Static Sift and the Evolution of Dry Sifting

0:23BubblemanHey, everybody. Welcome, welcome. Sunday morning at 9am, December 1st today. So we are here for Hash Church, episode 17, Static Sift episode with Charles from Sambo Creek Filtration. We've got Sam popping in to share some time with us as well. Let me just make sure that we're live. Yes, we're live. I see me just going live. I'm going to let some folks in here real quick. We're going to do a little Sunday morning hash church.

0:54BubblemanAll right, we got Charles, we got Skunk Man Sam, we got Chris K, we got Alex Martinenko. All right, here we go. Welcome, everybody.

1:09BubblemanWelcome, welcome. Oh, you're in the tropics, Charles. Hi, Amy. How you doing, Alex?

1:16SpeakerPretty good, thank you.

1:18BubblemanExcellent. Well, welcome. Welcome. We got Wolverine Dabs about to pop in here. Oh, we've already got almost 100 people watching live here after 90 seconds of starting. So that's wonderful. We're always happy to see everyone up and at it as early as possible, at least for the folks who are in North America. For those of you that are in Asia and Europe. Well, it's a little bit later for you.

1:40BubblemanFor those of you in Australia, geez, it might be tomorrow for all I know. But welcome. Either way, Johnny B, I think we got to get Johnny B on this particular, this particular show. So I'm just going to send him an invite really quick. And then we'll get into some introductions and some of that stuff. So yeah, today we are going to celebrate hashish in all of its glory.

2:05BubblemanAnd we're going to focus on static dry sifting.

2:10BubblemanSee here, John Burfellow. Bear with me, everyone. I just want to send John the link so he can come join us this morning. And there we go. Welcome. Look at you, Charles. You're looking pretty good.

2:26SpeakerLikewise. Likewise.

2:28BubblemanYeah, man. Good to see you. Good to see you. I see you've got a few folks in. So why don't we just get right into it? We can have you kind of go over and introduce all the folks that you've brought in one by one. You're welcome to let them do an introduction after you tell us a little bit about yourself. And yeah, just give a little brief breakdown on who Charles is, what Charles has been up to, and why has Charles been going to Morocco so much these days?

2:58SpeakerThat's a really good question. Right on. So hi, everyone. I'm Charles McGowen, and I work with Sambo Creek, and we just make pretty much cannabis related equipment. And right now, I guess the The big thing is static shift. We love static shift. And we came up with a nifty little device. Hey, what's going on? Which like you're saying, Marcus has been really popular in Morocco because that's the culture over there, right?

3:26SpeakerI mean, that really is a culture. And so there's, there's a huge following.

3:35SpeakerBecause it supplements the traditional practices that they have over there. And so I've been doing a lot of research over there myself, trying to really understand what the needs are, because in my mind, things might work a certain way, but when you're actually in the field and you see the challenges that people are going through, Yeah, it's totally different. So anyway, that's me. I'm Charles. And so we've got Alex, Chris, I think Renee might join.

4:02SpeakerSo Alex, why don't you introduce yourself? Okay, I'm from Canada, working on electrostatics for a long time, maybe for 30 years. And also I was developing separators. So and two years ago we made a major discovery with Charles that these crystals are electrically charged and that allows us to use this for building device. Fantastic. Awesome. Fantastic. What do we have next? I see Ezra.

4:51SpeakerHey guys, how's it going? I'm in the lab right now and I've got someone actually pressing rosin with the automatic pump. So if the noise of the pump, if you can hear it and it's annoying, let me know and I'll move to a different room. Hi, my name is Ezra Marcus. I work for Hudson Cannabis in Hudson, New York. And we had a day.

5:20SpeakerWe're losing you, Ezra.

5:23BubblemanThat happens sometimes in the lab. I've been guilty of it myself.

5:27SpeakerLet's see if he makes it back. Let me move over because the internet.

5:42SpeakerIt's awesome. You're grinding on a Sunday, man. Love it. Well, we've got MJ BizCon coming up, which is really exciting, but it happened to coincide with the new product launch. And so we're just trying to get all this rosin pressed before Monday, you know, because most of our team's going to be gone. Things in New York have been really exciting. It's growing really fast. We're really lucky to be in this market.

6:04SpeakerBut the pressure's on, man.

6:05BubblemanIt's always like... What kind of press are you using, Ezra?

6:11SpeakerWe've got the four-way like Osprey set up with the automatic pump that has the button. Oh, yeah. The low temp. Sorry, not Osprey, low temp plates. My bad. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

6:21BubblemanI got what you were saying. I call it Osprey all the time. Yeah.

6:27SpeakerYeah, yeah. And so that's been a whole journey to pressing dry sift. And we've been figuring out a lot of stuff there. And recently I've been awoken to fresh frozen though. I've been like putting it off for so long because I was so focused on figuring out this dry sift hash system. But some creators out there just make content of their wash process that it got to me.

6:50SpeakerI couldn't help it. Fantastic. And we've got Christoph.

7:00SpeakerHey. There he is.

7:06SpeakerHey, my name's Christoph Krause. I work for an electrostatic company from Germany. And I support Charles with some research and power supplies and some knowledge. And we are working on some ideas we tested also. I worked with Rene in the Netherlands in his facility. And yeah, we're trying to figure out how to make the process better and to improve everything with a lot of knowledge in R&D coming from our side, yeah.

7:39BubblemanI love to hear the multiple countries involved and people all over the world. And you know what? You guys probably already know this, but you guys are in the room right now with Skunk Man Sam, the very man who created the journey that you are all kind of following along now and continuing. And I'm sure it puts a giant smile on his face. So, uh, yeah. We'll make sure that we get Sam speaking a little bit about the history and maybe we'll go over the discovery of how he figured out electrostatic process very accidentally one afternoon in Africa.

8:15BubblemanSo we'll make sure that he tells that story a little bit later on. If you want to continue on with the introduction.

8:22SpeakerIs Rene on yet?

8:23BubblemanRene is on. Yeah, I see him in the corner. iPhone Von Rene.

8:27SpeakerThere you go. Say hi, Rene. Hi.

8:30BubblemanHi.

8:30SpeakerHow are you? There he is.

8:33BubblemanAwesome. So who's Rene? Can you tell us a little bit about yourself, Rene?

8:38SpeakerYes. So my name is Rene. I'm from Canada. We are one of the license holders in the Netherlands. So we are one of the first legal producers in Europe. Big facility. We have a greenhouse. 50,000 square meter, that's about, what is this, 5 million square feet, something like that. And we are producing hash, all kind of brick hash, static hash now. And we are going to make now the live rosin from static separated material.

9:15SpeakerAnd we are one of the few in Europe at the moment.

9:21BubblemanWonderful. That's in your neck of the woods, Sam. We'll have to hook you up with Rene. Maybe you'll get a little tour.

9:27SpeakerSure. Every time. Awesome.

9:34SpeakerI think Skunk Man Sam is in Amsterdam, right? He is in Amsterdam, yes. And he's also in this room. Because we are close to Rotterdam, so it's not so far away, one hour from Amsterdam. So every time, he's next to us. Bye and have a look.

9:54BubblemanWonderful, wonderful. So who we got left? We got Logan left, Mr. Wolverine Dabs. What's up, Logan?

10:00SpeakerHow's it going?

10:02BubblemanIt's going good, man. Welcome. Welcome. I'm, you know, Logan was one of the first folks that I sort of talked to about the Sambo filtration equipment when I first received mine. Logan was kind enough, mainly because Charles was in Morocco and maybe even Italy or something. He just didn't have a very good reception. So Logan was kind enough to walk me through the build out of the machine.

10:27BubblemanAnd so I appreciate you for that, Logan. And also, Fuck, dude, you've been, you probably posted one of my favorite pictures in the last, you know, listen, I'll tell you something. Yeah, so when Sam first showed me this process, and I don't even know how long ago that was. Now, God, it's got to be 10 or 15 years ago.

10:48BubblemanHe, you know, it was like, it was low key. It was like, we're not, you know, it was the hardest thing for me to do because I have a ton of pictures of the hand, but I never posted any of them. It wasn't really something that it was like, well, I can't, I can't post this, but I sure love the ones that you posted. I only have the blue glove one, but it's actually the black glove one that I preferred.

11:12BubblemanI must have accidentally deleted it off my computer, but there's... And that one's beautiful. There's a shot of Logan. Anyone that's ever done the hand sifting, the skunk man, Sam Tech, knows that that hand in particular is bonkers. That's good material. When you see material like that, man, you are pretty happy. We've come, we've come a far away, you know, in the last 10 to 15 years.

11:36BubblemanAnd there was always people sort of, you know, for me, this all really started, I mean, listen, for Skunk Man, Sam, it started a lot earlier. So, you know, Sam, why don't we actually just start with you? I know you've told this story before, but if we're going to start at the start, let's start at the start. You can kind of tell your origin story of discovering this and how it came to be and then I'll chime in with learning about well no way before learning about it I think it was 2008 when I was first at Sam's apartment and I posted a photograph of his dry sift he allowed me to macro photograph his dry sift and that picture That picture started the journey we are all on more than anything because before that nobody fucking knew unless you were lucky enough to get invited over to Sam's house and smoke some of his full mouth dry sift.

12:26BubblemanYou just didn't have any idea how much better it was than literally everyone else's hash. Thank you so much for joining us.

12:56BubblemanOh, what was it? The Slee Stack. There's a variety of them that came out that were just next level. So, Sam, why don't we start with you this morning with your origin stories. You can just talk about, you know, the beginning of Static Sift.

13:10SpeakerI'll be happy to do that. The first hashish that I saw Static hashed Was in 1988 in Gambia, West Africa. And a friend of mine was there. He was trying to grow cannabis. I think he was trying to grow skunk cannabis in Gambia, which is difficult because the photo period is so short in Gambia. But he hadn't finished a crop yet. So what he was doing was making hash.

14:02SpeakerWell, he was dry sifting. The local weed that was in Gambia because it wasn't that great or strong. And so he would get rid of, he would dry sift it to get rid of everything that was too big and then dry sift it again to get rid of everything that was too small. And that way he was able to get a fairly potent hash from it. But what I noticed when he was doing it He was rubbing his hand around on the screen to get rid of the stuff that was too big or too small.

14:44SpeakerI think it was the small screen he was doing it on. And he didn't notice it. But I noticed that all of the best resin seemed to be sticking The way it does to a glove around his hand. And what he did was he would just brush it down in with the good stuff. And he wasn't trying to really separate it out. He was just trying to get rid of the big stuff and the small stuff.

15:23SpeakerBut with static tech, it takes it. To another level, because what you've got is farmer's hash that doesn't have anything too big or anything too small. But the static check changes that from like 50% THC resin heads. So they might be maybe, I don't know, 30, 40, 50% resin heads in the farmer's ash. I mean, if you clean it up several times with the static check, you can get 99.9% resin heads.

16:06SpeakerAnd I didn't really mess around with that much in Gambia. What I did instead was when I got back to Amsterdam, I played around with a bunch of... Skunk number one that I had and I immediately the light went on in my head and I well actually the light went on in Gambia but once I had made it here I couldn't believe it because I had never smoked hash that completely melted and dripped and went right through a very super fine stainless steel screen and I realized this Truly was something special.

16:51SpeakerAnd yeah, that's where it went from there in 1988.

16:57BubblemanIf it don't bubble, it ain't worth the trouble. So that came about around 1988, 89. I feel like you would have come up with that very soon after watching that dry sift melt down your roor downstem.

17:14SpeakerThat's absolutely correct.

17:17BubblemanOkay, so the screen sizes, you figured that out pretty quickly. You understood that, yeah, you could sift with a 200 or whatever, a 180.

17:27SpeakerI think I used a 150 to get rid of the stuff that was too big to be a resin head. And I used, I think it was a 70 or a 77 to get rid of the stuff that was too small, microns. And, uh, Yeah, it just took me a week or so to figure it all out.

17:49Etienne FontanOh my God, dude, that is just so crazy to think of.

17:52SpeakerLuckily, I had lots of raw materials. So, you know, what I would use would be cannabis, which had dried for two weeks in the dark and then cured for a couple of weeks in a box. A couple of months, excuse me. So I was using raisins rather than wet grapes. And that made it much easier because otherwise the resin heads want to smear when you do this sort of processing.

18:26SpeakerAnd I eventually figured out ways where I didn't even have to use, well, I have to use my hand for the static check, but for the, for the, Processing the branches, the dried branches, I could do it with pharmaceutical particle sizing machines that were rotary sifters, and I could easily create 100 or more kilos a few hours in a walk-in freezer.

19:01BubblemanWow. Well, I'll never forget making hash with you and Rob back in the day and just producing. So you had these eight foot by five foot dry sift screens that you would just lay right down on the ground and pull out a 55 gallon barrel. One of, I don't know how many you had. It must've been a hundred of them stacked up against the wall, just full of ground dried flour.

19:28BubblemanAnd just dump it over the screen and give it a little shimmy shimmy. We had the rakes. I'll never forget. One more thing. Thank you so much for joining us today.

19:59BubblemanThank you so much for joining us.

20:23BubblemanYou know, the mid-2000s again was when you cleaned it. You cleaned it all up. And I took the chafe that you cleaned out, which to the naked eye just looks like... It just looks like... And I remember going into your bathroom and dumping it in the toilet and taking a picture of it while I did it. And man, that picture, people, holy fuck, that picture rocked people's minds.

21:00BubblemanThey could not wrap their head around it. They were like, I would have smoked that Like, no problem.

21:05Dr Mark ScialdoneWhy did you throw that down the toilet? Like, what are you doing?

21:08BubblemanAnyway, I want to I want to show that picture because I did finally find it. So this was making a little bit of dry sift over at Sam's. You can see the feet in the top corner of Sam and Rob. So you can see that's like that's a lot of dry sift. That's like it might have even been six or seven thousand grams. I can't remember. But we made it in like five in like five hours.

21:30BubblemanZach Minutes. And you can see also the rake in the top of the picture, the red rake. That's what we were using to move the material over the screen. And of course, you know, you look at that green material and it looks it looks, you know, pretty, pretty darn spectacular. But then you look at, you know, what what Sam would turn that into very shortly after with his method.

