. You don't really know what you're talking about. Don't worry. We got this.

59:36SpeakerThey'll throw you out of the room when they're treating a baby or a family member. The doctors will Put you right out of the rooms because they don't.

59:45MarkColorado has taken the lead on so many fronts, you know, so many fronts. Colorado has basically set the stage for this is how you do it. And it's just really disheartening to think that Children's Hospital is full of a bunch of big pharma tools that still are in the dark ages when it comes to using cannabis. To treat situations like this, you were lied to.

1:00:11SpeakerThey lied to her and said that they had many cases of patients with pancreatitis from cannabis.

1:00:17MarkWhere is it in the literature? I googled it. I didn't see anything. I'll still look for it. Believe me, if it's out there, Tony, we need to know about it and we should communicate it. You think Children's Hospital in Denver would take a more leadership role? I can't wait for... This to come to Pennsylvania because the Pennsylvania hospitals are not standing still. They're issuing eight R&D licenses.

1:00:42MarkWe have some of the best hospitals in the world in Pennsylvania. I can't wait. For Children's Hospital in Philadelphia to maybe step up to the plate, we're here. Children's Hospital at Denver has fallen short. This is really horrible to hear.

1:00:56SpeakerAlso, too, whoever told you that cannabis is causing pancreatitis, demand that that person shows you references.

1:01:05MarkRight. In the peer-reviewed literature where other bright scientists and doctors looked at the data and the data is validated, Have you ever heard of that sound? No.

1:01:16SpeakerI never have. I'm not saying it's impossible, but I've never heard of it.

1:01:23ChrissyYeah. Sounds like... I thought. I told them. I was like, that doesn't make any sense to me. It would have been way sooner that this happened.

1:01:32MarkIf anyone can protect you from pancreatitis because, again, the fat-soluble antioxidants are going to get in there and quench reactive radicals that cause all kinds of damage in the pancreas. I think that it's actually just the opposite. It's like saying that cannabis kills brain cells or cannabis causes glaucoma. Bullshit.

1:01:55SpeakerWell, and if they say it's true, they've got to have papers to back up.

1:02:01MarkYeah, and I'll be the first to admit that, you know, okay, yes, there's documented cases, but if there were documented cases, why wouldn't we know about it? Why wouldn't Ethan Russo know about it? Why wouldn't the leaders in our industry know about it? It's bullshit. It's crap.

1:02:21SpeakerWell, you know, a lot of medical people do the same thing that cops do. They make up the rules as they go. And they look at the baby, they're lost, they don't know what to say about it, and then they go, you've been giving it cannabis. That's what I thought. That's probably what it is. The cannabis has irritated the baby. And, you know, everybody on this planet wants to be an expert.

1:02:47SpeakerAnd people don't like The idea that they couldn't be right. And so egos will often weigh in over reality. And you got to be careful. Hi, Natasha. And so you got to be careful. Ask her. Hi, guys. Yeah, that's Natasha. So I've been listening. What did you want to ask me specifically? Why does cannabis cause pancreatitis? Um, so, okay, so there are some case reports showing that, uh, and I mean these are case reports where it's not necessarily proven, but they're thinking that, uh, they're associating cannabis use with pancreatitis, and this is, again, Something really rare.

1:03:39SpeakerI think there's only five case reports. And it seems to be more they're connecting it with THC. But I also want to say that there's also a lot of evidence that cannabinoids are very protective for the pancreas also. So again, this is confusing. There's not a lot known. But I just want to point out that there are some case reports where THC specifically they're calling out. I mean, again, this is...

1:04:08SpeakerLike a lot of these.

1:04:09ChrissyCan I ask a question? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it came to my head. Are these cases of kids with pancreatitis also on pharmaceutical meds for their epilepsy at the same time?

1:04:20SpeakerWell, and that's the thing.

1:04:20ChrissyAnd do you think that the THC is forcing out these chemicals that they're being given, and those are the culprit as a secondary cause?

1:04:30SpeakerYeah, the case reports, there's none with children. They're all with adults. They tend to be adults in the range of 24 to 30. So there is nothing with children. And I agree that from what you're reporting, it seems to be Most likely due to the pharmaceutical meds that the child is on. But again, I need to say I'm not a medical doctor. I'm a researcher. So I can look and see what the literature says.

1:05:01SpeakerAnd I can't make that claim to say is it the cannabis or isn't the cannabis. But I just heard you guys talking and I just wanted to point out that there are some case reports. That being said, there's also a lot of preliminary work showing how protective and beneficial cannabinoids are for pancreatic cells. So again, this is complex. But something that I can speak a little bit about with regards to your daughter is the constipation issues.

1:05:33SpeakerAnd I looked a little bit about the nutrient supplements, so Peptamine that she's on. And one of the things I noticed is it's very high in whey protein, so milk protein. And I know you had said she was having a lot of issues with constipation. So I just put together a nice write-up for one of my friends who was also having a lot of issues with his son with constipation.

1:05:57SpeakerSo some of the things that I recommended or just Thank you so much for joining us.

1:06:18SpeakerWhen they replace cow milk with soy milk or something like that they can get rid of some of the constipation issues and it seems to be the whey protein specifically that can cause some constipation issues so that may be something you want to discuss with the health care providers and looking at different supplements and juices or sorry not juices but like Meal replacements, there we go, for her to consume.

1:06:47SpeakerAnd another thing with constipation to really look into is magnesium. So I'm not sure if you, where you live, but for instance, in Vancouver, in the surrounding area, normally our water contains magnesium, but in Vancouver, Our water is really low naturally in magnesium and just generally lots of people are deficient in magnesium. It's found mostly in things with green leafy vegetables. So anything with green chlorophyll has a magnesium compound attached to that.

1:07:17SpeakerAnd so a lot of people just don't generally get enough magnesium And when you don't get enough magnesium, constipation is a big side effect. In fact, for some people, if they take too much magnesium, they actually get diarrhea. So there's different ways to take magnesium. So foods are, again, green leafy vegetables. Magnesium citrate is a good supplement. I can email you some more information about that. And another thing is Epsom salt baths.

1:07:44SpeakerThank you so much for joining us.

1:08:00SpeakerAbsorb some through the bath. And this is also really good just for muscle pain and general just discomfort. Magnesium bath is really nice. And then some other things with constipation, obviously fiber, but what happens when some people get constipated is you throw on a lot of fiber too quickly and this can make the gut freak out basically and further lead to more bloating and more distension and more discomfort and more pain.

1:08:29SpeakerSo what is good is if you're going to increase fibers is to do so very slowly. And one of the best fibers, natural fibers, is prunes. So prune juice or Thank you for joining us today.

1:09:02SpeakerThank you for joining us today.

1:09:27SpeakerIf you take too much too fast, it can make your gut bacteria go crazy and they'll create a lot of gas and your stomach will hurt. So with flaxseed, it's so powerful to get the fiber processes in your bacteria going Just start with like a little teaspoon, like small amounts and see how the body responds to that. And then another thing is just oils. So an old treatment for constipation used to be to take castor oil, drinking it.

1:09:56SpeakerI wouldn't recommend that. What actually, our mineral oil is another one. I wouldn't recommend that either, but there's been a clinical trial showing that if you take little bits of flaxseed oil or olive oil, it's just as effective as they call them castor oil packs. Don't do that. So small amounts of oil. And so the oil can do a few things, but it just gets your gut muscles and things working properly again.

1:10:23SpeakerI'm just trying to think. Oh, another really important one is exercise. So there's been a few trials. So not necessarily running or working, but breathing exercises, stomach exercises, massage. Indra, I'm sure you've got some pressure points that may be of use. And even just like getting into that habit of doing a stomach massage and then another big thing with constipation as everyone knows is stress and anxiety and especially for kids if like going to the bathroom becomes a really big deal they can feel that whole stress and anxiety and if they're feeling clenched up and tight it's going to be harder to go to the washroom so even simple things like having music playing when it's bathroom time, having Like essential oils like sweet orange and lavender are safe for children.

1:11:09SpeakerThey smell really nice. They need to be diluted properly. But having those just aromas in the air can actually make going to the washroom easier. And then finally, the thing I wanted to mention is this thing I recommend everyone get it. It's called the Squatty Potty. I'm not sure if she's at the stage of using a toilet by herself at this age, but what the squatty potty is, is it's basically a foot stool and it goes, I'll send the link to it.

1:11:37SpeakerYou can also use like a box or something like just to put your feet up. But what it does is it puts your feet up into an angle where your body's actually in a natural squatting position. And what happens is when you're sitting on a toilet, the way your feet are, there's like a part of your stool of your, sorry, your colon that stays on. Thank you for joining us today.

1:12:09SpeakerSo I'll send the link. If you Google it, it's called the Squatty Potty. You can actually buy this stool. It's like a nice little white stool that just sits by your toilet. But all of these things together, like constipation is a very, very complex issue and it seems silly, but if you can figure that out, that's a huge, and as you said, that can be part of the trigger to the seizures also.

1:12:31SpeakerSo just some simple things to figure that out can help. Hey, Natasha, don't you think eating pot seeds, which are about 50% oil, is like taking oil to help with the constipation? And the other thing I was going to mention is that position, that crow position, putting the feet up high and the knees up. It realigns your pelvis properly. It's like when you're standing. If your pelvis is tilted forward, you're probably going to be constipated.

1:13:02SpeakerIf your pelvis is tilted back, you're probably going to be constipated. If your pelvis isn't exactly at the right level, your intestines, which wind down in a spiral down to your exit point, if they're in one way or the other, it's going to affect because the intestines themselves have very weak peristaltic action. And so having good posture has a lot to do with it. Even laying down posture, having a sleeping position that's complimentary to it so that your guts aren't working too hard at night.

1:13:38SpeakerAll those things figure into it as well.

1:13:41Etienne FontanI've had a squatty potty for a couple of years now and I love it. I honestly, that realignment, I first got exposed to that kind of alignment when I went to Saudi Arabia and I got to see that there's just holes in the ground with just straddle points. There's no toilet. So you had no choice but to learn how to squat. So I also learned how that natural alignment was better that way as well.

1:14:06Etienne FontanBeen a fan of it, so I highly recommend it. Testimonial.

1:14:15SpeakerHas anyone, I'm not sure if you guys talked about this yet, but has anyone mentioned anything about a ketogenic diet for epilepsy and seizures?

1:14:23BubblemanI don't believe so yet, nope.

1:14:30SpeakerSo what a ketogenic diet is, is a really low sugar diet. So it contains high protein, high fat. There's some forms of epilepsy that respond really well to this.

