Technical Difficulties and Industry Updates

0:09BubblemanAll right. Welcome, everyone. Hash Church 78. Having all sorts of technical difficulties this morning, but it looks like we have finally gone live. So, yeah. Welcome, everyone. Let me tell you, I've been sick as a dog for the last week. I don't remember the last time I've been this sick, but... One of the things I just couldn't wrap my head around missing today was Hash Church and spending my Sunday with all of you.

0:38BubblemanAll sorts of different things to cover today. So I'm going to send out some invitations to our panelists, our regulars. And yeah, Bubble Man is sick. That is no joke. Bubble Man is sick as a fucking dog.

0:56BubblemanSending some messages out. I just hope I can remember everyone that needs to get this message sent to them. Oh yeah, I wanted to talk to Dana Larson today about his giveaway with a million seeds. That ought to be kind of fun. Maybe we'll get him in for a little visit. And who knows, maybe we'll even get some other people in here other than myself because my voice is almost gone and I could really use the help of the panelists right now.

1:25BubblemanI'm not going to lie. Come in, please.

1:34BubblemanAll right. Hopefully we get these panelists in. I spent the last 45 minutes trying to get this to work and, uh,

1:43BubblemanOf course it's not working. Of course it's not working.

1:53BubblemanThat went out for starters. Otherwise I'm going to be in here by myself. I'm going to have a very interesting hash church. The one time I need...

2:15BubblemanAh, there we go, Johnny made it. That's a start. Mark made it. That's another start. That's good enough for me, two people.

2:24BubblemanYou've got to put your, turn your mute down there, buddy. That came in real loud. And welcome, guys. I don't know how I made it, but I made it. I've never had Hash Church just tell me. There was no broadcast button all day for 45 minutes. They didn't offer me a broadcast button, so I'm like... Alright, well I'm only as sick as a dog, I guess I can do some troubleshooting on this.

2:49SpeakerYour mic is very loud, John. You're still hungover from Spain, huh?

2:55BubblemanOh dude, not hungover, destroyed from Spain.

2:59SpeakerDestroyed from Spain, dude.

3:00BubblemanDestroyed from Spain.

3:03SpeakerHey, man, I think toxicity to that shit is more real than a lot of our friends in Europe seem to think. They look at me like I'm crazy when I feel sick after hanging out with them for a few days, and really, it's not them. It's the tobacco and the chemicals, man. I don't know what else it would be.

3:18BubblemanYeah, I mean, it can really lower your immune system in a way that opens you up to all sorts of viral infection, and that's what happened to me. How was your class, Mark?

3:35BubblemanOh, you're muted. You've got to delete and come back. We want to hear it. Good morning, everybody.

3:44SamMark, I hope you get better.

3:46BubblemanGood morning, John. There's only one direction for me to go, and that is better.

3:56SpeakerDab's a win.

4:01BubblemanNope, no sound still on Mark.

4:06BubblemanWell, that's okay. We've got 500 people that seem to be ready and willing to rock some hashtags.

4:15BubblemanVery loud. Very, very loud. You've got to mute your mic when you're not talking, please, bud. Mark has no sound and John has, like, super sound. Like, even when he took off his neck brace, it was so fucking loud. I was just like...

4:30SpeakerI love it.

4:31BubblemanThings are back to normal. You know what?

4:33SpeakerFor as many of these as we've done, we haven't had that many technical difficulties in the morning, so.

4:40BubblemanWell, I spent 45 minutes just pulling my hair out, so I love the fact that you feel that way.

4:45SpeakerHow's the volume now? Am I getting better over here? Should we get back up to here and talk?

4:56BubblemanYou're hilarious, John.

4:57SpeakerHow was your trip? The trip was amazing. Going to Toronto for the cannabis, well, it was the Zen Extract Party, Cannabis for Cancer. Went out with Michael, the neighbor, and just a really good event to see the amount of people that are getting involved to educating and helping and my charges pop. But it was fantastic. It was good to see everybody just, you have hundreds of people smoking pot and it was just amazing.

5:27SpeakerThe vibe was awesome. And then as it shut down, people started dabbing. Everybody went inside and started drinking. And I was like, okay, time to go. So I jumped in the car and left. And, you know, that kind of progressed. But it was great. They had the dab station set up. And it just kind of flowed through. It was a good event. To see it in Toronto, to see these huge tents and just people puffing hard, no cops, no problems.

5:54SpeakerMy only problem was the airport because I had this jar on me. And they opened it up, and boy, I had three cops, security writing me down, everything. It was actually quite entertaining. Oh, you were Remo and Mark. I was, they said, what's that? I said, it's a jar of weed. And they're like, okay. We have to check on this. And they asked me for my card, I gave it to them, I said, this expired.

6:19SpeakerI said, of course, because of the injunction, we're protected under the charter, and Then the cops showed up and then I showed them my picture of me being on the global mail and that says that we've gone through this and then they started going through all my meditators, shaking them all. It was actually quite entertaining. I didn't get the plane but we were two and a half hours early for the plane and we made it by 15 minutes.

6:41SpeakerThat's how long they really screwed around. It was okay. It was entertaining.

6:48BubblemanWell, I'm glad it worked out and that you didn't have too many problems. It's...

6:53SpeakerI got this killer rosin gave it to me. Somebody also came by and gave me some Tangy Full Melt Bubble. It's killer. I just want to say thanks to you guys in Toronto because, wow, I mean, just the people out there and the vibe and the energy around the hash and what everybody was talking about. Everybody's coming up with rosin and bubble and it's really good to see because we were at a shatter extract party, to be honest, and I was smoking just bubble and I had a great time.

7:21BubblemanOh, nice to have such an event.

7:23SpeakerYeah, it's killer.

7:29BubblemanIn the meantime, Oregon's trying to, what is Oregon doing exactly? It didn't look to, it seemed like they were offending a lot of people in their latest and greatest decision to regulate extracts. Well, I think there's still a lot of Oregon now, is that what it is?

7:53SpeakerGo again, John? I was hearing when I was at the event on the weekend that they were saying that Oregon passed that no hydrocarbons, no butane extractions, no CO2, that's just water and ice. Is that correct? I have no idea. I heard something similar, you know, and I didn't know when CO2 became an offensive hydrocarbon, but... It's cool. You know, I think there's a lot of confusion.

8:20SpeakerAnd you know what I hate is honestly there's not a lot of open conversations. And instead of everybody being on the same side of cannabinoids, we have people that just constantly swing shit onto the other side, you know, when really we're all trying to Thank you so much for joining us.

9:06SpeakerDude, I love that.

9:07BubblemanAnd you know what?

9:07SpeakerAnd this is what I feel that I kind of love all of it. I mean, when it comes to cannabis, I really haven't met a variety of cannabis or an extraction of cannabis that I haven't liked. And I think that they work differently for different people and, you know, different people find their relief in different ways. I mean, you know, if you're using it like John's using it, Deeply serious medical use, you know, or if you're using it on a Friday night because you just feel like not drinking a beer, I mean, come on, everybody should be supporting one another's use of cannabis and not, you know, throwing stones at each other because they use a different, slightly different variation of cannabis, you know.

9:49BubblemanIt's the classic divide and conquer where we've been divided for so long that as we fight for this unity... We don't know how to do it. We don't know how to unify. We know how to unify under our own conditions, but, you know.

10:10SpeakerAnd we should all be fighting for this plant, and that's what it comes down to. This plant gives us life. It gives us everything. And, I mean, it's, like I say, it's a food, it's a fuel, it's a fiber, it's a medicine. It's really, it's... Thank you for joining us.

10:44SpeakerYou know, they all deserve respect, you know. I mean, there's as much importance in the people that are doing stuff with hydrocarbons and CO2 as there is with water and air. You know, we're all here learning about the plant. I mean, and it's weird because like lately online I've seen people, you know, oh, this and that about Hash Church. And I think, go do what we're doing, which is just share the knowledge you have with your friends.

11:08SpeakerLet others look in over your shoulder and learn from you. It's called being an apprentice. You know, we happen to have a lot of experience in this industry and we're trying to share it. I don't see anything downside about that. And if anyone watching this thinks they could do better, go by all means, go do it. You know, go be inspired.

11:29BubblemanAbsolutely.

11:29SpeakerI think that's what we do here is inspire thousands of people, and that's why people are here.

11:34BubblemanWelcome back, Mark.

11:38BubblemanNope. Nope. Still no sound for Mr. Mark Scaldone, because we want to hear from him, so his mic won't work all day. I can attest it was working.

11:47SpeakerHe and I were the only ones in the other chat room that you created talking to each other for a minute there, so I'm not sure what's going on.

11:56BubblemanMan, I'm just glad I somehow managed to get this alive and kicking and invite folks in. Oh, I know who I forgot. I forgot to send the link via email. Too many different ways for me to have to send these bloody emails, I'm not going to lie.

12:18SpeakerNo, I had such a good time that everybody I talked to at the airport, I had a two and a half hour layover. The conversations I had with people about cannabis and for pain control and for cancer, certain people would just turn it off and you'd have to change the conversation to bring it back in so they wouldn't like walk away. It was actually quite entertaining of the people's perspective from all different parts and from the grandma that's like, yeah, so helping out my grandson and from the one guy who's like, yeah, well, You know, my wife smokes way too much.

12:50SpeakerI figure she's not getting anything done. I'm like, that's why she is getting something done, dude. She's not taking an Ativan and drinking a glass of wine at night, be happy. And then when I said that he laughed out loud so hard, he goes, you're so right.

13:05SpeakerWell, you know, though, I think there's a lot of it is, you know, it might be just getting an access to a different variety of cannabis because if somebody finds that cannabis is working for them but they feel like it's tiring them out or sapping them of energy, they just might want to move away from, you know, What we call broad leaflet drug varieties or Afghans or northern varieties and start trying to find things that are more equatorial and give them more energy.

13:29SpeakerI mean, I kind of suffered from that until I got to Amsterdam and discovered haze. And when I discovered haze, I didn't know that there were high energy plants that inspired me and got me high and made me, you know, giddy. So I still love haze. You know, it might just be the energy of the plant she's smoking.

13:49BubblemanYeah, Haze is definitely one of my favorites, bud. I was lucky enough to get onto that well before my trip to Amsterdam. We had the Haze, and it was, I think it was about an 18 to 19 week, so by no means was it anything pure, but pretty pure for the 90s, you know? Getting into the 18 and the 19 week back then, I can definitely remember people being like, are you insane?

14:18BubblemanAnd yeah, the answer was absolutely. I'm absolutely insane for Hayes.

14:24SpeakerWelcome, Sam.

14:28SamWelcome, G. Sharon!

14:32BubblemanYeah, the answer was absolutely. Sam's got to mute the YouTube and then we're good.

14:42SpeakerWelcome, Sam.

14:44BubblemanHowdy. Howdy.

14:53BubblemanWell, let's just mute his mic until he figures that out. And in the meantime, how the hell are you, D? Doing good, buddy. Right on.

15:03SpeakerIt seems like I haven't seen you in a long time. It's been at least a fucking month, bro. Fuck. Like, not even contact. Like, I think I've seen you on Periscope a couple times, and I think we FaceTimed once, didn't we? Let's get this started right then. Bong rip. Bong rip. Rip. Terp dip. I walked into a dispensary in Vernon the other day, the day before yesterday, and I walked in and the guy behind the counter looks at me and goes, bomb rip?

15:34SpeakerDouble dip? I'm like, fuck yeah, buddy. That's awesome. Yeah, it was pretty cool. It was cool, for sure. I'm going to have to break out this terp dip I got here. How's your neck doing, Johnny? You know what? When I was at Toronto, I was running. I was jumping up on the things, and I had them braced on and off, but I definitely 100% feel fantastic. It's like I'm shaking people's hands, and I haven't met people.

16:12SpeakerA lot of people don't know who I am because I've been living in so much pain, and I can look at people in the eyes, and it just feels fantastic. Everybody, it's...

16:20BubblemanI felt like when you said I'm shaking people's hands, I felt like the next thing you said was going to be I'm kissing babies.

16:28SamI'm not kissing babies.

16:31SpeakerIt's a deal to grab someone's hand and look them in the eyes and not seeing the pain in my eyes. It's really difficult. Mark, you've seen it. Darren, you've seen it. A lot of my close friends, they see it all the time. Like, oh, you're okay because I twitch and stuff, but... It's actually fascinating that I can actually hold a conversation with somebody and not have to look away or look down or cringe or, you know, it's definitely, it's a bomb rip.

16:56SpeakerIt's a bomb rip. It's the first time and I can't believe how amazing it is. It's awesome.

17:05BubblemanHow was your trip, Mark?

17:07SpeakerEverywhere you went, it looked pretty amazing.

17:10BubblemanIt was a really good trip, you know, getting things ready, and Jamaica was exciting, and moving things forward on that level, and I had a couple of weeks in Jamaica, I was lucky enough to be there for the Stepping High Ganja Festival, thrown by some good friends in Negril, good family group of people there, and it was great, you know, it was just, it always ends too fast, and unfortunately, Getting sick in Spain wasn't really the way I was looking forward to it, but it was nice to spend time with Sam and spend time with Tony and all around pretty good.

17:49BubblemanHow did the legends go?

17:52SpeakerI don't know. I wasn't there. Because you were sick with the fucking plague? I was there. You were pretty sick from a flu or something, eh? You caught it over in Jamaica?

18:04BubblemanNo, I got sick in Spain at the... At the Advanced Nutrients Party, it was the night I got sick. We went there just for a short period, and then we went over to the Hemp and Hash Museum for a private viewing, and I just woke up real sick after that. We can hear you, Mark.

18:25SpeakerOkay, great. Thank you.

18:26BubblemanGood morning, everybody. Welcome, Horatio. Welcome, Mark, Sam, Darren, John, Todd.

18:33SamI attended Legends, and it was freaking great.

18:37BubblemanYeah, you did. You know what, Sam? I think it was foreshadowing when we went to the non-smoking room at La Calada and they pulled out that dry sift, the melon cookies. It was pretty good. I mean, it was pretty fucking good. That shit was 99.999. He told me it took him 12 hours.

19:04SamTwo kilos, eight grams.

19:07BubblemanEight grams. Two kilos, eight grams. Two kilos, eight grams. So La Colada, big shout out to La Colada. They took amazing care of us. We had a great terpene party there at their place. They made a beautiful terpene, little Blue River terpene cake. They just went out of their way, bent over backwards for us. The culture there is that this is an Italian group of guys that our friend Lorenzo hooked us up.

19:35BubblemanThey're deeply entwined in tobacco and cigarette smoking and cannabis with tobacco. And I just want to thank them for how far out of their way they went to welcome us and to show us the purest of the purest of the pure. And I believe they took first place at Legends. So really big congratulations to you guys. You absolutely destroyed it.

19:59SamThey took first place in the judges choice. The popular choice was a Rosen that smelled kind of like Febreze.

20:07BubblemanYeah, remember that was the 710 guys. That dude rolled in from UK and just was like slapped that down on my table and the first hit I took of it I was like I couldn't believe the taste. It was so trippy. If It did taste almost weird, but it didn't make me feel sick. Like I could tell it wasn't Febreze or, you know, any of this other weird shit that could have been in there because it just made you feel real good when you took a hit.

20:35BubblemanAnd I don't think an entire room full of people could be wrong at Legends.

20:41SamI think with a little bit of luck we're going to get number 23, which was that one you're talking about, and number 8. We are having it tested, so we'll get the results back.

20:53BubblemanYes, thank you to Ananda. What was the name of his company? His name was Soto. He's got a company out of Spain that does testing, and he offered quite kindly enough to get the two tests done, at least the first place anyway. And so that'll be nice to just see a terpene profile and a cannabinoid test on that.

21:16SamAnd somebody else said, asked me a question. Was it you, Mark?

21:19SpeakerYeah, it was me, Mark. You know what the active ingredient is in Febreze, don't you? No, I have no idea.

21:28SamIt's cyclodextrin. That's funny. Well, what does cyclodextrin smell like? Does it really have a smell?

21:38SpeakerNo, no, no, no. It doesn't have any smell. What it is, it's a molecular basket that absorbs all the smell. No, no.

21:44SamI know what cyclodextrin is, as you're aware from the stuff I sent you. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

21:51SpeakerSure, sure. So, I mean, it's a guest host molecule interaction that it's usually, The host for a lot of foul-smelling molecules, which are the guests, so to speak. So yeah, it's just basically a molecule that absorbs a lot of foul-smelling molecules, and yeah, that's the magic ingredient in Fabree's. I just thought it was interesting based on our conversation.

22:20SamI can honestly tell you that number 23 that Marcus is talking about I had one of the loudest fucking smells I've ever smelled in my life. It was almost like artificial. I don't know what, that's why I'm really curious about getting it tested.

22:39SpeakerYeah, well, cyclodextrin is not going to have any vapor, but not going to have any odor at all. It probably should be odorless, essentially. It's just the terpenes that are giving you the fragrance and the essence. Bone rip!

22:58SpeakerLet's do it. Come on. Okay. Let's do it. Let's do it. I'm going to do some West Coast Concentrate Bubble with some rosin.

23:16SpeakerDid not West Coast Concentrate Bubble too? Everyone is.

23:22BubblemanThat's why I had to change it up a little. Get some Concentrated X, something none of my friends have.

23:31SpeakerWhat do you have that we don't have?

23:33BubblemanI hope you're saving some of that for when I come down. Concentrated X, baby. I'm certain it's not in your stash, but it could be. Check them out on Instagram, shitsfiego. What's the name? These guys will have it in three days. I'm going to hit some of my Concentrated X, dry sipped.

23:52SpeakerWhat's the name? On the Instagram?

23:56BubblemanYeah. It's been away for a month sitting in this jar. Actually, all the hash I left for a month tastes and smells way better, including my, my, uh, oh my god, my, my West Coast Concentrate shit smells like it got a hundred times more dank. Oh man, the West Coast stuff is fucking so killer, dude. You owe it to yourself not to smoke it all in the first week that you have it.

24:21BubblemanTry holding onto it for a couple of months before you empty one of those jars. This European profile changed quite drastically.

24:29SpeakerI've saved this chunk of fucking Hindu rosin for the last month in my little fridge.

24:38SpeakerAnd it is so fucking tasty. What was the name of that guy on Instagram, Mark? Again.

24:46BubblemanWould you like me to spell it out for you so you can make sure you know? C-O-N-C-E-N-T-R-A-D-E-D-E-X. Tell them Bubble Man sent you.

25:01SpeakerThat was a little fast. Concentrated X.

25:06BubblemanConcentrated X. Boom.

25:12SpeakerWell, hello.

25:15BubblemanI'm now following you. There you go. Happy to build hash businesses worldwide. Thank you.

25:27SpeakerWow.

25:32SpeakerOh my God. Medicated cotton candy. Let me tell you how high Mike got on the plane eating one of these things. He was like sitting there melting. I'm so high.

25:45BubblemanMan, I can't get that high on planes.

25:47SpeakerIt was hilarious. No way. I can hardly get on a fucking plane, man. Aaron, this medicated cotton candy would get you on a plane because you'd be like... No way, man. No way. I need booze and Valium, I think, just to pass out. Knock them out. I don't want to play them. You just need first class. You know, I went and checked out first business class tickets to Spain at the last minute.

26:17SpeakerThey were, my ticket would have been $6,600, but the seat was like, I was, if I'm going to put an expense account aside for traveling because I'm not going to travel anything but business class if I can. That's it. I'll be able to travel like that, no problem.

26:37BubblemanThat's the way to do it for sure. Terrible to have to travel. I've flown economy my whole life, but on this last trip home I definitely upgraded to first class and it was ridiculous. I was just able to sleep.

26:56BubblemanWhat's going on with the ratio?

27:00SpeakerI took that bong rip before my nail cooled down from cleaning it, so I'm a bit high, but it's just been a long, stressful week. We had some awesome windstorms back in Canada that, like, right after Hash Church, the house, like, shook, and then I found my power box in, like, the grass, and I'm like, that's not good when BC Hydro finds out. They're clipping me off.

27:23SpeakerOh, no. It's been a little... It's been a long week, but, you know, we put the house back together and we're back up and running distillates because it seems that people need them more than ever in Canada. They're not really as available as you'd hope. So it's taken up a lot of my time.

27:38BubblemanIt's true. I've got to admit, you know, all sorts of people say they have them, but I'm just, I don't know why. I don't know why. I just, it just seems more worrisome from my perspective. A lot of people that are making this distillate just don't... I mean, maybe we'll be able to get tests and make it a lot safer, but I definitely see the stuff that you're pulling out is of a next level for sure.