21:55SpeakerAnd I call that still farmer's hash. Because we got rid of stuff that was too big or too small to be bad, good. But it was still, to me, farmer's hash because, yeah, because you can make it 99.9% pure. And that's the cream de la cream.

22:21BubblemanWhich you absolutely did. I'll never be able to explain to people how special and amazing this thing was. I think it was also even more amazing because it was an actual unicorn that nobody really had in the world. Like if you were lucky and you had some trim bin sift that melted into a liquid. It might be 50% heads, but this was 99.999% heads to the point where your eye in this picture, you'll be able to see the like three capitate stocks immediately.

22:53BubblemanThe more pure you make something, the more contamination stands out. It's the most insane thing. I will just put for reference the picture that said or the you know, when Sam was mentioning The... Farmer's Grade Sift. I always like to show this to people because I think it's so educational. This is what Farmer's Grade Sift looks like. You're lucky if you're in a 10% to 20% heads.

23:23BubblemanI'm not talking THC content. We're talking the purity percentage of glandular trichome heads. Now, if you're doing a very light bounce, and I'm sure Johnny B will chime in here in a little bit with his first bounce. If you do a very gentle bounce with incredible material, You could get upwards of 80%, you know, but to get 99%, there was always this other process involved. And I, you know, I would like to reiterate with the static process that Sam discovered in Africa.

23:54BubblemanIt's a two-part system and a lot of people didn't really understand this. The static aspect is one part of the system. He's rubbing his hand, he's rubbing it on the screen, he's creating a static charge and things are sticking to his hand. The second part is that he's using force on the screen. He's pushing on the screen while he does it. And that is so important that so many, many, many companies That tried to create equipment and machines and who tried to improve this equipment early on seemed to be missing.

24:28BubblemanAnd that was the pushing and the breaking up of the contaminant. Because if you didn't do that, that contaminant would gladly, you know, stick to your hand. It would go and stick to all of that material on your hand the same way the heads would.

24:42SpeakerWhat was happening was the, it's like when you, Walk on a wool carpet, you brush your feet against it and it creates a static charge. When you put your hands round and round and round on a monofilament screen, then it creates a static charge on your hands that attracts the good and repels the bad.

25:10BubblemanYes, exactly. So I think, you know, I'd always try to explain to people, you know, because I saw people using balloons and other tools. And I just thought you're going to still create that charge, but you're not going to really be pushing contaminant through the screen simultaneously because capitate stocks and systolic hairs, the cellulose type materials. In colder environments in particular, we'll break and push through the smaller holes of the 70 micron screen while the heads themselves You know, unless they're small enough, we'll go through.

25:45BubblemanThey'll stay on top of the screen and eventually attach themselves. And anyone that's done the static hand sifting can tell you as well. It's just like anything. If you're using subpar material, it really doesn't work as well. And I think that's where the Sambo Creek filtration machine comes in, because with this And I think it's the same reason why it didn't spread quite like wildfire like I kind of thought it would when I first was like, okay, I'll start, you know, we'll put this out here a little bit.

26:17BubblemanWe had D420K with the iTunes card he was using to card his material, which was the process that I had figured out. You know, before I was told anything, I mean, the first time Johnny B and I met in Amsterdam, I invited him over to the house very soon after. I'm sure you remember that, Johnny B, the first time we made dry sift together.

26:40Johnny BWe laughed like kids. We dumped it all too. It was like one of the most funnest times coming back on that plane from Amsterdam in 2012. And then I said, I had this sift at home. He's like, bring it over. Let's clean it. I'm like, what? I already have a clean. He goes, no, no, no.

26:57BubblemanWhen you showed up, John, when you showed up, you were like, dude, look at this. You were like, this is good dry sift. This is the good dry sift. And I was like, That is not the good dry sift, John. I can tell you that's not the good dry sift. And so we carded his hash. I shit you not for 45 minutes. Now, I wish you could hear the audio of this video because this is the actual video of the hash that I cleaned for John.

27:26BubblemanAnd it was, we took this hit simultaneously. I took a bit, he took a bit. You know, you can't carve it. There's no carve back in the day. This was the Skunk Man Sam technique of using a stainless steel screen. And really, you have to understand that back in like 2012, even still, this was so... Insane for people to see, but when John and I finished this rip, and you can see this rip was like, I don't know, it was like three or four minutes long of us smoking this hash.

27:55BubblemanAt the end of it, we both like spit out our rip and you can hear us just laughing. I really wish I could figure out a way to share the audio because we were literally rolling around on the ground and I can tell you a light bulb went off in John's head and John's like, John's got to be one of the most fucking craziest people in the most wonderful way that I know.

28:16BubblemanHe's such a good dude, but when he attaches himself to something and he's now going to learn it, nobody's going to learn it like John. And he literally spent like the next 10 years just developing his first bounce, playing around with the sift, growing his own plants, and just like, you know, it was, I bet it was less than six months after this that he came to me and said, I'm, uh, I'm just going to turn all my crops into hash from now on.

28:43BubblemanTalk about that a little bit, Johnny B. What a revelation that was for you, you know, as a patient, because above all, you're a patient.

28:51Johnny BThat was the biggest thing is how it helped me with my pain. And before I was like, you know, doing butane, we made glass, made all these crazy things, right? So I understand like, like for me, when it came to SIFT and I go back a little before that, I mean, I mean, I was using a lot of concentrates to get through what I need for breakthrough pain.

29:09Johnny BSo I was the hot dabber. I would hit everything at 710. Everything dabbed me out because that's what I liked. And really when SIF came into the play, it was that next level because it got the flavor. It was able to actually help me with that next level, right? Like it wasn't just about... And it was the pure and be able to see that and then... Then cutting down my plants on the screens and getting that first bounce.

29:30Johnny BAnd I'm like, whoa, that was even more pure at that point than the carding, right? So that kind of led into the next stages of where we are now. And like, yeah, I mean, I got screens everywhere. They're sitting right here, of course, right? I mean... I got all kinds of different sets of screens. I was cleaning on the 304. I literally have everybody's screens outside in every different sizes.

29:53Johnny BAnd I was really learning how the different microns, and I was testing that too on a GC. So I was seeing the same profile, but just different TC levels with the hash and stuff like that. So I didn't really go down the rabbit hole. Awesome. Now it's kind of like, Shit, the little static tech and that little change. And I bare hand did the bare hand. And when that happened on my hand, I was like, that was the next level.

30:19BubblemanYeah, dude, that's what's up. I think Jen Doe lost sound. I think we all have sound. Sound is all working in the hash church there. So I'm not sure, Jen Doe, what's going on there?

30:34Johnny BWe're getting to that next level now. Now there's just so much going on with SIFT and that's what's so great about it. And seeing the advancements and then where it's going now in machines. I can't wait. We've had that shaking machine someone sent me. You've had all these things. Everybody's tried different machines. They're trying to have SIFT and the static tech.

30:55Johnny BWow, it's been a game changer because now everybody can do it at home and we're getting, well, I can't wait to hear what we're going to be involved with today's show. I'm very curious on all the new techniques and what's coming out in the future and what we're doing and be able to have separation.

31:10BubblemanWell, you're going to have to come by ATS one of these days soon, Johnny B, and we'll get the Sambo Creek filtration machine going and we'll make a nice video, the two of us, just like on this journey, right? Like 11, 12 years ago, we started this journey together with the dry sift. I started it a little earlier myself. I started dry sifting in probably the 90s, in the mid 90s.

31:35BubblemanI was a, you know, pretty much a... A farmer's grade dry sift guy. This was prior to Bubble Hash. And, you know, for me, it all started, and I've told the story many times, like bumping into Rob Clark in Amsterdam in 95. I was with my lawyer, John Conroy, at a Thai food restaurant near the Damrak, off the Damrak in Amsterdam. And I always tell the story.

31:58BubblemanIt was that it was a trippy Thai food restaurant because every single one of the waiters was a lady boy, a Katoi, if you're familiar with Thailand. And they were super cool. They were like they would let us puff in the restaurant, which was just like there weren't that many restaurants in Amsterdam. I mean, of course, The artiste, Simone's restaurant that we spent a lot of time in that Sam and Rob introduced me to years ago.

32:23BubblemanSimone was kind of militant. He would really let Sam and Rob enjoy puffs in his restaurant. And in fact, even one time, And then, you know, it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,

32:55BubblemanAnd Rob hit us up with this bowl and I smoked it and I watched it bubbling and melting and it just like disappeared. And he said, if it don't bubble, it ain't worth the trouble. And I was just like, what fucking wizardry is this? And for him, it was probably just come and gone experience. I couldn't stop thinking about that for years until I discovered and created my own full melt resin.

33:20BubblemanI had never seen hash in my life that melted into an oil. And my excitement for it really lit my passion. And anyone that ever met me in the early days when I was showing them the process, particularly of water extraction, because that's where it led for me into the bags and processing with water and ice. And that moment when you pull that bag and that golden sand is looping around on the screen and I called it the eyebrow race because everyone went, Like everyone, everyone's eyebrows hit the top of their hairline when we saw this process.

33:56BubblemanAnd of course, this was in the late 90s as well. So we've come a long way. You know, our community is a hilarious community. I think it's because so many neurodivergent people are attracted to cannabis. Yes, I'll say it. Neurodivergent. It's just a nice word for our mental illness. Thank you so much for joining us today.

34:42BubblemanBut I think it shows, you know, that our community is so out there. We're so fringed out. It's nice to see the legal aspect. It's nice to see that we, you know, it's good to be in the ethers and floating around and trying to discover things. It's also good to be grounded and have people on your team that are extremely grounded. So it's nice to see to see that more developing.

35:04BubblemanYou know, back in the day when cannabis was very illegal and prohibition was so hardcore, Thank you so much for joining us.

35:31BubblemanNow it's more safe for other people to be involved. It's safer for people to come out of the woodwork. People that have been working on these sort of processes that a lot of us might not understand completely. We're not all scientists. We haven't all delved down the rabbit hole. Thank you for joining us.

36:05BubblemanThank you so much for joining us today.

36:32BubblemanThank you so much for watching.

36:56BubblemanThank you so much for joining us today.

37:20BubblemanJust, you know, bouncing sift. So then we had the carding. Well, it was in the carding that D420K discovered that stuff was sticking to his card. Well, then Mies came along and created the balloon or whatever else he created. And then Tan had and more people. And it was just this sort of, you know, discovery because people were getting a little bit more of the information.

37:42SpeakerSo I'd love to say one more thing.

37:45BubblemanPlease, I'd love to hear from you.

37:46SpeakerI tried every technique I could. The static. I used a Van de Graaff generator and what it actually did was it spread the resin all over the room sticking to everything. So it was a failure. I guess I was using the wrong end of the electrical charge, the positive or the negative. The other thing I can remember early was somebody, I think it was THC Seeds, They found what they called Oprah hash.

38:25SpeakerThey were watching Oprah on TV and they noticed that the electrical starch of the TV screen was attracting the hash. And, you know, so a funny story. But another thing was I like that what John was talking about with the sifter. It's a stock sifter, each one with a different size screen that would mechanically shake. And those were very handy for what you could do is each different variety of cannabis, especially if it's grown in different ways, indoors, outdoors, big containers in the ground, has a slightly different sized resin head.

39:14SpeakerSo you could run some dry sift through this shaker that had, you know, all the different micron screens stacked, you know, the biggest at the top and the smallest at the low. And you could tune in exactly what was the best size screen to use for that particular variety.

39:40BubblemanAwesome, dude. Yeah, that generator story is hilarious, dude. I mean, look at even the Sambo filtration. I think one of the things they figured out was we got to encase this thing because I'm telling you, if you left the doors open on the Sambo Creek filtration plasmatic sifter, you would get a similar effect than you got with that Van de Graaff generator.

40:01Johnny BYou know, I can't believe how many different ways that I know we tried make and sift. I had things vibrating on screens. I put speakers. Oh, I mean, I tried everything. Went down that rabbit hole. So it was kind of fun to start seeing it, like I said, with the sifting and not just that change with static was, was the game changer.

40:21Etienne FontanDid you try different music? Was there any particular melodies or sounds or like heavy metal music? The bass really pushed the sifting or what happened?

40:31Johnny BI think we made a video on it just going across the thing and then we had this other like wand thing. It was definitely fun seeing how it's evolved and where it is now and the future, right? Like, It just, like I said, you know, separating all the different gland heads and those gland heads to have different accuracies and they all help with different conditions. And that's just my hypothesis, my hallucination of how we're going to start really taking it to that next level and just the different, the different, you know, maturity of that gland head and what, what it's actually abilities and what it can do with new research and technology.

41:08Johnny BWe're just scratching the surface. I'm excited to see what this is going to go.

41:12SpeakerHere in the Netherlands, When you tried to use a pollinator, for example, to make your farmer's hash, if you tried to do it in the middle of the summer when it was hot and humid, good luck. I mean, the yield was so ridiculously small and the rest would clump up. I mean, it was just terrible. But a walk-in freezer solved that really good.

41:39BubblemanAbsolutely. I still sift in a, even to make my farmer's grade sift, I sift in a walk-in freezer always. It just releases material better. I get a nicer, cleaner. You know, one of the things from the water extraction world, before water hash was happening, very few people were making hashish in the cannabis world. You had some Thank you so much for joining us.

42:12BubblemanSomething people threw away. They dumped it on the side of the road. I could get tons. And when I say tons, I don't mean like a lot. I mean like metric tons of sift. No problem. It was completely available. People were just tossing it and throwing away. And once the bags came out, it was three or four years after that, you couldn't get trim anymore. Now trim became something that you could buy if you were lucky.

42:37BubblemanSo it really changed the game in regards to... You know, how we looked at that material and it was this sort of, you know, turning trash into stash, right, was the old logo or motto, I should say, of, you know, being able to access that material. People legitimately were throwing it away. And in a very short period of time, it became a high value product. You know, years later, people would stop even using trim.

43:09BubblemanAnd a lot of people were starting to just say, hey, let's just use the flour. It wasn't too long after that, that someone was like, why don't we just freeze the flour right when it's off the stock, and we'll run it that way. So now, We were accessing these processes that would preserve volatile organic compounds. Well, the beautiful thing about dry sifting is you don't necessarily have to worry about preserving volatile organic compounds because you're not putting them into the water.