1:14:45SpeakerI can share some literature, but I'm not sure if you've had any experience with that, but I can send you some info about that also. They also are, there's some clinical trials exploring it as a treatment for people with brain tumors also, and they find that when they really reduce the sugar, the brain starts, basically it's kind of the theories behind people following like the Atkins diet and those really, what is the recent one called?

1:15:16SpeakerPaleo, sorry, the paleo diet. So those are the high meat, high fat diets, but really, really low sugar to the point that they don't even eat most fruits anymore because they contain too much sugar. I don't know if you need to go that extreme, but there are, there's some good data for how it shifts your metabolism and helps with fat burning. But there's also some really interesting data showing that it can help with seizures and the brain.

1:15:42SpeakerSo I can send you some literature on that.

1:15:50BubblemanNot sure if Etienne realized he was muted there.

1:15:56SpeakerI like it once in a while when it goes to crickets.

1:15:59ChrissyCan you hear me?

1:16:01SpeakerYes, we can hear you.

1:16:02ChrissySorry, I had baby screaming, so I muted it.

1:16:09ChrissyAre we good now?

1:16:11Etienne FontanYou're doing fine.

1:16:12ChrissyOkay.

1:16:13Etienne FontanI was cheering.

1:16:17ChrissySorry.

1:16:18MarkGo ahead.

1:16:19ChrissyI actually, that information, I've been doing a ton of research. So I have been finding out a lot of that stuff. And we use the juice to make the bowels work better. So the cannabis juice really makes her system work perfectly. So, but I am switching over to, I'm doing a calcium magnesium supplement. And the formula, she's severely allergic to dairy. And that was the only one at the time when we started it many years ago that didn't actually have like milk, milk in it.

1:17:04ChrissyIt had the whey protein, which I know it's crap. It has to be an isolate to be anything worth anything. So I have been doing a ton, ton of research To try and get her off of the Nestle product and make my own formula for her. So there's some things in there I didn't know and I will look into them. I appreciate that info. I am also sorry about the baby crying.

1:17:34BubblemanOh, please don't be. I was just going to say it makes me happy and warm inside. I miss my baby. I'm away from home right now and it's a good job.

1:17:45SpeakerI could make some protein isolate for you from marijuana seeds. Mark, what was the number on the protein isolate I made for you?

1:17:53BubblemanOh, it was 62% protein powder isolate. It was like 12% higher than the company that was bragging about having the highest in the world. Oh. Yeah, yeah, his stuff. How I knew that John was legitimate, because I meet people on the internet all the time, Chrissy, and John is an amazing resource, and anything that he offers you, I would absolutely take him up on, because it'll just be of the utmost highest quality that you couldn't even go and purchase anywhere.

1:18:25ChrissyOkay, what's the caloric intake on that?

1:18:30BubblemanI'm not too sure, actually. I can find out. The research is for sure there. I'll go and search out on a few of the different companies and what they're saying in regards to their 50% protein powder isolate.

1:18:46ChrissyOkay, yeah, because the one I got, we researched it pretty thoroughly, and it's only 110 calories per 8 ounces, and I need to get her to at least 2200 a day.

1:19:03ChrissySo that's my goal.

1:19:08BubblemanWe'll absolutely find out for you.

1:19:10ChrissyOkay. That'd be great. That'd be great.

1:19:14BubblemanYou still here with us, Tony?

1:19:19ChrissyIt looks like he is, but he's muted.

1:19:20SpeakerYes. No, I am. I'm listening to the whole thing. I absolutely am. And she's, Christy, how many kids do you actually have? You have like three, don't you?

1:19:30ChrissyI have four.

1:19:32SpeakerFour. Four children. Not an easy battle.

1:19:43SpeakerYeah, I think you should set up a GoFundMe and I think Cash Church could help you on many platforms. Hopefully today you're able to get some of the answers on what you're asking me. I told you this would be a very good platform for getting that information out there. When people first hear about Hash Church, they don't necessarily know what it means. You know, they kind of giggle at first.

1:20:09SpeakerOh, Hash Church, that sounds so funny. But, you know, there is smoking of hash on the show, but the main reason why it was formed was to bring together leading minds and people that understand the plant and how it works as a medicine. And give good advice where advice is needed and also helping patients along the way. It's the main mission. So hopefully today you got what you wanted out of the group.

1:20:42ChrissyI did. I appreciate it. I do.

1:20:50ChrissyBut I still got to go out there and fight.

1:20:54BubblemanAbsolutely. Well, you have the right, the driving force that's behind you is, it's a strong one. I wouldn't have any doubt in it. It might be the strongest driving force on the planet, a mother and her child.

1:21:11ChrissyI just don't want them to be the cause of her demise. I want it to just be because it's that time, you know, and the The medical world and being in the medical world myself as my profession, I'm ashamed of it. I'm absolutely ashamed of the other nurses and doctors and their integrity does not exist. Their compassion is gone. They have this holier than thou and I am mighty mentality and it sickens me because they're not here to save.

1:21:46ChrissyThey're here to make change. You know, put a band-aid on it and send you out the door because they don't want to deal with you. Like, there truly are not very many people out there in that profession anymore who give a crap.

1:21:59SpeakerWell, they don't teach you to be a human in medical school. You have to learn that somewhere else. And going to medical school reduces your humanity in a kind of a way because they browbeat you endlessly and they're From morning until night and then internship is another nightmare yet. And by the time you get out of the whole thing, probably you're not the same person you are when you started in the beginning.

1:22:29SpeakerAnd I know I had that experience myself and it can be a tough scenario. But hey, not everybody that does medicine is to be condemned or bad. There's a bunch of really, really great people out there. There's a bunch of people behind them looking into things for them. It's just that not every doctor can also be up to date. When it comes to that, researchers are probably more up to date than most doctors because researchers are busy looking at the new stuff that comes online every day.

1:23:05SpeakerAnd doctors tend to get so busy in their practice that I've met a number of different colleagues who freely admitted that they were 10 years behind. And so it happens. It's a hard row to hoe. And that's why you get people who are in business doing it. And then you get doctors who are doing it because of love of humanity.

1:23:31ChrissyI have met a few.

1:23:38BubblemanWell, it sounds like you found an angel in Tony for sure.

1:23:43ChrissySure did.

1:23:45BubblemanAbsolutely. I want to take a moment to say hello to my little buddy, Tanner, who's watching right now. Hello there, Piederman, and my beautiful wife, whose birthday it is today. It's the first birthday I've missed in 28 years, and she's watching right now as well. So happy birthday, sweetie.

1:24:02SpeakerHappy birthday, Mrs. Bubble Man.

1:24:06BubblemanThat's it. Yeah, I get to be back with them tomorrow, so.

1:24:11SpeakerAre you going to sing happy birthday?

1:24:15BubblemanWhat's that, John?

1:24:16SpeakerAre you going to sing her happy birthday? I mean, we're all right here. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you.

1:24:41SpeakerHappy birthday, Nick. Happy birthday, Nick. Next time, let's sing it faster. How about a balloon of helium first and then...

1:25:04BubblemanOh my God, that was a super volume happy birthday for real.

1:25:08SpeakerI also wanted to say that Hash Church is dedicated to the advancement of Hashish through the dissemination of information.

1:25:20Etienne FontanI like it.

1:25:21SpeakerI'll buy that.

1:25:23Etienne FontanI'll take it for free.

1:25:26BubblemanThat's awesome. Well, happy birthday, Char. And many, many more. Indeed. Everyone said it was creepy, but I think it was nice.

1:25:40SpeakerNone of us can sing. That's the problem.

1:25:42BubblemanNone of us can sing. Okay, so this isn't the voice. We're understanding this is not the singing.

1:25:51SpeakerNo. It did have Adam's family kind of... We should have snapped along. Nice and creepy.

1:26:02BubblemanNice and creepy. Well, you know what? That's okay because I'm pretty sure that one of the first dates we had, I'm pretty sure we went and saw like the Nightmare on Elm Street. So we've got a bit of a creepy foundation.

1:26:16Etienne FontanThe original?

1:26:19BubblemanNo, it was probably like the third one or something. This was 1989 and I think the original was in 84. Does that make sense?

1:26:32SpeakerI missed them all.

1:26:34BubblemanYou don't know what you're missing out, man. Oh, my son is now saying after the song, my son said to my wife, turn off, mommy.

1:26:50Etienne FontanDaddy's friends creep us out.

1:26:55SpeakerSorry, we didn't mean to creep your family out.

1:27:00Etienne FontanWe meant it with love.

1:27:02BubblemanThank you for watching.

1:27:21BubblemanI will 150% translucently show every payment that came in and give it all to her. I have no problem doing that as well. So any little bit helps for people that are going through this type of hell. I've never, I mean, my heart sank constantly during your story. Oh, she just got bumped out. Maybe she'll come back. My heart sank constantly during her story and I definitely will make a point on donating something.

1:27:47SpeakerYou could really hear the strain and stress and emotion in her voice. It was paramount. She was just barely able to tell the story without breaking down. And it was real heartbreaking listening to her.

1:28:07SpeakerYou know how hard it is to stand up to authority and the doctor and all the rest, especially when your child is involved and you don't want to make a mistake. Oh, I know. I raised four of them. That was one of her things in the story was that she didn't want to, like, it was weird. They had her, she didn't want to give the medicine in that moment because they were doing their own thing.

1:28:37SpeakerAnd she's like, no, I'm not, you know. There's certain liability lines, you know. And then they later came after us. Well, you have to give it to her. It's like just crazy. It's like, no, no, no, we know what we're doing. We're going to drug the shit out of her. We know exactly what we're doing. She needs to be sedated like eight more times. And then in the end, it's kind of like, well, you have to give her the cannabis that she was prescribed.

1:29:00SpeakerOtherwise, child services. It's like, what are you talking about?

1:29:08BubblemanYeah, that's unbelievable.

1:29:10Etienne FontanWell, it's surreal to even hear that because it's the complete opposite. We've heard story after story of, you know, child being taken away from parent because they gave cannabis to. This is the first time I've ever heard of the absolute reversal.

1:29:24ChrissyIt is pretty crazy.

1:29:25Etienne FontanIt's a bizarre world.

1:29:28ChrissyIt baffled me. I was like, why are you here?

1:29:32Etienne FontanAnd... You had to, I mean, be dumbfounded sitting there listening. I mean... What were your initial, take us through that initial reaction because you had to be at normal level and then it had to escalate you at many different levels.

1:29:46ChrissyWell, when she said that it was because I was not giving all prescribed medicine including the cannabis, I said, but I signed a medical release waiver stating that I was going to continue And then the hospital sent some women to ask me to participate in a research study on cannabis. I was like, this should all be like thoroughly documented. You know, like there's a form stating that I was continuing to give it.