28:05SpeakerWell, it's this weird line where I'm like, we have to remember the alternative was just rice cooker RSO for the masses, so every... Every fraction's a step up, but yeah, no, we're starting to get to somewhere where it's like, okay, we're hitting the end of another standard, and you know what it looks like, and you know what it tastes like, and you know what it smells like, so anybody on their feet can think quickly and know it's not what it's supposed to be.

28:39BubblemanWow, there's some fuckery in the chat.

28:44SpeakerThere's some really nice people sending me information about what they feel is happening in Oregon and they feel like it's a lack of communication between regulators and of course our side of the industry and they think they'll work through it.

29:07SpeakerDid I miss that first part of Hashtag? What was that stuff I saw this week where there was these sensational fake ads where it was like Oregon's banning everything and then I would Google it and I'm like I can't get a list of what is and what isn't. Why were some people saying rosin was going to be banned? Was it just because there was some term that came out?

29:27SpeakerIt was like all concentrates are bad?

29:31SpeakerRosin? What did they, now, what did Rosin do? That's why I thought it was clickbait. I literally saw, like, all these things, like, Oregon is banning everything but Bubble, including Rosin, and I'm like, how is Oregon aware of Rosin to be banning it? This must be turning into... I'm standing there with a gun saying, don't squish that bud, don't squish that bud. The fuck is going down?

29:52SpeakerWell, that's why I thought, like, whatever was going on in Oregon was just getting turned into Facebook confusion by people. Because I was like, when did a new law banning all extracts come out on a Saturday, you know, and why is the ads, like, everyone just starts sharing the same picture without opening the link, it seems. Well, regulation is the new prohibition. And I think that the cities and communities are trying to come in and regulate the hell out of a problem that doesn't exist yet.

30:22SpeakerAnd, you know, we're dealing with bigotry on a different level because now that the legislative bodies are realizing, you know, we're going to get our way and we're going to have legalization in some form, they're trying to say, okay, limit it through regulation. And it's a little weird because at some point they're going to have to accept what's going on around them, which is like the Dutch attitude towards prostitution.

30:44SpeakerThey have legal prostitution for over 350 years because their attitude is prohibiting it is not going to stop it, and thinking it will is stupid. So they deal with it like mature adults, and I think we're going to have to do that with all aspects of cannabis. And I think these legislators are only going to You know perpetuate an underground market if they don't regulate the activities that are happening every day.

31:10BubblemanYep, I could see that happening as well. I saw a post by Jim Frere, the chemist, and he was quite upset about how it was all going down. He said he was going to sort of stop posting on social media for a while. He just said the amount of shit that he used to do with essential oils and companies that you could do in your own garage, extracted poisons and deadly carcinogens, totally allowed and barely regulated, and they want to over-regulate this plant, like, I guess because it is the one...

31:40BubblemanThank you so much for joining us.

32:06SpeakerI see it more of a control thing, Todd. I don't think they're trying to control this plant. They're trying to legislate it. They're trying to make it so it's like alcohol of some sort, so it can be taxed, and it can be governed, and it can, and that's what we're doing here in Canada. They want to make sure it's not access to kids, and I mean, like, look at me.

32:25SpeakerI'm getting ripped apart at an airport with a license, everything. I've got a neck break, and I'm showing my scar, and they're harassing me over this. I don't know. And this is the least amount of weed I've ever carried on an airplane in my life, I think. It's ridiculous what's happening.

32:43BubblemanHey, welcome, Mike. I like the look, bro.

32:49MikeNo, thank you. Thank you. I'm actually at work, so I can't. I'll just explain the Oregon law real quick. And then I'll have to hop back up and start watching it. So Oregon separated the classification of concentrates and extracts. Concentrates being a mechanical or non-chemical extraction, which includes dry sift, dry ice hash, bubble hash, and rosin. And then they created a separate Classification for extracts. Extracts being obviously the hydrocarbons, butane, propane, and then high pressure carbon dioxide, high pressure, and then other hydrocarbon extractions.

33:40MikeSo what they did is they basically said that if you're doing a concentration without using potentially dangerous chemicals, In Oregon, you can still continue to produce it for medical products until October. For the companies that are producing cannabis extracts using either butane, propane, high pressure carbon dioxide, or other potentially harmful extraction solvents, you have to be, after, I guess, March 1st or April 1st, you have to be licensed.

34:16MikeWell, the licenses have not been issued yet, So they essentially put all of cannabis extraction in Oregon and prohibited it until all the companies start getting licensed. Cannabis concentration is still allowed under Oregon's rules, but the extraction and specifically the sale of extracts Two medical dispensaries or recreational companies cannot be done until the state actually issues the extraction processor licenses.

34:52MikeSo as much as I do believe that cannabis is extremely healthy, obviously if somebody is going to be running potentially explosive gases,

35:05MikeI'm glad that they are starting to pass some regulations. I'm a little bit disappointed that they outright banned it until licenses were issued, but they certainly allowed some pathway to allow concentrate still to be consumed in Oregon.

35:23BubblemanInteresting. Well, that's a good overview. Thank you for that, Mike. What... You know, what's the next move for Oregon? All these companies that have money invested and that aren't able to, you know, work. What is the situation? These companies are just left holding the bag?

35:43MikePretty much. So, Oregon State Law is going through the application process. They've already started issuing the application paperwork. They've started allowing people to submit the applications. But until they actually issue the licenses, they essentially put a stop-buy order for all the medical dispensaries. So in all likelihood, most of the dispensaries are not going to be purchasing any hydrocarbon or supercritically extracted concentrates. The producers and processors who have licensed applications in Oregon currently can essentially continue to produce quower, Thank you.

36:25MikeThank you. Thank you.

36:55SpeakerA regulated hydrocarbon extraction industry that is doing fine and it's within regulations. And for Oregon to do this, it's really just trying to push us back into prohibition, in my opinion.

37:11MikeYeah, and this is something that, you know, all of the legislators or activists who are going to speaking to be legislators, You need to understand that the last thing that we need in this industry is to incentivize people to jump back into the black market. If anybody wants to see a successful market flourish, they need to be able to provide a pathway to legitimacy for any of the currently black market people.

37:40SpeakerYeah, I'm actually... You're making, and the reality is, is if they don't regulate it, they won't have legal extraction companies that are complying with regulation and doing it in industrial spaces in a safe atmosphere. They'll have the kind of crap you see, you know, happening back in apartments and garages and, you know, not where it's supposed to be. They're not going to stop it. They're not going to put the cat back in the bag.

38:06SpeakerYou know, they have to be realiztic about this.

38:10BubblemanWell, that's the real discussion here, isn't it? It's the discussion of are we going to push this back into the black market when people have fought so hard to get it into the mainstream, I don't know what else to call it,

38:24SpeakerWell, what's the rationale? We just want to be treated and regulated like any other commodity. I mean, we want safe products as consumers, at least I speak for myself. I don't want to see my friends going down to a cannabis club and getting, you know, potentially harmful edibles or potentially harmful extracts or buds, you know. I mean, we should have a sense of protection. This is the whole point of You know, what we're fighting for, I think.

38:50SpeakerAnd as a patient, I want something that's standardized, that is sane and consistent over and over. I don't want things that are different every time I go in. So with these extractions, we're able to get a standardized product over and over again. Taking that away is just only hurting patients 100%. I mean, that is what I've been striving for and looking for, is that standardized product that is over and over.

39:11SpeakerAnd I don't think we can do it any other way without it being an extraction process. Well, you know, I just, I wish that everybody that was using cannabis would get on the same page and fight for the same common goal of, like, freedom and liberty for the plant. Because, I mean, look, we have preferences and they're different, but the truth is we all have a preference for cannabis.

39:31SpeakerAnd us mudslinging and sending bad information about, you know, hydrocarbons or whatever, it's just, it's not helping us on any level, you know what I mean? Agreed. We can pull the negative out of all of these things.

39:47BubblemanWe've already seen it. We can pull the negative out of all of these things if we so choose to, or we can, you know, dissect that negative and get rid of it, whether it's a microbial growing in a water hash, whether it's chemicals that are being used inappropriately, whether it's, you know, all of these things. Thank you for watching.

40:26SpeakerWell, morning, Tony. You know what? I just read something. Tony, you made me think of it as soon as I saw you yawning. But remember when we were opening the jars of buds at my house and they were so fragrant? I read a thing on Boveda, those little packs I like so much, saying they did a test over six weeks of cannabis that was in jars with the little packs, and they had 15% more terpenes.

40:54MikeI would say that that requires some independent testing, but it's possible since as moisture gets evaporated out of the plant matter, that moisture could potentially also drive off terpenes.

41:10SpeakerYeah, I think the terpenes are light and volatile, and they evaporate off easily, so as the moisture escapes, it takes with it those really fragrant, delicate tastes and scents. Steam distillation. Yeah, on a room temperature level. Yeah, right, exactly. So I want to ask this question to Mike. So, you know, like if you're a restaurant and, again, we all believe in high standards and we all want high quality products and safe products for our consumers, so there's nothing wrong with instituting standards and having the industry abide by them, but like if you have a restaurant And you have a Department of Health inspection and they close your restaurant because you violated them.

41:57SpeakerYou know, there's a timeline to basically getting your restaurant up and going again. And so my question is like what's the rationale of some timeline, some arbitrary date, some time out in the summer when they're going to start issuing licenses? I mean, the point is that, you know, I guess if they have to evaluate a bunch of applications, they need to actually put together a board that knows what's, What's going on that they can review the applications or you know it just seems senseless to say well at this and such date we're going to start issuing licenses or going to start looking at applications when again there's already a market and like you said I'm so glad you brought up the notion that what this is going to do is not Create the birth of this market, but it's actually going to drive it the other direction.

42:47SpeakerIt doesn't create or destroy the need for the product. The need for the product is still there. So now, yes, all this is going to be made by illegal operations as opposed to legal operations. It makes no sense whatsoever. And so I want to know what the rationality behind this legislation is. It just doesn't make sense to me at all.

43:07MikeYeah, so a lot of it's going to be reactionary. There was obviously quite a few news articles about companies that were getting busted for unregulated pesticides or potentially harmful pesticides. In order, since there was some correlation with extracts carrying over potential pesticides and potentially harmful dosage, which obviously they haven't researched yet, The first kind of knee jerk reaction that the state of Oregon did was, well, okay, well, using potentially harmful hydrocarbons, you could potentially cause explosions or carry over potentially harmful pesticides.

43:51MikeSo that was where they actually decided to outright ban extractions, which honestly I think is completely erroneous. I mean, I'm I'm in certainly one of the most regulated states in the market currently and have labs in some of the most regulated states. Extractions can be done safely if SOPs are established and followed. The lab I'm currently in is in Illinois, which only issued 20 licenses. It's currently harder in the city of Chicago to get a medical marijuana license than it is to get a concealed carry permit.

44:29MikeSo the state has essentially made it easier for people to go out and buy hidden handguns than it is to possess cannabis. A lot of that has to do with corruption both in the political system as well as overall greed. But it's one of those things that there are certainly ways to do extractions safely, do formulations safely, and have the Proactively create regulations. The state of Oregon didn't have to ban extractions.

45:01MikeThey could have said proactive from March 1st forward, every extraction has to go through pesticide microbial residual solvent and has to be processed in an ISO 9 lab or a class 1 DIV 1 lab. A lot of states don't have regulations. Colorado is one of the few that actually has regulations requiring hydrocarbon extraction to be in a class 1 Thank you so much for joining us.

45:53SpeakerI mean, it would seem like that's exactly the impetus to make sure that it is regulated and is carried out in a self-contained facility that is okay for, you know, and OSHA regulates this in the flavor and fragrance industry or hydrocarbon extractions using. Hydrocarbon extraction is used in defatting of soybeans. And so all these industries are already OSHA regulated. They already exist. And so if you were going to apply the same scrutiny across the board to all these industries, you've got people.

46:34SpeakerDo you think our industry can handle that much regulation? I remember when Colorado people were like, I need $100,000 or else I can't get an explosion-proof room. And some people were like, well, fuck it, I'll just move state. And other people were like, I'm getting investors, I'm pulling together a team, and I'm getting it done. Is that type of regulation when a company's been running out of A triple door garage for the last three years.

46:58SpeakerIs that push them automatically into the unregulated market or is there room for them to apply for the capital to get legal? Can they actually get loans easily or does it always have to be coming from the dark market where the money to actually get regulated and up to par? Like how would someone actually do that? Like if LHO got hit with you're a hydrocarbon, you're going to blow up.

47:20SpeakerI'm like I'm not going to blow up. It's like you need 100 grand to not blow up. What would I be in a situation? Would I just end up underground or like I saw it in Colorado. People could literally just say like I need an investment. Check out my Instagram. I have 20,000 followers and people got investments to keep their company going. Is that possible in Oregon?

47:42MikeI think it's unfortunate that the state is regulating it in the way that it is. Unfortunately, I think that it's going to be a lot of what we see. Building Class 1 Div 1 rooms can be done relatively cheaply, but in order to build a Class 1 Div 1 room that potentially could survive any sort of FDA or international drug regulation requires that Thank you for joining us.

48:35MikeIt's critical to protect not only investors but as well as the businesses by providing a pathway to legitimacy. If the companies, if states or jurisdictions are just going to outright ban it until people magically appear with the money, you're not going to see an industry flourish. On the other hand, one of the big things that Oregon did last summer was incentivizing people to do the transition into recreational.

49:05MikeWashington has certainly turned its, the state of Washington has turned its back on medical producers. First they said they were going to issue separate licenses for medical producers which were different than the recreational producers. Recreational was more highly regulated and then in the past four months they've really just started to sunset the medical program in Washington which has not been beneficial to the medical groups. I mean, it's one of those things that, you know, there is going to be some need for any extraction company, whether it be a concentrate company or an extraction company, to develop good SOPs, keep safe products, produce safe products, and have those products tested.

49:54MikeBut just outright blanket banning stuff for six months isn't going to be a good way or an efficient way to incentivize anybody Thank you for watching.

50:24MikeWe certainly have not really gone through the issue of learning what SEC filings are, what patent filings are, even in some cases how to write P&Ls. So I think that as these markets start to transition into regulated markets, you're going to see...

50:44MikeBoth bankers getting involved and traditional business people getting involved as well as in some cases hedge funds getting involved which are going to handle the majority of the business side of it while those of us who are good at chemistry or cultivation are going to have to focus on our skill sets. I'm certainly not somebody who could make business suggestions or stock market suggestions but being able to You know, find investors to run the business side of it while I, you know, do the fun stuff, building out labs and developing those SOPs certainly makes it a little bit more efficient, a little bit less stressful because everybody has their own unique skill sets and nobody's going to be able to run a either local company or a national company by themselves.

51:35MikeIt's going to take a team of lawyers, a team of bankers, a team of extractors, and a team of growers.

51:43SpeakerWell, that's fantastic, Mike. You know, thank you for all the great points you made. I'm really glad you joined us this morning. This is really why I do Hash Church, because not only is it nice to, you know, put a little something in, it's so nice to listen to people like yourself, and I agree with so much of what you said, and I'm really glad you shared it.

51:59SpeakerAnd I'm going to go hiking, everybody. I'll see you guys next Sunday. But, wow, thank you again, Mike, and I'll see you guys all soon. Have a good day. Thank you, guys. Peace and love. Good to see you healthy, Mark.

52:11SamAlso, I would say that the truth of it is, no matter how much it costs to set up a good lab, they're doing this for soybeans, they're doing it for all kinds of industries. It can be done for cannabis, because cannabis is worth more.

52:29SpeakerNice. Yes. It's worth more. It sounded like you answered your own question, Horatio. You said if you don't get $100,000, you're going to blow up. So it sounds like you'll just go underground and blow up. No, well the reason why I ask that is because Canada had that, like Canada came out and like Health Canada was like, you can do extractions but no highly flammable chemicals. And instantly LHO and CO2 were the only thing that were legal because I'm not highly flammable, I'm just flammable.

53:03SpeakerAnd instantly that particular term, by basically saying highly, Two industries were valid and the rest were invalid and it changed the whole market. Of course in Canada everyone's like, F you Health Canada, we don't like you anyways and just continued pushing on. But a lot of companies that are gearing up for legalization already moved the CO2 route because they expect that type of viewpoint to stick. And it is going to be a rosin CO2 for medical and this LHO guy for the mix.

53:32SpeakerLike they're never going to adopt VHO in Canada just from the way they approach it. They're just going to say, why don't you use a CO2 machine? I don't care what you think about terps, go to hell. And that's the way it's going to be. Where what I see in Oregon was it's so blanket that I just end up in the same bin or literally they could have considered rosin.

53:52SpeakerThe transferring of pesticides, and that could have gotten banned when it has nothing to do with highly flammable. I see how CO2 people are mad that they're getting lumped in with one group, and every time somebody regulates something, it's a simple word that can make a whole group legal and a whole group illegal. So that's kind of why I wonder, because in my case, there should be no reason for 100,000 bomb-proof rooms, because I'm not going to blow up, but if a legislator...

54:17SpeakerIf some rule goes wrong and they're just like, yeah, anything that is exposed to oozing is banned, like that's, like it literally sounds that archaic in Oregon that even I end up in trouble. Like basically it's the same thing when someone can't extract with coconut oil because it's flammable. That's when it starts to get ridiculous and that's kind of what it sounds like. You can't do a coconut extract, could you, Mike?

54:41SpeakerThat would be considered... It's not hydrocarbon, but where is it? Wait, wait, wait. Hold on. Time out. Time out. Time out. Okay. Time for a reality check, please. Okay. So, a flammable liquid is different than a combustible liquid. A flammable liquid is a liquid whose flashpoint does not exceed 100 degrees Fahrenheit, right? A combustible liquid is one that The liquid's flashpoint is above 100 degrees Fahrenheit. Now, there's no such thing.

55:15SpeakerI can't find an actual classification of what you're calling a highly flammable liquid. It was a Canadian. It literally said highly flammable solvent, and I'm like, but you're not defining liquid or gas. Basically, they said anything with a flashpoint over 32 hours. Okay, so the National, the NFPA is the National Fire Protection Association and they're the people who set all the regulation here in the United States and this is for ISO certification as well as if you're going to have the place insured, if it's going to be underwritten by any of the large insurance companies, it has to be basically NFPA certification or they use the classifications and here's the classifications.

55:58SpeakerClass 1A Liquid is a flash point less than 70 degrees Fahrenheit, but a boiling point less than 100 degrees Fahrenheit. So that's a lot of what we're talking about. A class 1B is where the flash point is less than 73, but the boiling point is equal or greater than 100. And I'll give you a couple examples of that. So a class 1A would be like diethyl ether or ethylene oxide.

56:26SpeakerThank you for joining us today.

56:53SpeakerWe're going to talk a little bit about how we characterize these things as either being flammable or combustible. And then the room classifications are not only based on the classification of the solvent you're using but also is based on what's called the explosive limits and the flammable range. So at a certain limit, When you saturate a air with a certain amount of gas, it becomes then flammable, but then at even a higher saturation point, it becomes so saturated that it actually chokes for oxygen, and so there is no flammability, and so that window is called basically the flammability range, and so that all has to be calculated, and Mike, you're absolutely right, you know, the class, or what 1A, or class One division, one room or whatever.

57:44SpeakerThe top of the line is actually meant for where there's constant spill of flammable liquid or flammable hydrocarbon or whatever gas into that space. I think that that's an over-engineering thing that was viewed as being let's just go with the more safer thing just to build that extra degree of safety into these rooms. I don't think it was necessarily meant to be that The class 1 div 1 operation is what's going on in cannabis extraction because clearly it's not.

58:16SpeakerIt's class 1 div 2 if you read the regulation. It's clearly in that. But again, I think what they're doing is there's, well, like when you do your pour and you'll notice that, again, if you have a lot of butane that's effluent there, if you're not doing that in a chemical fume hood, yeah, there's constant release. In that area, if you're lining up your room with mason jars, if that's what you choose to use, or evaporating dishes of some sort, then yeah, you could be filling that room constantly and you need to have the class one, div one protection that you're going to have because you're constantly putting a flammable solvent in there.

58:55SpeakerMind you that, you know, again, all these things are going to have shielded receptacles. The light switches aren't the same light switches that you would have. And if you do have a fume hood, The blower on the fume hood typically are shielded so there's no effluent that goes over the top of those motors so essentially they can handle flammable effluent without having to worry about having an explosion.

59:20SpeakerSo just to speak to the earlier point, yes, this can be done. It can be done safely. It can be done, it's done all the time in adjacent industries and it just so happens that they're using this to sort of Crippled the beginning of this industry, which doesn't really make too much sense. Because again, they're just going to drive it to the black market.

59:43SpeakerI hope that was useful.