43:41BubblemanYou're not going to be, you know, whatever water solubles are in that material. And I've heard this many times. Oh, the water doesn't act as a solvent. Well, it certainly does because the water would be clear at the end of the process if it didn't act as a solvent. So it's definitely pulling material out of the hash that is not being pulled out from the dry sift material.

44:06SpeakerWhen we first found Varieties that you could dry varieties that you could water shift and minimally affect the terpene profile like Chitral. That was one of the first ones. You know, a lot of people drifted towards Chitral variety because the resin after you made water hash, it was practically the same as the Thank you.

44:50BubblemanRight. Well, from 1988 to 2024, I would love to hear, Charles, from you and your team, the scientists, how you guys figured out and came about creating this piece of equipment, because it certainly isn't what I would say. I mean, maybe to Alex, it is common sense. He's been working in electrostatic for 30 years. To the rest of us, it just isn't. When I first saw the machine, I was like, what the hell is this?

45:18BubblemanThis is wild. So I'd love to hear a little bit about that, Charles, from any of your team.

45:24SpeakerI have a question for Alex, which is, what is it that you were doing 30 years ago with electrostatic? Oh, this was separation of grain mostly. And the assumption was that they are different in conductivity, grain versus like garbage.

45:48SpeakerAnd that was reality because grain polarized and it was sticking to the surface versus all of this kind of... What kind of a device was it? No, it was wheat grain mostly. So it was separators of... But it could be used for any type of seeds. Basically, I... Don't want to refer to my previous experience, but real discovery for me was when I first had seen how you guys are doing this sifting on the screen.

46:29SpeakerAnd then I was, oh my gosh, there is charging here, right? And the initial assumption was that we need to rub it over nylon screen to get some charge. But fortunately, we bought a good, nice, very expensive electrometer. And that helped us to understand that, yeah, there is natural charge in raising. And this natural charge could work even without rubbing on the screen. So this could be like definite feature for separation.

47:10BubblemanVery interesting. You know, not everyone can do the process, Alex, with the hand. Some people's hands are too warm, and it just, what happens is as you're going in the circle... Or if their hands are sweaty.

47:22SpeakerAbsolutely. It doesn't work when you just discharge. With wet hands, you could discharge material, right?

47:30Jenn DoeYeah, or with a warm hand.

47:31SpeakerEverything should be very, very kind of low humidity. Cool.

47:36BubblemanYeah, low humidity, low heat, but even a bit of warmth without any sweat, which could be someone with warm hands and they've even got a glove on, so there's no moisture or sweat. It heats up the resin and it creates little balls. And the minute those balls are created, your hand is no longer touching the screen evenly. It's now lifted up a little bit. And anyone that's done this process has seen this.

48:00BubblemanSure, Wolverine Dabs has seen this, where you're just in the middle of doing a batch and all of a sudden you've got all these little The hash is starting to press and turn into little balls. And this is obviously, you know, not not what we want.

48:13SpeakerThat can also be probably because they didn't dry and cure the before they put their hands on it. Because and also if you have sweaty hands, good luck. Yeah, not only that, but if you have little bits of contamination sitting in the sift as well, that will also cause a snowballing effect and it will start building up those balls. But that's one of the things that the plasma separator has really helped eliminate for me in particular, because we run our material very aggressively.

48:50SpeakerIt gets rid of all those particulates. It just, it removes them onto the negative plate. Beautiful. There's also a factor of the material as well, right? Like some strains are just greasy and even for ice water, they might not wash super well. And so we struggle with them. We came up with a way around that, which we call brushing. But I think I was telling you, Logan, about that very excitedly.

49:12SpeakerWe found... Basically one kind of brush that will actually pick up contaminants off the screen. So you can do a reverse process if the material is not, well, we actually use it for everything, but if the material is not working well, you can just pull contaminants out instead of trying to pull the trichomes out and not have to put your hand on, on any resin. Yes. Some of the varieties, it's their terpene content, which is really, they're, they attract water and, uh, the hydro, uh, It's either being hydrophobic or hydroscopic.

49:46BubblemanOh, hydrophilic, isn't it? Mark, the chemist.

49:51SpeakerMarcus, so like, can you go ahead? No, no. I guess I'll write for me. Everything started with the work that Skunk Man Sam did. And you mentioned Steve Tanhat. That's really where I picked it up from. And we played around. With all kinds of things with him. And I posted a video on it. And that's really what got me interested was the number of viewers that were actually watching that video.

50:19SpeakerAnd I just, I kind of knew it was a there there. What really made things happen for me I used to be in mining. So this technology, it's nothing new. It's tried and true. I actually had an edge because I had used these machines in mining before. And here in Florida, one of the companies that actually makes the big industrial mining separators called Watertech, I flew up and did testing.

50:46SpeakerIt was weird, right? Because they didn't seem to understand what I was trying to do, even though they were really good at it. It made sense to me. You go to the pros and, hey, this is a simple problem. Can you help me fix it? Didn't go very well. What really popped for me was when I had a grown-up explain to me what was happening. Because obviously, based on what Skunk Man and what I had learned from Tan had, it was obvious that the physics were there.

51:11SpeakerBut I didn't understand what I was looking at. And I think, well, obviously what did it for me was like having Alex in the room, really explaining to me why, the why and the how, you know, try not to kill yourself with a power supply. So once that happened, everything progressed really quickly. And now that I look back into the years past, all of like the recorded videos that we took, There were obvious observations then that we simply didn't know what we were looking at.

51:38SpeakerSo like we're continuing to make discoveries that observationally they're there, but we just couldn't tie one and one together. And so like the pace of innovation, It's kind of been extremely fast because there are so many users and there's so much feedback from the community on how to improve the process. It's kind of like if you look at BHO, like the first extractors and where we are today, it's night and day.

52:04SpeakerSo because this is a new technology, everything's moving so fast. And then when you put in people like Christoph into the mix, I mean, like the man's extremely humble, but you combine the know-how With the passion of cannabis and then the access with someone like Renee, like, I mean, the pace of innovation is so insane that we have some really cool stuff, you know, just, just continually down the pipeline.

52:33SpeakerAnd then there's other people that are coming up with incredibly awesome stuff too, which is, you know, super cool. At the same time that this is all going on, People were improving the vaporization process. So together, it just, yeah, it just, because that's what I like, you know, well-made dry sift, really pure, and then vaporized instead of combusted. It was really cool for me. I remember I posted on Facebook or something like that.

53:10SpeakerAnd then you reached out. I'll be honest. We had a conversation and I really felt good about what I had done after I spoke with you because I don't know, like I felt like, damn, you know, like this guy is a legend and just kind of having that I'm going to say seal of approval sort of, but that's, at least that's what I took from it. I thought, you know, like kudos, you know, the man was like, you know, approving of what I had done and pushing the industry forward.

53:41SpeakerSo for me, that was like a real big morale booster after I had that conversation with you, I guess it was over a year ago or something like that. So anyway, that, that to me was pretty cool. And I really wanted you to hook up with Renee. And now that there's a machine right there, you know, you can kind of, at least Renee, you gotta, you gotta hook the brother up and...

54:00SpeakerTake some hash over. I would be very happy to see him in our facility and make some hash together. It would really be a honor to me to see him in our facility and to make a good hash in the Netherlands. And maybe we can make also something for the coffee shops, a real legends hash for the coffee shops. Would be really nice to see you here.

54:24BubblemanSome skunk man, Sam, static dry sift available in a coffee shop in Amsterdam would be absolutely bonkers. Oh my God, dude, I'm flying to Amsterdam.

54:37SpeakerUnfortunately, we're not in Amsterdam because the legal weed supply project is only around in the rural areas like Den Haag and Breda, Tilburg in these areas. Okay, you're one of the 10 licenses then. Yeah, we are one of the Dutch experiments. Yeah, the Dutch weed experiment. Yeah.

54:59BubblemanOkay. Yes.

55:00SpeakerI've spoken to quite a few of those groups and everything that you supply a coffee shop before it's supplied to a coffee shop. Is it lab tested to show that it's not adulterated in any way or contaminated or with pesticides or is that happening already? Yes, in the little weed experiment, everything what's going on the market must be tested every batch. So we test on mycotoxins, pesticides, heavy metals.

55:32SpeakerYeah, well, that's one of the things consumers, safety has to come first. I absolutely agree with this.

55:41BubblemanI also agree with this. It's, you know, there's a lot of people who, I saw this sort of, you know, people like, When the legal cannabis thing came out and, you know, you'd get the legal folks who were really not from the black market in any way. And they'd say things like, oh, you know, there's dangerous cannabis out there. And then the cannabis industry would get upset and be like, we've been smoking this cannabis that hasn't been tested for forever and it's totally safe and it's fine.

56:11BubblemanI don't know. I still visit grows in the black market to this day and they are spraying the most heinous shit all over the plants that you can possibly believe.

56:20SpeakerAnd you gotta remember, Marcus, that when the first testing happened in 2008 in California and a few years later here in the Netherlands, 85% of the cannabis either had Dangerous chemical pesticides, insecticides, or microorganisms that were not healthy for you to smoke.

56:45Etienne FontanSometimes higher than 85% sometimes there, Sam. So yes, I agree because I helped pioneer that testing in California back in 07, 08 when we finally railed it out. And we were absolutely floored by how many people were running illegal shit.

57:05SpeakerYeah, we knew it was true because we had a lab more than 10 years earlier than that time. And we found it when we were testing like high times cannabis cup stuff. We didn't publicize our results, but we found out what was going on.

57:27Etienne FontanAnd it wasn't the pesticides and herbicides that actually instigated it. I got an upper respiratory infection from a mold and I couldn't see it. And we realized then that we could not see something through our microscopes as Well, as we thought we were doing with organoleptic testing, we realized we were still failing. And that's what really pushed us to push me to reach out to all solely and ask them and get rejected and then find Ethan Russo and find Arno.

57:58Etienne FontanBecause it was a journey of frustration initially. I didn't have access to you or your lab or to say, hey, Sam, how do I start a lab? You know what I'm saying? It was something we literally had to start from the ground up and then finding real scientists, real coordinators of UVH PLC machines, of gas chromatographs. Then we were able to take that next step.

58:21SpeakerSteve D'Angelo came over and visited me several years before they opened the Steve Hill Labs and what he was doing. And I gave him as much advice as I could because freely I gave it to him because I really wanted to protect consumer safety.

58:44Etienne FontanWell, the big problem with Steep Hill, for those that are watching, is that they wanted to make the science proprietary. And I was like, no, science is open source. Science is replicatable. We're not going to hide behind a veil and outcharge everybody just to know the science. So that was something that we push. And one reason why I not only fired Steep Hill once, I fired them twice because of...

59:09Etienne FontanAnd it wasn't fun.

59:19SpeakerYeah, we were lucky because we were fully licensed in the early, very early 90s. And we were working closely with Dr. Bren Eisen in Zurich and Dr. Meshulam and Dr. El-Sole so that we were able to get proper, proper results very quickly.

59:44BubblemanWell, it's definitely important. You know, it's it is funny how many people in the sort of gray market were like, oh, God, we've been smoking weed for a long time. It's totally safe. You don't have to worry about it. It's like, yeah, well, when you get weed up to like five, six, seven thousand dollars a pound in the black market. Thank you for watching.

1:00:22BubblemanAnd I, you know, I saw it as well in Jamaica in a big way. And, you know, these were like super conscious people, super conscious growers, but I'd always, whenever I went to a field in Jamaica, I would run a walk around the outer area of the field because that's where they would toss these bottles of these pesticides and fungicides. And really bad shit that would like could fuck you up legitimately.

1:00:47BubblemanAnd I kind of, you know, one time I caught this guy and I was like, dude, like, what? What are you doing, man? This is like what you're better than this. And he was just like, man, this is a matter of me either putting food on my table or me not putting food on my table. So for him, it was like this. It was easy for me to judge and be sort of like, dude, come on.

1:01:08BubblemanBut on his side of things, he was like, look, bro, it's either I'm going to feed my family this month Or I'm not going to feed my family this month. So I personally love the idea of being people being forced. I hate over regulations. But I do love the fact that I've mentioned this on hash church before. That we do have a regulatory system in place. Maybe some of them are a little outrageous and we don't need to worry about like, oh, the packaging looks like it's being marketed to children.

1:01:35BubblemanIn the meantime, you can have Captain Morgan on the rum bottle, no problem, but you can't have anything on cannabis. So there are bad regulations for cannabis, but the regulations that make it safe, that make it so you can't spray Thank you so much for joining us.

1:02:09Etienne FontanYes, but let's also test the CBD suppliers who are filling their stuff with stuff we don't really know. And one reason why they backed out of California is because they can't follow the actual testing standards. And as Dr. Scaldone will tell you, and all of us, science matters. And the reason why we push science is because, you know, we were dealing with cancer and AIDS patients and they get an upper respiratory infection, it can kill you.

1:02:36Etienne FontanAnd that's the responsibility that we carry.

1:02:39SpeakerIt's bad enough when you use poisons on food. I mean, I would never do it in a million years. But when you smoke it, watch out.

1:02:52Etienne FontanWell, that's the problem. The unscrupulous people, because we watched it very early on, is that it would fail testing. And this is before California decided, well, then we get to destroy that as opposed to a retest it, then destroy it. I would watch them go right up the street and sell that cannabis that failed exactly for what you stated, Marcus, that we heard every excuse. I'm going to lose my farm.

1:03:17Etienne FontanI'm going to lose this if I don't have the money for that. So... That has always been a frustration of navigation of ethics. I think all of us suppliers, producers that are providing medically, we have had to navigate those unscrupulous waters every day because everybody wants to sell and everybody wants to make good. And again, back then we used to turn away 80% of what we used to see in a day's time.

1:03:48Etienne FontanAnd then when we started to test, then it became 10% because when you started to look at the significant amount of failures. And I'm glad that we started testing and that people have been held to standards that they have to get to because we know that there is good cannabis and you can grow good cannabis without pesticides and herbicides by doing it. But it's hard work and it's really about being clean and I'm constantly cleaning up after yourself and it's hard work.