1:30:13ChrissyHow is that even, that's not, doesn't make any sense to me. I'm like, I could see that you were here because I was giving her cannabis, but.

1:30:21Etienne FontanWere they saying this off of a test that they had done and they didn't find cannabinoids or something?

1:30:26ChrissyNo, I had gone to a follow-up with her doctor, her old pediatrician, and she was like, so are you giving all the medication? And I said, well, I haven't been able to fill the prescriptions that they prescribed, but I'm still giving her the cannabis. And for some reason, she stated I wasn't giving cannabis. Like, the doctor's office is part of who called Child Protective Services on me.

1:30:53ChrissyI just, I don't understand it.

1:30:57Etienne FontanSo how did you handle when CPS showed up at your door? Because they actually, they came. I know they came.

1:31:02ChrissyOh yeah, she came a couple times and it's not my first time. Because having a special needs child, you become more susceptible to people not agreeing with the way you choose to care for them. And I always have to reiterate, I believe in quality and not quantity. I will not debate my child until she survives longer for my own selfish benefit. You know, I want her to have a happy life.

1:31:26ChrissyAnd The woman was very nice and she said, you know, I have no doubt in my mind that this is just an absurd call, but, you know, I have to follow protocol. And

1:31:38Etienne FontanThankfully, she was educated and at least was responsive to your situation because you have quite an amazing one there because, again, this is the first time I've ever heard of that role reversal where they actually know your child is using cannabis and are leaving you alone. Thankfully, you're in Colorado and that dichotomy has completely shifted. But regardless, that she was educated about it and still responded and left you alone is astounding to me in all levels.

1:32:08ChrissyYeah, she she's like, I'm sure this won't be the last time I see you, though. I'm like, I know with 100% clarity, you'll be back. And that's okay, because that means I'm doing my job. And so be it, you know, by all means knock on my door. I don't care. I have nothing to hide. I just don't.

1:32:31Etienne FontanYou're just trying to help your daughter.

1:32:33ChrissyYeah, I mean, I have it all legal. She's got a red card, you know, I have her in the system. They know that this child is taking this. And I'm not going to sugarcoat anything. I told her everything. I told her everything. I went down to the hospital and, you know, all the abuse and The way that people treated me, and I'm still dealing with people at Children's treating me like crap.

1:32:58ChrissyI mean, because I fought them, because they were wrong. I mean, there were points when I brought in research. I mean, Edgar Cayce has extensive research on the correlation between the GI tract and the neurological system, and that the GI tract itself can have epilepsy of its own, and then trigger to the brain Thank you so much for joining us.

1:33:51ChrissyIt's out there. It exists.

1:33:54Etienne FontanSo what's next for you and your daughter besides the case that you're trying to do against children's?

1:34:01ChrissyI'm fighting to keep her alive. And she's... I mean, she's bad right now. And I'm going to go to Rocky Mountain Hospital for Children, which is a phenomenal hospital, just to let you know. Like, when we went in September... What it took Children's Hospital to achieve in a week with me pushing and being a jerk, Rocky Mountain Hospital for Children did it in under two hours.

1:34:29Etienne FontanI'm glad she's getting help and you're getting her seen in a place where they're listening.

1:34:35ChrissyOh yeah, I am too.

1:34:39Etienne FontanIs this where she is currently?

1:34:41ChrissyNo, right now she's visiting her dad and then tomorrow morning we're going to take her in...

1:34:48ChrissyTo address the seizures and the vagal nerve stimulator leads and see if somebody there actually listens to me and investigates it more. Because there's definitely a problem and somebody needs to see it and I can't just sit here and be this nagging voice and no one's ever going to listen. I mean, that's just devastating. I mean, it is truly devastating to see her every day in the state she's in.

1:35:18ChrissyThere's no quality in that. It's sad. I mean, in truth, I've been praying for peace. And that's horrific as a mom to pray for mercy and peace. Because it's a lot. It's devastating.

1:35:40ChrissySo.

1:35:43Etienne FontanWell, thank you for your strength and doing the best you can. And we only wish you success and luck and love and future.

1:35:53BubblemanAbsolutely. I can't imagine as a parent going through what you've been through. It's, I mean, it's even just hard to listen to. I definitely, definitely hope you guys, you know, succeed in this journey.

1:36:12SpeakerWell, don't forget, if you want the 62% protein powder, I would be glad to make it up for you.

1:36:18ChrissyI would love to try it.

1:36:20SpeakerMark, you can arrange all this, can't you, Mark?

1:36:25BubblemanYes, yes, I'm sure I can arrange all this. Is someone knocking on our door? I can facilitate that, no problem, John. I can get in touch with Chrissy via Tony, and it shouldn't be too difficult.

1:36:43SpeakerAnd then on top of that, whatever people sent to you for me, you pass on to her, okay?

1:36:53BubblemanAbsolutely. Oh, okay, sure, yeah, absolutely. No problem. That's 85 bucks or something like that. I'll have to go back and look, but it's close to 100 bucks or something.

1:37:04SpeakerYeah, we'll put that in hers.

1:37:07BubblemanI will do that. I'll add some to it as well.

1:37:11ChrissyThank you, guys. It's nice to find people who actually have compassion and care. Because in truth, like even my own friends have just washed their hands with too much.

1:37:24Etienne FontanWell, thank you for coming on and sharing your story with us. I don't know any of us that are even happy to hear this story or beyond saddened to even hear what you've gone through. But I'm glad that your daughter has such a brave mother that has the willingness and strength to fight through all this adversity because many people, I don't know how they would have been able to fight through it.

1:37:49Etienne FontanYou're a brave woman. Much respect to you.

1:37:52SpeakerHere's one thing to remember. We don't get any test that we can't pass.

1:37:59ChrissyWell, I'm done being tested. Can I just tell you?

1:38:03SpeakerYeah, I understand. Listen, I raised four kids. I was in India. One of my kids got kidnapped for ransom. If you don't think I was on the deep end of what to do about that. That was the story. And the guy that kidnapped him was one of the local Indian sheriffs, and he regularly did this to people. And he did it to me, and he got $2,500 out of me to get my kid back.

1:38:34SpeakerBut all during that, I was I probably didn't sleep for five days until I had that money so I could take it and give it to him to get my kid back. And it's because you'll do anything for your kids. You know that. As a mother, I mean mothers are like fierce fighters for their kids. You dare not mess with a mother. You try to get between a mother and their kid is a dangerous scenario.

1:39:02ChrissyYeah. I'm sure they witnessed that a little bit when I was at Children's.

1:39:09ChrissyI was really mean, but I didn't care.

1:39:13MarkThat's one of the reasons why moms for sick children make such good advocates for the cannabis movement in general. I mean, it was really the grassroots effort by many a mom of a sick child here in Pennsylvania that got the medical bill passed. I mean, they were the only people lobbying for this, and they weren't paid. And it was quite remarkable when one of the children actually had an epileptic seizure there during the hearings that they were having on this in the Senate chambers, so the Senators could see it for themselves.

1:39:57MarkThe type of anguish and agony that parents go through when their child's health is completely out of their control and there's a helplessness and hopelessness that really can consume you as a parent that you will need cannabis for just controlling that fear and that stress in your life.

1:40:20SpeakerWhat even brings more anguish into my life is the idea that these fucking senators have to be shown this rather than being part of the people and having their feet and hands down in where everybody is actually living in the back of the goddamn cave. Instead, someone has to drive them in a limousine out front and show them this. Oh man, I tell you.

1:40:46ToddYou know, I would like to just add to the conversation that, you know, Thank you for sharing your story about what you're going through. I find it really touching. When I was a kid and had cancer, they didn't recognize my medical condition at first because it was so rare. And they told my mother she was just a crazy young mother that didn't know what she was talking about when she was telling them that I was obviously sick.

1:41:11ToddAnd it was my mom that was the hero bringing me my pot and giving me pot. And really, if it wasn't for her, I would be dead. And I would only add that, you know, you have to take the part about practicing medicine seriously because these people are only practicing. And, you know, fortunately I wasn't born in 1870 or I would not have made it to 1872.

1:41:34ToddSo I know I owe a lot to Western medicine, but I know how fallible they are. And I would tell you to be grateful for the time you have with your daughter and to not carry that anger because, you know, they're making mistakes too. But, you know, that kind of is the whole situation. That's why they're practicing, you know, so you have to be the leader and she's really lucky to have you.

1:42:01ChrissyI wish they would listen. You know, when we were there, I did speak to some of the administrative people on the day she got burned. And they admitted to me that because it was a teaching hospital, that they had a lot of superiority complexes in these people. And that they didn't take to the fact that I have 14 years on top of their one year residency. And that when I say something is an issue and we need to look at it, that they actually need to give me some validation and hear me.

1:42:36ChrissyIt's really sad to have administration in a hospital admit That because they are a teaching hospital, these people think that their book smarts will trump my life with this child. And, you know, the one person that I came across who actually was a resident, she and I went back and forth. And I like when they engage, when I can say, hey, have we looked at this? What about this?

1:43:04ChrissyThis is what I'm thinking, you know, and they they They go back and forth like a sounding board and we actually get to some answers. I mean, that happened and things changed. And if they would just take the second to like go, wait a minute, maybe. Then the Western medicine would be a phenomenal thing if they would just Open their ears and use the book smarts that they have and the practicing they're doing and then take this person's years of experience of this child and try and find a medium ground and actually give me some credit.

1:43:41ChrissyBecause that's the hard part in this whole medicine world is I am a medical professional. I am not just a mother. And when I'm standing before them using You know, legitimate medical terms and actual information from years of research and giving them all the needed resources to go to to find this information themselves to validate what I'm saying, they should listen.

1:44:10ToddI agree. And, you know, there's a quote that I say sums up prohibition, and I feel you're bumping into it. And it's by Daniel Bornstein. And he says the greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance. It is the illusion of knowledge. And it's this bureaucratic prejudice that you're up against. And, you know, I would say that what you're doing is making a difference. And obviously they're not just hearing you.

1:44:36ToddThey're seeing the results of your efforts because they're realizing that the cannabis that you're giving her is helping her more than What they're doing, period, and that's substantial.

1:44:48ChrissyYeah.

1:44:53Etienne FontanWell, you've seen it firsthand. Now the doctors have, and now it's part of her regimen. So thank you for taking my risk and taking that chance, but as well as You're also, the dynamics have changed so that you do have doctors that will listen and do document what's happening to the point where, as you stated, they challenge you for not actually giving you cannabis. So it just shows you how far we've come, but you've also pointed out, gratefully, how far we still have to go.

1:45:23ChrissyIt's very far still.