59:46MikeYeah, Mark, I think the reason why they went with Class 1 Div 1 as opposed to Class 1 Div 2 was the potential and shown potential for explosion that has been shown in Denver. And since Denver passed the Class 1 Div 1 rule, they actually just carried that over into the other states. Honestly, I think that with the amount of hydrocarbons being poured off, it should totally be a class one div two.

1:00:11MikeBut since I'm in a new state now, then the state of Illinois has not passed any regulations regarding extraction. We ended up building it above and beyond the regulations in Colorado because sooner or later you're going to have Thank you. Thank you.

1:00:55MikeEventually, all of these labs, all of the chemical manufacturing labs are going to have to be passed some sort of safety regulations. Anyways, I'm going to hop off. Keep watching it. Feel free. I might join if you guys have some more questions. Thanks, Mike.

1:01:15BubblemanThank you, Mike. Much appreciated. I'll tell you, Sam. The endless barrage of people that don't have any idea your relationship with GW. I'm getting so sick of it, dude. You're going to have to eventually give these dogs a bone because they just won't fucking shut the fuck up.

1:01:39SamNo problem, Bubble Man. People like to imagine a lot of things. It's more exciting than just sitting around with their thumb up their butt.

1:01:50BubblemanI guess so. You know, this Enya Balka who says, oh, I'm not going to subscribe to this channel because Sam worked for GW. Well, now that same person's in the chat watching Hash Church, asking questions.

1:02:05SamWell, number one, I don't work for GW. I know. You know, I haven't worked closely with them for 10 years. I did license them off varieties and we developed varieties for them 10 years ago. That's true. Jeez.

1:02:22BubblemanIt's just an unbelievable... I saw the exact same thing happen with the Monsanto issue. I've seen, like, people just want to jump on something that they don't even know what they're jumping on. And if you want to dislike GW, by all means, dislike GW. But certainly do not dislike Sam, the gentleman who has done more for the cannabis industry than any single person that I could possibly pull out.

1:02:49BubblemanAnd Mark, the truth of it is, the reason I did that, quite simply, was because I thought Western medicine should accept cannabis again.

1:03:12SamI wanted cannabis to be brought into Western medicine through the FDA approval process, and GW is a big company and can afford to do that.

1:03:22SpeakerGood job.

1:03:24BubblemanTalk about right. What we're saying is we've been fighting for the normalization of cannabis, and now when people see it happening, they want to fight against that. So, you know, this person, the next time they basically write something in chat, I'm pretty much going to just dump them.

1:03:41SpeakerWhat's their issue with it?

1:03:45BubblemanTheir issue is that they are like sheep. When they hear the word pharmaceutical or Monsanto or whatever it is, they react. Their brain just starts turning at an accelerated rate faster than they can possibly...

1:04:01BubblemanFigure things out and it just, the bullshit out of their mouth and the way people jump on the bullshit that comes out of their mouth and it's just unfortunate that such garbage can be proliferated when it's so hard for us every week to join and gather. And share good, solid information. And then you just have a fucker like this come into the chat room and just beak off about it.

1:04:27BubblemanAnd it just bugs the shit out of me. I can't say enough about it.

1:04:31SamWell, it used to bug me, but you know what? I'm used to it.

1:04:36SpeakerThat's bullshit. That's why I asked you, Sam, about being 10 foot tall, because I realize I'm like, Sam is like the first... Because you're inaccessible, that celebrity like hip hop where it's like everyone's in the Illuminati as soon as they become inaccessible, it's easier to make up exciting tales about people. You know, like did your stream come out of a Lazarus pit than you actually worked hard and developed it like a normal professional adult.

1:05:03SpeakerI can totally see, that's why I can totally get you, Sam, when you're like, I wanted to see cannabis actually affect millions of people rather than be a niche folk market. And this is the only way to do it. It's a sacrifice you have to make because 10 years later, the name is enough to get you thrown in the Illuminati bin.

1:05:23SamWell, also too, I mean, GW is far from a perfect country, but I have a company, but I have no control over this. I did what I did, I'm proud of what I did, and GW directly or indirectly has helped the medical cannabis movement because it gave it scientific legitimacy, and It's going to be harder and harder in the future for them to throw some poor kid in jail for growing a couple plants for medical use when there's big giant companies that are mass producing and selling this stuff.

1:06:00SpeakerI've got to agree on that point. We always take for granted, you know how we always say like, oh yeah, cannabis is good for this, CBD is good for that, but then no one remembers what document you read to base all that information off of. And even though I haven't personally read all the documents, you would never imagine how many people were inspired to follow information based off trials we could never afford.

1:06:22SpeakerSo I do get it, because I've seen you on like ICMAG always like, You know, bickering the actual details when someone's like, I tried THCA or I tried Marinol or Sativex and it did this or that. And you would actually get into the details of, do you know what you think you're talking about? Because they're products that are very, you know, professionally specific. The stoner community tends to group things.

1:06:47SpeakerIt's all synthetic cannabis. It's fake as fuck. Where it's basically everyone's stone, so they tend to buy into a lot of bullshit. Here's a book here that I learned almost everything on, and it was from GW, Godfrey Guy, Brian Whittle, and Philip Robson. It's all on medical cannabis and cannabinoids. This is such a detailed book on how it affects the central nervous system. I'm sure you know those books now.

1:07:11SpeakerThis is a great book, and I learned so much from this book, and that's going back, like, eight, ten years ago. I mean, they did a lot for the medical community, and they brought a lot to, like, people looking at this research until now. So, I mean... Yeah, I think GW did a lot for the research in the medical cannabis community to bring it to where we are today.

1:07:28SpeakerThat's my opinion.

1:07:32BubblemanWell, it's... It is what it is, I suppose. It's just, it's funny, these people, they're like, those companies have done crimes against humanity. It's like, so has the company that you bought your fucking computer from. Who did you buy your fucking car from? Your groceries and all your fucking clothes? Giant conglomerate corporations that have done evil to humanity? That are currently doing evil to humanity? Like, holy fuck!

1:07:56SpeakerAnd Mark, I've never heard you swear so much. I mean, I can hear your passion. You're mad about it. And yeah, guys.

1:08:00BubblemanBecause Sam is a close friend of mine, and I know him as a cannabis warrior. And when I hear people calling him out, it really bothers me.

1:08:09SpeakerYeah, well, thank you for doing the reading and what you do for us, Sam, and the strains that you brought to us and the research that you do all around the world. You're just, you're truly a warrior. And you know what? Let's have a ball rip. Ball rip. Let's do it.

1:08:24SamHerb dip. Double Terp Dip. Triple Terp Dip. Triple Terp Dip.

1:08:32SpeakerMicro Terp Dip. I mean, GW is just what he did in the past. I mean, think about this, man. GW puts us at a precipice now where we can... Really start launching rubber bands at stars, man. We can really see a lot more now because that work has happened. So that's why I'm grateful. I'm standing on the shoulders of giants here. And so let's think about not what Sam did.

1:09:07SpeakerLet's think about what Sam's going to do. That's more exciting.

1:09:11BubblemanAnd for those of you that want to disagree with what he did, then do something different. Don't sit on your computer and be an armchair warrior. Go do something. What have you done?

1:09:22SpeakerFucking right, buddy. I don't like those internet tough guys at all myself. There you go. Talk about those leaves, right?

1:09:33BubblemanI know you don't, Darren.

1:09:39BubblemanMan, it's a tough one, man, because here we are for 25 to 40 years fighting for the legality of For the mainstream, to get cannabis like a mainstream medicine. And as it happens, you just of course are going to get this entire group of people fighting it with all of their power. We're all about this.

1:09:58SpeakerWe're all about the people together. It's bringing all those warriors, those weed warriors together and making a stand. We've done that too. So hats off to you too, Mark. We're bringing everybody together to stand up against this big problem and doing it right, not in a bad way, not protesting hard or nothing, just bringing proper science and information to the table. You can't argue with it.

1:10:29SamA lot of people have paid a lot of price. Look what happened to Gypsy. Two and a half years in prison in the Philippines. Jesus Christ.

1:10:39BubblemanThat was fucked up for sure. That made me so happy the other day. Sick as a dog, fevered out, you know, and I look on my phone and it says Gypsy's home and I thought, wow, that made me happy to think that he was home finally.

1:10:59SamI say a big bong rip for Gypsy because he sent me an email earlier saying he doesn't really have anything good to smoke in England because England doesn't have good stuff to smoke very often.

1:11:11BubblemanOh my God. We could sort him out. I sent him a message as well and obviously invited him on to Hash Church.

1:11:18SpeakerYou guys heard the man. Bong rip. For Gypsy. We're gypsy. Bong, Rip, Chirped In.

1:11:37SpeakerIt's also a historic week here in Pennsylvania. Our law finally got passed by our house. It's now in the way of being signed into law by our governor. And it's pretty restrictive, Bill, in that they don't allow smoking. But they do allow a large number of medical conditions, and I believe it's the first law that's allowing autism as a medical condition, which is awesome. And so it's a pretty decent bill.

1:12:09SpeakerI've actually contributed a little bit, and I can't wait for basically... And our industrial hemp bill also got passed last week, so it was a pretty big week here in Pennsylvania. And yeah, man. That's a good thing.

1:12:26BubblemanThat is a good thing. More access for everyone eventually.

1:12:29SpeakerSo, Mr. Bubble Man.

1:12:34BubblemanMr. Tony.

1:12:35SpeakerThis is new. This is what I'm going with these days.

1:12:42BubblemanLooks proper.

1:12:42SpeakerA little micro dabber that you can fold up.

1:12:49SpeakerRight? Yeah, I've seen those before. Yeah, they work really well. Because you could take, you could take, it's one quarter of a drop.

1:13:03SamWhat's it made out of, Tony?

1:13:07SpeakerPolypropylene. They're called micropipettes, just a laboratory, disposable laboratory pipette is all it is. Micropipettes?

1:13:17SamIs that resistant against terpenes that act like solvents?

1:13:22SpeakerNo, the very edge of it where it's cut, where you dip it in, there's an edge there that can absorb. It will smell just a little bit, but not too much. A folder? It's a thrower. That's kind of what I use to take the standards out of my little bottles with the GC. Yeah, when I handle samples that are going into my HPLC, I only use glass.

1:13:46SpeakerI don't use propylene or any of those because they do contain plasticizers that can leach out. Terpenes will leach plasticizers. Plasticizers, you're going to see are things like the di-octyl phthalate plasticizer, which is used in those polypropylene tips. Okay, I'll get glass ones then. Yeah, but they're so cheap that you just throw them away. You just use them. You don't throw them over. Yeah, exactly. You use them once.

1:14:11SpeakerAre people putting it to the nail or just to their stuff? Like, are people then hoping to do the, you know, the old school terp? Like, are people putting that to the nail or just putting it to their product? No. I provide these that are glass in each little packet. This little micro-dapper I use. I think it's nice to use. It's a throwaway, so you could use it.

1:14:36SpeakerI just used it like if I was going to do it on a gram or if I was going to just use a little bit to test it, see what it tastes like. So it'd be good for like parties where you literally, it's kind of like you don't want everybody fucking with the jars but it's like pull out of something, everyone can sniff it and then start laying it and then, that's what it's for, it's for a gram's worth of application.

1:14:57SpeakerSo it's pretty much the exposure time is like 45 seconds to 2 minutes and then it's over. Yeah. Yeah. Because otherwise you get your jar back and there's 6 different oils that have been fucked into it in the name of a turp dip.

1:15:15BubblemanI've got over a thousand people watching right now, and I want to thank you guys all for tuning in to Hash Church. I don't know how I made it today, but I think I'm going to make it all the way through.

1:15:28SpeakerHey Mark, I tuned in last week for just momentarily while I was at my class, and you guys were talking about Hashishin, and you said that you met somebody, like some young kid over in Barcelona who claimed that The coding around hash is hashishine.

1:15:48BubblemanWell, he decided that the wax membrane was hashishine and that there was no wax membrane. It was just hashishine.

1:15:55SpeakerYeah, no, that's bullshit.

1:15:58BubblemanOh, trust me. That's what we told him.

1:16:00SpeakerWell, I think we came up with a very famous saying then, too.

1:16:06BubblemanYou can lead a guy to the glandular wax membrane, but you can't get him to believe in it.

1:16:19SpeakerThe wax membrane has nothing to do with hashishine at all. Hashishine is just a decomposition product of myrcene. Right? When you heat up myrcene or when myrcene sees light, it decomposes and makes hashishine. But I think it's a metastable molecule. I think it goes on and does other things. I think it's just a degradation product. I mean, there's nothing special about it, but it's not the wax membrane at all.

1:16:45SamHe was just very confused. Can you see this picture? Yes.

1:16:52SpeakerYes.

1:16:54SamAnd do I have to make it the big screen or just somebody else? No, it's big screen. You can see it. Oh, it is big screen. Okay, because these are glass ones. I used to buy them by the hundreds when I was working with terpenes.

1:17:12SpeakerYeah, I got cases of them in my lab, too. You need them by the hundreds. Basically, the amount of them I broke off into the nail, I'm like, this is crazy. I'm going to get this in my eye. You need them by the hundreds. If you're actually getting high off terpenes and still using them.

1:17:30SamI was testing the terpenes 15 years ago, so that's when I was using them.

1:17:37SpeakerA box has 150 individual ones, and you use it once and you throw it away.

1:17:44SamThat's it exactly. I've gone through several boxes. I still have several boxes left.

1:17:52SpeakerIt's, I find the tips on my lab floor and I'm like, what the fuck did I just step on? I almost flipped and it's this micro pipette tip that snipped off and as soon as I, I break them as like pulling them out of the packet. I'm so shaky, but I do love them because you can leave them on the nail and just literally let the heat work the terpenes out for a slow dab.

1:18:15SpeakerSure. Yeah, I need to buy some. No laser. That's why I like the throwaway. You just use it once. I have the throwaway once too, Tony.

1:18:27BubblemanThe band hammer. That's it, that's it, that's it. Man, I haven't had a dab in well over a week. I missed all the dabs at Legends of Hash.

1:18:40SamWould you like me to describe them to you one at a time, all 23?

1:18:44SpeakerThat would be great.

1:18:50SamWell... Number 8 was definitely the best, then 11, then number 1. I sent you the list of the entries.

1:19:02BubblemanI did get to dab number 8, right? That was the melon cookie dry sift?

1:19:06SamYes.

1:19:07BubblemanYeah. La Colada, when we showed up in Spain, just put out like 7 little varieties of hash, all solventless, and then they also brought us Two extra ones, each for Sam and myself, of full melt dry sift, two different kinds.

1:19:24SamAlso, too, number 23 we happen to have had also.

1:19:31BubblemanRemember when I was about to leave and you were like, yeah, there's 14 entries, and I was like, okay, well, that's reasonable.

1:19:37SamHow the hell did it get to 23? 23. And 23 was the last one, and it won popular choice.

1:19:45SpeakerRight.

1:19:50SpeakerThat was Team 10.

1:19:53SamCorrect, Team 10. You've got the list of everything I sent you, yes, Tony?

1:19:59SpeakerYeah, with the rosin. Yep. So number eight, that was a sage skunk one, right?

1:20:08SamNo, that was 11.

1:20:11SpeakerThat was 11. That was number two.

1:20:14SamYes, correct, of the judges' choice. Yeah, it was really funny too because, okay, the popular choice, number 23. But then their second place was number 8, their third place was number 11. With us, the judges, it was number 8, number 11, and number 1. So 23 didn't get any votes from the judges, but the popular choice swept it up.

1:20:43SpeakerIt was also a... There was also a stalemate for 30 minutes, Bubble Man, where number 8 and number 11 were both picked and then flip-flopped and then back.

1:20:55SamAnd fourth place of the judges was Marimbo's, I forget the name of the variety, but you know which one I'm talking, Tony? The Nicole. Yes, correct, Nicole.

1:21:10SpeakerYeah, it was interesting because each one of them, like that one looked the part. It looked amazing. It melted amazing. The flavor didn't come out as well as the other ones. That skunk sage was my favorite flavor. Very unique.

1:21:26SamIt was pretty tasty.

1:21:28SpeakerIt was definitely one of the best tasting ones I've ever had as far as a dry scent. It was extremely... Tasty.

1:21:35SamI know exactly. What was amazing was the variety of dry sift and the overall quality. I would say better than Amsterdam. We've had 12 of them here. But this one, I'm telling you, Barcelona is now Europe's central for cannabis.

1:21:54SpeakerYeah, for sure. I was really impressed with it. And even the full melt. I mean, they stepped up their game. You know?

1:22:04SpeakerFrom two years ago, when I was there two years ago to now, it's totally different.

1:22:15SpeakerThat means I have to go back because I was there two years ago. Yeah, it's different, Johnny. They've come along. They've all got the static. I saw that. I saw that with Lorenzo and HQ and always talking about this stuff. They're definitely a great place to go now when... You can get that quality by the sounds of it.

1:22:36SamIt's awesome, guys. The first time I went to Spain was 1971, and Franco was in power. They busted you with a roach. The minimum sentence was six years and a day.

1:22:51SpeakerWow. For a roach?

1:22:54SamFor a roach. Wow.

1:22:58SpeakerI could have a roach stuck to my shoe.

1:23:02SamThat's worth six years in a day, dude, back then.

1:23:07BubblemanWow. That's insane. That's why I never, you know, when I was in Thailand and a lot of people were like, oh, go extend your visa in Malaysia. And I'm like, what? Why would I go extend my visa in Malaysia? I could be killed. Oh no, no, it's fine, it's fine. I'm like, listen, I have hash and weed stuck on me all the time. I can't be taking a bus over a border and then have them decide that they're going to hang me because I got a big chunk of Nepali rub stuck on my back pant leg.

1:23:40BubblemanThat shit's realiztic, bro. Hash gets everywhere when you travel.

1:23:49SamAnd the better it is, the easier it sticks.

1:23:53BubblemanYeah.

1:23:56SpeakerYeah. It's true. It's always everywhere.

1:23:59BubblemanIt's true. I'm sure it's on me right now somewhere.

1:24:03SpeakerProbably underneath your head.

1:24:04BubblemanHere, let me check.

1:24:07SpeakerOh, it's there, Tommy.

1:24:08BubblemanYeah.

1:24:14SamAnother thing that was really good about the Legends was they made some of the best food. I mean, really incredible. Now, Marcus, you wouldn't have liked this, but they made this grilled pork. What was that, Tony? It was pork. No, I know it was pork, but whatever it was, it was fantastic.

1:24:39BubblemanThose guys were on the ball for the whole food. I wanted to make sure that everyone had access to To delicious, easy, accessible food, I wanted to make sure people had access to really nicely fresh squeezed juices and fruit.

1:24:53SamThere absolutely was, and the people loved the food. They also loved the way that you had changed the legends a little bit and made the people's choice. In fact, it really only took them less than an hour to smoke every sample that was out there.

1:25:12BubblemanThat's awesome. Yeah, the people's choice, what Sam is referring to is something I learned about years ago in Nepal on Shiva Ratchery. Shiva's birthday they would, I mean not everyone, but my manufacturer who lives in Nepal, Mark Rose, a good friend of mine, he would always tell me about how at Shiva Ratchery they would put their plates out of all the little hashes and It was the year that Doc Atomic and I took two or three pounds of his bud and we turned it into this unbelievable stained glass window water hash.

1:25:48BubblemanI ended up in Jamaica with a little. He ended up in Nepal at Shivaratri. I went to Bob Marley's birthday bash, smoked out the Rastas with it. He went to Nepal and smoked out the Sadoos. He put it out on a plate with all the other plates on a big table. And it was just acknowledged, obviously, that the one that was gone first was the best. It wasn't the focus of the event.

1:26:13BubblemanIt wasn't like after they won, the Sadhus started etching that they won the Shivaratri event on their Instagram. It was really more about being at the event and being present and not being just so focused on winning. And being able to share what's so great. The best that you have. You want to share it. You want everyone to love it. And when it's gone, you're like, yeah, right on.

1:26:41BubblemanThat's awesome.

1:26:46BubblemanThat is awesome. Man, I'm telling you, my throat is damn near done.

1:26:58SpeakerI'm smoking this 10G full melt bubble. I can't remember the dude's name that gave it to me, but holy fuck. Beep, beep, beep, beep. Wow.

1:27:08SamI love tango.

1:27:12SpeakerMark, am I disturbing? What's going on, Nick? Hey, what's up, everybody?

1:27:37SpeakerMorning. Everybody's showing off their stats.

1:27:48BubblemanGoodness, my goodness. You just have to mute your mic when you're not talking, Mike. Everyone's reverberating through it.