1:04:22SpeakerUsing integrated best management.

1:04:27Etienne FontanExactly.

1:04:30BubblemanI got to shout out Grandmaster LED because I've yet to see anything more effective than that UVC light that he has. Five minutes a day, he's devastating threat populations, he's devastating mite populations, he's devastating apes. I've never seen a person bring thousands of spider mites into their room with a smile on his face. And the craziest thing is, This wasn't some R&D grow. This was his medical grow.

1:05:01BubblemanHe didn't have an R&D grow. He just had his own grow. He was like, all right, I'm going to stand behind this technology because I know it works. And it actually affects mildew as well. So we're moving into the future here with technology and abilities to You know, to grow better cannabis. I would love to know, Charles, if you're seeing a big problem with pesticides and herbicides in Morocco, if that's, you know.

1:05:27SpeakerYeah, I mean, that's for sure. So You know, Marcus, actually, we had envisioned to do a conference in Morocco in February. Unfortunately, I went to ANRAC. ANRAC is like the NED or whatever, the regulatory agency. And so basically, there were like no educational... Thank you so much for joining us.

1:06:18SpeakerBetter quality resin. I know Jen and her team is working with a plasma static to develop genetics that are amenable to that process to take to places like that. And I was just in Morocco, man, and really, we almost got into trouble because There's a, I guess there's been like atypical rains in Morocco and I guess flooding in the desert, which was like historic, right? And so there's been a lot of powdery mildew and we were at an actual farm where I almost got literally held up, you know?

1:06:54SpeakerBecause the guy that I was rolling with, I guess he sold these guys some seeds and they were blaming the issue on the seeds. And so the management practices that they have aren't on par. I get it. There's limits to their management.

1:07:12SpeakerYou know, you can't exactly go buy, you know, beneficial insects or just the access to technology isn't there. And so what happens is I've seen the kind of pesticides that they use. It is insane, especially when they start seeing these powdery mildews and all these kinds of things like that. The chemicals that they put, and not just that, it's the fertilizers too, right? The soil isn't forgiving and just, they need a lot more education and they just can't get it.

1:07:45SpeakerThey really can't get it. What they need is genetics which have, that resist mildew and there's also genes which are susceptible to mildew. If you have the ones that are susceptible to mildew, good luck. If you have the ones, it's more important to not have the susceptible ones, to have the resistant ones, but it's better to have both.

1:08:16BubblemanYeah, having no susceptibility and resistance, that's the combo you're looking for.

1:08:21SpeakerBut Marcus, even like post-harvest practices, There's so much knowledge that you need to spread because just some of the stuff, I can see how they were losing resin. They're just throwing the flour until dry and concrete. Look, a lot of it has to do with lack of knowledge, but also lack of investment. And at the end of the day, for the most part, it's still illegal there.

1:08:44SpeakerSo they don't really want or can't invest in infrastructure because it's illegal. They really are limited with what they want to do and what they can do because it's all liability. So I understand that it's very difficult, the situation that they're in. But nonetheless, you see some of these not best practices that They end up producing lower quality stuff because the soil is... They have the right to roar to do something far better than they do.

1:09:16SpeakerAnd the proof is that I've got some guys down there that are producing just some incredible stuff, incredible fresh frozen stuff. One of the other problems in Morocco, of course, is that... It's all seeded. There is no Simpsonia grown in Morocco that I've ever seen. Yeah. No, it's a problem. Everything gets fertilized.

1:09:40BubblemanThe government doesn't see the value of reducing the illegality, the prohibition, which feeds the gangs and the, you know, the... The folks who make sense to me. Yeah, like it just and then the safety of like people are using it. They're the number one exporter of hashish worldwide. So I can't imagine that they don't see the value with like the US and Canada and Europe and all these countries and continents, for God's sakes, like legalizing cannabis.

1:10:13BubblemanMorocco could be in an incredible position. I can't believe they told you no education.

1:10:19SpeakerThat is wild. I, I, to me, it didn't make sense because the way I saw it was, look, We're not advocating that you do anything illegal. By all means, not at all. I want everybody to legalize and get on board and do things right. But they see it as you're educating the illegal market how to do business. That's kind of how they see it. So either you legalize or you don't.

1:10:44SpeakerI don't know that middle path that they want to be treading. Maybe I disagree with it. I mean, it is what it is. But I just think that If you're going to go down that path, they should go down that path. Everybody should legalize, learn best practices and get and get their act together. Primarily because I just believe that so if they're obviously the consumption isn't local, so it's going to third parties, the third countries.

1:11:10SpeakerRight. And so if that's the situation, I mean, I look at the price that these local farmers are growing or getting locally. They're getting some real good prices. It just seems like most of the people there are making money. They're making a lot of money. So my concern is there are, I mean, you're driving down the road and there's just farm after farm. It never stops. And there's thousands of people that depend on this industry.

1:11:33SpeakerSo my concern is what happens when the prices in Europe get to like a California type situation where at one point, if the quality in Morocco does not step up, They won't be able to make any money because they won't be able to sell to Europe or they will just be able to, they'll just be like a lower quality product. They won't be able to compete because it's coming.

1:11:55SpeakerI mean, look at the size of Rene's operation. I mean, it's insane. And he's just one person, right? What happens when the entirety of Europe Thank you for joining us.

1:12:24SpeakerTry to grow corn in the Amazon. There is a billion and one bugs trying to kill you and trying to kill the corn. And then when you harvest the corn, there is no way you're going to get that corn off of that mountain onto the river and to market at a profit. It's impossible. So that's what I'm concerned that's going to happen to those people. And I thought, if I can help, you know, I know great people with the knowledge to help these people.

1:12:50SpeakerI was going to do a free event. You know, we had already 100 people signed up. Free education, free food, free education, free everything. Just so they can understand Thank you so much for joining us.

1:13:24SpeakerYeah.

1:13:25BubblemanSo obviously the government needs more. There needs to be a group of people in Morocco working on sort of promoting these concepts to the government to see that.

1:13:32SpeakerYeah, more advocacy.

1:13:33BubblemanIn my dream world, you know, all of these, and it's so weird that cannabis is like this. It's like all the people that were deeply involved, not all of them, but a lot of people that were deeply involved in cannabis were Thank you so much for joining us today.

1:14:02BubblemanI could buy hash from Afghanistan or Lebanon or, you know, India or Nepal. I always got to show my traditional hashes when I talk about traditional hash. So there's a kilo of Afghan right there. I'm a little bent up because it's so soft. I can just sort of, this is just like the most beautiful, beautiful, like traditional hash. Skunk Man Sam wouldn't be interested in it. And the Becca Valley hash.

1:14:28BubblemanYou know, the old school bags. There's a kilo in that one as well. And I would just, I would love for everyone to be able to go down to the store and be like, oh, I got some Nepali finger hash today. It just came in from Katmandu. Like, how fucking cool is that? Oh, really? Well, I've got some Lebanese Becca Valley blonde here. Let me just shave you a little piece off and I'll take a little.

1:14:49BubblemanIt's the spice, right? It's been traded worldwide for so long that, you know, and once again, for the Dutch experiment, I think it's great that the Dutch are working on doing things and it's cool idea for the Dutch to grow all of their cannabis in-house for the market. For hash, Holland, Amsterdam in particular, has always been about like, I mean, go to the Bluebird Cafe and see the 15 to 20 different kinds of hash on the menu and And those hashes are from all over the world.

1:15:19BubblemanAnd you can call, you know, you can call your hash Afghan style or Lebanese style. But if you didn't grow it in that terroir, it's not. That's just a fact. So the terroir becomes the thing. You know, what we're doing is we are allowing the resin to express the variables of the terroir. And that is the value. It's like, oh, what's the terroir like? Well, here, let me show you.

1:15:46BubblemanThis is what the terroir is like. This was a particularly dry summer. We had to water a little extra, you know, just all of these different things. And to me, that becomes the value of the product, not just the product itself. Of course, here in Canada, we did the same thing. And I'm sure the Dutch probably copied us on it. We very much locked out importation. We can export, but nobody imports into Canada.

1:16:11BubblemanAnd that was because, you know, companies spent hundreds of millions of dollars to build up a facility. As they're complete chads and totally clueless. But on the flip side of that, you've got the ability to not have to spend that much money, build something in Columbia and ship metric tons into Canada, while all the other people that spent hundreds of millions have egg on their face. and their business is being collapsed so that's how canada set it up they set it up to protect investors so that when we built and and we're growing here in canada that you wouldn't all of a sudden be like oh actually jamaica is now sending uh bubble hash it's uh 33 cents a gram uh and you my friend are out of business so i don't pretend to understand world economics so perfectly but i do wish that we could all enjoy the terroirs Thank you for watching.

1:17:21BubblemanWe don't know how many places in the world can produce even better cannabis than the cannabis that we're seeing now because the culture might not have been birthed there like it wasn't the center of the cannabis universe like California was. That's not to say there are some spectacular terroirs around the world that could grow some unbelievable profiles for us to experience. I'm blabbing on.

1:17:48SpeakerI agree with you, Marcus. As long as it's tested and safe and everything everywhere should be allowed to be sold everywhere.

1:18:01BubblemanThat would be a nice thing. Well, I guess, you know, it starts with allowing it to be accessible. And really, this whole episode about Static Sift, it's really about the accessibility of Static Sift. I can tell you 10 years ago, this panel would have been like two people. You know, 20 years ago, it would have been one person, just Sam sitting by himself. Hey, how's it going, everybody?

1:18:22BubblemanBut now we've got all these other minds playing and tinkering and working in different cultivars. And the more that we get that, the further we'll travel down this pathway of purity and isolation and extraction. So I'm here for it. I just had a nice little rip of some, oh, what did I hit? Rainbow Marker. Very nice. Pheno number seven on the Rainbow Marker. Absolutely spectacular. You know, I had, I'd love to hear more from Alex on the sort of the science and the figuring out of, and even really, okay, I'm not even sure where you are, Alex, in the world, but one of the things that has really made life difficult, and Sam can speak to this because he wanted to get a machine done years ago, and he had a machine in mind that he thought would work, but it was in, was it in Poland?

1:19:16BubblemanYeah. It was in Eastern Europe.

1:19:19SpeakerIt was in Eastern Europe, right. I went there. I offered to... Have them send me one and I'd give them a $50,000 deposit because it wasn't a cheap machine. It's more like the lines you guys were talking about working with the mining industry and stuff. But it could do huge volumes, huge volumes. And I knew it was going to work. But once they found out I was working with cannabis, even though I was legally licensed by the Dutch health ministry, They wouldn't have anything to do with me.

1:20:01BubblemanYeah, so that stunts the growth of these think tanks, getting together and being able to like, let's create equipment. Well, where's all the equipment created? Well, not in cannabis friendly countries, I can tell you that. Almost exclusively, they are not available in cannabis. Now, Germany, okay, Germany has kind of changed the, flipped the script a little bit. It's still slow to go, but at least they're not like maybe pulling people over on the side of the road and taking their blood.

1:20:29BubblemanI don't know, maybe they're still doing that, but that's fucking crazy. Holy Christ, there's some madness out there in this world. But no, I'd love to hear from you, Alex, and just in regards to like where you are, is it difficult to find cannabis to work with? Because you can work on these concepts all day long, but if you don't have cannabis to work with, he's your neighbor.

1:20:49SpeakerI really appreciate, Marcus, that you brought together all people from around the world. I'm here close to you in Eastern Canada, in Halifax.

1:20:58BubblemanOkay, yeah, that's only like a 98-hour drive. I could be there in 98 hours.

1:21:06SpeakerWelcome to Halifax. I like it. And there's a couple of cannabis companies around. And the problem for us researchers is that we could not work in university with cannabis because it does require special licensing and all of this stupid stuff. So I'm working with industry directly. And I'm glad that I kind of found Charles, who is also interested in the same type of problems. So I guess we are doing great things together.

1:21:45BubblemanYeah, I forgot that you were in Canada and that you had access to Canadian LPs. It is, listen, our system here is completely focacled in the worst of ways, yet I will also say, as focacled as it is, We have incredible access to cannabis. You know, you can literally like go to the store and just buy like some of the top hash and live hash rosin that you could really find anywhere on the planet.

1:22:12BubblemanIt's just available to random people to walk into stores. You can grow your own plants. You can, you know, the whole legalization of cannabis to me, how it really sort of Hit prohibition hard was that how cops always busted us was with their nose. And once cannabis became legal, recreationally and medicinally, it pulled that ability. They were no longer able to be like, hey, I smell cannabis, like pull over there.

1:22:40BubblemanI'm ripping through your car. It was like, yeah, I have a legal cannabis license. I'm allowed to have cannabis. There's my cannabis in the backseat. That's what you can smell. So having the ability to be taken away from the police to search and seize, personally, that was the first big one that I felt when I got my cannabis license back in, geez, I don't know, 2014 or something, I think, Johnny B.

1:23:03BubblemanI walked me down to the his his pain specialist doctor and was like, if you got pain, like just let's get you a license like you can grow 98 plants. So we're very lucky in Canada. Not so lucky. I have manufacturing partners who have worked at their Chinese. They've worked out of China their whole life. They're also my partners at ATS, which was formerly known as Embark, which is an LP here in Canada.

1:23:27BubblemanReally great guys, really smart guys, and they've been doing manufacturing for a very long time. So like anything that exists already, they can make it even beefier and better, but they can also more importantly just From our ideas and concepts from paper to CAD, just develop equipment that we that we can be testing, you know, in a short period later. But the problem is cannabis is so fucking illegal in China, so illegal in China.

1:23:57BubblemanSo illegal, in fact, that the Chinese government made an announcement in Canada that they requested that their Canadian citizens, the Chinese Canadian citizens, did not indulge in the cannabis market in any way, shape or form. That was from the government of China sending a message to Chinese Canadians in Canada, you better not be fucking smoking weed while you're there.

1:24:21SpeakerThat's how much... Go to Oklahoma and work on the slave farms. This is good just because it will protect us from copying of machinery.

1:24:34Dr Mark ScialdoneDid they send a message on TikTok?