1:45:26SpeakerWell, as Mark said famously to me one time, there's a bunch of deniers

1:45:37ChrissyWell, they also don't make a big profit off of prescribing cannabis. So that's the other side of it. The dark side of it is that when they prescribe these epileptic meds that they even don't have the research to back up what it does. I mean, let's see, over the, she started having seizures at seven. Every single medication that they ever tried on her, a common side effect was seizures.

1:46:06ChrissyI'm sorry, how does that make any logical sense to give someone something that could cause more?

1:46:14MarkYou know, if you're treating a symptom and they're not treating the underlying cause of the disease itself, and what they're doing is they're just deadening the nervous system, then turning, I'm sorry to use this comparison, turning your kid into a vegetable. Because this is exactly what happened with Naya in Pittsburgh. And I can tell you, you know, I've been following her case now, and again, she's, again, pediatric, a Dravez patient who, yeah, her illness and most of her symptoms was not her body's illness, it was the side effects from the Barbiturates and other crap that they had on her.

1:46:56MarkThey were pumping so many drugs in her that they don't even know what the interaction between two of these are, let alone the action of three or four of these drugs are. And certainly, again, when you have someone that's not on a traditional diet and is not eating what a normal healthy person would be eating, now you have all kinds of issues around You know how their body is being nourished and how their body is able to stave off infection and manage the symptomology of their disease.

1:47:28MarkBut again, make no bones about it. Most of these drugs that they're giving you to control seizures, correct me if I'm wrong, Natasha, are just basically short-circuiting The central nervous system to basically deaden what you see. You don't see the flailing, but now you just see somebody who's completely unresponsive to the world and the environment around them.

1:47:51SpeakerComatose. But you know, Mark, one of the things about them is that they're looking at it strictly from what they've learned up until that moment. And that may not... Ring well with what everybody who's been around them, like a parent, for instance, has noticed. They too often ignore anecdotal evidence that come from parents because they think that the parents are too emotional to accurately transmit any information that can be helpful to the diagnosis.

1:48:28SpeakerAnd so they, doctors don't listen because they spent six years or so in school listening to people and they're sick and tired of listening to people so they don't listen anymore. And it's a, It's a bad habit to break, but I see it all the time. And it's something that we run into. And it has to do with the profit loss thing that we've made out of medicine.

1:48:51SpeakerAnd it's not because that particular hospital isn't making money on that procedure, but it's the whole overall picture of health in exchange for money. And that's the problem. That's what's going on. It's not looked at as a right. It's looked at as a luxury item if you can afford it. And if you can't, you should go die somewhere. And it's all sponsored by the GOP folks.

1:49:24MarkGot to add politics, eh, John? Did I say that?

1:49:32ToddWell, can I point out something that's been troubling me this whole conversation? And one of the reasons why I'm so firmly in support of Proposition 64 is because in California, even if you are a card-carrying medical marijuana patient, the Child Protective Services can come in and destroy your family. And God forbid it's a kid that's sick and not the parent. And it's the kid that's got cancer or the kid that's got some type of incurable disease that Western medicine's not touching because then they can come in and use your use of cannabis to take your kid away.

1:50:09SpeakerWell, I believe there's going to be some law changes here. Listen, they've allowed BHO and Honey Oil Labs. And along with that, they're also looking at the ability of child protection services to do that when you're on a medical treatment. That's being discussed. I can tell you that. I know that for sure. And there's a lot of people who are unhappy about that fact, Todd. I can tell you that what I heard was more negative Reports about that circulating among the people who make up these rules than positive ones.

1:50:50ToddWell, let me make my point perfectly clear in a sense. I feel that we, you know, here we are 20 years after Proposition 215 passed and a medical marijuana family is treated subjectively very different from the family that drinks beer or drinks wine or has whiskey on their bar. And what bothers me is that, you know, we're not just recreationally using alcohol in a sense. We are using cannabis to help our families, our children, our health.

1:51:18ToddAnd Trout's Protective Services, as of right now, 20 years after we passed this medical law, can still come in. They don't view medical and illegal marijuana use any differently. And the courts use it as opportunities to take away the children and then force card-carrying medical marijuana patients to stop using marijuana, cannabis, because if it's in their system, they will not return their children.

1:51:45SpeakerAlso too, Todd, when people are having divorces, parents use it against each other. If one of them is a pot smoker, then again, they can threaten to not get the kids. That's true, but you know, they do the same thing for alcoholism too. When there's alcoholism found in the home that's affecting the kids, they'll rip the kids right out of the house. Yeah, but the difference with cannabis is traditionally all cannabis use was abuse, period.

1:52:17ToddWell stated. That is exactly my point. And we get treated very differently. You won't lose your kids until you do something stupid and abuse that alcohol. But if you have an eighth on your table when Child Protective Services come over, they can use that four, three or four grams of cannabis as grounds to disrupt your whole family. And this is one of the reasons why patients will not really have their real rights to medicine in this state until the medicine itself is legal.

1:52:44ToddAnd not just an affirmative defense to breaking the law. And I think a lot of the people that are against 64 don't realize that this is going to finally legalize cannabis, period. And once it's legal, then medical is undeniable.

1:52:59SpeakerWell, another thing it's going to legalize is big corporations to come in and take a crap on everybody who's growing it and drop the quality. No, actually, not for the first five years.

1:53:15ToddFuck them corporations. Grow your own.

1:53:19SpeakerAlso, they can't enter the market the first five years. Five years, that's right. They will. We'll see you next time.

1:53:55ToddBut my point again is who cares if there's cheap cannabis available everywhere? Who cares? Who cares? It's not about the cheap cannabis.

1:54:04SpeakerIt's not about letting big business come in and take over from all of those people who are struggling and have struggled, who bore this baby out in the middle of nowhere without a doctor present. And now big business wants to come in. And John. I'm sorry, John.

1:54:27ToddThat's too metaphorical. What you're saying is a little removed because the truth is we're having this conversation on a corporate computer going through Google. Couldn't be more corporate. I mean, we use these tools ourselves as society to benefit ourselves. And the truth is corporate cannabis just means cheap cannabis. Doesn't mean I'm going to buy it. I don't buy cheap wine. I don't buy cigarettes. I don't buy a lot of corporate stuff.

1:54:50ToddDon't care that it's out there.

1:54:52SpeakerYeah, but you know what? Corporations will trump down on your ability to grow your own at home and your other rights. It's traditional. Look at corporations starting 200 years ago till now. They've never done one fucking thing good or right. Don't stop beer and wine production at home. For personal use? Well, they did for a very long time. Only when the law changed did they allow it.

1:55:20SpeakerLook, Big Farm is funding a lot of this stuff because they have already seen big dents in their pill mill sales force and alcohol has seen a big dent in it because a lot of people are drinking a lot less booze. And so these two groups are pumping tons of money into the idea of getting hold of control of how everything is done. And that's the issue.

1:55:49SpeakerIt's not about cheap pot or anything else. It's about having the wrong people in control of the rules. And that's what I'm afraid of.

1:55:56ToddThat's what we have, though. We already have big corporations running the government pretending to be our police force and raiding our houses. That's already in place. I can't see it getting worse than The 80s and 90s drug war that we just came out of.

1:56:10SpeakerWell, I don't want to be a dog for the big corporation. I don't want to heal and walk on the sidewalk.

1:56:17ToddI think that you're making it up. Nobody says you have to. This is not the way it's going to be. Cannabis can be grown anywhere. I was a 13 year old teenager growing it in my closet for a year and my grandma didn't even know.

1:56:30SpeakerYeah, but didn't you spend some years in jail because of your

1:56:33ToddBecause I was a political activist. Sure, John. That has nothing to do with what I'm saying, though. The truth is a 13-year-old child can grow cannabis successfully in his closet without anybody else in the house knowing if they don't go in his bedroom.

1:56:49SpeakerBoy, that must be a pretty secure closet because all the pot I ever grew, you could smell it way outside the front door of the house.

1:56:56ToddJohn, wake up. It was 1984. I had fluorescent lights, bro. We're not talking 100 light rocking setup. We're talking a kid with fluorescent lights growing buds in his closet.

1:57:07SpeakerIt's true. I'm just talking about a very small grow, a few plants. I had a few plants in my house in Colorado. And furthermore, I had a big giant dome that was way up high at 10,000 feet. And, you know, I had, actually it was one plant. There was one plant. It was up on the third floor. But it stunk. And when the Boulder Police Department came to the door, they let themselves in.

1:57:33SpeakerAnd they tore the whole fucking house apart to find this one plant. It had seven leaves on it. It was six inches high. The guy at the trial wanted to say it weighed a pound. He wanted to include the pot and the dirt. And everything that was in there. But I had a pretty smart lawyer. And anyway, the whole thing got thrown out when the real story came out.

1:57:56ToddBut I lost that. The point I'm trying to make is that cannabis is not lending itself to corporate greed. Anyone can grow it in their backyard. Anyone can grow it in their closet. There's no manufacturing, refining, or distillation involved, bro. That's it. It's that natural. Grow your own.

1:58:15SpeakerI understand that in the wild it's that way, but You know, I'm just concerned about regulation. That's all. Regulation is coming. There's nothing we can do about it. I've been spending days talking with the state fire marshals about the code development for regulation. And, you know, they've said, okay, we're going to let Honey Oil Labs exist. And, you know, that's good. I'm just...

1:58:42Etienne FontanBut you're talking MRSA. You're not talking 64. MRSA is what you're actually... The laws that were under the legislature that was passed and then signed by the governor, which, you know, will afford these protections. So there's some confusion also I'm seeing between people who seem to confuse and think that 64 is going to affect 215, which it's not. It's MRSA that is affecting Prop 215. And as much as I am frustrated by it as well, you know, Where were you people when the law was being written?

1:59:18Etienne FontanWe were fighting it. We were the ones who fought for the provisions that we will now have available to have, you know, you know, BHO and other extractions. But, There's only so much that we can do. And this is why, you know, part of one of my taglines and one of my emails is eternal vigilance is the price of liberty. You know, you have to be out there.

1:59:41Etienne FontanYou have to be active. You have to be on the list. That the state puts out for regulation. Because if you're not on already, you've been missing the boat for months on end. There's regional discussions that are taking place and continuing lobbying that's happening in Sacramento that allowed that bill to actually make it to the governor's desk. Because in the past, that would have never been possible if we hadn't built up the momentum of the discussion Regarding, you know, hash cannabis as our medicine.

2:00:16Etienne FontanSo we've only been able to do so much and I'm not happy with everything in MRSA the same way I'm not happy with everything in 64. However, 64 is modifiable through the legislature. MRSA, we're at the beck and call of what the decision of the state is. So With that, you'll be able to continue to grow medically your own without number limitations if you're a medical patient.