1:27:57SpeakerHey, Mark, you have a sore throat? Mmm, it's not as sore as you'd think, actually. Okay, I do have a home remedy for sore throat if you want to hear it. Give it to me, give it to me. Pickle juice. Pickle juice, eh? Yeah, there's something about the salinity and something about, again, there's caryophylline that's in those peppercorns, so maybe there's some caryophylline happening in there. But when I start feeling the tickle, that sore throat coming on, what I typically do is, oh yeah, I'll drink some pickle juice and keep pickle juice on the back end of your throat.

1:28:38SpeakerAnd there's something about the saline that's in pickle juice, it's kind of like gargling with salt water. I think it really does, especially if it's viral, it really does the whole thing well. So try that pickle juice. I'll check out the pickle juice, my friend. Thank you. Thank you. Put it in your Bloody Marys if you need alcohol to go with it.

1:28:57BubblemanNo alcohol for me, sir. No alcohol for me. You know, I did all of high school without alcohol. I did all of university without alcohol. I traveled around the world without alcohol. And I really just had a great life without alcohol.

1:29:16SpeakerPickles do make a nice accessory and a good Bloody Mary, though, I must admit. But there's something about the terpenes that are in the pickle juice, too. There's probably some healing effect there that we don't quite understand, but try it. Pickle juice terps.

1:29:33BubblemanThere it is. Yep.

1:29:48BubblemanSo I know we had a pretty... Nick's got the rough internet.

1:30:01SpeakerI think he just wants to talk about the Oregon law.

1:30:05BubblemanYeah, I wish he would have come in earlier when we had that big discussion with Mike.

1:30:12BubblemanI think he's been having some problems all day with his internet though.

1:30:20BubblemanAnd he's gone. Garlic, garlic. Well, I'll tell you, I woke up today not knowing if I was going to be able to do Hash Church, and my little guy, my little son Tanner, woke up and smiled at me, and I put some music on, and I just danced with him for a little while. He loves dancing. You put the music on, and he just starts moving. And that's when I knew I was going to do Hash Church today.

1:30:49SpeakerThat's awesome, man. The energy from your son, that just kind of gives you, that's cool to hear.

1:30:55BubblemanYeah, it was amazing. He's just, he definitely brings me joy. I feel like I wanted to sort of mention to all of the people out there suffering with chronic pain and chronic illness that I really feel for you and that try to stay positive and Try to keep that positive mental outlook. It's incredible only to have been sick for a week how much it knocked me down and how much it eroded me and ground me.

1:31:24BubblemanAnd it just really made me feel how blessed and lucky I am that for the most part I have incredible health and I'm very lucky and I just wanted to, you know, give thumbs up to all those people out there that are suffering with chronic pain. You guys really are troopers. It's not an easy thing to do, and I'm thinking about all of you.

1:31:49SpeakerLike you said there, Mark, stay positive, and that's the best thing you can always do for yourself when you live with pain, because staying positive helps alleviate pain. Negativity only creates it.

1:32:01SamMark, you know, next year at Legends in Barcelona, we need to take those little mouthpiece plugs that Thank you for joining us.

1:32:28BubblemanAnd then sharing dabs. It might not be our best moment. You know, this might be one of the things we might want to look at changing. Hey, let's all get together as sick as possible and then promote the use of cannabis by basically sucking on the same glass pipe that everyone's sucking on. It just seems to lack health.

1:32:49SamCarmen, share it.

1:32:51SpeakerWell, at the event that they had in Toronto, they had dabs and they had girls there, so after every dab it was wiped with an alcohol swab, so there's ways of always making sure that we keep it clean and safe smoking, definitely. Absolutely.

1:33:10SpeakerWhich would you prefer in the future? Do you think 20 years from now all Jamaicans will be walking around with an individual rig? Or these tiny, tiny little pendy rigs because they can't have spliffs anymore? Spliffs have been banned in all restaurants. Will they all have rigs? Because in Jamaica, you're pretty much the only person bringing people around a unified... Chalice, if it's not like a ram horn event, even those, it's all the fist move, but it's only big things that they share.

1:33:40BubblemanJamaicans are no strangers to rigs, you know, the steam pipe, the chalice, chalwa. These are ancient forms of pipes that they smoked, I'm quite certain, well before papers were invented for them to roll ganja spliffs. They were the world's first vaporizer.

1:33:57SpeakerYes.

1:33:59BubblemanAs for the Jamaicans, they're a unique group that I can't personally ever see not smoking joints. It's going to be very difficult for the Jamaican governments to tell Jamaicans that they can't smoke a spliff in their car. They've just been doing it for so long. I think it'll be a long road traveled to get to that road. I certainly have no problem with my Jamaican brethren smoking spliffs.

1:34:26BubblemanWherever and whenever they feel the urge to, it doesn't hurt my throat. It doesn't give me headaches. They don't offer it to me every three seconds because most spliffs in Jamaica are personal units. They don't pass a spliff around. It's not considered a healthy thing to do to pass your spliff to another person's lip. I don't know. It's an interesting question, Horatio. It'll be interesting to see.

1:34:53SpeakerIn 20 years, we will have As diabetics do, these little insulin pumps, there will be little cannabinoid pumps that we will be able to basically dial in different cannabinoid ratios and basically with just basically a turn of a button or a flip of a switch or some app on your phone, you will be able to dial in your cannabinoid ratio From your cannabinoid pump, which will be hardwired right into your brain.

1:35:21SpeakerThat sounds like one of those sci-fi futures where people are literally like, people have their finger on the CBN button, and there's pushers that are walking up to you and hitting you with a dose of THC. I could totally see that in the sci-fi end, and a guy tripping out, he's like, my CBN function is busted, all I keep getting is CBD, it's fucked. That would be totally awesome.

1:35:44SpeakerThe poor would have like bad malfunctioning devices and they wouldn't have all the cannabinoids or it would be like five terps only.

1:35:52SamIt would be 20 years though because I'm doing it already. I've been doing it for 20 years.

1:35:59SpeakerWorking with a group that's interested in not letting the blood-brain barrier be a barrier to getting cannabinoids in there and so there's Techniques now in microcatheterization where basically we can get a catheter into just about any part of the brain that we possibly can. And so wouldn't it be wonderful to actually attack solid tumors in the brain by basically just plumbing a catheter to it that's basically just feeding it with cannabinoids until the tumor goes away.

1:36:29SpeakerSo this is what I'm talking about. That's more like it. Just don't tell me to hit like a fanny pack where I'm getting wasted. That's not what I want.

1:36:39BubblemanYeah. Well, we'll see. This is the beautiful thing about cannabis. There's an endless variety of ways for it to express itself in our realities, and we have so many endless realities among the seven plus billion people on this planet that we're continually expressing and exposing ourselves to new ones. I personally don't want a catheter pumping into my brain, but I sure would fight for the right for someone that did want to have it if they were suffering from a brain tumor or some form of horrible carcinogen cancer that was growing at an accelerated rate and not seeming to be killed by anything else.

1:37:18SpeakerWe're at the beginning of the S-curve of this industry, and at the beginning of any S-curve, there's a whole lot of innovation that's going to happen in the next 10 to 15 years as this thing becomes, again, more and more prevalent. And more investment enables more innovation to happen at a substantial level. And so it's hard to imagine what things are going to exist 20 years from now that don't exist today.

1:37:45SpeakerWhen you look back 20 years and you look at what exists today that didn't exist 20 years ago, I mean, it's almost fascinating to think where we can go from here. That's why I'm more interested in not what Sam did, 10 years ago, but what Sam's going to do, you know, that's much more fascinating.

1:38:13SpeakerSam, what would you say you'd like to see done that you're not going to be doing in your lifetime? Like, what would you like to see the next Sam tackle if there was another character?

1:38:24SamThe most important focus for me When I retired was terpenes. And what I felt was that it would be possible to breed varieties of cannabis which contained say 10% or something like that amount of THC, no other cannabinoids, and only one terpene. So one for Myrcene, one for Limelene, et cetera, et cetera. For all 150 terpenes, if you could, although probably more than half of them are very, very minor, but who knows how they might contribute in some sort of synergistic way.

1:39:04SamBut once you have those single terpene varieties, The dried material could be handed out to patients and people would start getting feedback which terpenes are beneficial for which particular medical indication or which combination and which ratio and then it's possible to breed a variety with that exact ratio of terpenes.

1:39:33SamSo that's what I was the most interested in. I mean, I wish somebody would do it.

1:39:41BubblemanTerpene-specific breeding.

1:39:43SpeakerGeez, I've got a lot of work on my hands now. Sound effects. Damn.

1:39:50SamWell, you could start with the big ones. Myrcene, Lymeline, you know, go for those. I've heard of people who have varieties that are practically all myrcene.

1:40:03SpeakerThere's a couple strains already like that.

1:40:08SamWell, that's a good place to start to make one that's absolutely only one terpy.

1:40:13SpeakerYeah. Yeah. Tony, is that something, like, I thought I saw that in hemp. Is that the, like, that's where I saw the mercine constantly show up. Are there other strains that do that more than the hemp I've come across? Yeah, gift is mercine. The can of tonics has a lot of mercine in it. ACDC, there's a lot of mercine that's in flowers that are dominant. And Ringo's got, the Red Congo is interesting.

1:40:55SpeakerOkay, so it's not just following like let's say ACDC because that's where I came across it because I was like well maybe I should follow the cannabinoids to find unique like one dimensional but it didn't add up that way. Are all those strains CBD dominant because they don't sound that. At a certain point it sounds like just breeding like you know tuna kush. Yeah, that's what I was asking about like several episodes ago was are the terpenes Somehow paired or related to the cannabinoids in any way.

1:41:27SpeakerWe were kind of talking about it because of that reason right there. Because I've seen 71 varieties now in their terpene profiles. And you can see a lot of different patterns when you see that. And when you're not exposing them to high heat or oxidizing them, You can see those first sets, and then you could oxidize, and you'd see a different set. But, I mean, I see a lot of flowers that express one or two or three.

1:42:03SpeakerThen there's a lot of them that have like 20, 30, just little bits all the way across the thing.

1:42:10BubblemanHave you ever seen one that expresses one single terpene?

1:42:14SpeakerYes. Two of them.

1:42:16BubblemanNo other terpenes.

1:42:18SpeakerNo other terpenes.

1:42:19BubblemanYou've tested a variety of cannabis that came out with one terpene only.

1:42:24SpeakerYeah, it's on my Instagram 50 weeks ago.

1:42:27BubblemanOh, shit.

1:42:28SpeakerYou're the fucking man, dude. Tony, that was my question. Are you going to tell us what it is? Yeah, I've said it about 80 times. Rinko's Gift. That's the one. Ringo's gift. We talked about it. I posted about it. Nobody gave any attention to it. I was like, yeah, this guy, Ringo, who did Sour Tsunami and many of our CBD strains, and he passed away. And his brother and Chase and everything that was tied with that whole family, Ringo Lawrence, You know, no one seemed to pay attention to it.

1:43:10SpeakerI was like, that's the first time I'd ever seen it.

1:43:13BubblemanSo he bred that?

1:43:15SpeakerYeah, right before he died. Wow. What ratio came out on it? Because I remember that. I remember being like, I think I think that, but I can't prove it like Tony can prove it. And that's when I started asking if all these like Oracle and Charlotte's Web, if they were all just the same strain. Should I just look for the ratio and ignore these names in cannabinoids?

1:43:36SpeakerBecause they seem to all be the same strain rehustled out of Canatonic. That's kind of why I wondered, is Ringo's just another Canatonic? No. Okay, so there's even a picture of the greenhouse. Of the whole, like a hundred plants of Ringo's Gift. And that's what I was pleasantly surprised. It was something that I would smoke. It almost, it kind of, it kind of, like Harlequin, kind of had like points, good sized colas, but it smokes really well and it doesn't quite give off the, that cherry cough or anything.

1:44:16SpeakerThe only issue with it is it's like 11% CBD and like 0.03 or I'd have to look at it. It's almost no THC and just beta-mercine.

1:44:32SamBut back to what Bubble Man had said in the beginning, there is no link between cannabinoids and terpenes. You can put any terpene profile on any cannabinoid type plant. I mean, there is a casual relationship, but there's not a direct relationship.

1:44:51SpeakerWell, that's very, very interesting, because that means you're pretty much doing what you want with terpene breeding then.

1:45:00SamYeah, I'm really surprised, but do you still have that alive?

1:45:05SpeakerWhat, that strain?

1:45:07SamYes.

1:45:08SpeakerYeah, they're growing it. I know the farm that's growing it.

1:45:10SamOkay, cool. I think that's really interesting. Now we need one for Limeline, Linolu, and a whole lot of other terpenes.

1:45:21SpeakerOh, yeah. Well, the one thing, I wish it was like higher in actual CBD content. But it's still all right. I mean, 11% CBD, 10% CBD. How are these tests being done? How are they doing the measuring? You just take them to SC Labs. You take them to Steep Hill. So this is by HPLC? Yeah, I guess so.

1:45:44SamWe're terpenes. Some of those labs use GCFID, but they also use HPLC, so I'm not sure.

1:45:53SpeakerSo the one thing that I always do is we, so before we run terpenes on a flower, I usually have them get the test. An SE does 34, and a steep hill does like 10. So I at least try to get a test on the flowers and get the terpene percentage. And then after the extraction and purification, I always like to lay that over what the flowers was so that way you can see like what the lab was honest or what happened in between it and what I've noticed in that process over the last two years is that you know different extraction methods and processes that can change the terpene making.

1:46:39SpeakerYou know, getting something that's oxidized or something that's been exposed to heat, you would see the transfer.

1:46:46SamDo you know how Ringo bred that variety? Was it a self-population? In other words, I'm just curious how it got only nursing.

1:47:00SpeakerI mean, I'm sure he bred it because they talked about it.

1:47:03BubblemanHe talked about it at the Emerald Cup a few years back, I believe.

1:47:07SamNo, what I mean is, was it using breeding of selfing, where you take a single plant and you breed it back to itself? Because that's the easiest way to get increased amounts of a targeted terpene or cannabinoid.

1:47:26SpeakerI don't know. I wasn't part of that. No problem. I was just curious. It says it's a cross of Harley Sue and ACDC, but you can't trust Leafly until someone says, yeah, in the real world, I can confirm that. Yeah. It's supposed to be Harley Sue and maybe ACDC. Maybe.

1:47:46BubblemanSomeone in chat mentioned Ringo worked with big numbers outside with regular breeding. I don't know what that means.

1:47:58BubblemanBut he did a panel with Subcool and DJ Short at the Emerald Cup. You might be able to find it online where he talks about it.

1:48:08BubblemanOh, that's Chimera. Ringo did regular seed breeding with male plants.

1:48:17SamWelcome back, Mike. Then it's all that much more surprising that it was pure myrcene.

1:48:25SpeakerBut Sam, I asked because I had the ACDC and unfortunately because it was decarbed, I can't tell if there were other lighter terpenes. That's why I asked. I'm like, this is really one-dimensional, like super one-dimensional. It was actually a problem when I distilled it. If you're not sure, get it tested. Well, in that case, it was a sample given to me, like, see what happens when you run, and I'm like, wow, this, how can it stink so strong if it's decarbed?

1:48:51SpeakerAnd then I looked up Mercy, and I'm like, it must have either been forced to one dimension, or this is the way the strain runs, so when Tony says it, and I hear it consistently, it sounds like ACDC is getting close, and then you can breed it down to perfection, but Tony, would you say, did he make it more smokable, but he lost The ratio of like 20 to 1, like it seems when people, the ratio goes down, it's more smokable.

1:49:16SpeakerBut I don't know why. It doesn't seem to make sense to me.

1:49:22SamAnd to be honest, I wasn't interested in a CBD variety so much as a high THC variety with a single terpene. Because I wanted to be able to do both recreational evaluation and medical. But I've already heard from medical patients that just terpenes alone without any cannabinoids, in fact, was giving a medical benefit, which I found real surprising, but I think it's fantastic.

1:49:54MikeSo Lawrence Ringo actually developed Sour Tsunami through an inbred line of diesel that he outcrossed with Ferrari and then backcrossed to stabilize the CBD percentages. A couple years ago, before he passed, he actually outcrossed it with Canatonic, which then became Canasu, and Harlequin, which then became Harlasu. The Kanasu, I've grown probably five or ten packs of, same with the Kanasu. I have not been fortunate enough to grow the Ringo's Gift, but I believe the Ringo's Gift was the Harlasu, high cost with ACDC.

1:50:35MikeThe Kanasu hybrids were averaging anywhere from a 2 to 1 high THC to a 2 to 1 high CBD ratio. With the Harlasu, we actually saw up to 18% CVD and as low as 0.8% THC. So there was a few phenotypes that could be listed as ultra-low THC, but none that tested as low as the ACDC cultivar. I believe that when Ringo hybridized the Harless Sue with ACDC, it was because he was trying to stabilize the ultra-low DAC ICME cultivars.

1:51:23MikeI don't believe he got a chance to back-cross it and stabilize it, because, of course, naturally he passed away. But there have been a few people continuing to work on it, both through the... So, um, the organization and the CBD crew.

1:51:41SpeakerWhat year was Harley Sue created?

1:51:47MikeI'd have to say, I believe it was, it first got up to us in Washington in 2013, but I believe it was 2011 that it was actually read. I'm not positive on that, but I believe that when I was researching Ringo, he said that he was stabilizing the Sour Sue, which is a sour diesel IBL, as far back as 2005 through 2007, and then he started outcrossing it in 2007 to 2010.

1:52:21MikeHmm.

1:52:25BubblemanWell, nice to get a little information on that anyway.

1:52:31BubblemanAlways like when Mike pops in and drops the knowledge bombs.

1:52:35SpeakerYeah, that's accurate. That's accurate.

1:52:42SpeakerThat is what we were looking for. Accurate and precise. Absolutely.

1:52:53SpeakerI'm going to head out, everybody. I think Chamara or anybody else wants to pop in, give them a spot. Some bong rep on the way out. I didn't realize we were full. Bam. We're fully bong rep. You feeling better this week there, Bubbleman?

1:53:27BubblemanAbout that much better, ATN. I gotta say, I'm still feeling pretty rough.

1:53:32SpeakerI can hear it in your sinus. Beastie. Yeah.

1:53:36BubblemanThank you, Darren. How are you doing, ATN?

1:53:40SpeakerDoing great. Had a late day this week. It's just, man, this daylight savings time just really fucks up my world. I know it does for other people, too, but I hate it. I think it's the dumbest thing ever. Especially now, it was great when we were all in an agrarian society and all we did was agronomy and grow from, you know, daylight to sundown, but that ain't the case anymore and it just seems dumber and dumber every year.

1:54:07SpeakerWhich side would you like it on, the darker side of the year where it's at 4.30, it's pitch fucking black for no reason, or the lighter side where it's 7.30 and you don't know, like, it's almost time for bed? It's all man-made at a time. I don't give a fuck. Let's just stay to one thing. I don't care. Darker later, you know, really doesn't matter to me.

1:54:25SpeakerLet's just get our shit together and our heads out of our ass and move forward.

1:54:31SpeakerWhat would you prefer, Aisha? It's this weird thing. It happens and I'm like, oh my time, I'm all fucked up. And all of a sudden I'm like, hey wait a minute, oh my god, I gotta start planting. There's light everywhere. Anytime I see light, the anxiety to plant food starts taking me over. And I don't like that it just happens in one weekend and then every day starts to get brighter and brighter.

1:54:51SpeakerLike they just control me. Because of course it fucked the conference and everything, but I want more light. I only want basically planting hours. More light. You know what would be really cool is rather than turning it ahead and then turning it back, if we kept on just turning it ahead. That would really fuck with people, right? Yeah, the year 2020, the year of darkness, everyone had a day shift, had a night shift, and every night shift had a day shift.

1:55:20SpeakerI can't wait until I get older and it's sunny when I go to work. So everybody in the chat room, what time zone are you guys in? Let us know what time zone you're in. Let's see where they're watching us, right?

1:55:33BubblemanI'm in my time zone. I'm in the high zone.

1:55:41BubblemanI just want to enjoy a dab again one day.

1:55:43SpeakerIt does happen. It's over time, Mark.

1:55:50BubblemanWell, we'll see what happens anyway.

1:55:52SpeakerYou will definitely get better. You'll definitely be dabbing. I'll definitely smoke. A lot of Pacific time and Greenwich Mean Time.

1:56:00SamYeah. I'm in the time for a dab zone.

1:56:05SpeakerYeah. I think it's time for another dev zone. Anytime you do this thing where you ask the chat for like where are you at, it sends the comments to like 10 billion after Hashtritch is over because it's going so fast now that I'm like what am I watching? Some mad stock ticker? EST? PST? What the fuck am I looking at?

1:56:26BubblemanIt stops for me when I click on it. I don't know if anyone else has that ability but you can kind of click on the chat and then it If I scroll up, it'll create a blue line on the bottom that says more comments below. And the chat will still be going, but it allows me to go back and look and read the chat. And I'm sure it works like that for everyone that's wondering how they can read the chat when it's going so fast.