1:24:36BubblemanMy partners are less interested in copying. They're more like the beat. They make incredible quality equipment. So if you ever want that equipment made in the most insane beefcake way, they have like lasers that do all the robotic lasers that like that do all of their welding. So like the welding, it's just beyond what a human being can do. It's absolutely bonkers. But yes. It is good because if they did have cannabis in China, I suspect, well, everything pretty much comes from there now as it is.

1:25:11BubblemanI'm sure all of our computers and most of our clothes and who knows what else, but quite a few things. I want to give a shout out to Wade and Jen Doe and Dr. Mark Sheldon. They've all three have come into the room since we've been blabbering on for an hour and a half. So I wanted to make sure that we said hello to them. How you doing, Mark?

1:25:32Dr Mark ScialdoneOh, doing well, doing well. Still, I really enjoyed the conversation with Roger last week. That was so cool. And it inspired me to dust off the Puff Co and get it out.

1:25:45BubblemanDude, I went and found that old pen.

1:25:48Dr Mark ScialdoneI saw that. Yeah.

1:25:49BubblemanSo why is the internet so full of like just nasty people?

1:25:54SpeakerI find it.

1:25:55BubblemanI just put, listen, I haven't touched this pen. It might be even five years. But at least two or three.

1:26:18BubblemanWhat the fuck? So I post this and then people are like, what's the big deal? Like I have stuff that I haven't used in years and I just charge it up and it works. And I'm like, OK, yes, maybe you missed the part where I did not charge it up. It's it's been sitting for like, dude, honestly. I don't know if I've ever charged this unit in the 10 years that I've owned it.

1:26:38BubblemanI don't ever remember.

1:26:40Dr Mark ScialdoneIt still has the original charge from Roger.

1:26:42BubblemanDude, I don't know. I'm not trying to make shit up, but I'm telling you, this thing sat in my truck for years, and I absolutely did not have a truck charger for it, and it just worked. Thank you for watching.

1:27:15BubblemanI was blown away that it still works. I'm now timing it from today to the next time. And I haven't turned it off. So when it's on, if anyone understands how batteries work, the battery can release its power, right? It's still on. The fact that it doesn't have an auto shut off really shows how old it is, too. How old it is, yeah.

1:27:38Dr Mark ScialdoneBut those things were ahead of their time. And it was great to give him an episode to tell his story because it's a great story out there, right?

1:27:47BubblemanWell, it's a great success story. And the bottom line is I like to give exposure, not that Jolly Roger and Puffco needs it as well, but to our community here on Hash Church, I like people to know, like, It's good for us to acknowledge the people who have put in the work and who are doing, you know, like people can hate on Puffco all they want and they can go and make their little comments.

1:28:10BubblemanBut I don't think people really understand how much true energy we put into developing and building these, you know, whether it's Etienne with the Berkeley's patient group, whether it's Skunkman Sam with his licensing and his You know, production of CBD cultivars for GW and all the work that he's done myself with bubble bags, like Wade with Harlequin, all of these different people, they're putting like their hearts and souls into it.

1:28:36BubblemanSo when you just see someone coming out of left field on Reddit and going, oh yeah, those guys are fucking, fucking this and fucking that. And let's just fucking, I'll just, I'm destroying this company today. It doesn't take a lot of energy to go on the internet and try to destroy someone. But I'm telling you, whether you believe it or not, there is a karmic, Thank you for joining us today.

1:29:16BubblemanThat's the guy that's going to spend the next seven years on Reddit trying to destroy my company. Absolutely. 100%. So the other moral of the story is when you are in the wrong and you've done something that isn't ideal from a human or customer service perspective, apologize.

1:29:35SpeakerThat's easy.

1:29:36BubblemanMake it right.

1:29:38Dr Mark ScialdoneIt was just pent up anger. You know, I don't know. Maybe people are jealous on what they've done. But holy shit, it's been, what, 10 years now since they came out with that. And Marcus, I got to just thank you again. This church, the Hash Church has been so great. For just bringing us back together. I mean, I had completely... Roger and I had not talked in years.

1:30:02Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd since we've exchanged texts and we're going to try to hook up and it's just... Yeah, it's so cool because the people... Obviously behind the products, not necessarily the products is what makes it cool. But Marcus, so I want to go back to something that you had said earlier, and I just want to make sure that I understand this. So you had said the word cellulose, and I remember early on in a Hash Church episode when we had this discussion, and I think Sam agreed with me that we went to the Pioneering work of Paul Malberg, right?

1:30:38Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd so he was like what, right? Sam, like one of two federal lab. There was the lab in Mississippi where El Soli was, but then Malberg also had a license. And within about 10 years, he published about 20 papers on the accumulation of cannabinoids in the trichome. And did the most extensive studying on what the makeup of the trichome was, where the enzymatic machinery was that was actually making these cannabinoids, how the cannabinoid and terpene biosynthetic pathways intersected.

1:31:16Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd his work is all available on the internet. So it's just a wonderful body of work like Mishulam to just read and to understand the guy and how he thought of things.

1:31:27BubblemanCan I task you with posting that in Hash Church, some of those studies?

1:31:32Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, there's actually, Marcus, there's actually a website. I think he was at the University of Indiana, and I believe the university itself has an archive of Thank you. Thank you.

1:32:05Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd that waxy cuticle is not made of cellulose. It's made of fats, waxes and lipids. And so when the when the trichome develops biosynthetically on the plant, you're actually developing basically an envelope of fat, right? Because all these molecules are fat soluble. You were talking about water soluble. Before, in terms of losing terpenes that you would lose in a water extraction versus a dry sift, and I'll talk about that in just a second.

1:32:37BubblemanAt least volatile organic compounds, maybe not terpenes, volatile organic compounds. Something smells in the water.

1:32:44Dr Mark ScialdoneRight. Most terpenes have very, very limited water solubility, but they are slightly soluble to the tune of about, you know, one, about two milligrams in a liter. So you can imagine a two liter bottle of Pepsi or just imagine that. So there'd be two milligrams of stuff in that two liter. That's not a lot of stuff, but certainly enough to flavor and fragrance the water. Now, other terpenes like camphor have a much higher degree of water solubility, but most of the terpenes that are in cannabis aren't very water soluble, but you will basically saturate to the point where the water turns cloudy.

1:33:27Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd what you're looking at in that cloudy water is actually what chemists would call an emulsion, right? Because you're starting to emulsify the oil layer Thank you for joining us today.

1:34:05Dr Mark ScialdoneHi, molecular weight polymer of glucose, right? And so like the fibers of the plant and the bass fiber itself is mostly just just cellulose. But in and around the trichome, it's mostly fats, waxes and lipids. You could actually feel like a very. Thank you for joining us today.

1:34:48Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, the chemical makeups of everything else that's in there. But the last thing I just wanted to say is that, you know, it's funny because, again, what you're distinguishing when you when you get the heads. So when you're talking about the television screen and just the developing of a static charge most of the time. So the reason why the reason why a static charge develops in the first place is because you have two heterogeneous materials that are next to each other.

1:35:17Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd often in the homogeneous material, the positive charges and the minus charges are equally balanced. But when you put two different materials together, That's when you create this imbalance and that's where you get that static charge. So I was thinking, you know, God, what would be actually the physical phenomena of why heads would be attracted? And so it's pretty easy to think about because like with the television screen, it's basically positively charged.

1:35:53Dr Mark ScialdoneSo it attracts negatively charged dust particles and that's why you get the static discharge every once in a while. So what in the trichome is negatively charged? Well, if you look at the fats and waxes that are making up the head itself, Those all have basically a charged group, right? They're basically, it's kind of, it's what, it's what, it's not quite a liposome mark. It's more like a, it's more like a micelle.

1:36:24Dr Mark ScialdoneSo what happens is you get the alignment of all the positive charges that are around the head. And then what happens is the hydrophobic tails stick into the middle. And that's what creates the solubilizing medium for things like cannabinoids and terpenes and whatnot. So it just dawned on me, oh man, the heads are negatively charged, right? Because you gotta know whether it's positive or negative, right? Because it sounds like, Sam, from your experiment, you reversed the polarity, right?

1:36:56Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd you found that negative repels negative and this shit went all over the room, right? But I wonder how uniform that is because I don't know. I mean, the head itself is balanced in terms of its charge. So for every positive charge, there's a minus charge. But maybe there's kind of like an overall minus charge in and around the head itself, which makes the reason why it attracts.

1:37:24Dr Mark ScialdoneSo again, just from a chemical point of view, I was just trying to think of what chemically might really make that feature prominent. And I'll stop there.

1:37:35SpeakerMark, very interesting. Very interesting thing because we do have charging on the double layer. So basically these heads are natural electric. And this is, this is kind of, Very important thing which will allow us to separate heads from tails or from everything else.

1:38:00Dr Mark ScialdoneSo is there a functional group, Alex, that I'm kind of ignoring in terms of like the self-assembly of the outer surface of the trichome head that there could be like a carbohydrate that's on that head that's negatively charged? Or what's the chemical species that's negatively charged? And I looked at a bunch of Malberg products. Papers while I was, while we were on the episode earlier, and I didn't see him address it at all, so I don't know if that is fully understood yet.

1:38:33SpeakerSee, the chemistry of this is really complicated, and I guess we are just at the beginning of discoveries in this area. But the point is, what the fact is, that they have pretty much a distinguished electrical charge, and I measured this charge It's coulombs, so it's, sorry, nanocoulombs per, say, per square millimeter. So it's significant charge which could not be simply discharged. We could definitely change this charge by manipulation with electric field.

1:39:17SpeakerHowever, it's much better just to separate this hush in natural state without preliminary, let's say, electrical interactions.

1:39:29Dr Mark ScialdoneBut if you did attract them, like you say, can you reverse the polarity of the electrical field and now disattract them or you make them fall off? The physics would say that you can, right?

1:39:47Dr Mark ScialdoneI don't know.

1:39:49SpeakerWe tried it. Christoph, this is like for you right there. That's like your realm right there, man. You want to talk about that one? Is Chris still on?

1:40:05SpeakerI have to put my mic on. Yes, I did. There he is. So we did some research on that and we it's like the electrical fields does polarization with the with the different types of materials and we are to be honest we're also starting to get into it because we haven't we had this more on a project size we had before. And we think it's also the polarity, polarity binder that you have in THC.

1:40:38SpeakerYou have a polarity binding in there that has a like a A direction in the electrical field that it tries to go through or that it attracts one side of the plate, especially because you also have a higher water content in the heads than in the stems. Water is easier to polarize. I guess Alex will know much more than I do because he worked in a longer time in this field.

1:41:06SpeakerI'm only here for like 15 years in my own company. And we're working on that and trying to look that, to look at the capacity of the material, to measure that, the comparison between heads and stems, also to do some, we're working on some research, especially with Renee right now, to improve like the separation way and the separation results that you have in the machine, also to improve the process.

1:41:37SpeakerYeah, but it's a little bit longer way to go. Still.

1:41:42Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, Chris, if you're saying that the attraction is actually due to the THC or the cannabinoids themselves, do you see a more profound effect the higher the potency is in the head?

1:41:58SpeakerI think so, yes, of course, because you have much more THC molecules inside there, and the more THC molecules you have in there, but I'm not a chemist, sorry.

1:42:10Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I am.

1:42:12SpeakerYeah, that helps.

1:42:14Dr Mark ScialdoneI'm a chemist. Do you have a chemistry question?

1:42:18SpeakerPerfect.

1:42:18Dr Mark ScialdoneHere's a question. What

1:42:21SpeakerSorry, Chris, go ahead. I was just going to say, like, I mean, if we should ask these questions to like Logan and Ezra and Renee, as far as like the propensity of separation of larger molecules versus smaller, you know, like 45 micron heads, I guess that could really just give you a ballpark whether the concentration of cannabinoids Indeed is the primary catalyst of a stronger separation. So like Rene, Logan, Ezra, what do you guys think?

1:42:54SpeakerWhat does your visual work tell you about the separation?

1:43:02SpeakerAnyone?

1:43:06SpeakerI see Rene, you're really thinking about it.

1:43:11SpeakerCan you rephrase the question more specifically? Are you asking about like separating things under 45 micron or like above 175? Okay, so the bigger the head, so like if you have like a 190, the argument is that it'll contain a larger amount of THC or cannabinoids in general. Smaller heads would contain a smaller amount of THC and cannabinoids in general. And so in your experience, is it easier to separate the larger heads, which should contain more cannabinoids than the smaller ones?

1:43:43SpeakerUm, No, I think in my experience, it all comes down to the level of contamination in the sift you're working with. I think if you have the right concentration of heads and you're using the right technique, like we can usually collect them. Generally, it's harder for us to clean up the larger micron material just because the amount of contaminants there are larger and like more difficult to sift out sometimes because we utilize size separation.

1:44:09SpeakerAnd so we'll take our what we call bulk keef and we'll split it into a bunch of Thank you so much for joining us.

1:44:41SpeakerWell, I want to say that when I tried to do my same static techniques with CBD, it was much harder to get good separation than it was with high THC varieties than CBD varieties. I mean, the CBD varieties were difficult much more than the high THC varieties. Yeah, I've only messed around with size. One time with hemp, I tried to make some CBD hash because a chef wanted to put it on his sushi rolls in his restaurant around here.

1:45:21SpeakerAnd I messed around with it, but I couldn't get it to work. And from Charles, my understanding has been that really THC, THCV, CBG can all charge, but CBD struggles to charge. Yeah, Logan did some testing for the guys in France. Remember those guys, Logan? Yep. Yep. Ran that material. I mean, we definitely cleaned it up a little bit, but it wasn't anything significant. The heads also look crazy different under the microscope.

1:45:53SpeakerThey're more opaque and like, was that was that Gwen? Yeah. Yes. Yes, that was Gwen's tongue.

1:46:02BubblemanI got my finger on the pulse.

1:46:07SpeakerGood, good, good, good. So what do you think, Rene? What's your experience with like larger and smaller heads? I don't think that the larger heads are separating on the static better or worse. I see most of the time all of the stuff together. I don't fractionate the static because I don't see really a big difference. Maybe the bigger heads have more problems to get Thank you for watching.