2:00:45Etienne FontanAnd if you're not a medical patient, you get to grow your sex.

2:00:48SpeakerCan I bring up?

2:00:50ToddGo ahead, Sam.

2:00:54Speaker64 is far from perfect, but it's better than it is today for recreational growing and smoking. Is that simple?

2:01:03Etienne FontanAbsolutely. And on top of that, my friend Todd McCormick doesn't have to go to court then for his recent marijuana thing because he is one of those people whose cases would actually be thrown out if this were to pass.

2:01:15SpeakerSo let's start a campaign that says, keep Todd free, vote yes on 64.

2:01:21ToddThat's great. I can see the memes already. But you know what? The truth is, is that thousands and thousands of people are going to have their cases dismissed if this passes and we're going to see a drop in arrests just like we did in Colorado and Washington. And with almost 40 million people in this state, it's going to be extremely, extremely substantial.

2:01:41Etienne FontanAnd an auto expunging of records at 18 or pre-18 as well as later on. It all becomes expunged as well, which means your previous records become wiped away from cannabis. Okay.

2:01:55SpeakerYou talking about Colorado? They're not expunging any records in Colorado. California does.

2:02:00Etienne FontanCalifornia will, sir.

2:02:03SpeakerYeah, California. It's part of 64, John. State of Washington is not expunging records either. I can honestly say. If you read 64, it's in it. As somebody who mails in their ballot, I already voted yes on 64. All right. Well, we'll be hunting you down later.

2:02:28MarkHe's doing his part to keep Todd out of jail. Come on.

2:02:31ToddI love it. It's all my fault. It's all definitely, it's all my fault, right?

2:02:37SpeakerHe twisted my arm behind my back.

2:02:40Etienne FontanI did. I did. I don't know. He probably gets better internet connection in jail, though.

2:02:47ToddI don't know. Can I just say this, guys? You know, it's funny to me that, like, can we all agree that I don't drink beer? I don't really drink, so whatever. But Budweiser, for instance, I think everybody would say probably sucks, right? It's the epitome of corporate beer. But I don't hear microbrewers crying about Budweiser taking over the beer industry from them because there's so many microbrews popping up and flourishing.

2:03:11ToddYou know, so corporate beer didn't stop micro beer in the least. It probably helped it because people looked at the comparison and went, I don't like Budweiser, I want homegrown.

2:03:24MarkThe basket of deplorables drinks Budweiser, don't they?

2:03:30SpeakerSorry. Listen, when I was in Vietnam, the Koreans used to want to come and trade the Korean apple beer. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:04:04ToddGreat guys. Corporate beer. Then you just undermine the whole point. Corporate beer for everyone, everybody. Corporate beer.

2:04:14SpeakerChicken in your pot. Hey, you know, corporations aren't going to do us any good when it comes to quality. They've never done so far. So I don't see where you could possibly point out any even anecdotal evidence that they might have even.

2:04:33ToddI can put it this way. They're not putting out pesticide-laden moldy beer.

2:04:39SpeakerAnd what about the premium brands like Dom Perignon Champagne? Overpriced. Yeah, but that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's quality. I guess if you like it, to me it tastes like horse piss. Listen, I don't drink alcohol of any kind, but people who do tell me it's great. I've heard that, but then again, there's people who like poo-poo. So, you know, what can I say? There's no accounting for taste, okay?

2:05:10SpeakerThere's just no accounting for taste.

2:05:12ToddBut, John, doesn't everybody, don't you think there'll always be a market for quality?

2:05:18SpeakerYeah. Look, the reason all those microbreweries are becoming successful isn't because of entrepreneurship. It's because Budweiser sucks.

2:05:34ToddBut you know what? This is the thing. I think corporate pot all over the world, in the Midwest, on the East Coast, in the South, definitely in the South, all those people need it. They need cheap, clean weed, man. They really do. More than they need two-buck chuck wine. So I'm all for it if it means those. I'm not going to smoke it. I'm not going to use it.

2:05:55ToddBut if it helps society, I'm all for it. I don't care. Let them build the factories and help pump that shit out to Georgia and South Carolina and all those other uptight places.

2:06:06SpeakerYou just don't care what goes on in the southeast, right? There are a bunch of goddamn rednecks. Let them smoke hay.

2:06:13ToddNo, I'm saying let them smoke good pot. I think the world would be a better place if they all got herb like I had. I just totally think the place would have a better perspective if they all just lit a really good joint and took a moment to think about it.

2:06:30SpeakerThe really important thing is that it's safe for the consumer. If they want the best, they'll find it. If they don't care, they'll smoke the rest.

2:06:40BubblemanYeah, I mean, the bottom line is, unless this commercial, you know, we call it the licensed producers up here, but, you know, this legalization, how it's going to look, unless it's, I mean, I'm trying to really put my thoughts together here. I just can't really see it. If it doesn't replace the black market and prohibition, With something people like better, the black market and prohibition will never go away.

2:07:06BubblemanIt'll just still operate under that auspice. People will still be like, so it's all right now, just conjecture what people will think. You know, a lot of people in the chat room earlier, they don't believe you can grow great herbs Thank you for joining us.

2:07:36BubblemanWe've been fighting to get this involved. We've been fighting for the mainstream to want to become a part of this. The monopoly of prohibition, do not get it wrong. It was indeed a monopoly. And just because you were willing to go to prison or you were willing to do something illegal, you were allowed into that monopoly.

2:07:53SpeakerAlso too, Marcus, the truth of it is, is if you do it on a small scale and your focus is quality, then very likely you're going to get quality. If you do it on a massive scale and your number one focus is quality over quantity, quality, quality, quality, let me tell you, you could produce it by the ton. Anybody who doesn't think so just hasn't done it or hasn't seen it done.

2:08:22BubblemanWell, you know, I go back to my point on people for so long wanting to get this plant legal, be allowed in the mainstream, have bar-type places and vapor lounges that don't serve alcohol but that are cannabis-based. All of these dreams, being able to enjoy a vaporizer after a restaurant meal. That is to involve the mainstream. And now what you see these people who come from the prohibition world, they want to control that monopoly.

2:08:47BubblemanThey don't want to let it go. They want to say, well, we wanted this, but we wanted it the way we want it because we've been in control. And it's like, well, that's not how it works. You want it. You invited all these people in. Now you better figure out how to play nice because they're coming. They're involved. A lot of them are very articulate. The cannabis community was so small before and now finally as we've yelled from the rooftops to get everyone, we all want people to be involved.

2:09:13BubblemanMost people in this industry claim they're for the patients and if you're for the patients or if you're for people, you want people to have access to cannabis regardless of whether they're sick or healthy. Thank you for joining us.

2:09:44BubblemanThat they don't, they're saying, oh, these guys are going to control it. It's like, oh, you mean like the way you did when it was illegal and a lot of people weren't involved so you were able to shine. Get 100 million or 200 million people from all around the world focused and involved in this that have been, that are very, very dedicated You know, potentially, I had this conversation with a friend the other day.

2:10:06BubblemanHey, man, someone might come along in the next year and just a young guy or girl and just blow away everything that I've ever done and I'll work with that person. I'll engage that person. I have no problem being replaced because my position isn't what's at stake here. What's at stake is cannabis becoming accessible for people. That's it.

2:10:30SpeakerI 100% agree with Sam. If you are a corporation wants to grow it good, I mean, if they really want to grow it good, they're going to grow it amazing. I just don't think that that seems to be the case for the most part that corporations do that sort of thing. But it's possible. And I'm the last one to I disagree with the fact that it's possible.

2:10:54SpeakerEverybody who builds machines out there gets up to a 20 pounder. I make a 2,500 kilo model and it doesn't suffer in any way, shape, or form from quality. It produces the best quality. It doesn't care if it's got 100 pounds in it or 2,500 kilos in it. It produces the same quality. Yeah, the real core problem is the bigger a business is, the more the focus is on profit and money and quantity rather than quality.

2:11:26SpeakerBut if you don't budge from your basic principle of quality, you can do it, I'm telling you. I believe you. Look, I remember seeing Chimera's pictures in Morocco there, which looked like, you know, pot to the horizons.

2:11:45SpeakerAnd they were digging holes in the ground and catching the rain in order to be able to grow it in those kinds of quantities. And I've seen it elsewhere grown in huge quantities. And if you go to India, I mean, let's face it, you catch up to the foothills of the Himalayas for two days with pot on both sides of the road, 25 feet tall.

2:12:09SpeakerNobody's even tending it.

2:12:12ToddYou know, I think that one of the things that is going on set is the fact that cannabis has proven itself to be an uncontrollable commodity because it lends itself to giving itself to the people because even the simplest of people, like I said, a 13-year-old kid in his closet can grow it. And that is a huge key to its success. They will never be able to put this genie into the bottle.

2:12:36ToddThey tried so hard with machine guns, tanks, everything. The drug war, it failed. And I think that no matter how they try to corporatize or monopolize cannabis, that cannabis has a whole other agenda and it has a billion of us out there that love it, that grow it, that put it into society and that's never going to stop. We're all outlaws right now and that's never going to change.

2:13:01SpeakerWell, thanks a lot. I'm trying not to feel like an outlaw, but you've scratched that completely, haven't you?

2:13:08ToddWell, be proud. You know what? If slavery was legal, I would be against it. I would probably have been hung quite many years ago because there's no way I'd be able to tolerate that shit. So, you know what? Just because something's legal doesn't mean it's right.

2:13:25SpeakerThere's a big difference between outlaw and criminal. Nobody wants criminals. But outlaws, I mean, when the laws are unjust, give me a break.

2:13:37BubblemanYeah, outlaws are just people who practice civil disobedience. I mean, Hillary's an outlaw.

2:13:42ToddThis whole community should be proud that we are because we took science and we took history and we took facts and we waited against the political idiocies that were thrown at us and we chose reason over all that. And now look at where we've come. It's been the people that have overcome the drug war. It hasn't been the government. They loved having those control mechanisms over us and they would love to keep marijuana illegal.

2:14:07ToddIt's worked out great for them. Private prison industries have grown incredibly in the past 30 or 40 years. And it's time we take that money back. It's time that we have the right to use this plan. And the other thing no one's talking about is environmental hemp. Isn't that important to us? Isn't our environmental sustainability important to us? And Proposition 64 legalizes industrial hemp.

2:14:30SpeakerThat's huge. Well, Todd, my releasing BHO in 1998 was my little way of thumbing my nose at the government. I thought, you know, put this out, everybody will do it, and then what will they do? Are they going to go run around trying to find everybody who's blasting in a pipe?