1:56:51SpeakerWho's the guy that's on the space station? They said the space station. Who is that? Hey, space station guy, come back. Someone's on the space station watching church? Is that right? Mark, I wouldn't believe that one. It might be a hoax. Yeah, it might be a little bit. It might be the truth. It might be the truth. It could be happening. I mean, I don't know who it's going to be, but it has to be, by definition, someone has got to be the first guy to smoke a dab in space.

1:57:27SpeakerIt has to happen. It has to be. Someone has to be the first guy to take a dab in space. Who's it going to be?

1:57:34SamWell, it's not going to be with one of those D-nails. They're going to use a vape pen. They're going to use a vape pen.

1:57:45SpeakerI think we can use a big old torch and just whip it out and, you know...

1:57:52SpeakerI'm already literally thinking this astronaut goes for the spacewalk and then he goes to some panel he set up on the outside of the ship, pulls it and comes back and taps on a window and is like, I got the fucking stash. Open the bay doors. We're ready. Did you call him a hashtronaut?

1:58:10SpeakerIt depends on what he brought. If it's full melt when they bring it in.

1:58:15BubblemanThen he'd be a dabstronaut. A hashtronaut. I like that.

1:58:23SpeakerMaybe it'd be easier to do psychedelics in space now that I think about it. Let's do a dab to the astronauts dabbing in space with pens. Yeah, because you couldn't use a bong because the water wouldn't work as a filtration. I know, it would go everywhere, right? And then you'd blow out your hit and where would your hit go, right?

1:58:44SpeakerJust constantly be there, right? I assume the ship would like serve it back to you as like a reclaim dab. I mean, they recycle the piss and everything else, so it's all plausible. That's fact.

1:59:00BubblemanSome of the shit out of our mouths, eh? It just hashes out. Turp dip.

1:59:09SpeakerI'm going to mix some of this up. What are you smoking today, Bubble Man? Are you even smoking right now?

1:59:17BubblemanI've just been smelling my West Coast Concentrate PC times Master Scout. I've been smelling my Concentrated X Strawberry Banana Dry Sift from DNA.

1:59:28SpeakerOh, that's ridiculous.

1:59:33SpeakerThis actually works. When you find those therapies that work, it's just going to give you that little bit of extra like when you brunch. Are you a cooking bubble man or are you just THC free right now?

1:59:47BubblemanI've been pretty THC free for the last week. Well, that's not true. I eat coconut oil extract every morning. I just kind of forget because I've been doing it for so long.

1:59:59SpeakerYou have to know your levels up there, sir. Yeah. In the refrigerator right now, grab that bottle of pickles and start drinking. Pickle juice. Dude, make some pickle drink. Put your coconut extract in the pickle juice. It'll all emulsify, and then you've got a new drink for the market. Some pickle drink? Did you say drink? A great cure for coughing that's natural is pineapple juice. There's a natural chemical in pineapple juice that's better than any cough syrup.

2:00:27SpeakerSo if you ever have coughing problems and coughing fits, it's great pineapple juice. I learned pineapple juice for different reasons, but those are different reasons. Those are different reasons. Yeah, they change different turps.

2:00:41SamI thought it was lemon and honey that was supposed to help your throat.

2:00:47BubblemanYeah, lemon and honey are the keys for sure. A little slice of lemon in the water, a little dab of honey down the throat sure makes everything feel better.

2:01:01BubblemanMakes everything feel better. Oakland City Park. There we go. Thank you.

2:01:09SpeakerSo are you homebound for a little bit now?

2:01:13BubblemanMe?

2:01:15SpeakerYeah, after traveling there for a good bit there.

2:01:18BubblemanWell, I've got to go photograph an LP near Calgary called Aurora. Terry was the guy that bought my camera when it got stolen in Toronto, so I told him I would do that. And they finally hit me up for that, so I'm going to try and go do that at the end of the month here. And then I have a couple more trips. I got a Lyft symposium that Tony and I are speaking at in May.

2:01:44BubblemanWe have a booth there as well. I'm going to be doing the Terps. And then I'm pretty sure there's something else I'm forgetting that I have to do in the very near future as well. 420? No rest for the wicked here, that's for sure.

2:01:59SpeakerHey, I'm hearing or I read that Amnesty for previous cannabis arrests is off the table there in Canada. Is that true?

2:02:11BubblemanIs off the table?

2:02:13SpeakerThat's what I was reading.

2:02:14BubblemanIt could be.

2:02:17SpeakerIt could be true. Repeat that? Amnesty for people who had previous arrests for cannabis in Canada at this point? That isn't happening. Everything's reversed. There's 22,400 arrests since the liberals have gone into power. I was fully harassed at the airport yesterday. I chanced over six grams of weed, two cops, three security guards. I'm fully licensed to everything. They made it an ordeal. I thought it was kind of funny because I just left it in there for the first time, just Guy goes, what's my weed?

2:02:49SpeakerHe goes, oh, now I have to do stuff. She goes, I said, yeah. So they just went through the protocols and it was really a waste of money. It was ridiculous what's going on here in Canada. What did they do? Did they detain you and go through all your stuff? Pardon me? What did they do? Did they detain you and go through all your stuff? Yeah, they didn't open up the jars.

2:03:08SpeakerThey started opening up maintainers and going through things, looking through. They found some cotton candy. The guy just looked at this and he just quickly put it back in. They were just kind of, You know, they weren't that bad, but it was just the amount of time they spent, everybody writing down my name in books and verifying how much I'm allowed to carry and what I'm holding at the cart.

2:03:28SpeakerI had a great education about it, so I told them about the injunction, how we're protected, I'm stable to grow, blah, blah, blah. The officer was very much, he knew all about it. He says, but this is what I have to do. It's like their protocol. It's just a waste of, it makes no sense what our government is doing right now. It's a recent protocol. It's a recent protocol.

2:03:48SpeakerPardon me? Is this a protocol? Well, what was said, what Trudeau said there recently is that, you know what, things are as usual. They're still arresting patients, not patients, they're still arresting people for cannabis crimes. They're still taking, you know, it's still, nothing's changed in a sense, so... Sorry, I've been doing this all along with more of my questions pertaining to the recent situation.

2:04:22BubblemanSorry, ask the question again. His mic is reverberating everything you say, so I'll just ask you, John, to mute your mic when you're not talking and then unmute it when you want to talk, and that way you can answer ATN's questions that way best.

2:04:36SpeakerMy question was simply the... Police detaining you and going through your thing, is that a recent protocol or has that happened to you in the past? I've never had, they didn't detain me or nothing, I just stood there, they had my license and my driver's license and stuff like that so I was never detained. This was the first time I'd not flown in Canada quite a bit with my license always that they've ever, this has ever happened to me.

2:05:02SpeakerIt was, and it wasn't It was just random. They ran my thing. I went through the thing. The one guy opened up my bag and asked me what the jar was. So it's my weed. It's my medicine. I have my neck brace on and everything. But I think this has a lot to do with the liberal government because there's been 22,400 arrests is what they're saying. And since they've gone into power, there's this whole new platform of legalization, the right legislation over the next...

2:05:30SpeakerSix months, but they still have four days to appeal our court decision on patients being able to continue to grow and access cannabis. So it's just all sitting like this right now. I think we're all waiting on the UN to meet New York. It's interesting what's going on with the whole cannabis and legalization and the corporate entities and how everybody's just trying to jump in and how everything's working on the legal platform because...

2:05:57SpeakerLast week, I have a friend that has a legal dispensary in Vancouver going through all the processes, stage three. They drove into his driveway and took the money out of his basically hand and said, so that's organized crime, that's illegal, it's cannabis.

2:06:16BubblemanI think that's when people say they have legal dispensaries, I think that they have confused themselves because we don't have legal dispensaries. We need them. I want them. We've got to get them, but we do not have them.

2:06:30SpeakerIn the United States, we have states that allow it, and we have local municipalities that allow it, but the federal government can come in and destroy us all in a squish of a

2:06:44BubblemanThat's crazy.

2:06:45SpeakerBut that's why we all have to stay active. That's why we lobby. That's why we work with our city council. That's why, you know, we have, I belong to the NCIA, and we have a lobby day where over 100 of us are going to be lobbying in Washington, D.C., actually going out and talking because, you know, as much progress as we've all seen and all made, we still have a shitload of work to do, and until it's legal, we're all going to be harassed wherever we are.

2:07:11SpeakerAnd apparently the United States is the key to all this. And we have a lot of people at the UN right now and major proposals going out that it's going to be hitting the media majorly in the coming weeks because of all these countries around the world. And potentially we're hearing the United States getting behind it, which is the biggest thing because they have to change the 1961 drug treaty.

2:07:39SpeakerBecause if we don't, then we're going to continue to all be harassed. You're going to continue to get Trudeau just to say, oh, well, international treaty, we can't do anything to the fucking bad people. And even the UN has launched, you know, formal complaints against the state of Washington and Oregon and Colorado and Alaska because we have legalization going on here. And we're going around and still making countries execute people and harass them and, you know, Continue to eradicate cannabis.

2:08:12SpeakerTrust me, people, if you allow Trump to let Christie be our Attorney General here in the United States, say goodbye to the entire, any type of legal industry. They're going to come in and just bring the hammer down. So we can still see everything we have moving forward rolled right back if we don't stay active. So stay active locally. Get active if you're not. Get registered to vote.

2:08:37SpeakerIf you're not registered to vote, if you're in the United States, and vote. It matters. The Millennials are the largest per capita out there available for voting. And if you guys go out and ladies go out and actually vote and do something, you're going to actually see some real change. I don't care who you actually support, but it's the same thing with these initiatives. If you guys and gals don't go out and actually vote, And aren't actually registered to vote, to actually sign, to register these initiatives, you're wasting those people's time and our time because, you know, you may think it's funny and a giggle, but that counted two signatures then discounted and thrown out and they go through a certain rating of those and they'll throw out sheets and you can actually lose an initiative.

2:09:26SpeakerAnd I've been on the losing side of an initiative and I've had to sue to actually get my initiative back on the ballot four years later. And it's a headache, people. So, again, just my plea, again, stay active, stay involved, get into whatever you're in. I don't care who you believe in. Just get out there and vote and support the process.

2:09:46BubblemanWell, my buddy Marbleslinger, Glassblower, I saw him post on his Facebook page the other day, and it really made me laugh. He said, all these people say that voting is a waste of time. You know what else is a waste of time? Posting on fucking Facebook, but you all seem to do it all fucking day long. What's a few more seconds of wasted time? Go out and vote.

2:10:14SpeakerVote for Bernie Sanders. Bernie Sanders is the only guy who's going to basically legalize cannabis, so you got to vote for him. Feel the burn. Once Facebook and the government link up to create an app where you can vote through Facebook, Then shit might actually fucking happen. Well, we're starting to see here, such as the state of California, following other states like Oregon, as soon as you register for your driver's license, you're registered to vote.

2:10:40SpeakerAnd by seeing this type of large voter registration taking place, I think it will do nothing but good as long as people actually vote.

2:10:55BubblemanWell, it's a crazy situation regardless. You can only, you know, and you hear, I hear Mark say vote for Bernie Sanders because he's going to legalize cannabis. Well, that's what Trudeau promised us and all he's done since is arrest people for cannabis. He has not in any way, shape or form stood his ground and I'm very upset to see that it's gone this way, not overly surprised because Politicians lie to your face, and then when you elect them...

2:11:24SpeakerPoliticians that are owned by big corporations like him and like everybody else on the ballot except for Bernie Sanders. Oh yeah, except for Bernie Sanders, that's right.

2:11:35BubblemanHe's the only one that's different. It's not going to turn face and lie to your fucking face when he gets elected. That's right. I forgot. My bad.

2:11:45SpeakerNo, no, no, no, no. Mark, he's right in the sense that, I'm talking Scaldone, he is right in the sense that if Bernie were to get in, he would face the same obstructionism that the current president is finding. You think that just because Bernie's in power that he's actually going to reduce large scale industrial prison population? That's mostly owned by the states and controlled by the states.

2:12:08SpeakerSo even that one thing that he's spouting regarding the reduction in the actual prison system, it's a great idea, but the realities do not the rubber and the road meet. The buck stops there. The buck stops at the White House. The White House is basically the charge of the executive branch. The executive branch has to execute on the laws that are legislated by the legislative branch, and it starts there.

2:12:33SpeakerYou can't have another tool of large corporations, which is what Hillary is, and everyone on the other side. That's how we got Trudeau in right there.

2:12:42BubblemanLet go. Corporation, I'm telling you, man, it's exactly what played out in Canada. Oh, don't hire, don't vote for Harper, he's the most evil. We basically voted this cocksucker in because... He wasn't Harper. And now I hear the same thing. People saying, oh, I'll vote for anyone but Hillary or Trump. That's not a good enough fucking reason.

2:13:07SpeakerHe's the best guy for the job. He's the best guy for the job. He's not beholden to large corporations.

2:13:15BubblemanWhy don't we talk about it after he's elected and we'll see what he does. And it'll be amazing if he does what he says he will do. That's all I'm saying.

2:13:27SpeakerI'm much better than any of the alternatives that are... That's what they said about Trudeau. Look, I've lobbied locally, I've lobbied at the state level, I've lobbied at the federal level, and I've had my face lied to directly by every single one. Okay, so there's no such thing as an honest politician. Again, they're professional panderers. Even Bernie himself is just very good at it, and I like what he says.

2:13:51SpeakerBut I've dealt with politicians, I've dealt with the Senate, I've dealt with the House, and he's going to have to deal with them. And if you don't think that if they've been obstructionism... Of the highest order of Barack Obama, you don't think that they're not going to cockblock him all the way through his four years? I can't wait for Mitch McConnell to say that no, we have to wait for four more years to replace the Supreme Court Justice until we get a Republican in there.

2:14:21SpeakerI mean, it's absolutely ridiculous. The whole thing is... That's obstructionism on the Senate's part by not actually doing their own constitutional duty. And hopefully what we were talking about earlier in voting is people will actually deal with them in the actual ballot box as opposed to this 92%, you know, rehire rate that the Americans have allowed these politicians to do. Again, millennials, you're the largest voting per capita out there.

2:14:45SpeakerIf you actually got active and got involved, you could actually change things. If you want to stay, as the old man said, just petty and stick on Facebook, fine. We can have more of the same. But, you know, I don't want to see Hillary. I don't want to see Trump. I don't like politicians. I think our whole system's fucked right now. And the whole thing needs to be redone.

2:15:05SpeakerBut... Because it's completely bought out by the lobbyists. We at the NCIA, we have one or two lobbyists going against 1,000 tobacco lobbyists, going against 1,200 NRA lobbyists. And if you think about the actual numbers, they're stupidly staggering what we're up against. And that's why I say again is that we have still a lot of work to do. We've done a lot. We've done a little with a lot.

2:15:31SpeakerBut we still have so much more to do.

2:15:41SpeakerWell, I know they're working on access and we'll see what Chido's going to do here, but yeah, he's basically, we're not getting anywhere with what we've been promised, but at the same time we have legislation that has to be probably, well, we'll see what happens. You know, it's courts and government and as we sit as patients and as other people that are using this plant, we're being imprisoned and they're spending way too much money on it.

2:16:06SpeakerIt's It'll be interesting to see what's going to happen. I mean, we're putting so much big, huge corporate money into it. There's so many big LPs involved. There's so much big money involved on an international scale. Something is going to go. We're just not going to like the way we see it. It's going to be more controlled than probably what. I'm not saying there's alcohol or some kind of an Oxycontin or something like that.

2:16:28SpeakerIt's not going to be readily available. But it's going to happen. I mean, we're seeing it. There's just too much money involved with it right now. Well, that's why we have the initiative process right now. There's multiple initiatives right now in California that are gathering signatures and in other states are gathering signatures right now to be on the ballot here in 2016. And as we see more states come online and actually change, it's just going to be like the medical cannabis.

2:16:56SpeakerOnce we have the numbers and momentum on our side, it's only going to continue. So we're just continuing to pay Sisyphus a bit and push this rock uphill. But right now, you know, people are like, well, what initiatives do you support? I support all of them. You know, I want to see legalization happen in California. I got into this so that all our brothers and sisters were out of fucking jail.

2:17:16SpeakerYou know, I don't want to see bland handing and, you know, awards and all this shit really given out until all our brothers and sisters are free. The work still has to be done. You know, we can glad hand when all that stuff's done, but until then, we still are in a war, we're still fighting, and we still have to be active in the way of looking around And what's happening and how we can affect change.

2:17:37SpeakerSo if you're in California, find those initiatives, gather signatures, read about them, you know, get it on the ballot so actual change can happen because if you see it happen here, the ripples continue. And if we continue to sit on our ass, we'll continue to see more of the same and watch each one of us that sure enough get picked off time and time again as we, you know, be the vocal ones.

2:17:58SpeakerBut if we continue to actually Get active, get involved, no matter what your belief system is, then that change will happen. Don't be fatalistic. If we were all fatalistic, we wouldn't be where we are right now. We all saw enough of our life that we had to change things for ourselves that we got active and helped others. Now we need our other brothers and sisters now watching us.

2:18:19SpeakerThey need to grab each other and help lift each other up and educate themselves so that we have a more educated populace, which is why we all, right, we all volunteer our time here every Sunday to speak truth so that, you know, out of love and respect for this plant and to you, the viewer, so that you can be educated. We have this knowledge. We want to share it so that you can do something with it.

2:18:41SpeakerDon't sit there and do nothing with it. Actually, You know, get active. Please. If you can't get active, support those that are active. Be it financially, through your actions, through your support, your emails, letter writing. You've got to understand those conservatives out there going against us have real letter writing campaigns and are actually doing something right fucking now against us. They actually have organizations that are created to just go up against cannabis and You know, only just recently has DARE actually dropped cannabis from its actual curriculum.

2:19:16SpeakerOkay, so I'll get off my soapbox, but I just had to say my piece is that we're still not done here, people. Still shitload of work has to be done. There was also a rumor about DARE. It was not a true story. Yeah, that's not true. Hey, you're in your big soft brown chair that you're always in, ATN. You're not in a soapbox at all. You're in that big brown chair that we always see you in.

2:19:41SpeakerIt's made out of soapboxes. Oh, are you sitting on a soapbox? What is a soapbox? I've never even seen a soapbox before. What the hell does a soapbox look like? Soapbox back in the day were just literally a wooden crate that they would stand on so they could stand on a crowd. See, short men like me would get lost in a crowd, so by standing on a soapbox, I could be heard and people would look around and be like, what's the crazy fool saying over there?

2:20:07SpeakerAnd either they would listen or continue walking, so yeah. You're sitting in the throne where the Pope belongs.

2:20:14SpeakerNo throne, just a chair.

2:20:19SpeakerBlow smoke towards Berkeley. So with Pennsylvania, you guys had some recent change that's happening that seems to be more token than actual real reality. Well, we're going to be the next state to legalize medical cannabis, which is great. They've got a whole list of conditions here. But you can't grow it. You can't grow it. You can't grow it. Yeah, it's going to be a heavily regulated thing, kind of like the New York bill.

2:20:48SpeakerI'm just glad that they put autism on there and severe and chronic pain is on there, sickle cell anemia, glaucoma, intractable seizures. But it's pretty much only going to allow finished products, correct? It's not going to allow smokable cannabis. I think vaping is allowed. There was a confusion when they were drafting the legislation that Vaping and nebulizing were the same thing. I had to break it down.

2:21:16SpeakerI submitted some testimony that was given to one of the house members. I think they were just confused that a nebulizer can somehow be used. A nebulizer is used for a water-based delivery system. It's not practical to be used with cannabis at all. It doesn't He heated up to the right decarboxylation temperature, number one, and number two, just water is just a terrible vehicle. You would have to disperse it with some surfactant, and now you're breathing some surfactant in the air now.

2:21:49SpeakerIt just wasn't going to work at all. I just submitted a couple-page testimony on it, but there's a lot to be benefited by looking at

2:22:01SpeakerThe Colorado law and looking at the New York law and looking at other laws that they can kind of draw from what not to do or what to do. The real exciting thing I think is also it stole the thunder that the medical bill passed, but the hemp bill also passed. Pennsylvania is a big farming state, a big agriculture-based state. It was the cradle of the hemp industry during During the 13 colonies, you know, literally miles from my front door here along the banks of the Susquehanna River, in William Pence, Pennsylvania, you were taxed if you did not grow hemp because Her Majesty needed, you know, rope and ships needed sails and so they needed all of this hemp.