1:46:53SpeakerI typically remove everything that's below either 65 or 75 micron because it allows me to remove more of the stock content. Once I've removed the stock content, however, it is a little bit more difficult, I've found, to remove those smaller heads from the bulk majority of the stock. But that's just my personal experience with it.

1:47:19Jenn DoeAll right.

1:47:24BubblemanAre you chopping out a bit? Does anyone else hear her coming through a little choppy? Yeah. She's very choppy. There's a click every time you talk. I don't know what it is. Maybe we just have to make sure the rest of us are muted. Sometimes that causes... The headphones. Yeah. We can all mute ourselves. Well, let's try that.

1:47:47Etienne FontanIt's your headphones microphone. Try pulling out your earbuds. Live troubleshooting with Etienne Fontaine on Hash Church 5.0. I do this all the time with the VAC. Oh, yeah, you do.

1:48:02Jenn DoeOkay.

1:48:03BubblemanNo, your headphone jack, your headphone jack. Sorry, Jen. I think we can hear you better now.

1:48:07Jenn DoeCan you hear me now?

1:48:08BubblemanYes.

1:48:09SpeakerYay.

1:48:10BubblemanAwesome. Welcome, Jen.

1:48:12Jenn DoeHi. Thanks, guys. So I actually have a lot I kind of want to like chime in on. But as far as this goes, I want to take it back to what Mark was saying as far as like that head. Right. And what it's actually constructed with. And then I want to consider that maybe it's not THC or any type of like specific cannabinoid that is inside the head, but more so the volume of liquid that is contained in that head and also the ratio between the actual head versus the liquid inside.

1:48:44Jenn DoeSo when we get down to these lower microns, like the 45, we're going to have a different concentration of actual just liquid. In that head and therefore the balance of it, that head is too, too thick and it's acting as an insulator for that liquid and just the sheer volume of liquid. So like CBD, um, my theory on that is that yes, it's, it has all of its components inside the head, but it's the actual liquid.

1:49:14Jenn DoeCause when we think about like static electricity, like where did this come from? Where did this start? Who discovered it? Um, Amy Van Dyken, ADE, she, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her, her,

1:49:42Jenn DoeThat way, like when we're doing the static tech, you're noticing you're not picking up a whole ton of like broken heads because if it was the actual head that was being attracted or charged in a certain way, then why wouldn't we also pick up broken heads with the full heads? So my theory after all of the research that I've been doing and also Just years of going through all this but finally like focusing on the the details scientifically of the sift now that i've got this opportunity on this farm um i think it's just the actual volume versus you know the the ratio the volume of liquid contained in the head and also the thickness of the head on whether it's going to allow that charge to be able to come through make sense

1:50:31BubblemanI like it. It's interesting. I will say this, that like my 25 micron hash, bubble hash in particular, like when I make a 25 micron head, it's like 70 plus percent THC. Like it is a definitely like high cannabinoid.

1:50:47Dr Mark ScialdoneTHCA or THC?

1:50:49BubblemanTHCA. Sorry, Mark. Thank you for fixing that. The narrative from a very early day was that 25 micron heads were immature and not fully formed. Whereas I think that is not so much the case these days where people realize the potency of a head that small. In particular, if you go to places like Australia, the Australians very early on, you know, even when the bags only had three or four bags, I was always like, oh, the 73, the 73.

1:51:22BubblemanBut my Australian friends were like, no, dude, the 25. And I'd be like, what? Well, 25, what are you talking about? And I remember the first time the Mullum Madman from Mullum Bimby sent me the Mullum Bimby Madness bubble hash he made with his bubble bags. It was all 25 micron bubble, but it was like, it was the first time I'd seen full melt 25 micron bubble.

1:51:46BubblemanI'd never had that, you know.

1:51:48Jenn DoeHere would be my theory on that. So you said that it's a higher percentage in THCA? That's why I don't know that it's the actual percentage of the cannabinoids as much as the liquid those cannabinoids are able to hold. So THCA when dried is a white crystalline substance. Therefore, a higher concentration of THCA is going to have a smaller concentration I mean, Mark, you're the, you're the chemist.

1:52:20Dr Mark ScialdoneThat, that, that, that's right. So the, the, the liquid that's in there is not water, right? Because, because the, the, the makeup of the oil is mostly terpene and terpenoid based, right? So it's going to be, it's going to be an oil, right? And so the THCA, which is not crystalline. Thank you for joining us.

1:53:02BubblemanWell, if you told me that you had all of these different, you had volatile organic compounds, you had these crystalline structures in there, I would go with probably the crystal being the thing that's charging.

1:53:15SpeakerWell, I've seen heads that are crystalline. I've seen heads under the microscope that have, they've almost crystallized and I've tapped them on the microscope with a tool and completely shattered them, turned them into powder. Hmm.

1:53:31Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, so basic, maybe somehow that the envelope, the waxy envelope that's supposed to hold the liquid has kind of like dried out. So it's crystallized. I mean, I don't know if you've seen this too with CBGA varieties. So the CBGA variety, the white is notorious for losing its potency in between the field and drying because the trikes are so brittle. And you lose a lot of potency with CBGA.

1:54:01Dr Mark ScialdoneSo yeah, I'm absolutely certain that somehow the cannabinoid inside the juice is affecting all this.

1:54:09SpeakerMark, so consider this, the needle-like trichomes, the CCL trichomes, you know, in support of what Jen is saying, they don't separate. They typically contain about a third of the amount, not the purity, but the amount of cannabinoids in a round glandular trichome. So they don't separate. They contain cannabinoids. They should have a very similar cell structure to round trichomes, but they don't separate. They actually get rejected.

1:54:34SpeakerSo I think the relationship... You know, of the actual cannabinoids to charge versus whatever water content, which is also a fair hypothesis, but also the actual structure, the cellulose or the fats in the actual trichome, how all of those things really play a role because it stocks as well, right? Stocks will be a greater proportion of fats, the smaller proportion of cannabinoids, even though they also contain cannabinoids and maybe they contain a lot less terpenes.

1:55:05SpeakerSo I think that there's a We have a hypothesis, of course, of what's actually going on, but we haven't been able to flat out prove one way or another because there's inconsistencies in all of our theories.

1:55:22Dr Mark ScialdoneCharles, check this out. So look at the link I just put into the chat here. And Marcus, if you could post that link from the Zoom chat into the YouTube chat, that'd be awesome. And go to reference number 34, Kim and Malberg from 2003. Man, it is just fascinating what they did. So the title of this paper is called Secretory Vessel Formation in the Secretory Cavity of Glandular Trichomes in Cannabis.

1:55:53SpeakerI mean...

1:55:55Dr Mark ScialdoneIf that's not the title that basically describes exactly what you're describing, like where are the cannabinoids located? Where are the enzymes? They did, I don't think it's this particular paper, but I think his student, this guy, Carl Hillig. Sam, you know Carl, right? Carl Hillig? Yes, I funded his research. Okay, you probably patented it too, right?

1:56:20BubblemanI can't even tell if Sam's being like joking or he's probably... No, no, I did.

1:56:24SpeakerI gave a grant to Carl Helig for his research.

1:56:30Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, so I seem to remember a paper that he had published and I'm not seeing it in this list of the Malberg... Um library where he actually did staining studies to actually identify like where the synthases were and and like so where where do the precursors come in that actually make the cannabinoids because we know that there's a uh uh well the autovic acid biosynthetic pathway is at the front end of the cannabinoid biosynthesis pathway And it basically, it uses the same types of biological precursors as do the terpenes.

1:57:15Dr Mark ScialdoneSo yeah, cannabinoids are just fennel terpenoids, right?

1:57:23SpeakerMalberg and Kim also were taking many, many, many really small micropipettes and sucking out of living... Terpene Cannabinoid Heads. Their work was fucking amazing.

1:57:43Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd it's so like, like I know Mishulam often gets cited and now Roger Adams, but this work, particularly for hash makers, Marcus, I believe like if there's the science to hash making course, like if there's a ever like a course, I believe that like most of these papers are going to be the seminal papers that guide, you know, okay, what is a trichome? How are trichomes made?

1:58:10Dr Mark ScialdoneWhat's in the trichome? I mean, all this work that Paul Marburg did was absolutely very foundational and extremely important. And I'm glad that you funded it, Sam.

1:58:24SpeakerWell, I love moving cannabis science forward. And Carl couldn't do the work without funding. So I gave it to him. And it's funny because Besides Malberg having a license, and besides Dr. O'Sullivan having a license, there was also Weeblen at the Maryland Weed Institute. It wasn't weed meaning pot, but weeds meaning like agricultural weeds. And so there was a third license out there.

1:59:08Jenn DoeSo can I ask something?

1:59:10BubblemanGo ahead, yes. Please, Jen.

1:59:12Jenn DoeOkay, so to play back into what we were just talking about, right? So the liquid in there, I'm not talking just water, right? The terpenes actually, I think, play a larger role than we actually realize. And not just because of, you know, the contents of them, but like, I wish Horatio was still around, like, Chris and Peace Horatio. But when we think back to Horatio talking about the limonene extraction and how he's able to use one of these.

1:59:41Jenn DoeSo a lot of the terpenes that we're using are very solvent. And so in the plant as those mature, I feel like those are actually starting to break down that trichome head from the inside, right? So it's starting to almost dissolve some of it or What not? So the liquid in there is not just the water and it could have everything to do with like as far as maturity goes, the level to which those terpenes were able to start processing, let's say, like basically eating itself from the inside out.

2:00:18Jenn DoeRight. And so that is now going to affect the thickness of your head and whatnot as well. So Yeah, like I think there's a lot going on inside there. But when I say liquid, I'm not talking just water. And like with THCA, I'm thinking things that can actually convert to a solid material. Whereas like terpene fractions, we're not able to necessarily solidify those in a certain process the same way we are with THCA, CBD, CBG, CBN, you know, I've yet to see a powderized terpene, which tells me that even though it's not just water, like, so that's kind of where my thoughts are as far as what is working inside the head.

2:01:10Jenn DoeAnd how is that being affected? Right? Does that make sense?

2:01:15SpeakerI do know that when you dried cannabis and cured it, it was static tech worked way better than with fresh, still gooey resin, which was really, really hard for me to work with. You can freeze it and do other things, but with static tech and dry sifting, curing, And that probably lowered the monoterpene levels. And like you say, Horatio's work with Lamline, he was using it as a solvent the way that people were using BHO.

2:02:03Jenn DoeYep. Yeah. So we have to think of like why it does that inside the, like what it is actually doing to the container. That is in because it is a solvent. And if you can dissolve in a higher concentration, you can break down that trichome head. And in these smaller, very nature precise, you know, it's it's basically going to a certain point before it dissolves completely. So with the dried cured heads, we're getting that outside shell that is now protecting it.

2:02:36Jenn DoeBut like if we think of like a Peanut butter, M&M, right? You got the peanut butter, then you got the chocolate and then you got the hard shell, right? So like within that, there's like softness levels until you get to that hard shell. So I feel like that's kind of what happens when we're working with the dried is that it is able to callous in a way that it's no longer that the percentage and the percentage of those solvents in there is not able to break through that outer barrier because Nature, nature designed it in a certain way to where they're not just going to dissolve and then melt, right?

2:03:13Jenn DoeBut where we are now collecting that in such a high volume, we are able to, to dissolve that as a solvent. So it's, it's going to, I mean, those things and the weights and the volume of this versus that versus the solids versus the liquids, you know?

2:03:33Dr Mark ScialdoneSo those membranes are no match for some solvents. You're absolutely right, Jen. And it's so interesting you bring up Horatio, you know, just to get historical for a second. Horatio is the reason why I'm here, right?

2:03:52Dr Mark ScialdoneHoratio was the guy who basically, or who said, you got to come in here and set Tony straight on terpenes. I was out mowing my grass one day.

2:04:02BubblemanHe would hit me up and be like, I got this friend, Dr. Mark. I think he'd be great for Hash Church. I'm trying to get him on. I'm like, dude, for sure, man, bring him on. So yeah, I remember that.

2:04:13Jenn DoeMark, do you remember the first time we talked? That was when, what was it, 11, 10, 11 years ago when I was talking about the crystallization of my water hash, which now we do that today. And we would name that Piatella.

2:04:28SpeakerRight.

2:04:30Jenn DoeSo me going through this whole battle to try and set straight the fact that like, no, my hash did not oxidize. I feel like there's a different chemical process that's going into this because It did not degrade. You know, it did not oxidize. It actually is better. It is, it is transformed. So we were originally calling it the crystallization of hash, which is originally why you, Mark, brought me on to Hash Church was because of that.

2:04:57BubblemanYeah, it was called, we called it buttering out. And I will say that back in the day.

2:05:01Jenn DoeWe called it whiting out in a bad way. Buttering out was a little different.

2:05:05BubblemanWell, exactly. Whiting out, whitey. So what I have put together since Piatella exists now, and we had Iced Gourmet on last week on the Puffco episode talking about Piatella. To me, it was simple. The original water hash was never dried properly and people left moisture in the hash. And then that hash moisture would have to get out of the hash. And as it traveled out of the hash, it would foam the hash up and it would look exactly like Piatella.

2:05:34BubblemanThank you so much for joining us.

2:05:51BubblemanThank you so much for joining us.

2:06:21BubblemanAnd that's how Piatella really took off in Spain. At least that's what Ice Gourmet was saying.

2:06:27SpeakerI wanted to mention too that when I tried to dry certain haze dry sift, you couldn't. It just would remain greasy forever. I'm not sure what terpene that was. Maybe it was terpylene? Terpylene? Yeah, maybe that was the one, but it was just greasy, and no matter how long you tried to dry and cure the bud or the resin, it just wouldn't do it.

2:07:07Johnny BI'm having some fun here, guys. As we're talking, I'm punting this into a GTP called Resin Master. And I'm going to start putting it in chat because it's actually quite interesting in what we're talking about. And it's talking about moisture levels. It's talking about humidity levels. And it's talking about all of these different things that you guys are talking about. It's pretty cool. This is an awesome topic, by the way.

2:07:27Johnny BSo as I'm just punching it in here, it's talking about below 55% relative humidity. Static can increase. Terpenes can evaporate faster due to friction and heat. Also, brittle trichomes can rupture more easily, expressing the terpenes inside to the air. So it's during storage and escaping how to perverse these terpenes by managing the moisture. And that comes from storing resin. It says here store at 4 to 10 degrees Celsius.