2:14:54ToddI think that once we take away these mechanisms of arrest, they're going to be in a real hard place to move on us. I mean, the more jurors are informed, the less juries are going to convict, period.

2:15:09SpeakerIt's better as the older people die off, we'll start getting younger people, millennials on those juries, and it'll be a lot better because the old people are easy to convince. Hey, these guys were growing drugs. They don't say pot. They say all kinds of nasty things at trials because they're allowed to.

2:15:30ToddYeah, I just wish people wouldn't be afraid of the future. I mean, society has been evolving in a positive way. We're striving towards equality, and cannabis is going to have to keep fighting until it has that kind of equality in commerce that it deserves.

2:15:48SpeakerThe truth of it is, the war on cannabis was lost in the late 70s when people started to be able to make clones, use artificial lights, and have great seeds. They lost. They just didn't admit it for 20, 30 years. I thought you were going to say in 1938 when they started calling it reefer. No, no, I'm saying in the late 70s.

2:16:18SpeakerYou're probably right. I would agree with that.

2:16:23SpeakerI was a seed freak. I had lots and lots and lots of seeds. With artificial lights and clones, it became unstoppable.

2:16:36SpeakerAbsolutely. There's something that was unstoppable besides IRS.

2:16:45ToddYeah, I believe cannabis is unstoppable. If it was stoppable, they would have pulled it off in the 80s and 90s.

2:16:53BubblemanHey, how about way before that when they were ripping the teeth out of the Sufis in the 17th century in Cairo Square? Those guys didn't stop eating hash. They ripped their teeth out with pliers.

2:17:04SpeakerThat's what they used to do is feed them rotten milk, make them drink it, and if they threw up green, then they presumed that they were eating hashish, and they pulled their teeth out. Jesus Christ.

2:17:18BubblemanThat seems extreme, but let's say prohibition's been going on a lot longer than what we're talking about right now.

2:17:27BubblemanThe suffering that's gone on over this plant goes way further back than us trying to protect our business interests in You know, growing and producing and all of these different things. This prohibition goes back a long time, and we just want this plant to be accepted. We want to not hear stories like Chrissy's story.

2:17:47SpeakerI want it so there's no longer an us and a them, just a big us.

2:17:54ToddIt's coming. I love that. You know, some, a couple of the things that I really discovered that bummed me out when I was really doing research on 64 is in California, at least since decriminalization in 2010, we've had over a hundred thousand arrests. Of people arrested for misdemeanor amounts of marijuana in California since decriminalization, we average between 20 and 30,000 people a year getting busted for nothing, amounts of pot we give away.

2:18:24ToddAnd the other thing that I learned was between the years 2002 and 2012, the Marijuana Eradication Task Force had seized over $180 million from marijuana-related cases. They're still ripping us off under 215 left and right.

2:18:46SpeakerI think that you're going to find plenty of local sheriffs and counties and so forth that are going to buck against 64 and make it illegal anyway. And they're going to still keep arresting people. Why? It's a good business.

2:19:04ToddThank you for watching.

2:19:22ToddThe cops still raid whenever they want to.

2:19:26SpeakerTodd, one of the biggest things is when it is legal in California, let's say 64 passes, well, why shouldn't we be able to send it interstate? I mean, if it's legal in Colorado and it's legal in California, that's ridiculous that it can't be traded like alcohol is.

2:19:47Etienne FontanBut it's the interstate commerce. It's interstate commerce. Federal. The federal, yeah, that's exactly right, unless the feds do something.

2:19:53SpeakerThat's what I'm saying. The feds are ridiculous.

2:19:55Etienne FontanHowever, once California, if California passes 64, the influence it will have and the repercussions it will have because of its needs and desires to do so, because if you will look, then you will have Washington, Oregon, and California All bordering each other, also as well as Nevada, all legal states now.

2:20:16SpeakerI'm personally for really totally free cannabis enterprise, which means as long as it's produced safe for the consumer, we should be able to get it from any state and even more so from any country if it's truly legal. Yeah, we're not going to make legal in other countries by making it legal here for one thing. I think you're wrong about that.

2:20:41ToddWell, let's see. I think legalizing California would make an epic difference, John. It's the sixth to eighth largest economic power in the world if it was its own country. I mean, this is not a small conversation we're having. When we legalize in California, it puts an enormous amount of pressure on the federal government, and nothing is going to put federal pressure on them other than states legalizing and their laws becoming really impractical and inoperable, because that's what's happening.

2:21:09ToddBecause how are the feds going to really take federal cases to jury trials in places like California when the jury pool is already voted to legalize the activity?

2:21:19MarkAnd they need to stop 280E right now. 280E just needs to end because it's unfairly penalizing all these new businesses that are going to come online in California.

2:21:30Etienne FontanIt needs to end and you need to lobby. You need to lobby. Thank you for watching.

2:21:51Etienne FontanNational Cannabis Industries Association, but it takes, you know, voices. They need to hear you as well, and your local representatives need to hear that you're sick of these states unable to have, that have legal businesses, can't use banks. You know, all these different states.

2:22:11SpeakerHere's something that's going on.

2:22:14MarkOkay, I just say one thing. Because you contract 280E to a financial loss, because this is basically a financial loss, we need to find a fucking big-ass law firm to sue the federal government because this is money that basically they're taking away unfairly from small businesses.

2:22:36Etienne FontanYou would have to have a legal standing and there's no legal standing. You have people like Cameron Wykowski who are actively fighting it through the court system as best as they can, but it's not the only way. There has to be more voices than that. So yes, Mark, that system is currently happening, but it's a long, slow process. Look, mine took five years. It's going to take them longer.

2:22:59ToddHey, Mark, one of the things that you say that is we all remember when Oprah Winfrey got sued because she said she wouldn't eat meat anymore, and they went after her under beef libel laws because there are laws against libeling products and hampering their ability to do commerce. And I thought to myself, why aren't we suing the federal government over veggie libel laws because they're libeling cannabis and prohibiting its ability to benefit us in commerce?

2:23:26SpeakerIt's actually- Because those laws- Todd, those laws were enacted during the war, and they were done to protect beef production for the war effort, and that's where that law came from. It's not something new. It's been around for a very long time. And the way a lot of the states are getting by this interstate commerce thing is they are making it okay in their state. Like, for instance, you can have a medical card in Nevada and come to California and walk in and buy weed.

2:23:57SpeakerAnd so... No, no, you can't anymore.

2:24:01Etienne FontanNo, no, no. California and Nevada are not letting each other go through medically that way anymore. That was kiboshed. Once they become legal and they're both 21 after November, if both their laws pass, then yes.

2:24:16SpeakerWell, Washington and Oregon have that. You can come from Oregon and use your card here at a dispensary here. So I, you know... It's still a way around it because you know those people are going to come here, buy pot, and drive back to Oregon. Hello?

2:24:35Etienne FontanNot saying it's not logical. I'm just saying the state of Nevada actually just fought against that through their own legislature to kibosh that.

2:24:45SpeakerIt wasn't California who wanted to kibosh it. It was Nevada. Correct. You got an asshole in Nevada by the name of John McCain who's doing every single thing he can.

2:24:55Etienne FontanMcCain's in Arizona.

2:25:01Etienne FontanNever mind. Sorry, I stay up on these things.

2:25:06BubblemanI just got some nice seeds given to me here, some Lebanese crossed with blue chunk. It's always nice to get a nice little chunk of seeds as a gift. You know your friends put some good work into them.

2:25:21MarkWhat's the reason why I mentioned, wait, hold on. The reason why I mentioned, Todd, about submitting to the federal government is because here is a tractable piece of money, right? I mean, there's definitely losses that all of the businesses who are operating Legally, underneath their state regulation, you can basically say, yeah, here's what I've lost to 280E. Here's what I lost to 280E. Pile that into one big thing and say, here's what the government has unfairly penalized all these legal operating businesses in the state.

2:26:00MarkAnd those funds should come back from the government. This is the same government who's licensed their patent To a small startup company, you know, and again, when that happens, that means that they had, you know, the company got together, there was money raised, there was certainly money transacted, and now a company is developing drugs based on the US government patent. So the government is gonna be drawing licensing revenue and licensing fees while they're unfairly, IRS is unfairly penalizing all the legally operating businesses.

2:26:37MarkThis is just fucking horrible. This is terrible.

2:26:42Etienne FontanI agree. I have to go. Hey, Marcus, what is blue chunk? I know what Lebanese is, but what is blue chunk, or at least the background of the genetics of blue chunk?

2:26:55Etienne FontanYou're muted.

2:26:59SpeakerMarcus, hello.

2:27:01Etienne FontanYou're muted, Marcus.

2:27:05BubblemanI was just talking to the other people in the room. Sorry about that, guys. I was asking them what the makeup of this strain, so it's the Baalbek Valley Lebanese, which is like a 50-year-old strain, crossed with blue chunk, which is a Northern Lights number one, crossed with blueberry hash plant, and then crossed to the chocolate chunk. Sounds interesting. He's just showing his crazy water filtration thing that he has over here right now to another friend, which is...

2:27:35SpeakerIs that a Klingon one?

2:27:43BubblemanYeah, that's a Klingon one. So tell them what that is. Tell them what that is.

2:27:49SpeakerIt's a water, a restructured water unit. So it's got crystal quartz balls that have frequencies all in line in a synergistic formation. And then they do what to the water? Chris has dissolved oxygen, rapidity, vitality, plants, yourself. See, it is clean. It'll destroy you. It'll destroy you. Oh, dude. So that's what I breed my plants with. That's what I grow with my plants. That's the water I drink.

2:28:26SpeakerRight. It's really cellular hydration.

2:28:30BubblemanHelps detoxify your cells. Interesting.

2:28:33SpeakerJust increases the nutrient uptake, less nutrients, which is more efficient. Make work, use it. I'm going to have him, I'm going to give him a trial unit for about six months coming up. So he can see for himself whether he's drinking it, his pet, his wife's cooking with it, growing plants with it, doing extractions. Oh, I'll do all of those things. Using this water to freeze the ice and the water to spin.

2:29:06SpeakerRight. It's all like good positive intentions. Biophotons, living water, structured water, restructured water.

2:29:14BubblemanIt's interesting.

2:29:16SpeakerLove innovation.

2:29:17BubblemanWhat's that, Andrea?

2:29:19SpeakerLove innovation.

2:29:21BubblemanYeah, he's been on this for a while, like over a decade now. Cool. I'm looking forward to it. I definitely have him on at another time to talk more about it. Just thought it was cool. He was showing another friend of mine in the room the unit. And I could just walk right over there and see what's going on.

2:29:40MarkAsk him how it works.