2:22:48SpeakerAnd so in places like Hemp Field, which is now up in Lancaster County, right up the road, it's mostly Amish farms right now, and those Amish are ready to grow hemp. As soon as there's an infrastructure to basically support the milling of the seeds and the making of hemp seed oil, the Amish are ready to grow hemp, and it's going to be a real big economic boom here in Pennsylvania in years to come.

2:23:16SpeakerPennsylvania also is the home of most of the hemp machinery that's made throughout or that's used throughout the world to harvest hemp is actually made right here in Pennsylvania. So it's nice that we can actually start growing it here again. That'd be awesome. I have a lot of love for PA. After the war, I spent time there and I worked with the Amish. I always had to wear long-sleeved shirts because if they saw my tattoos, they wouldn't speak to me.

2:23:41SpeakerBut Man, Aaron has some hard working people and I would love to see them working with him. Oh man, the hallmark of the Amish for people who don't know about this culture is that it's a high quality agricultural production which really fits well into the cannabis industry because they do everything organic. You know, there's sort of two sects in Pennsylvania. You have the Amish, which again, do not believe in the modern conveniences of life.

2:24:09SpeakerThey don't use gasoline powered Tractors, the Amish farmer that's just on the other side of the hill over here, I'll see him out there with full teams of horses plowing the field. It's really just such a stark image when you see a Land Rover going by this Amish guy in the field with basically, you know, just doing it like his grandfather and several generations did the year before.

2:24:34SpeakerAnd, you know, we buy all of our produce without exception between the months of August Oh, right around April to right around the end of October, all of our produce we buy from our local Amish farm because it's not only A, organic and freshly grown, it's also much less expensive. I get a huge head of like red leaf lettuce for like a dollar that's picked that day, grown organically by my local Amish farmer.

2:25:05SpeakerThe same head of lettuce would be $4 down at the grocery store right down the road. So it's much more economical to support your local farms. And these folks, ATN, are ready to grow hemp as soon as there is an infrastructure to basically take that crop and do something useful. They are ready to grow it, and they're ready to grow it. Well, the Mennonites, too. Now, the Mennonites are different.

2:25:30SpeakerSo the Mennonites will believe in electricity, and they believe in electricity. In gas-powered tractors, and their farms are a little bit bigger. They typically, yeah, I mean, again, grow corn.

2:25:43BubblemanSome Mennonites don't believe in gas-powered tractors. It's all buggy, no electricity. The guy who split, it was in 1963, this guy Jacob Amann, he was a Swiss Anabaptist leader, and he felt the church leaders were not holding to the strict separation from the world and that the spiritual renewal was needed, and he was the one that really sort of pushed that horse-drawn implement farming, plain and distinctive dress patterns, no electricity in homes, etc., etc.

2:26:13BubblemanI grew up in Manitoba, very close to Mennonite farms.

2:26:18SpeakerYeah, I mean, they're hardworking people, Mark. Again, I'm not confessing like I believe their religion is their own deal.

2:26:26BubblemanYeah, it's their beliefs.

2:26:28SpeakerBut they really, I mean, again, this Amish family that's over by me, I mean, I've watched the kids grow up in this family. It's just a very interesting image when you go there the night before Thanksgiving and, you know, you have BMWs and, Range Rovers Park next to this place where there's a horse and buggy. And then, yeah, I mean, it's just so weird because you get up to the front of the line and then there's this little 14-year-old Amish girl, you know, with the bonnet and the lace, dainty, and she's rifling through a stack of 20s like a Vegas dealer, you know.

2:27:02SpeakerI'll be right with you, sir. I mean, it's just such a stark image because they understand... Value, and as soon as there's something valuable that can be grown from the ground, oh man, the Amish are all over, at least here in Pennsylvania. If it could be grown and people want it, the Amish want to grow it, and they grow it inexpensively and good and organic, and their products are just wonderful.

2:27:27SpeakerIt's great. One of the benefits of living in this area of Pennsylvania. Do the Amish do cannabis at all?

2:27:37SpeakerIt depends if you watch that show Amish Mafia. I guess, I mean, no. Yeah, you know, you get the same thing from watching Weed Wars from all cannabis people. You can't generalize like that. Yeah, no, I would think again because it's, if they grew it, maybe they would. Who knows? But right now, I do know that there is some sort of black market cannabis that is growing up in Lancaster County and You know, that's where the Amish are, so, you know.

2:28:07SpeakerThe Amish kush. Put the Amish kush.

2:28:13SpeakerThat's right. It's Amish dabs, right? Something. Would it be OG for OJ to Daya?

2:28:23SpeakerOJ to Daya. I think they're the perfect workers for this industry because they understand high quality agricultural production. And they don't complain about less than ideal work conditions. They are really the ideal agricultural farmer. They really are. They're the people of the land. Right.

2:28:50SpeakerSo what makes Amish Hayes Amish?

2:28:55SpeakerIs it the belief system of the cannabis? No.

2:29:04SpeakerMark, are there, so there's a lot of Amish folks up in Manitoba. Are they, they're agricultural?

2:29:10BubblemanYeah, they're agricultural people. They all own farms and Mennonites mostly, but Amish as well. Are they growing hemp up there, do you know? I'm not sure if the Mennonites, the Mennonites must be growing some hemp because at this point in time, we've been growing it for over 20 years legally. We grow... Thousands of hectares annually in our province, and I can't imagine that they would miss out on any sort of profitable new agricultural product to be grown in the prairies.

2:29:50MikeI just wanted to touch on, I mean, regardless of where people's political stances, whoever they're voting for, it's going to be a Interesting election. The three or four frontrunners, both Hillary, Trump, and Bernie, have all agreed that the U.S. national law in regards to cannabis is not sustainable. Obviously Bernie has said that he would like to see cannabis outright descheduled, and as a president he would have presidential authority to remove cannabis from the scheduling of drugs.

2:30:31MikeHillary suggested that she would prefer to see it in Schedule 2, which would then lead us down a road requiring FDA trials on any cannabis-based pharmaceutical and nutraceutical drugs. But ultimately, it's going to be reliant on activists on a state level, no matter who gets elected in the next election. We're going to continue to have to be activists, continue to educate activists, Our legislators continue to force on a state, local, and national level improvements to the laws.

2:31:04MikeWe will not see the law change overnight and the floodgates open. It's going to be a slow and steady progressive evolution in the industry. And what I'm actually excited to see is what's going to happen in April. For those viewers that haven't heard, in April the UN is actually meeting to re-sign the UN Singles Treaty. The UN Singles Treaty is the treaty that both Harper as well as Obama have said that due to international treaties, national governments cannot legalize cannabis.

2:31:40MikeNow, if I was an activist in any country, I would be contacting their UN representatives, their UN office, and begging, pleading, and providing whatever evidentiary information is necessary so that When the UN Singles Treaty is convened, ironically enough, April 18th through 20th, they can actually amend the UN Singles Treaty to allow jurisdictions, whether it be national governments or state governments, to pass progressive laws. So if you're, no matter where you are in the world, please contact your local UN office and explain to them why we need to have progressive UN stipulations included into the UN treaties.

2:32:28SpeakerVery important.

2:32:29SamDo you understand that the UN does not ban medical use? It just has to be controlled by the state, whereas recreational is what they actually ban.

2:32:41SpeakerYes, but that treaty actually allows, makes it that they have to have a cannabis eradication program going on in their country. And that's one of the most important things that we want to see reversed.

2:32:53SamOkay, but all I'm saying is that medical use, it is legal to produce medical cannabis and use it. All you have to do is follow the control system of the United Nations.

2:33:08SpeakerThe U.S. doesn't seem to want to follow that, and they choose to ignore it willfully depending on where and where you are. And until we change this at that treaty, we're only going to continue to see, as I said before, just all of us getting harassed one way, shape, or form wherever we are. I agree, in principle, absolutely, Sam. That's always kind of been the case. However, explain that to the people in Michigan.

2:33:30SpeakerExplain that, you know, that just saw raids happening this week, you know, and continuing harassment even though they've got medical on the books there in their state.

2:33:38SamYeah, but they're not plugged into the national American and the United Nations control scheme where they weigh everything, they control the disposal, everything is all by book. And I'm not saying that they're right, I'm just saying that they're not following it, and that's the difference. In the Netherlands, for example, Bedrocan produces for the pharmacies, and it's all part of the United Nations Single Convention.

2:34:11SpeakerActually, I was contacted by a hash church here from Germany who was telling me that They're trying to allow for medical cannabis, and medical cannabis is allowed, but the only thing that's allowed is the better can, and it's $22 a gram. And they don't like it because it's a Jack Herrera.

2:34:27SamWell, that's true to a certain level, but, for example, two people just kind of quitted in Germany, I think, just in the last few days or a week. Where they were growing, and they were also legally allowed to buy Bedricon, but they grew it because it was cheaper, and they got acquitted. So I'm not sure that's applicable to everybody.

2:34:50SpeakerWhat state was that in?

2:34:53SamI don't know. I'll look it up, and I'll send it to you later.

2:34:56SpeakerYes, please. Because when I was talking to the gentleman in Germany, I was asking if there was a medical defense, and he said at this time, no. But if that's the case, that sets precedents.

2:35:07SamI got the newsletter from the IACM this afternoon.

2:35:13SpeakerWell, we have the same program here in Canada, Sam, the same as in the Netherlands. It was granted access for patients. It was grown by CannaSat Prairie Plant Systems. For a number of years until then we won the right, but now we have more LPs coming into question and stuff like that that were granted to supply cannabis for ill patients and stuff that was through those huge, the convention laws were from 1961, I believe.

2:35:39SpeakerSo through medical purposes and scientific research. So through the McGill University here in Canada and Ottawa was... I can't think of the gentleman's name right now. He did all the research on it and we're still moving forward with the medical system in Canada and that's why I'm able to grow my own and consume cannabis right now. It was through those whole laws from 1961.

2:36:05MikeYeah, and I'm sure we will see that as the industry evolves, no matter what country you're in, it is always harder for our government to take away what is perceived as quintessential human rights than it is to grant commercial rights. So by addressing your local politicians or legislators and saying that, you know, look at these potential pharmaceutical drugs that could kill me, and here is a safer, non-harmful substance, It's going, you know, we have the law, we have the evidence on our side.

2:36:39MikeWhat we don't have on our side are the laws. And by any one of us educating our legislators, those legislators will, even though it's small steps, being able to educate legislators is going to allow for those small steps to slowly open up the doors for all of us to do what we love.

2:37:00SpeakerSo in Canada, at Since Bedrocan became Tweed, has that cannabis made it to market yet? Has anybody seen the quality of that cannabis?

2:37:13SpeakerMarcus, anyone?

2:37:15BubblemanI haven't seen the Bedrocan herb myself. The only really thing that they got my eye, a few things. They obviously hired a very good friend of mine by the name of Hillary Black, who founded the BC Compassion Club here, a good friend of a lot of the panels as well. From there, the next thing that I saw was that they dropped their price, that they had gone down to $5 a gram while dispensaries were still charging $10 and $12.

2:37:41BubblemanSo I thought that was a very powerful move on their part. But as for quality, I haven't seen the herb. I haven't seen what they're producing. I couldn't make an accurate statement on what that herb looks like.

2:37:54SpeakerYeah, I've only seen the veg budget.

2:37:58BubblemanYeah, even on the Canadian...

2:38:01SpeakerWhat kind of genetics do they have? Does anyone know?

2:38:04SamI'm pretty sure it's Jack Carrar, the high THC variety. But they also have CBD varieties. They have four or five different kinds, but Jack Carrar is the THC one.

2:38:16SpeakerYeah, it's the bedrocan, the regular floss is Jack Carrar because they were supposedly some of the original breeders in the Netherlands because I've only seen the Dutch because I went to the Dutch grow and did the whole bedrocan It's all right. The way they grow it is interesting. I won't go into that, but I've grown and can grow it better.

2:38:57SpeakerAre they growing it in the ground in a greenhouse or is it in? They're growing it in pods and pots. They put it in a pot and they put it in a room and then never go in that room.

2:39:11SamWhen I saw it growing up near Groningen, I thought they were using rock wool. Maybe at the very end they weren't. I don't remember, to be honest.

2:39:22SpeakerThey were using the clay rocks when I was there. They were, of course, doing the clones and the rock wool. And they did have rock wool for the mothers, but then they go into the other one.

2:39:33MikeThey go into the pots, and then they put the watering system in, and then they close it all in.

2:39:41SpeakerWhich I thought was an interesting way because most every garden I've ever been in, everyone's always gone in it.

2:39:46SamThat way they can label it as untouched by human hands.

2:39:51SpeakerCorrect. But it also still has to be irradiated too. Due to that methodology. Yeah, if only someone had touched it and said, this plant has PM, maybe they wouldn't. Is that just because, without just trashing bedrocan, is that because that's where they learn their standard practice of other plants, or is that something they only invented as a wacky science to cannabis, like not touching plants? That makes no sense.

2:40:18SpeakerThey have, and they're on, I guess, their second or third contract, or every five year contract with the Dutch government. And their whole thing is consistent cannabis. And the whole thing they've always tested is to be consistent. It's always consistent. So they grow it the same, feed it the same, and have done it from the beginning the same way. They're not changing anything because they're just shooting for consistency.

2:40:44SpeakerAnd that's what the Dutch standards call for is just consistency. If it comes in between this range and after it's irradiated, of course it doesn't have any molds or mildews, So, bam, it's ready for market. I went to a pharmacy where they actually get it in bulk for the patients who can't afford it in the individual jars, and it's cheaper for the pharmacy then to just dole it out locally to the patients as opposed to sending it off, which incurs another cost into packaging into the yellow containers.

2:41:20BubblemanAh, the yellow containers.

2:41:23SamBottom line is, in the Netherlands, you can buy better weed cheaper in a coffee shop, and that's what most patients do. Bedrocon is not a financial success in the Netherlands.

2:41:35SpeakerI was told in 2012 it was finally cheaper than Dutch cannabis. Since you're there, you know the truth more than I do.

2:41:44SamWell, I can honestly say I don't go to coffee shops very often either.

2:41:51SpeakerOkay, so Sam, you just answered our question for us, which is that artisan produced cannabis on a much smaller scale is more desirable to cannabis users than Mass-produced, you know, okay cannabis on a much larger scale.

2:42:10SamWell, they're hardly mass-produced. I mean, they're a bit mass-produced, but not really compared to a greenhouse production or something like that. But the real core problem with small-scale artisan is the lack of control over the use of insecticides, herbicides, fungicides. And what they do with leftover fertilizers, leftover anything, most of them flush it down the toilet.

2:42:39SpeakerSam, since you rarely go to coffee shops, and I will ask you, what coffee shops do you frequent when you actually go?

2:42:45SamI think the last one I went to was the Bulldog because Mila had a birthday party there.

2:42:54SpeakerOkay, where was a place where you would actually purchase cannabis then?

2:42:59SamOh, no. Last time I did was when Dr. Osole was in town. I took him out to a coffee shop and I bought some skunk so he could see it.

2:43:10SpeakerWhat decade was that?

2:43:11SamOh, 10, 15, 20 years ago.

2:43:19SpeakerI thought you were going to give us some cool coffee shop that we could go to that had the most amazing strains.

2:43:24SamNo, I'm the wrong guy to talk to, really.

2:43:29SpeakerI always enjoyed Katsu because they always had the hazes.

2:43:34SamYou're right, and the gray area and the bluebird were traditionally known as interesting places, too, for variety.

2:43:44SpeakerExcellent.

2:43:49MikeYeah, Mark, I think to answer your question, I think that artisanal farms that spend their time, spend their passion developing cultivars and trying to maximize the terpene preservation is going to always outclass the farms that are trying to, on large scales, produce lots of weight, homogenize it, and irradiate it. Now, naturally there is going to be a commercial, it's going to be advantageous for commercial companies to do the R&D, do test plots, to figure out what grow methodologies, what soil medium, what lights, etc.

2:44:27Mikeproduce the best product. But ultimately, The passion that comes with small artisanal farms is going to, far and away, produce better products.

2:44:40SpeakerWe have that in California with wineries. You have the large-scale wineries where you've got the Mogan David and all those others that are mass-produced, but then you've got these fine artisan wineries that, I'm not much of a wine drinker, but to wine drinkers, it knocks their dick in the dirt. They're happier than a... So I think it's the same thing is applicable. Once it is finally legal, et cetera, et cetera, you're going to have places that are artisan areas.

2:45:12SpeakerMaybe you'll have the Mendocino or Humboldt will be the Napa Valley or you'll see like Meigs County in Ohio, be the Humboldt County of Ohio, all these things that you'll see these regional areas. Then have small concentration because there will be the perfect sunshine, the perfect soil, just like they found for wine. And I think you will see congregations and people will sell their artisan cannabis that will only be available at that particular area.

2:45:41SpeakerSo that's how we look at it here because we already see it with the wine countries.

2:45:45SamWell, the one difference that I feel is that you can produce large quantities in absolute highest, highest, highest quality. I really think you're mistaken about that. If you look at some of the wineries that produce some of the best wine in the world, they produce millions of bottles, I mean some of them.

2:46:07MikeI 100% agree with you, Sam. The difficult part that I've seen is, you know, In markets, it costs me essentially $300 to do an analytical test because the state requires us to have independent third party tests above and beyond any internal testing that we do. When we're looking at supplying medicine on a large scale, as much as I would love to produce 99% dry sift, if I wanted to sell that through a commercial market, it would oftentimes be cost prohibitive to the medical patients.

2:46:43MikeI agree. And that's unfortunate. Now, I am a patient. I would gladly pay the exorbitant prices that many shops offer their top quality hashes for. That said, we have to keep in mind that there are patients who have extremely costly medical bills, need low-cost medications. So finding that happy medium of being able to produce keeps and dry sifts, Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

2:47:42SamAll the value out of it in the end. But they'll still be able to produce dry sift for a much more reasonable price once the prohibition leftover of cannabis is really gone and it's just a normal commercial crop.

2:48:01MikeAbsolutely. And that's what we really want to push for is allowing those cutting edge technologies to help improve the efficacy whether it be Being able to recycle your soil using organics so that you can cut the cost out of that and therefore reduce your cost of goods sold. And then improving the technology so that instead of getting a, I believe I saw it was like, Tony, you can, nope, Tony's not here.

2:48:29MikeOn the terpene extractions, you get an extremely low yield. By improving the efficiency with that, you can get much higher yields. Same with CO2 or butane extractions. As much as people may not be for butane extractions, you can produce high quality solvent extractions at a much significantly lower cost just because you can do your dry sift extraction and then follow it up with a solvent extraction. That solvent extraction then can produce an oil that per milligram is going to be a lower cost than the full melt dry sifts.

2:49:08SpeakerAnd for me, I do the dry sift. Then from there, I do the bubble hash. And then from there, I can actually decarb it. And then I can consume it in a capsule form, open it in coconut oil, and redo it that way. So I get three different forms of my medicine, 100%.

2:49:24BubblemanSpeaking of medicine, my wife just brought me some fresh squeezed juice. I am so happy right now. Oh, what's this one? Clarity, apple, carrot, pineapple, and orange.

2:49:37SpeakerWhere's the pickle juice? Wouldn't it be nice if it said on there 13% THC?

2:49:43BubblemanApple, lemon, and fresh ginger. I think I'm going to go with orange. You've got to go orange. You've got to go orange sometimes. Where's the pickle juice?

2:49:53SpeakerIt's not available retail just yet, Mark. But it should be. I'm sure it... I heard in Trader Joe's, like, they have the craziest things these days. I bet there's pickle juice in Trader Joe's, like, in the therapeutic zone. No, pickle juice is the juice that the pickles are swimming in. You want pickle juice, just buy pickles and drink the juice. That's it, man. Fuck up my pickles.

2:50:17SpeakerIf my pickle sticks out of the water, it's going to shrivel. No, no. I'm saying after you've taken the pickles out, you eat the pickles first. Then you're left with this bottle of juice. My wife did that, and it had the one pickle in it that looks like the doo-doo log sample. I don't want to drink it when it looks like that. No, my wife was like, don't touch it.

2:50:35SpeakerIt's the pickle juice jar. I'm like, how much pickle juice are you stockpiling for the war? No, my family, we love weird shit like that, so I've been through pickle juice excess. Yeah, pickles might be the world's most perfect food, right? I mean, you could do anything to a pickle. I suggested pickles and peanut butter for weight loss and everybody booed, but it actually controls your satiety levels and satiates you pretty quick with peanut butter and pickles and crackers if anyone's looking to lose weight since we're on the pickle topic.

2:51:06SpeakerYeah, it's the sodium. There's a lot of sodium in there and I think what it does Like with your sore throat is it creates that saline hyper-solidity environment that really starts driving the ion channels to expel all kinds of crap out of the cell. So I think there is actually a basis for using pickle juice to basically try to, I don't know, get your terpenes and get your cells cleaned out.