2:07:54Johnny BAnd wrap in sheets to prevent from sticking, oxygenization, and parchment for PTFE, for live resin and rosin. Store near freezing temperatures in glass jars, tightly sealed lids to avoid the containers frequently exposing to air and speed the terpene loss.

2:08:13SpeakerI could tell you a funny story. When I used to make dry sift with skunk and different other varieties, I would get it really, really, really bone dry. And I was doing this in a frozen room, which had super, super low humidity. I mean, maybe zero or probably not zero, but really low. I would put it in a film can to use it. And if I would take it out and open the film can in a hot and humid environment, then it would absorb Water from the humidity in the air and it just sucked it up like a sponge and then we used to call it, the hash would lose its adhesiveness when you pressed it and it was what we called turning whitey.

2:09:14BubblemanI saw your hash do that in Jamaica. I saw it like expand and absorb moisture out of the Jamaican air like almost instantly.

2:09:25SpeakerAbsolutely true.

2:09:30Dr Mark ScialdoneHey, Johnny B, should we be teaching AI how to make dry sift? I don't know if that's a good thing for the world.

2:09:39Dr Mark ScialdonePretty soon they're going to be making better hash than us.

2:09:42Johnny BThey're going to be able to show us other ways. It's how we complement, right? AI is just like a co-pilot in life. So as you use AI, like as we're talking, and things have created clones, have created all different things to actually help express what we're doing to take it that much further. Thank you so much for joining us.

2:10:20BubblemanI'll tell you after 10 years, Johnny B, it's helped me make the best like thumbnails for Hash Church that I've ever been able to make. And it does it in all of like three seconds. I just, I'm like, you know, Hash Church, maybe throw some plants in a pew, have a nice stained glass window, wha-bam. It's like I did that one in three seconds on Grok 2.

2:10:44BubblemanIt's pretty cool in the sense of being a tool that just helps me, you know, speed certain things up that I personally wasn't as good. I've never been good at Photoshop and layering and all of that sort of stuff. So I appreciate the ability. Go ahead.

2:11:00Etienne FontanThat church needs more lumens, Doug. It's a dark church. It's a dark church.

2:11:07SpeakerMarcus, everyone, on that note, I have to bounce. We have MJBizCon coming up. I appreciate the time to be on the show. All of my friends and everybody else on the podcast, I really appreciate you guys stopping by, giving us your opinion. Maybe we can do this again sometime. If anybody's going to be in Vegas, stop by. We have a demo out there as well if you guys want to see tech.

2:11:34SpeakerBut in general, I really appreciate the opportunity to be here. I think we had some really cool conversations about the science, which is just wild. There's so much to learn and so much that's coming. Man, I'm super excited. I'm really looking forward to all of the cool stuff we're going to come up with and all of the wild things other people are going to come up with too.

2:11:50SpeakerI think it's going to be for the better of the industry. And again, I appreciate the opportunity. Come on. Where are you located? I'm in Miami, Florida. I'm right near the beach. Okay, Miami.

2:12:01Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah.

2:12:02SpeakerYep.

2:12:03Dr Mark ScialdoneWhat's your booth number, Charles?

2:12:06SpeakerI think it's 4238 or 238. I think so.

2:12:11BubblemanWell, I'll put your website information and your contact info in the description of the video. So that'll be on there afterwards. And when you say there's more to come, you're not wrong. We're still going to be talking about this two hours from now. So thanks for coming in, dude. We appreciate you. And anyone that's that came in with you is, of course, welcome to stay for as long as they like.

2:12:32BubblemanWe're going to be just. Continuing on the conversation of all things resin.

2:12:38SpeakerAppreciate it, guys. Everybody have a wonderful weekend.

2:12:43BubblemanThanks, Charles.

2:12:44SpeakerCheers. Bye-bye. I have a question for everybody. Does static tech work as good with frozen resin heads, like fresh frozen resin heads? I've never tried it. That's frozen. No, it works only with dry. It works with fresh as well.

2:13:08Jenn DoeYeah, you can do fresh. So one thing that I've actually been working with a couple of people with lately is so with the resonator, for example, you can run for fresh frozen heads and then you're going to freeze dry those after, right? So once those are freeze dried, they're more stable. So one thing that I've been kind of working on is cleaning up like some of the some of the larger microns on water hash that has been freeze dried.

2:13:39Jenn DoeAnd doing basically like a blend. So you wash it first. And then when you pull those bags that aren't as clean, especially now that we're freeze drying, I don't know if anybody's noticed, but a lot of these melt shots that I'm seeing from this freeze dried melt, they're still just riddled with, uh, with stocks because once we move to the freeze dryer, people aren't having to pay as close of attention to how much that they get out because the freeze dryer will keep it that color they're looking for.

2:14:06Jenn DoeSo if you're not able to clean that out, what I have decided would be the best idea would be to do a mix between wash them, if you're going to freeze dry them, perfect, and then actually run them through the screens to do a further cleaning of that before you put it on the shelf as a melt. Because the melts that I'm seeing, like you can see in all of the pictures, there's so many stocks.

2:14:30Jenn DoeLike when I make my full melt water hash, I don't have that in my heads, but that's because I am paying that close attention to get those out Rachel Jones, As I'm doing it in the bags, like my bag work is where all my work is, but people are cutting corners and they're not needing to do that. Rachel Jones, Because they're not getting the same oxidization factors when they're freeze drying as I would if I was air drying with bunch of stocks in there.

2:14:54Jenn DoeRachel Jones, So doing a you know the the pre wash freeze dry and then running through all the different microns to clean those stocks out um. Yeah, I said it first.

2:15:07BubblemanI think those stocks were always there. And I think that when you air dry, they're well hidden under a microscope. And when you freeze dry them, they literally become artifacts. They just become like shadows of their former selves. But you can see them clearly under a microscope. Because I don't think people were doing everything wrong suddenly. I've been macro photographing resins since 2008. And it was only when freeze drying came out that I started seeing stocks.

2:15:34BubblemanAnd not only in just random people's hash, in even hash that I was making. So I think those stocks were always there. I think when you air dry, they conglomerate and they mix in in a way that they're not seen to the naked eye. But when you freeze dry them, They suddenly become the most, and that's just my theory because how did they just suddenly show up with freeze dryers?

2:15:55BubblemanLike people weren't making their hash differently. I wasn't. I know for a fact I wasn't. I had the exact same SOPs prior to, in fact, my SOPs were better and more aware and more intensely focused on Thank you for watching.

2:16:36BubblemanAnd then a botanical terpene with distillate and floor sweepings is the number one product in the country.

2:16:43SpeakerThey've obviously forgotten that cleanliness is next to stoneliness.

2:16:51Jenn DoeWell, and even though like techniques haven't changed, I think it's just a lot easier to see in the air dried. Like for my full melt, the six star, I do a lot of bad bag work on that. So it's not just a simple run it, rinse it, dry it. Like there's a lot of attention and care that I have to put in to make sure That there are no stocks in there.

2:17:16Jenn DoeAnd I know everybody's seen macro pictures of my final product. And I'm only talking about just the absolute six star, right? Because obviously there's still stuff showing up in my five star, whether it be the thickness of the heads, creating it to not melt or some of those stocks that wouldn't detach. But for the most part, I think that like literally the, the freeze dryer just takes out the need Thank you so much for joining us.

2:18:04Jenn DoeLike everybody's showing on their freeze dried fresh, fresh hash, you know, like I would have gotten laughed out of legends of hash with that, you know, like it's, so what happened to stability? The problem is, is that even though we all have this standard, it doesn't mean that these new people have any type of standard because now everybody's creating new standards. Oh, it melts like water. Look how amazing it is.

2:18:31Jenn DoeAnd I'm like, What, what, what, what happened?

2:18:36BubblemanYou got older.

2:18:38Jenn DoeRight. It happened to me too.

2:18:39BubblemanYeah, of course. Listen, we're only, Skunk Man Sam has somehow managed to stay connected over multiple decades, but it seems like I feel myself. I mean, I see that happening. I mean, listen, when I started, well, first we, I showed people the wrong way and the hash was wet. So we had to deal with that for like three years, everyone rubbing up their hash all wet and it whiting out and being like, no, no, no.

2:19:05BubblemanLike it's, It's got that funky smell, like we, the moisture, we got to get the moisture out. And then, you know, trying to get to that point with air drying and then Fletch discovering freeze drying and sharing that with everyone. And it's just, yeah, it's, and then Piatella. And then, you know, there'll be more things in the future that are probably like, I'll be like, oh, like what?

2:19:25BubblemanLike even like hitting super fresh frozen material. Like if I can hit some of Skunk Man Sam's properly cured flour and then sifted to pure heads, Thank you so much for joining us.

2:19:54BubblemanThat's a little bit harsh. So it's yeah, I think there's definitely part of it is that we're just in different generations and younger people are going to come up with their way to make this theirs that that's different from how how we've always done it. And cannabis is super subjective. So you just got to like, you know, your resin is a is a representation of you and your choices and what you do with it.

2:20:17BubblemanAnd that's all we have to stand on. Don't go to Instagram for any reality check when it comes to making hash. Because that's just full of like fuckboys galore that are just, you know, flexing for all that. Look at, look at, I made a gram. Look at this. It's like, okay, boy, we're over here.

2:20:32SpeakerMaybe one of the solutions is if you can't get the stems out is to make rosin out of it.

2:20:40Jenn DoeAnd that's exactly what it is because you have that additional filtration. So why spend the extra time and steps in the bags like I do when you don't have to because now you can just take fucking 25 micron bags, stuff it in there, and that's doing all that work for you.

2:21:00BubblemanYeah, but you're capturing the elusive full melt. And those people who are like, I'll just make rosin, they wouldn't get full melt even if their stocks were taken out. So they need the rosin. The rosin market relies on mediocre hash that doesn't melt. If all the hash was six star and melted, there would be no fucking rosin market. It wouldn't exist. There'd be a small percentage of people who are like, No, removing the other 2% is everything.

2:21:25BubblemanAnd maybe they're right. Who's to say they're not? But it's the people who have access to the elusive full melt. If you know it's there, well, you're going to get it with any technique that you can come up and discover. On the flip side, the 80%, they know it's not there, and they're going to press it into rosin.

2:21:44SpeakerYeah, but the dry sift, if I made it 99.9% resin heads, to me, that was the gold standard. But the other thing that I liked really a lot, to be honest, was just take some stuff that's 50, 60% resin heads and make rosin out of it. And you end up with a product that's quite similar.

2:22:11Etienne FontanSo I have a question for Jen and for Sam here then. How would you then travel with your six star in the sense of what container? Do you store it in a freezer? You know, do you keep it cold as you travel? You know, how do you best, you know, preserve your process once you're done with it?

2:22:33Jenn DoeWell, for me, so let's go back to that stability standard that I used to be held to, right? I was told it needs to be as stable as possible.

2:22:43BubblemanYou or everyone?

2:22:45Jenn DoeWell, everyone, but I'm going to speak for myself. Everyone. Um, but because of that, and because of trying to reach that standard, I have some different post-process techniques that I keep to myself. But by doing those, um, that actually I've been able to create a certain stability in my hash. So it doesn't have to be now, I'm not saying keep it out in warm room temp because it will melt.

2:23:10Jenn DoeBut as far as having to like, keep it absolutely frozen, like these days, if you take out some freeze dried hash right out of the freezer, it's So it's my post for the, and I'm talking for like the six star specifically, like my specialty hand done, hand dried, air dried, sorry, hand dried, hand separated, air dried. Um, I do a post process on that to be able to, right.

2:23:37Jenn DoeI do a post process on that to be able to, um, Basically harden those heads a little bit so that I can keep a little bit of that stability. But it doesn't just happen. That is literally like at least a three-week process hands-on every day that I do in order to achieve that stability. As of now, if I was to travel with like, I don't know, regular stuff that's on the market now, you would need to find a way to freeze it.

2:24:06Jenn DoeYou would want it in glass. I would probably surround it in ice, you know, or like ice packs. You have to keep it cold these days. I mean, my air dried, like I said, there's a three to four week process behind that to allow me to achieve that stability, to be able to transport it so that it still looks the way it started without being Instantly like melts and it's like fucking snowman on a sunny day.

2:24:38Etienne FontanHey, Jen, by the way, you, you know, you've been teaching your tech and knowledge on Instagram and your Instagram got shut down. And I know you just restarted a new Instagram. Can you shout out your IG so everybody knows how to find you on Instagram again?

2:24:53Jenn DoeYes. Thank you. Cause yes, that was tragic. No, it was not the algorithm. I will not say that again, but Jen Doe, 420.1. So J E N N D O E 420.1. I would love to find more of my friends. This has been such a fucking nightmare of just like trying to gather everybody again. You know, it's like, it's like having a fire drill and not having any set like spots to be able to go like find your group again.

2:25:30Jenn DoeSo yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. Come find me. And if it disappears again, because I'm still kind of like on the end of dealing with this little group of people that has made it their mission to try and make me disappear. If it deletes again, then next time it'll be Gendo 420.2. So

2:25:55SpeakerWe, um, I've had a lot of, I've had a lot of luck. I just checked on Instagram and I actually followed your new account already. I must have seen it from like Hashfighter from Charles. But, um, I've had a lot of luck of, I had to like dig in the settings on my Instagram, but I changed my account type to a personal blog. And when I first started posting stuff, like I had two followers, but I immediately got censored.

2:26:19SpeakerAnd when I change it to personal blog, I've never been bothered, uh, Since then.

2:26:24BubblemanBecause Instagram works on an algorithm. If you understand that there are 2.4 billion people on Instagram, there are not enough people for someone to just report you and then attack you and get rid of your account. There's 2.4 billion Instagram users. So if you, if you, and, and yes, people can make life more difficult, but like you just said, Ezra, if you figure out that sweet spot and you make sure you don't say, sir, my friend Thomas just, he's also had this nightmare, Jen, and he's a thousand percent sure that it's people.

2:26:57BubblemanAnd I'm like, yes, it's people, but really it's people. Thank you so much for joining us today.