2:29:43BubblemanHow does it work?

2:29:44MarkYeah, I'm just curious.

2:29:47SpeakerHow does it work?

2:29:53SpeakerYou chlorinated your water.

2:29:55ToddYeah.

2:29:55SpeakerTook all the chlorides and heavy metals with pre-filters. And you have the water that's got remaining minerals go through the unit. And they're all aligned. You have seven quartz crystal balls, and they all have hundreds of frequency in line together synergistically. And what it does, it creates a vortex and picks up the memory that was implanted into the quartz crystals.

2:30:21BubblemanThis is like some Masura Emoto type shit.

2:30:25SpeakerYeah, exactly.

2:30:26BubblemanMessages in the Water. Not sure if you guys ever heard of Emoto, the Messages in the Water guy, but I went and saw him speak. Didn't he do Messages in the Bottle? No, that was Sting. Oh, that's right. That was 1981, but...

2:30:41SpeakerHe's the guy who got me started to making the pictures in the oil.

2:30:48BubblemanThat's right. That's right. We did mention him before. It was you that had mentioned him. Yeah, yeah. I'll tell you one thing. I went and saw him speak. He doesn't speak English or whatever, but he has like a translator, and he just seems like a pretty genuine, awesome guy. And his research tripped me out. I was like, what the hell is this? This is insane.

2:31:10SpeakerYeah, he was the sweetest guy on the planet. Too bad he passed.

2:31:14BubblemanYeah, yeah. He wasn't that old, was he?

2:31:20SpeakerHe was in his 80s.

2:31:22BubblemanOh, he was that. He was up in the 80s, eh?

2:31:27SpeakerNot that that doesn't have anything to do with dying. I mean, I thought I was a goner at 42, and at 70, I'm still here, so...

2:31:35BubblemanNo, but it seems more acceptable than when you're like 12 or 23 or, you know what I mean? It's like, oh, okay, he was in his 80s. Well, that sucks. He could have got maybe 20 or 30 more years if he lived to be like 100 to 10, but at least he lived.

2:31:50SpeakerWell, that's because when you're young, you keep telling yourself you're never going to die. It's impossible. I'm immortal. I'm bulletproof. And after four drinks, I can fly.

2:32:07BubblemanFeel that? Well, I think it's time for me to take a bong wrap.

2:32:12SpeakerYou ever see that vodka shirt? Absolutely not. One shot, I'm strong. Two shots, I'm invulnerable. Three shots, I can fly.

2:32:26BubblemanWell, the only thing I use vodka for is to sometimes clean my pipe when I'm somewhere that I can't find something better.

2:32:33Etienne FontanI just remember the one tequila, two tequila, three tequila floor.

2:32:39SpeakerThat was three tequila floor? Yes. Okay.

2:32:48BubblemanBunch of lightweights, man. I can drink 40 tequilas.

2:32:52Etienne FontanOh, man. After the war, I could drink a fifth of Jack Daniels like nobody's business, and I still couldn't sleep at night.

2:32:59BubblemanHow about like that Irish guy that chugged the whole thing after eating like six eggs or whatever? What is the internet coming to?

2:33:07Etienne FontanDude, there's some vast stupidity out there. I mean, there's some Darwin Award wanters.

2:33:16Etienne FontanI think it's how Tosh.0 started his show. Well, I grew up in the South, but before YouTube, it was, hey, hold my beer, watch this.

2:33:26SpeakerYeah, yeah. That still happens. People are asking to see those picks. I'm busy publishing a coffee table book, and when I'm finished with it and it comes out, I'll tell you where you can buy a copy.

2:33:40Etienne FontanYeah, that's a great, I'll grab a copy of that for sure. When's it coming out? Is it coming out before the holiday season?

2:33:46SpeakerUnfortunately, no. We've got, it's from 10 years of extracting oils and making micrographs.

2:33:54Etienne FontanSo sometime next year.

2:33:57SpeakerYeah, probably near the end of next year sometime, I guess.

2:34:00Etienne FontanYeah, because of layout printing. I was a printmaker lithographer in college, so I know how that all goes.

2:34:07MarkSeparations. I have to buy a coffee table now.

2:34:11SpeakerYeah. Well, the separations are tens of thousands of dollars for all the pictures.

2:34:17Etienne FontanYou're going to do digital versions, yes?

2:34:19SpeakerI haven't talked with them about that. I've only... We've been talking with them for the last couple of years about layout and they heavily wanted to edit all the descriptions of everything because they didn't like the way I wrote them. But, you know, I guess I'm not up to millennial writing.

2:34:43Etienne FontanWere you using technical terms and you confused them?

2:34:47SpeakerNo, I guess I was using too simplistic of terms like, wow, look at this. Well, look at these wonderful crystals. And, you know, they're like, they had a different viewpoint on it. They wanted to... And is your market millennials? No, I don't know what the market is. I started it actually 10 years ago because that's when I started making the pictures. And so I've been at it so long that I don't know who is going to be interested in seeing them.

2:35:16SpeakerBecause the whole printing field has totally changed since I started this when I was taking 35...

2:35:25Etienne FontanYeah, to even do printing of large books like that, that's practically done in China nowadays, and to find places in America that will even do large scale format, high quality, you know, color printing.

2:35:40SpeakerSome of the art ones I think are still done in Italy.

2:35:44Etienne FontanYeah, I was going to say go to Italy if you have the opportunity to avoid the China, but because they have better quality inks and just layout.

2:35:51SpeakerWell, my Swiss partners are very much of the same mind. They want to have me publish it because they have their own ideas of what to use it for. But they think that Italy is the place to do everything. Right now, we're having a dozen machines built in the Midwest, and they want to take One of the larger ones and one of the smaller ones to Italy and have it redone in Italy and then shipped back here for assembly because in Italy they can make a whole shitload of them at once and we're kind of limited to 10 or 12 at a time by the guy in the Midwest.

2:36:33BubblemanItaly for the win.

2:36:37Etienne FontanWell, they had also produced amazing, when I was looking at hemp machinery, Gardella is an Italian company, and they make the finest decorticators and hemp processors before some of the other companies started playing with it.

2:36:51SpeakerIs that in Italy?

2:36:52Etienne FontanYes. Gardella is a company in Italy.

2:36:56SpeakerWhere?

2:36:58Etienne FontanI don't have it on me, but at my office.

2:37:00SpeakerYou don't remember the city?

2:37:02Etienne FontanNo.

2:37:03SpeakerOh, okay.

2:37:04Etienne FontanI can promise everybody. I have the flyers at my office that actually have all that stuff in their address.

2:37:09SpeakerI spent quite a bit of time in Italy. We even got a license from the Italian government to grow hemp in Italy, which surprised everybody because none of the Italians could get it at the time.

2:37:23Etienne FontanBut you had to grow French EU seed, right?

2:37:28SpeakerNo, we grew both drug and recreational and industrial hemp varieties. But we had to grow it at a fenced nuclear power site surrounded by military police.

2:37:42Etienne FontanWow.

2:37:43SpeakerBut they allowed us to do it.

2:37:46Etienne FontanWell, the government standards is you can have, what is it, a guard tower every hundred feet around the entire plot?

2:37:54SpeakerWell, this one definitely had guard towers. They were guarding the nuclear power plant.

2:38:01Etienne FontanSo how much acreage, pardon me, how many hectares?

2:38:04SpeakerOh, no problem. We had several acres.

2:38:09Etienne FontanAnd what grew better?

2:38:12SpeakerWe were actually looking at pests and diseases more than anything else. That was our real focus of the work we did there. You can read about it in the IHA if you look online.

2:38:27BubblemanDid any of that information get translated to the book?

2:38:35Etienne FontanMaybe. Some of that in Rob's McPartland and McPartland's book regarding cannabis pests.

2:38:41SpeakerYes, that was possibly in there, but I'm talking about the International Hemp Association online website, which has all the 12 original journals and A bunch of information.

2:38:58Etienne FontanI was curious about that because if you're first growing it, you don't really have many insects that are necessarily acclimated to accessing or attacking the hemp so much.

2:39:09SpeakerSo were you able to find much? Unless there's a pest which is in the surrounding areas, there's some sort of a major agricultural crop or something, then if those pests are also Thank you for joining us.

2:39:55Etienne FontanWas it like a white powdery mildew or a botrytis?

2:39:57SpeakerIt's pretty toasty and warm. And I mean, if you know where Bari is, it's pretty toasty.

2:40:06Etienne FontanRight. But was it a white powdery mildew or a botrytis?

2:40:11SpeakerNo, it was a botrytis. I did not see powdery mildew. Cool. We might have even written a report about the problems, but I don't remember off the top of my head.

2:40:28Etienne FontanAnd you got full crops in?

2:40:33SpeakerCompletely finished flowering, correct. And when Rob and I flew back... From Bari, after examining the crop that morning and for a day or two before that, we flew from Bari to Milan. And when we got off the airplane from Milan, They had dogs smelling all the people in the carry-on luggage. I think it's some sort of a heroin courier ship or I'm not sure what the fuck's going on, but they were doing it.

2:41:08SpeakerAnd so me and Rob had been handling Both drug and hemp plants that morning. And we had washed up, but we weren't trying to be super careful. We didn't have any cannabis products with us or anything. That wasn't the problem. But the dogs, when we came down the steps, they hit on both me and Rob, and they told us to step aside. Then they had the dogs go over us better.

2:41:35SpeakerAnd yeah, the dogs just decided we weren't interesting. And that was that. You should have told them that you were sitting in the plane on seats that were actually made of hemp, and that's probably why the dogs went. I'm not sure what the problem was, but the dogs at first seemed interested in us, but in the end were not interested in us. Maybe it's because we didn't have any cannabis on us.

2:42:02Etienne FontanHow was the quality of the drug variety that grew? Were you able to try it in the end?

2:42:07SpeakerNo, I didn't try it, but I knew it fairly well. It was skunk number one.

2:42:12Etienne FontanYeah, I think you know that, Gene.

2:42:15SpeakerBy the way, the units that we're making, the reason we're going to Italy to do it is there's not going to be any Chinese dog shit on our units whatsoever. Nothing from China. It's all going to be Germany and Italy and USA sourced materials and things.

2:42:31Etienne FontanQuestion back to Skunk Man for a second. That is one awesome, Andrea. Skunk Man, since you, of course, know the quality of your plants, do the plants grow to the consistency of quality that you're used to for Skunk Number One?

2:42:45SpeakerAbsolutely not. They were smaller, and they weren't watered as well, and the soil wasn't really up to snuff.

2:42:53Etienne FontanOh, so they went directly into the soil by seed?