2:51:35BubblemanWell, I'm really happy to just have some fresh juice. My throat feels... Oh, so much better just from a little sip of OJ. Gotta love this juice. Never pasteurized.

2:51:48SpeakerYeah, the other thing with pickle juice, and obviously with some of the juices you're drinking there, Mark, is that they're low pH. And here's the thing about vinegar. I mean, vinegar, which is acetic acid, is low pH. And for those of us who are going to be celebrating Easter next weekend, you always put a little bit of We're going to talk a little bit about the protein that's in your vinegar in your Easter egg coloring.

2:52:11SpeakerThe reason why is because it protonates the protein on the Easter egg that makes it hold the dye better, so the dye will be a little bit more intense if it's treated with a little bit of acid. The other thing that acetic acid, which is vinegar, is really good for, if you ever get a sunburn, if you're ever out in the sun and you get that really red sunburn where it really Is very painful and then it starts itching the next day.

2:52:40SpeakerThe best remedy in the world. Don't buy any of the crap at the drugstore because it's all pH relevant and all you need to do is soak it with a little bit of white vinegar. White vinegar will make that itching and that burning sensation of a sunburn go away. Works every time.

2:52:58MikeYeah, I was actually going to suggest one of the things that one of the veganic chefs I know, you can take vinegar, white vinegar or vinegar and dissolve flowers in it, but you can pour vinegar, mix it with honey, and then dilute it with water, and that actually makes a great way of not only flushing out your sodium channels with the sodium in the pickle juice or the vinegar, but then coating it with a source of honey.

2:53:26MikeIt reminds me of one of the recipes Dr. Russo spoke about. When people get too high, you can actually modulate the high by providing them lemonade because lemonade actually is a natural inhibitor to the stoniness, the narcotic effects of high amounts of THC.

2:53:48BubblemanThat's cool. I just love the ingredients list on this. Ingredients. Apple, lemon, and fresh ginger. That's it. Why do we need anything else on there? What the fuck am I going to drink?

2:54:03SpeakerI had a question. I had a question.

2:54:06BubblemanSam could come.

2:54:09SpeakerHello there, Sam.

2:54:14SpeakerHis mic is muted. Well, I picked up some Neville's Haze here. And remember we were talking about it was a 14-week. But you had mentioned that most Neville's Haze is like, what, 16 or 18 even?

2:54:32SpeakerBubble Man? I'm sorry? The Neville's Haze. How long should it be grown out? Because I picked some up again recently, and I really like it. It's got like a sweetie tart kind of...

2:54:45BubblemanIt really depends on which Neville's Haze you're growing, I think, because... I've heard anywhere from 18 to 24 weeks.

2:55:05MikeSo I've got a question for Mark. I know it. That's beautiful. Mark, with Phytocannabinoids, as I recall, are a biosynthesized form of a terpenoid, and what happens is in the, as the CBDA or THCA synthase binds a terpene from a, what is it, a phytol, so possibly would Harvesting plants early for, in Tony's example, harvesting a haze at say 10 or 12 weeks as opposed to letting it go 18, would that, I guess, lead to higher levels of precursor terpenoids and lower levels of phytocannabinoids?

2:55:56SpeakerThat's why I'm talking about it because what I notice is in plants that are allowed to let go their full maturity, I see a lot more terpene yields. And what we're doing, then when the plants are pulled very early. So, and I think that has to do with, you know, the heads swelling up in the last several weeks, finishing out. But I see a difference in early versus late.

2:56:24SpeakerThat's why I wanted to know on the Neville's Haze how long people were growing that out for.

2:56:33SpeakerIt looks like it could go longer.

2:56:37SpeakerYes, so I think your point, Mike, was that actually, chemically speaking, cannabinoids are terpenes, right? So when you formed a bond between GPP, which is geranyl pyrophosphate, and allotolic acid by CBGA synthase, That carbon-carbon bond formation that happens there is you're basically making a bond between a phenol, which is all talvic acid, and these terpenes. It's a phenylated terpene, I guess is the way you would describe CBGA, which again is the precursor for both CBDA and THCA.

2:57:31SpeakerIn most

2:57:35SpeakerHi CBD varieties. You see a lot of CBG and you see a lot of, or not a lot, but I've seen some that have a market amount of CBC, more CBC than I see in high THC varieties. I don't know if that answers your question, but I think to the point is that in terpene production, terpene production and cannabinoid production kind of go hand in hand because They're both reliant on geranial pyrophosphate as their biosynthetic precursor.

2:58:10SpeakerWhen that just does a beta elimination, you have You have myrcene when it does the cyclization to the terpenyl cation. You basically make all the things like limonene and terpenylene and all the other six-membered ring-containing ones. So certainly, I think they do go hand in hand. So if you go back in the biosynthetic pathway and you look at where does geranial pyrophosphate come from, I'm sure, again, if Chimera were here, he'd probably chime in, that, again, this is a ubiquitous material that's Thank you so much for joining us today.

2:58:45SpeakerWe're going to get started in about a minute.

2:59:09SpeakerEspecially on the high CBD varieties, you always got to remember too that sometimes in the extraction process itself, CBD can sometimes interchange just like some of these terpenes. So depending on the thermal conditions of your process, you can actually convert CBD into THC. Mark, is that the patent I saw where they were, basically it sounded like they were basically short path distilling in the presence of nitrogen?

2:59:39SpeakerAnd that was converting it? Like it seemed, the document I read for converting it had required nitrogen with the heat process. It didn't happen normally. Yeah, they were doing what's called a hot sparge. So basically you're just, you know, basically blowing nitrogen in there at some temperature. And the reason why you want to keep nitrogen down there is because So what's happening is that you're converting CBD into THC, but you've got to remember that if you do that conversion in the presence of air, especially air, you're going to start getting CBN formation.

3:00:19SpeakerSo the reason why they're doing that under nitrogen is to make sure that they're controlling the environment over the top. Thank you for joining us.

3:00:42SpeakerThank you for joining us today.

3:01:07SpeakerSo which would you recommend? Like if I'm, let's say, someone gives me, and they're like, oh, I grew this 20 to 1 for my child, and I saw you make the distillate, can you distill it? I don't want to give them back a different ratio of THC. There are multiple different techniques for sparging. It doesn't have to be nitrogen-based. Would it be more appropriate to take on a percent of CBN as a different fraction than expose it to nitrogen and have it convert to something potentially psychoactive?

3:01:35SpeakerFor, you know, the hypothetical child. CBN is psychoactive. CBN is... Yeah, but it's in a different flask. I'm going to pull my CBN as a separate fraction that I can keep out of it. But if I end up with THC in my CBD, it's not as easy to pull out. CBN always seems to come after, so that's kind of why I like... If you're doing a vacuum distillation, if you're doing like a short path or a cougar distillation and you're doing it under vacuum, by definition there's no air in the system.

3:02:06SpeakerYou've evacuated all of the air out. So if you're heating it up and you've removed all the air, you shouldn't really see too much conversion over to CBN because CBN formation requires air. When you start seeing that smoking, like if you're ever... You're doing this out open under atmospheric conditions. You'll heat it up, and when you heat up your cannabis oil, it'll start bubbling at about 110 or 120 degrees.

3:02:40SpeakerYou're going to start seeing white smoke coming off the top of that. That white smoke is water vapor because you've heated up the cannabis oil above the boiling point of water. And in order for THC and CBN to be converted to CBN, it has to react with the oxygen and air. And what it's doing is it's reducing, while the aromatic ring is forming, it's oxidizing the cannabinoids, it's reducing the oxygen and air to water.

3:03:10SpeakerAnd because you're above the boiling point of water, the water appears as steam or white smoke. So when you start seeing that white smoke, what you'll see on the HPLC is you'll start seeing So again, I think the cascade is that CBD cyclizes to go to THC, and then if given the opportunity to react with air, THC on thermal heating will eventually go to CBN. Okay, because yeah, no, I used to use atmospheric sparging, but because that document freaked me out, I never leaned in the direction of nitrogen sparging.

3:03:51SpeakerI just moved to it. But I don't want to end up in a situation where I'm creating THC out of CBD out of somebody's product. If that was in order for a ton and it changed the ratio, someone would be very pissed. Yeah, this is the reason why you can't distill CBD, right? You have to crystallize CBD because if you heat it up, it just cyclizes.

3:04:16SpeakerSo is there ultimately, because I do see, like this was one of those questions, I see people able to distill CBD, but then they'll always say it was locally grown. Anytime you seem to try to do it out of a hemp powder, it's a disaster. So I never knew if it was a hard set rule that CBD always had to be crystallized ultimately in the end, or if it was a limit based on people working with like imported hemp, decarbed hemp, dirty hemp, because I do see CBD products that look The part, I don't know their test results, but they always say it's local, like they had access to something else than powder.

3:04:56SpeakerYou know, if it's enriched with enough CBDA or CBD, they can crystallize it from an oil. So a 20 to 1 oil, or like a 30 to 1 oil, I wouldn't be surprised if you cool that down with petroleum ether, that you can precipitate out the CBD crystals from that. So, but I would think, again, the reason why I think it's problematic is because you're going to make HC when you distill CBD.

3:05:20SpeakerThere's no question about it. Can't keep it from happening. Okay, well, that's a scientific hard set rule. There's no point in boiling anymore. At least it saves time. There's no way to boil upside down and change the rules of the universe. There's a reason why THC and CBD seem to take different paths and you don't see a huge dearth of CBD on the market. It's there, but it seems that it's always going to come out as a different ratio.

3:05:49SpeakerYeah, I mean, I was just going to say there's GW patents that describe the purification of both THC-A and CBD-A and CBD and THC from high cultivars. Most of it is chromatography. Very rarely do you actually see distillation being used. I think it's because chromatography can just be used so much more effectively to get the purified fractions of material. Yeah, but I, you know, I have to be a real chemist to hold petroleum ether and not be a bastard, so I never ever will.

3:06:26SpeakerI don't know about that, but... I'm not saying people can't. I'm just, that's a lot, those are those lines that I draw personally where now I feel like that's the part of cannabis I don't want to see. I don't go where basically someone else, that professional, should just be controlling. Like when you do it, you would never do it without a fume hood where someone else is like, I gotta get those crystals now.

3:06:52SpeakerOh yeah. I'm not a fan. Like the attraction to attempt it. That's the problem. Breaking Bad proves that the average man can participate in chemistry, and that's what is not, it's not so simple as that. The simple man doesn't survive chemistry. Whenever you're dealing with volatile chemicals and chemicals that you could be exposed to, it has to be dealt with in a fume hood. I mean, that's the way OSHA regulates all other industries, and that's the way they'll someday regulate this industry.

3:07:22SpeakerBut just to, you know, there's no magic to crystallization. If you have a high CBD oil and you're looking to crystallize CBD from it, all you really need to do is just find the right polarity solvent to crystallize out the material. And what you're looking for there is a solvent where at warm temperature everything goes into solution. But as that solvent cools, your impurities stay in solution.

3:07:51SpeakerBut your crystals crash out. And so that requires a little bit of art because there's a lot of practical learning that you learn over the years on how to take gooey-goos and how to make crystals. And as soon as I make crystals, I praise the Lord and then I take a melting point because melting point is just a wonderful way to determine how pure your crystals are if the melting point is recorded.

3:08:20SpeakerAnd remember that you can only get a lower melting point than with the pure melting. So if the pure melting point of something is reported in the literature, any impurities in that crystal that might make that crystal slightly impure, slightly yellow, are only going to decrease the melting point. So you can't increase the melting point from the known melting point. And so again, melting point, without needing a spectrometer, without needing any special fancy equipment, All you have to know is at what temperature does the crystal melt, and if you know at what temperature the crystal melts, you can compare that to literature value and see how pure you are.

3:08:59SpeakerIs that enough? In our market in Canada, there's no crystals, let's say, until after this hash church of CBD, but is just... I don't want to take a dab of no ether. How do you know and what percentage? It just freaks me out. It's just like shatter is where it stores the most butane. When it goes into a butter structure, it releases it all. So when I see crystals and I'm like, you just pulled them out of your freezer and you poured it off?

3:09:28SpeakerDid you even wash it with water? How hot was the water? Or did you just basically fan dry and pull it back and go? Like that's kind of, people don't even know what shape of crystals let's say would, could represent a complete process versus incomplete. The other thing, we talked a little bit about this in my class last week and had some great input from people who were in the room and people who were on the line.

3:09:57SpeakerSo as things crystallize, they also create Little void volumes within the crystal and lattice structure that can hold solvent or that can trap terpenes. We talked about the whipping that goes into the live resin and how the whipping with air actually creates surface area on which these things nucleate, which is why you can't see through live resin. That's why live resin scatters light. But going back to the point, it's more germane to crystallization is that If you're trying to crystallize something, first of all, you have to know that it's crystalline to begin with.

3:10:34SpeakerOnce you know it's crystalline, then the question is how pure can you get it in the non-crystalline stage, and can you actually do a crystallization? In most cases, like with THCA or with CBDA, A lot of the impurities that can be in there that can keep it from crystallizing are pretty non-polar. And so something like petroleum ether or petroleum ether diethyl ether mixtures where you're tuning a little bit more polarity by adding the diethyl ether in there will be enough to solubilize all the impurities and hopefully at low temperature crash out your crystalline solid if it's there in a high enough concentration.

3:11:18SpeakerSo would you give a CBD crystal to a baby?

3:11:23SpeakerWould I give what now? A CBD crystal. Literally, I'm looking at the fact that people are like, yeah, that's the purest. I'll get that instead of the black oil. People are motivated. What is it about that? What temperature did your CBD melt at? I'd want to compare it to the literature melting point to be able to show that my stuff that I'm making compares favorably to the literature value.

3:11:46SpeakerWell, no, you aren't going to make it right, sir. That's not a question. If I go on Instagram and it just says CBD Crystals, 99.999% pure, $120 online, people go, yeah, that's what I need to solve this problem. Ask them what the melting point is. You know there's no such thing as a melting point.

3:12:06BubblemanPeople are going to be encouraged to buy that over some negative... How is there no such thing as a melting point when everyone has a denail just out of curiosity? Is it really that fucking hard to get a melting point on something?

3:12:18SpeakerIt's not, but I look at what's marketed and I'm like, wait a minute. You know we're different. We're not even going to buy it. But when I look at the fact, holy shit, this is everywhere. People are just going to have this ship. It's crystals, and it's, you could say, the highest form of purity, but it's also carrying the highest potential for an accident to happen if it's impure.

3:12:42SpeakerIs there anything to tell people who are basically gaga over it? Because we don't have it in Canada, but if it shows up in Canada, nobody's going to ask for a melting point. They're just going to snatch it. That's kind of why I'm like, it's funny, nobody really scrutinizes me. I scrutinize myself. In other situations, people end up with a different product. Like, you're talking about crystallization, and I know it's done right, but can petroleum ether be a problem?

3:13:08SpeakerLike, when should people not try this? I never did that part. When you repristalize in a solvent like that, you filter it. When you filter it off... You've basically now taken the solvent away so the solvent is no longer associated with the crystalline material. You then typically take that crystalline material and dry it under vacuum in a desiccator and you basically dry it until the manometer goes down to the best that your vacuum could pull and then you've convinced yourself that there is no residual solvent in there.

3:13:41SpeakerNow certainly you can go and test that but the easiest test In and of itself is you just take a melting point. If the melting point is right on the literature melting point, then your purity is established. Mark, let me make a comment. You said something about the denail. What I'm finding is that the temperature setting on denails deviates greatly from the actual temperature setting of the nail itself.

3:14:12SpeakerIt's called a temperature laser. Right, but even those surface temperature things can also be a little bit misleading.

3:14:23BubblemanIs it better than nothing, or should we just completely avoid using them at all? No, no, no, no, no.

3:14:28SpeakerI think it gives you a good ballpark result. I mean, I don't know. What's the barbecue meter thing I have in my hand? It's thermally touching so that it's not a reflection. Just get a turkey thermometer. Right. You know the thing is stick the meat. Bubble Man doesn't stick much meat, so I know you wouldn't have one. I have one of those too, and you can get one at any grocery store, Target, or whatever.

3:14:49SpeakerThey're just like in the food. They're great. The problem is that most of those thermocouples contain materials that aren't thermally stable at like nail temperature. So if you touch any of those things to your nail, it's just either going to melt, So what I'm trying to say Mark is it's difficult to use a nail as a melting point apparatus and I think the cheapest melting point apparatus is like I don't know like 500 bucks so it is maybe not as easy as it might seem to get a good melting point but this is a standard piece of apparatus in most organic chemistry labs.

3:15:32BubblemanPost it up in Hash Church today, maybe, Mark. I'm sure people would love the idea of being, I mean, people spend $50,000 on their motherships. $500 might not be as much as you think.

3:15:47SpeakerYeah, I mean, I know that the melt temp apparatus itself costs $1,086. People can do that. People will post real melt temps and post some $1,200 piece of gear. If you can find it and think it's a good one, it's sold. Well, I told you, as soon as I come across that big pile of money that I'm looking for someday, Horatio, I'm going to buy you one.

3:16:15SpeakerFor now, I guess we'll just take it across three D-nails and average the number. Yeah, for now we can just praise the Lord. We'll just praise the Lord and just stop there, I guess. Praise the Lord! Yeah, but again, the context that was mentioned was would you give this CBD crystal to a baby and then, you know, people are, you're essentially talking about buyers or People on the market, and if they've got to then take their medicine home and melt it to figure it out as pure, I mean, that's kind of fucked up.

3:16:46SpeakerIt's crack talk. Like, unfortunately, it's crack talk. Right. So why don't these things come with certificates of analysis?

3:16:55BubblemanBecause the people who are doing it aren't doing that. And the people who have the certificates of analysis ability, they're not currently producing the medicine for the people who are fucking dying. That's why. That's, dude, that's the crux.

3:17:09SpeakerAnd the fact that someone, they just bring it in from China now and then... We have like a super hype over crystals that have made people like, look, I just want to hold it up. I don't give a fuck if it is a crystal or not. I just want to post. This hype culture drag, it's starting to drag in parents because I see what they're asking me and I'm like, holy shit, if you didn't find me, I know exactly how you would be played and what story you would be told about purity.

3:17:36SpeakerIt's no different than seeing products that are stretched with coconut oil cost more than the raw ingredient. And they're told it's made bioavailable by MTC oil. I'm like, you diluted it and you sell it for more? And parents are like, so it's ready for my child? And they're like, technically yes. And they buy into it. So when I see the level of these CBD crystals, I should get the most bang for buck out of them.

3:18:00SpeakerThey look pure. Is the problem that the microprocent that's not pure more dangerous than even a butane molecule? That's what I'm asking. I don't fuck with petroleum ether.

3:18:14SpeakerWhat I'm saying is we don't know any of those things, and the people that are buying these crystals for their babies, if that's in fact happening, that if there is no certificate of analysis, then they shouldn't be buying them. That's ridiculous. Because you don't know what they are. It's because I accept that they buy a black stick, and I really don't know what's in the black stick when it says it only has 20% CBD in it, but it's a full black stick.

3:18:38SpeakerSo I get when they go, holy shit, do I want this black stick or do I want the crystals? Every human brain says the crystals equals purity. It's white. The alternative is not so pretty either. I really look at it and I'm like, holy shit, there's nothing from the black stick to crystals. There's just this huge jump. Yeah, that's the really fucked up thing about the Canadian market that you're seeing in all these dispensaries because that's not the way it is in the States.

3:19:04SpeakerYou know, in the States, there's companies that are producing, you know, chocolate almonds with one milligram of THC or CBD per almond or, you know, pills or all these things that are really accurate methods of dosing. And the Canadian system, because we've been so head in the sand about Extracts and other forms of dosing, even like dry herbal cannabis. You know, we've got all these people now producing this shit in an unregulated market, and the parents don't know any better, and it's really a fucked up situation.

3:19:39SpeakerAnd it's not going to get any better until the government starts accepting things like extracts. You know, in California, Colorado, all these other legal markets, extracts are legal. In Canada, you can make an extract that's THC with, what, 30 milligrams per THC per milliliter, which completely rules out any dabbing or any inhaled product because you have to have the active ingredient in a solvent. So, you know, until that's fixed in the regulations, until all that stuff is addressed in the regulations and people are allowed to have Butane extracts or even water extracts, like water hash extracts, you're going to have people at home in garages blowing themselves up.

3:20:18SpeakerIt's just inevitable.

3:20:24BubblemanIt's definitely a mess up here. There's no doubt about it. We've kind of gone backwards with our federal program in the sense that down in the states, these state mechanisms are allowing for so much more to happen. In all the different states, then we're actually being able to get done here in Canada with a federal program.

3:20:45SpeakerYeah. Well, and the thing that sucks too, and I keep, I know I keep coming back and harping on all these extractors and shit, but stuff happens. It happens when you're doing extracts and processes. And I think Horatio was talking about 10 minutes ago about, you know, the C in extraction does. Right, if you're not doing it under a basic environment, if it's an alkaline environment, the CBD cyclizes pretty readily to THC, so people can be producing these type 3 plants, or these pure CBD producing plants, and then fucking up the extraction process, just, you know... Dude, I made it, I made it, and it, basically, I, John...

3:21:28SpeakerDid some testing and found out of some other products and I never sold anything because I was like, wait a minute, that's possible? That's plausible? Oh my god, this explains why crystals exist. Because someone must have hit this wall and then said, fuck. I didn't know, I just never happened to release it. I'm like, this is, it's different. Something's wrong. This can't be the canatonic I started with.

3:21:52SpeakerI just started at least explaining to myself why crystals existed for CBD and there was no distillate. I had no clue, but imagine if I had, yeah man, just pump through, let's go, let's go, I got that CBD for you, and then just put out like 100 grams, 500 grams. I see how scientifically untrained we are in some things that Everyone would be gaga over CBD distillate just because, hey, it's cleaner than the black stick.

3:22:20SpeakerBut to know that now the ratio has changed and you just gave it to some kid blind because you're happy it's clear. You're just happy it's clear. That's the thing. You're a rarity in a market where people are chasing dollars. I mean, there are a lot of people that grow cannabis for love, but there's also a lot of people that grow cannabis for money. And the people that are producing it for money, they don't give a shit whether CBD becomes cyclized and adulterated with THC.

3:22:47SpeakerYeah, but for instance, Mark just basically promised me, I'm fucked. There will be no CBD coming out of me until I figure out another way to do it without petroleum ether in a natural setting. So pretty much if I can't figure out how to do it with terpenes for CBD. There is no CBD for parents. I can't help them. There's other ways of purifying CBD. I'm just saying crystallization is one way.

3:23:11SpeakerI just mentioned pet ethers, one particular solvent that I would try. No, I'm not saying that you need to do that at all, Horatio. I think that, again, you can rely on your genetics. Your genetics will go a long way to provide you the ratios that you need. I think what Chimera and what I'm trying to say is that in the processing of those extracts, the metastability of these things are such that you can take your genetics, which might start one particular ratio, and just completely change it and scramble it in the processing.

3:23:49SpeakerI don't know. I don't think that you can distill A good CBD product without having it contaminated with THC. Now that said, I believe you can fractionally distill it, but I think you end up converting an awful lot of that to THC. So the point is that why not either use column chromatography where you don't have to heat it up, Thank you for joining us.

3:24:32SpeakerThe baseline separation you see in between your different peaks of cannabinoids could be realized now in a fractionation of those cannabinoids. Okay, well then I got a question, because obviously that's as far as I got. I can clean it up without distilling it, but I cannot get it... I don't have access to hemp that hasn't been decarboxylated. So therefore crystal formation becomes a different type of conundrum for me.

3:24:56SpeakerSo I hit a limit of refinement. I can fraction off CBD... But it's still contaminated with color, you could say. It's not pure enough to be a standard. And if it's not pure enough to be a standard, then all I have is just daps. Try chromatography. Chromatography will always work. You could chromatograph. It might be my, remember, it might be my LDW. I'm using limonene. I'm using limonene.

3:25:24SpeakerSo what I mean is I can isolate CBD with chromatography, but let's say I can't get the red out. Because it won't crystallize, because it's been decarboxylated. Did I miss something? People seem to tell me that you can recrystallize decarboxylated CBD, and I don't generically get it, but it doesn't mean it's not plausible. That's what I'm asking you. Sounds like you need to hire me to do some consulting.

3:25:48SpeakerWe can talk about this offline. If you finally want to, let's solve it. Come on, this is house church. Keep going. I'm really listening to this. Can't you hear me? I was like, yeah, keep going, yeah.

3:26:02SpeakerOkay, so look, there's lots of ways of getting rid of color. I mean, color is the, you know, I call color the most, oh, I don't know, it's a difficult thing because, you know, you can't always go, color tells you a lot of things but some people are very, very misled by color, especially about, you know, darkness. I mean, you know, darkness, we were talking about dark before.

3:26:24SpeakerTypically, darkness to a chemist implies a lot of decomposition and thermal degradation that happens. Look, if the trichome contents are clear on the plant, they should be clear in the resin, or your extract. So if your extract is dark, chances are you've probably thermally compromised the most sensitive compounds that are in there.

3:26:54SpeakerKeep it cold. Dr. I don't apply too many things at once. Someone was like, why don't you re-acidify it? Why don't you do this or that? I'm like, I'm not going to reach for what you want to reach. I don't want my hand dancing in my lap. Dr. I want to bring that up for a second. Hold on. Thanks for bringing that up, Chimera. In your chromatography solvents, you should always spike with just like 0.1% acetic acid or something, just to keep things on the acidic side, especially if you're talking about separating out Thank you for joining us.

3:27:31SpeakerI have that. It's not something I would say openly, but you said it, so I have that. Will that help? Basically, is there any hope for how clean can I make it? I can clean up by distillation to clear, but I can't do that for CBD. If I'm not distilling and I'm just using chromatography, if it's pre-decarbed and I don't have a choice about my inputs, it's given to me cooked.

3:27:56SpeakerWhat's my limit? Can I make a crystal after that? Or am I just going to be making an oil that is decently pure? If you could see separation on an HPLC, then ultimately you've just answered the question. That means if you have the Preparative HPLC version of that HPLC, you can separate it. So if it's single and that's the only peak, then yeah. But again, affording the preparative HPLC, which costs probably about $250,000, is a completely different issue.

3:28:29SpeakerI just use silica and limonene, but I can try adding the acid the next time I get an opportunity to try. I don't currently mix in any acetic acid because I don't want to come back and bite them. Yeah, if you follow your chromatography by TLC, I think what you'll see is if you add that 0.1% acetic acid spike to your mobile phase, I think you'll see your spots really tighten up.

3:28:55SpeakerWhat's usually like an oval spot will be much more rounded because, again, it attenuates some of the binding capacity of normal phase supports like silica.

3:29:08BubblemanYou got your CBD there, Tony?

3:29:12SpeakerYeah, I was trying to show Horatio the, he was asking about CBD crystal and stuff. So this you can seed. 91%. Okay, what does it melt at? What does it melt at?

3:29:40SpeakerI don't know. I didn't design it for smoking. The melting point of CBDA should be between 45 to 48 degrees centigrade, and the melting point of CBD should be 65 degrees centigrade, according to the literature. 65 degrees centigrade, right? Yeah. If it's CBD now, if it's CBDA, it's 45 to 48. This is pure CBD, nothing else. Oh, pure, so it's not the acid, it's the, it's CBD?

3:30:10SpeakerCorrect. Okay, so pure CBD melts at 65 degrees centigrade, according to the literature. The peer-reviewed scientific literature, which is often correct. Yeah, so this one came to, this is the result.

3:30:36SpeakerLet me see. 65, huh? Can we get a drum roll or something? Just, you know.

3:30:53BubblemanSo if that's pure CBD and it's 91%, what's the other 9%?

3:31:01BubblemanBecause it's white.

3:31:01SpeakerLike, I would buy that if I was a parent. Like, that's what I mean. It looks good by all olfactory senses. I'm not saying it's bad. It could just be myrcene. But when is it, how do you, where do we go from, like, knowing any better? Because everyone would say I need that. Absolutely. Well, I put that, that was developed to go into the P5. All right.

3:31:23SpeakerThe P5 is then paired with ACDC terpenes. So I paired, A full spectrum terpene with the CBD and put it into a capsule.

3:31:36SpeakerIn 10s and 20s and 50s.

3:31:38BubblemanInteresting. Well, that's cool.

3:31:44SpeakerWhen you say pure spectrum, you mean pure spectrum from that plant? Yeah, from ACDC.

3:31:53BubblemanJust mute your mic if you're going to play guitar, please, Mark. I don't mind if you play guitar, but I don't want to have to mute your mic, man. Sorry about that. I'm so fucking done.

3:32:06SpeakerYou're saying 147 degrees Fahrenheit?

3:32:13SpeakerHold on a second. Let me do my little conversion here. Let's see what it is. It's 65 centigrade, right?

3:32:28SpeakerWhich is 149 Fahrenheit, correct? Okay. That's what the melting point should be?

3:32:37SpeakerAccording to the literature.

3:32:40BubblemanBut there's 9% of something else in there, correct? It said 91%? Yeah, so what that'll mean, okay, so there's two things you've got to think about.

3:32:49SpeakerFirst of all, That's just what the HPLC detector detects. And so it's detecting ultraviolet light. So it detects like what a photodiode array detector would detect. It has to be UV absorbing. So things that aren't UV absorbing will not get detected by that detector. So there could be a whole lot of other stuff in there that will just be silent because the detector is not tuned into it.

3:33:18SpeakerSo it depends on what detector they use. I take it it's photodiode array, Tony? No, it's just that steep hill. It's steep hill, yeah. So they use, I think, HPLC photodiode array, not mass spec? Not mass spec. And so the point is, Mark, is that the other little bit of you're seeing is the CBDV. That goes in the solution. Like when he makes the sample... There might be fats that don't go in the solution.

3:33:48SpeakerSo that's why, like, when Johnny was making his samples and he saw those white floaties in there, those white floaties were part of the sample, but they didn't go in the solution, so they won't be picked up by the HPLC. So it's 4% terpenes. So it's 92 plus 4%.

3:34:07SpeakerOkay, so if anything, you're going to see a lower melting point because those represent slight impurities in that crystalline material, so you should see a slightly lower melting point than 149 Fahrenheit because there are such impurities. It's pretty low. Yeah. Did it melt yet? I'm trying to get my D-nail to go that low.

3:34:38BubblemanJust above river temperature. Yeah. You have to turn it off.

3:34:43SpeakerI can just do this with it, Mark. Yeah. Yeah, just give it a boob cure from quick melting point and we're on. I can tell you that, um, no, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,

3:35:09SpeakerIt's pretty nice stuff.

3:35:13SpeakerThrow in methanol and see if you get any waxes in there than 9%. That's exactly what you do. If you take a few crystals and put it in either methanol or alcohol, and if you see it turn cloudy or white or you see any precipitate, that'll tell you that there's waxes or fats. There might be some fat in it from the fatty acids, what I'm saying. That's how I see it with everything.

3:35:39SpeakerIf I throw up methanol, it really shows me a lot. And I don't see it, only things that are being heated. That's another thing, Mark. I don't see it with the dry sifts or the bubble hashes, but anything that's had any kind of heat kind of process to it is where I see it in my vials and stuff like that, but not in the distillates. Yeah, you know what that might mean, John?

3:36:01SpeakerThat's so cool that you see that. What that might mean is that there's some thermal degradation mechanism like that hashishine molecule is making some low molecular weight oligomers, say, like in the rosin process. You know, I looked for that. I made some rosin. I think I showed you that HPLC result. I couldn't believe it. I just couldn't believe how pure it was. And I went back and I looked at that vial.

3:36:26SpeakerAnd it was clear. In fact, what I did is I filtered it again through another Cephadex filter because I didn't believe the result. And I filtered it again and still it came back like 96% pure. I was blown away by that, that result. It blew me away. You did it wrong with the distillate? No, this is just a quick press of a nugget between... You know, with a hair straightener between parchment paper and just looking at the HPLC purity of the rosin that we made.

3:36:57SpeakerYou know, these two great things right here. Yeah, right. What I use, I still haven't upgraded, you know. You know what they say in Oregon about that, that that's not what those things are designed for so you can't make the concentrates from them. Yeah. I see waxes and stuff floating in my vial quite a bit, but I only see it in stuff that's had any kind of a heat process.

3:37:21SpeakerIt's always nice to look.

3:37:31SpeakerI need to do a bomber. What did you say about the Oregon thing with rosin? You can't use rosin? Oppressed to make rosin in Oregon? Is that what you said? I don't know. Didn't they try to out ban rosin too? From what I'm reading, I think Nick was trying to get in, but he kept cutting out on him. They're still investigating that right now because the laws just happened.

3:37:59SpeakerHe was running it through his lawyers and they think that Pressurized extraction may still be available, but they're not sure yet. I can't 100% say either way.

3:38:10BubblemanIn the meantime, my brand is absolutely ready to process in Oregon.

3:38:21SpeakerI didn't know what that was going to be like, but we had a fire marshal walk through the lab that we had set up in Oregon with a group out there. For Prana and Double Man, Blue River, and the guy was fine with everything we were doing, but they were going pretty deep. They were like, what's this type of solution here? And I was like, well, we make this like fractionite fatty acid and change our polarity and make it act like a solvent, but it's not really a, it's not like a solvent in the sense that it's explosive or anything, and They wanted to know the smoke points and the boiling points of all of it, and then they approved that, and then literally the next day I saw them come out with no CO2 or no butane, and then I heard something about rosin, too.

3:39:20SpeakerSo, I don't know. I'm going to say you've got to throw some of the crystals and methanol and get back to us on that one. Yeah, I mean, how do they outlaw rosin? What, you can't press something and heat it? I mean, there's no... It's pretty ridiculous. You can smuggle, but you can't process it at a lower temperature, and it's insane. Okay. Welcome to the laws. That's why we say stay active, people, because otherwise you get laws like this shoved down your throat.

3:39:54BubblemanMm-hmm. I would have photographed that CBD crystal in Spain had I seen it again, Tony. I saw it only one time on the table, and you put it away so fast I never saw it again.

3:40:13SpeakerWell, it definitely melted at 100. It just melted at 160 degrees down to nothing, literally down to nothing.

3:40:22SpeakerHoly shit! Praise the Lord and take a melting point! It fucking worked! You see, the pool of... That's cool. I could do it again. You gotta go lower, Tony, lower. How low can you go? Yeah, get low on those temps before you go melting anything more. 159. 159.

3:40:52BubblemanYou know, I think the real problem with a lot of this Horatio is that it's not a race to release great product. It's a race to release the next great Instagram photo. Because Instagram is of course the start and the creation of all of these different extract companies that are producing their so-called extracts. You see a picture and then the manipulated assumption takes place in the rest of the people.

3:41:22BubblemanAnd in the manipulated assumption is the potential danger.

3:41:26SpeakerDude, I saw someone posted in hashtags, they were like, a blue fraction. I'm like, blue fractions are popular? Have I been just sitting there on my blue fraction? Holy shit, I gotta post to Instagram. And I'm like, you slow your ass down and fucking eat your dinner. And you can post a blue fraction in Instagram when you get your next blue fraction. But yeah, basically this Instagram thing is starting to fuck up us adults.

3:41:49SpeakerBecause even I'm like, what? I didn't even know that was something I was supposed to post as an accomplishment. It's just an in-between. But I'll post the blue fractions so everyone can go crazy for, you know, the ten minute cycle that Instagram payment is.

3:42:03BubblemanYeah, Jim Frayer was posting Azulene and a couple other different blue fractions that he produced and he explained how he produced them and that was actually one of the last good posts I saw him make before he said he was going to be Pulling back from social media.

3:42:20SpeakerOh, that's the thing is I saw that ages ago. It's just things have these cycles where it's like a bunch of stuff got posted. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. It just goes by. Then one day once like distillation becomes everybody and their bro, now it becomes everyone's paying attention all over again. So it's like if I post that, I'll probably get three times more likes than Jim posting it over a year ago.

3:42:41SpeakerAnd it's just the stupid way it works that that's some form of Viable branding, but if you don't participate, you get wiped out by the last guy that posted. Well, I just heard Jeff complaining. You kept saying over and over, I don't have another way to make CBD crystal. I'm stuck in, I have to spend $100,000 and I'm going to blow myself up. You've got all of these excuses and it's right there in front of you, man.

3:43:09SpeakerJust step outside of your limonene box and start thinking about other ways. I think I'll stay in my lightning box and figure it out the way I have everything else in the line that wasn't figureoutable. I'm just messing with you. I think that, why don't you try seeding? It's not that. Like, right off the bat, I think the first problem was I've never come across undecarboxylated CBD or else what I do for making THCA should work.

3:43:42SpeakerIt's just not coming across that and constantly seeing CBD crystals test in the decarboxylated form. I ask myself, well, there must be something wrong with me. I've got to figure out... I don't want to say, well, yeah, I can only make a black extract for you. I just have to look at understanding at a deeper level what is petroleum ether doing or not doing and reapply myself.

3:43:58SpeakerIt doesn't

3:44:17SpeakerI don't have to make it to Instagram first. I have to finish last with something that is perpetually sustainable.

3:44:27SpeakerI got a bag of hemp here. This big. It's about 2% CBD and it would be un-decarved. It would be what you need if you want to have fun with it. Come pick it up.

3:44:46SpeakerWell, I mean, you're suspending your cannabinoids in, so that's really what I was getting at.

3:44:55SpeakerMan, it sounds like Instagram's a real problem. It's like high school all over again. Well, I mean, isn't the president election really an Instagram campaign? Like, it's running the country, so it's a big problem, that attitude. It is a high school race at times, and... If you don't understand how to win in the high school competition while trying to finish your PhD, you could lose your funding.

3:45:19SpeakerIt's like this weird thing.

3:45:25SpeakerWell, you'd think your farm was a good product if the funding would come. Here's what I'm going to do. Somebody, as I walked out of the building yesterday, I grabbed some of this orange creamsicle, 90U. Fuck that shit. And I micro-dabbed that shit with some Jack and Jack Orange Creamsicle Turp Melt. Remember when we used to do it to Full Melt Bubble Man? Oh, yeah. I'm starting to like it again because it's like when you get five-star and you get really good Full Melt, and people say, why would you want to add terpenes to it?

3:46:02SpeakerNumber one reason, because you can. Yeah. You can. That's why. That's our number one reason. Why would you want to raise the THC level? The number two reason is because then you can mix match and make whatever types of combinations of flavors that you want. And the third reason is to change your response. So this Jackie, this Jack Orange Cream Supple, Turt Melt, straight fire, and I wish you were here to smoke it.

3:46:38SpeakerMe too, dude. It's just greasy.

3:46:41BubblemanI'll watch you smoke it. A little dab will do you on the sick. I just came to the conclusion that my sick is destroyed. I guess you tried to twist it out, hey? You gave it a good, nice, strong twist from the element and it just snapped right off the base.

3:47:01SpeakerWell, you got me sick. I was really sick and I got three other people sick since they've been sick.

3:47:10BubblemanBut you're not sick anymore, hey?

3:47:13SpeakerIt was a three-day horrible racking of the brain and the body. Every muscle in your feet, every joint. It was the worst.

3:47:26BubblemanI wish I could have got out of there before I got you guys sick.

3:47:32BubblemanIt was horrible. No fun getting your friends sick, that's for sure.

3:47:39SpeakerNo, I got my buddy sick.

3:47:41BubblemanThat's a big dog.

3:47:47SpeakerYeah, that's our neighbor's dog. Nice.

3:47:51BubblemanShe's an amputee tripod. Oh, a tripod. Front or back?

3:47:56SpeakerWell, she's kind of three and a half. So, trying to figure out getting her a prosthesis.

3:48:05BubblemanYeah, I hear you can print them up in 3D printers for dogs now. Yeah. That's pretty cool, huh? Amazing, dude.

3:48:16BubblemanAbsolutely amazing. People wonder, they say things like, well, what is a 3D printer ever going to do? It's like, well, I don't know, printing limbs for humans and animals is pretty awesome.

3:48:27SpeakerHow about taking a scan of somebody's missing limb and 3D matching it perfectly versus having your arm rubbed all fucked up for your life because everyone has the same plastic mannequin arm. I don't think people understand what 3D does when it comes to inputting the world before it spits something back out. True. But they watch it every day in movies as they 3D scan actors and have them do ridiculous shit.

3:48:50SpeakerIt's so... people forget...

3:48:55BubblemanYeah, it's pretty incredible. Little CAD software and a 3D printer and you're off to the races.

3:49:07BubblemanMan, the most I've ever coughed in a hash church and I haven't taken a dab. I want to thank you guys all for coming out. I don't know how I pulled off four hours of that. Sorry about being full of piss and vinegar today, but that's how it is sometimes with the bubble man when he's sick as a dog. And yeah, thank you all. I can never say it enough for all the people watching.

3:49:35BubblemanFor all the trolls, suck my dick. And for everyone else, keep doing your thing. Be good, be smart. Praise Ganja. We'll see you next week on Hash Church, everybody.

3:49:48SpeakerMuch love, bubble man. Thanks, guys. Thanks. Thanks, Mark.