2:42:55SpeakerYeah, they were planted in the ground, in the open air, correct.

2:43:00Etienne FontanWere they relying on the rain, or were they actually bringing in water?

2:43:06SpeakerI'm trying to remember if there was an irrigation system. I honestly don't remember at this point. This was 20 years ago.

2:43:16Etienne FontanAll good. I was just curious.

2:43:21Etienne FontanBut did the hemp varieties grow to expectation as well, or were they also under smaller maturation?

2:43:26SpeakerNo, all the plants were a bit small because the ground really wasn't properly dug up or have a high enough organic content. I mean, cannabis can grow in any kind of soil, but it doesn't grow well in shit soil.

2:43:50Etienne FontanAnd what kind of fertilization?

2:43:53SpeakerI think they just dressed it with NPK. I don't think they were using anything organic or nothing like that. This was being grown by two Russian scientists.

2:44:05Etienne FontanCool.

2:44:08BubblemanWell, I know the Karma Cup is doing their awards right now. I just shared that on my Facebook, the live video, if anyone wants to go check that out. We've actually got it on right here on the TV. So dabs and the Karma Cup results. Just thought I'd add that in. I'm only going to keep Hash Church going for probably about another 15 minutes if you guys have anything in particular that you want to cover.

2:44:35BubblemanIn this particular episode, we got till 3 o'clock and then I got to rush down to the Karma Cup and do the expo for the last couple of hours. Someone's asking me to ask Sam about the haze number five in his recent crosses. What is it like? Hayes number five.

2:44:53SpeakerWell, Hayes number five was a clone selected by a good friend of mine and returned to me, and I used it a couple times, and some people found it interesting. It's not actually my selection, but the father was, which was also pure Hayes. Actually, I'm not 100% sure of the batch he's talking about or whether or not it's possibly got other genetics in it too. I don't remember perfectly clear.

2:45:45SpeakerYour sound is off, Marcus.

2:45:48BubblemanYeah, no, I had to, I keep, there's people in the room and they're talking and plus we have the TV going so I mute my mic every chance that I can get. Also, often I'm talking to the people in the room so when you see my lips moving sometimes if I'm muted, most likely I'm not talking to the chat room.

2:46:05Etienne FontanWell, then I was going to take that time and that quiet to say, bong rip, because we haven't seen Mr. D in today.

2:46:11BubblemanI can't believe D never came in. What's up with that? I think he texted me a while ago. He must be busy. I think he was at like a football game the other day or something.

2:46:18Etienne FontanI saw him in some sort of a picture at a football game.

2:46:23MarkHey, Marcus, did they make it to Slayer? I thought I saw a couple pictures up there.

2:46:27Etienne FontanOh, they made it to Slayer. They had pics with Tom.

2:46:31BubblemanThey slayed, yeah. They slayed Slayer. I mean, they were going to Slayer anyway. They had actually bought meet and greet tickets. So that was all just a huge, like, massive bonus. Darren was very happy for sure.

2:46:47MarkRight. Awesome.

2:46:49SpeakerBy the way, Mark, 420 Super Cool got back in touch with me, and he's coming this next week to get his breath restored. And your friend who brought me the new...

2:47:02BubblemanRotoVap, Mike. What did you call him? 420 what?

2:47:06SpeakerSupercool.

2:47:08BubblemanSupercool. I love that though. That was so awesome. Your friends, 420 supercool. I was just like, that sounded so great. I'm going to tell Sub that. He's going to like that and I'm very happy that he's finally coming to see you.

2:47:24SpeakerYeah, we had a good talk and he was excited about what could possibly happen. And Mike, the guy who brought me the new RotoVap, I noticed he was panting when he brought it in and helped me set it up. And I asked him and he said he'd had trouble breathing ever since some serious issues in his family. And so I restored his breath for him and he's a happy boy, I can tell you that.

2:47:49SpeakerYou should ask him yourself.

2:47:52BubblemanYeah, no, he told me it was amazing. He's definitely happy. He's watching right now, so...

2:47:57Etienne FontanHey, Andrew, if you ever come down to the Bay Area, I would love to meet with you and talk about breathing.

2:48:04SpeakerWell, dude, I don't get down there very often, but if you get up this way, I can definitely work you in and help you out with your breath. I typically can increase whatever function you do have by 100%. Usually people lay down 20 minutes later, they get up and they They're dizzy with breath and their face will fill out with color, their ears will get red. And it's because in addition to the making of the breath, opening the front of the chest up so that the immense amount of fluid that flows in the body up to the head and back can go unimpeded.

2:48:45SpeakerYou can hold a microphone on your chest and listen to it and it'll sound like a waterfall. You've got so much fluid going back and forth. And when the breath is shut down, that's usually shut down too. So that's why he feels so much better.

2:49:01BubblemanThat's really great. Usually I get a text from him right away once I mention his name, but I didn't hear it go ding, so maybe he's not watching right now. But I'm glad that he came to see you and I'm glad that in his selflessness of wanting to loan you that amazing unit because he was inspired by your words from Ash that he could, you know, do something good for you, that you were able to in the immediate now return the favor and give him breath.

2:49:33BubblemanThat's pretty cool.

2:49:35SpeakerI tell you, you don't understand the importance of breath until you can't get it anymore. And when you can't get it, it starts really hitting home. And when you open people's diaphragm and chest back up to breathing, you can just see their whole life force, their energy, their color, the way they look improves. And it's great fun to watch. I did it for 35 years and I've got it down how to do it in a minimal amount of time.

2:50:10SpeakerAnd yeah, it's good stuff. I love air almost as much as I like dabs.

2:50:18BubblemanWell, you know, you can't have dabs without air.

2:50:20SpeakerYeah, I know. It's an eclectic mix, isn't it? Absolutely. I'm so addicted to oxygen.

2:50:27BubblemanI've been on it my whole life, Etienne, since I was born. I know, right?

2:50:37Etienne FontanThe struggle is real.

2:50:40BubblemanThe struggle is real. I need breath to carry my dabs into my lungs. I think I have a problem.

2:50:50BubblemanYou do. Well, tell me. That's the breath too also, Indra. I'm sure you've noticed. You really start noticing. People don't know they have a problem breathing or how shallow they breathe until you put them into certain yogic postures. And when they get into these postures, suddenly they'll be like gasping for breath. I mean like the shallowest, like their lungs are the size of a thimble.

2:51:10SpeakerLike literally just like... That's because you put them in these postures and it changes the amount of space for their lungs and their body. And so you reduce the amount of...

2:51:24SpeakerOpen space for it to work. I mean, you can only breathe in as well as you can breathe out. And if you can't breathe out really well or if you're inhibited or some position you're in, it is meaning that the structure of your body is not supporting your lungs completely emptying themselves. Thank you for watching.

2:52:00SpeakerI know they will give you shots and they'll put a little plastic thing in your mouth and say blow on this, but those things aren't real measures of what's going on in your body structurally. And so when you make the structural change, the rest of it goes along with it. It's going to have to be in this particular case, form first and then function.

2:52:28BubblemanWell, that sounds good to me. I think I can't cut it under three hours. You've got to put at least three hours into Hash Church on a good Sunday, you know?

2:52:41Etienne FontanWe've been putting in a lot of four hours lately.

2:52:44BubblemanDude, I know, they've been just rolling off, like coming out so nice. I always feel it's more difficult when I'm traveling, so it's nice to at least get those, even two or three hours when I'm traveling seems like a great success for certain.

2:53:01Etienne FontanDo give our hugs and love to everybody in the room, to Hillary and everyone. We wish we could be there, but glad that y'all are all hanging out. It warms our hearts. Spirometer.

2:53:14SpeakerThese guys are saying a spirometer is a measure of lung function. But look, a spirometer is only going to measure what you're able to do. And when you change the structure of the body, the spirometer reading goes off scale. And so it's really just measuring basically what's there and not what you're capable of. And so that's my... I guess they're okay for something, but I use them as a before and after.

2:53:40SpeakerA lot of times people come and I'll say, here, blow on this, and then afterwards I'll do it and show them the video. And they can see themselves because usually the after, they can blow the spirometer right off the top of it. That's because they've learned how to empty their lungs before they take in a good breath. Chad, I just wanted to say congratulations for your victory.

2:54:06Etienne FontanThank you. I'm humbled and honored. It's been, it was, it was a fucked five years and I'm glad to in the end finally have a victory, but there's nothing more humbling than fighting the government. Let me tell you.

2:54:22SpeakerThat's because basically it's fixed. They had unlimited resources.

2:54:29Etienne FontanYeah, and again, people said I was crazy and why should I do it? Why should we try? And I had no choice but to continue to try and fight because if I laid down, then others would lay down too. And I'm thankful because there were others that the government did the same thing and they closed their doors. We hung on and made it happen. And in the end, we won.

2:54:52SpeakerWhat's really crazy to think about is all of us that pay taxes in America, Help pay for that government to do that to you.

2:55:04Etienne FontanThat's insane. Yeah, it is, but more insane was giving up and giving in to them and just continuing to plod on in this drug war. By standing up and fighting, at least the warrior in me could be satisfied that I stood and fight.

2:55:21MarkThat I fought, and now I can stand with the same government that you used to fight for, the same government you put your own life on. Yep, and I swore to protect you for that.

2:55:33SpeakerI think there's a famous song. What's it called now? I fought the law and you won. Wait a minute.

2:55:41Etienne FontanYeah, I get to change the lyrics on that one now every time I hear that song by The Clash.

2:55:49MarkIndeed. That wasn't the Clash's tune, was it?

2:55:54Etienne FontanNo, the Clash, I was more made aware of it, but of course, it's a much older song.

2:55:58MarkYeah, Jesse Fuller, I think, or somebody, that's an older tune than that, yeah.

2:56:03SpeakerYeah, it's a very old tune. To the guy in the chat who thinks that you can't breathe in anymore, anyway, whatever it was, that comment you made, yeah, you show up, And after I double your breath for you, then you go ahead and say that again to me so I can hear in person how foolish it is.

2:56:26BubblemanWell, I was going to say, I was going to give the floor to Chrissy again. I definitely want to thank her and Tony for coming in and her for sharing her story about her daughter. Really was very sad. Hopefully we can maybe get her on again one day just to have closure and to find out exactly what they're going to be up to and how we can help.

2:56:46BubblemanBoys, I thank the panel, Indra and Skunk Man, Etienne. The resident doctors, Mr. Mark Scaldone and Natasha Rees, Todd McCormick, who has also left us now, and everyone else that was in the room earlier that I have forgotten about. Thank you everyone for watching Hash Church, episode 109. It is going to be episode 110 next week. I'll be back in BC. Thanks everybody. See you next week.