2:27:31BubblemanThat's what the algorithm picked up. The tarantula. Go ahead, Jen.

2:27:36Jenn DoeI've always been very careful about what I post. So I've never had algorithm problems. I've never advertised that I sail. I watch my language on there. I'm very cautious at the way I do things. But you're right. The second that somebody starts reporting things, Then it can get caught into this loop because they're looking for a pattern. But if anybody goes on to my Instagram in my highlights, I literally have a highlight reel that says don't blame the algorithm because I have since deleting these 12 accounts from these couple girls.

2:28:14Jenn DoeWe won't say the company, but I haven't had any more reports, you know, and first it started out as blocking their eight accounts. And then I stopped getting reports for a couple of days, right? And then I'm on the new one and I start getting reports again. I was like, what the hell? And everybody's like, oh, it's because you say my IP address, this and that. No, now you're on this list.

2:28:37Jenn DoeNo, I wasn't. So I went through and I found that they had a couple more accounts that I had not blocked. So as soon as I blocked those accounts, all of a sudden, no more reports. So then a week later, I start getting reports again and I find that yet Another two accounts that I found that they were associated with not blocked and I'm getting reports. So as soon as I blocked them, I haven't had any reports again.

2:29:05Jenn DoeSo I figured since I had already lost my page, I might as well try this fun little experiment. So I went on my stories and I put hash, hash, hash. I even hashtagged hash. I even said, hey, IG, I, I, uh, what did I say? I, here, I've got it right here. Uh, I promote cannabis use. Okay. I put that all over. I put it on my story.

2:29:29Jenn DoeI also made a post of it. Now that I know fully that this group of people, right. I'm in that window where I've blocked all of these new accounts they've made. So they're having problems making new accounts. So in this timeframe, I put that up to test the algorithm because what's the worst case scenario, what my account gets deleted. Well, my big account already did, so whatever.

2:29:53Jenn DoeNever got flagged on my story. It's still on my post. Now, when I got on my story and basically said, and I put all this in the highlights because it's absolutely fucking interesting because I had put a post that said, it's still up. It's not the algorithm. This lesson brought to you by Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Now the algorithm was triggered by brought to you by.

2:30:21Jenn DoeSo within 20 seconds, I have Instagram saying, hey, we've noticed that you might want to monetize on this. And so it gave me the option So you actually like brought to you by a paid, a paid collaboration or whatever. So I tried it again, right? So I posted it up and I said, and this is the algorithm. It has nothing to do with hash, not the words cannabis, not saying that I promote cannabis, but brought to you by, right?

2:30:49Jenn DoeSo I did it again. Brought to you by, and it pulled up again. Brought to you by, and it pulled up again. So I put a picture of my hash. Brought to you by, pulled up again. Picture of me in my garden or just a regular flower because everybody's telling me, oh, it's the algorithm. They're flagging the flower pictures. They're flagging the hash pictures. They're flagging the words hash.

2:31:10Jenn DoeThey're flagging the words cannabis. It's thus promoting cannabis use. No, it's not. Like go to my highlights right now. I literally proved it because I was able to capture all of the cannabis content that I'm being told is triggering the algorithm. But then just the simple words brought to you by has now triggered the algorithm. So you can see, yes, the algorithm is triggered, but not by what people are trying to tell us it is.

2:31:38Jenn DoeLike it's the biggest scapegoat ever. Oh, it's the algorithm. No, it's not. It's somebody going through and strategically, uh, flagging people and reporting them. And if there's a pattern of numerous people and then they're seeing this pattern, then we're all getting taken out.

2:31:55BubblemanBut I, I, I've heard my account hit like 30 times and I've fought it every time and got my account back like five minutes later. And it's always been illegal drugs, illegal this, illegal that. I'm just like, oh, well, just, you know, actually, no, I'm in Canada. But I never talked to a person. I just know that there's, you know, yeah, they're using people to be the agent smiths and rat people out, which is no different, right?

2:32:19BubblemanIt's the same, like if you... If you go on, this is what I learned even from the internet before Instagram. The people that I bothered the worst made it their mission to destroy my life. And if you're out there and you just have one moment where you're smug with someone or you're like, you get them, you give them a, it might feel good for about five seconds until you're in a five-year patent lawsuit with them.

2:32:41BubblemanAnd spending six figures because that's how it worked out for me. I've learned to just be much more relaxed, more kind of try not to get into beefs with people, even though it's pretty consistent all around the board that there's always someone who wants to hate. I just try my best to operate in a quiet manner. I also don't define myself by my Instagram account or my YouTube channel anymore since losing them.

2:33:03BubblemanIt's like you're not your Instagram account. You're not your Your YouTube channel. And I will say, I feel like the algorithm is changing. Recently, for sure, my Instagram account is now getting pushed. I'm shadow banned. I've been shadow banned for, I want to say, at least 10 years. But recently, I started getting real serious numbers, like on this last piece of hash that I posted. It was like 266,000 people played this video.

2:33:35BubblemanAnd I was like, that's weird. And then I looked and it was 89% of non-followers, which is also my account's not supposed to be shown to non-followers. So suddenly my Instagram, while everyone else I know is just getting hammered, which I feel sick about, my Instagram, I'm able to monetize it. I'm getting pushed into the algorithm, meaning I'm suddenly being shown to 80 to 90% of the people that are seeing my photos and videos and reels.

2:33:59BubblemanAre from outside of my followership. And YouTube is the same way. YouTube hit me up last week and was like, hey, do you want to monetize your channel again? Like you can sell memberships. You can have you can take donations in your chat, super chats. You can you can do all of this stuff. You can create memberships. I was just like, what the fuck is going on?

2:34:18BubblemanSo I'm kind of hoping that maybe it will get better. I mean, these are independent companies and it's kind of like if you owned a company, you could do whatever you want. But it sucks for the cannabis community. It always has. We've always been sort of attacked in regards to sharing information and yeah, it sucks. It feels pretty shitty. I remember feeling pretty shitty the first time I lost my Instagram account.

2:34:42BubblemanI will say that I'm happy that I have Hash Church, which gives me a perspective because when we're all building our, listen, when my YouTube channel hit 100,000, Thank you so much for joining us.

2:35:17BubblemanThank you so much for joining us.

2:35:44BubblemanSo it is what it is. It's difficult. I guess we all just got to sort of hopefully, you know, make moves in a way that figures out a way to make this better. Maybe AI, you know, I've never asked AI. Maybe Johnny B should ask AI, hey, I'm a cannabis person. How should I be making my Instagram posts? Because everyone has countering information about how it works.

2:36:06BubblemanAnd you would probably have very good conversations, Jen. With my partner Thomas from Grandmaster LED because he's getting attacked in a way that it's just unbelievable. I suspect he'll lose his Instagram account here very soon, which is unfortunate.

2:36:22Johnny BI'll get attacked. I've been attacked, shut down so many times. It's ridiculous.

2:36:27BubblemanJohnny B, you've been copied. I see more cloned accounts of you than any other person. It's pictures of Johnny B and then you go into the photos and it's all jars of weed and his pictures and then it's like, Hit me up for inquiries. It's like, oh my God, these guys are selling weed under Johnny B's like good name and face.

2:36:47Johnny BPlus I screenshot them. People send them to me every week. I get someone reported to take account.

2:36:52BubblemanWell, here's something, Jen, that I am very confused by because I've been cloned myself on Facebook and Instagram. And then those are the only accounts I've ever reported. And I report them. And I even got one back recently and it said, they always say the same thing. Sorry, there's nothing we can do. That person's not impersonating you. So I'm reporting people, but their accounts aren't getting taken down.

2:37:15BubblemanBut these magical other people are reporting people and the accounts get taken down right away. What the fuck is that? And how does that work?

2:37:22Jenn DoeRight?

2:37:23BubblemanIt makes no sense.

2:37:25Jenn DoeI'm looking forward to finding one of the accounts that has stolen all my shit just so I can get some of my pictures back from them. You know, like where are those accounts that I couldn't get shut down now because they have all the content that I want.

2:37:41BubblemanListen, I'll tell you, the first time it ever happened to me was when Overgrow got shut down. When the dude that owned Overgrow got busted and they pulled those gold bars and weed and all this shit off of his property and the RCMP shut Overgrow down. That was pre-Instagram, that was pre-social media. I still have obviously all the photos and the content because I'm a photographer and I keep those on, you know, redundant hard drives.

2:38:05BubblemanBut it was the communication and the dialogue with all the amazing people that I lost, right? It was all the comments that are just like, oh my God, how can you? I think you can download that data now off of Instagram if I'm not wrong. No, you can't download that while you have it.

2:38:23Jenn DoeNo, you can try. You can try. But the problem I'm having is that they tell you that there's an option and they're going to send you a download link. But then it's been taking me in a circle. So, yeah. And and like you were just saying, like the dialog with people, here's my issue. I don't really care about the followers. Like most of my followers were organically made with feet on the ground in each of these states and communities that I've worked in.

2:38:51Jenn DoeSo that's not my concern. But I have friends that have passed away that I had voice memos in my DMs, you know, like certain things like that that means so much to me that now they're just gone.

2:39:07BubblemanAnd they won't give you the link? Is that what you've been waiting for?

2:39:11Jenn DoeOh, every single day. So I'm still disabled, but I keep going back because they're like, we'll send you a link. So they send me the link. It literally just takes me in a circle and I've been doing it the entire month, every four days. So here's a good lesson for people.

2:39:27BubblemanObviously it's harder to do when your account is banned. So anyone that has special things on their Instagram account, I just asked chat GTP. You can actually do exactly what Jen says. You go to your profile, you go to access settings, you select settings, you go into privacy and security and select security. Then you go to data download, and under data and history, you tap download your information, which requests a download.

2:39:50BubblemanYou enter your email address and tap request download, and then you choose your format, which is either JSON, which is a machine readable format, or HTML, Which is easier to read on computers. You enter your password, they initiate the request. I suspect she's having a difficulty because she's banned. But if you have things on your Instagram and you're in the cannabis world, I would be doing this process, you know, every month, every week, however often you want to do it.

2:40:18BubblemanAnd then you can at least avoid once your account's been disabled, you know, experiencing the hell that unfortunately Jen Doe has been experiencing. That sucks, Jen.

2:40:28Etienne FontanYou can actually come over to Blue Sky which allows for cannabis and for cannabis media and I've been there for a year and it's just grown as everybody has left Twitter but it's basically it's old school Twitter and all the old school heads, the producers, the creatives are all there and they don't gig you for cannabis because I have my Veterans Action Council Veterans Action Council, I've got my Cannabis Embassy and Berkeley Patients Group have shown pictures, names, everything.

2:41:01Etienne FontanNo, no issues. So I recommend as opposed to being stuck in the meta headache that Jen and everybody is, is try something new and different. It's also protected and there's no AI that serves your shit and you can block people outright.

2:41:19BubblemanThe only problem I have with it is that there's 20 million people on it and there's 2.4 billion on Instagram. That's the problem. It gates us into this small little chamber of people that are just like, fuck. Twitter, on the other hand, it does have 600 million monthly users. So it's still rocking.

2:41:41SpeakerI believe I was asked, how do I keep my products stable? And so I wanted to get back to that. Sorry, Sam. Which is, first of all, it depends really a lot. You know, once you get it dry and you stick it in a freezer, it's stable forever, for a really long time. I've never kept it more than about 25, 30 years, but it was practically exactly the same.

2:42:17SpeakerBut when you want to take it someplace else, first of all, it depends on how hydroscopic the terpenes in the dry soot resin is. Because some of it, I mean, you can't take it anywhere that's hot and moist at all. If you take it to someplace like Austria to go skiing,

2:42:45SpeakerYou don't have any problem at all. You can open it and there's no problem. But you take it to some hot, humid little Jamaican island and if it's got the right hydroscopic terpenes, there's nothing you can do. Well, we still smoked it. Oh, yeah, we smoked it quick. That was the solution.

2:43:12Etienne FontanSo Marcus, what was that kind of that portable box that you were showing us? Is that like a little portable refrigerator freezer?

2:43:20BubblemanWhat is that? You know what? You can find them for sale as makeup fridges. They're little mini coolers. They're makeup fridges. They come in all sorts of different size. They plug into the wall when you arrive, but they have like a two to six hour battery depending on the model. This one is my buddy. He sells it under the baller fridge. So you can find him on Instagram.

2:43:41BubblemanHe's pretty good, dude. And yeah, it's just it's a nice little way to carry. Listen, I am more interested these days. If it's traditional style hash, I'm all about curing it out and leaving it for a long time. And if it's about like, OK, properly dried and made resin, that resin, I just want to preserve. I don't want to cure it. I want it to be preserved because when I get it, I'm like, it's exactly how I love it.

2:44:03BubblemanAnd for that stuff, I keep it as cold as possible while I'm using it and then just kind of pull it out.

2:44:09SpeakerThe other suggestion I have is keep it in small containers so that when you open one of the little containers, all the rest of it is still fine because I used to keep a lot in little plastic film cans, you know, for like... Film came in, little rolls of film. And as long as I didn't expose it to the, it didn't matter how hot it got or any of that kind of shit, what mattered was if I took the lid off and exposed it to the high humidity.

2:44:55SpeakerIf I kept it shut, no problem. It's better frozen, but... You know, what really got it was the exposure to the hot, humid, wet air.

2:45:10BubblemanYeah, makes sense. Very smart. I wanted to shout out Andrew Cotter. The engineer at Whistler Technologies, he grew this up in Squamish outdoors, just in his backyard and then processed it. And I don't even know the cultivar. It's very orangey smelling, but it's beautiful, full melt bubble. And unfortunately, when he gave it to me, I let it grease up a little bit, but... I like it. It's pretty nice.

2:45:35BubblemanIt's very hard. You definitely have to use a tool, like even at room temperature, you got to use a tool that heats up a little bit that gets into it. Very lovely resin. What is everyone smoking today, by the way? Maybe I'll smoke some of that right now.

2:45:50Jenn DoeCan I do a little shout out real quick? Please, of course.

2:45:54BubblemanAbsolutely, you can.

2:45:56Jenn DoeAnd just show off. Hold on. Where did you guys go?

2:46:00BubblemanWe're here. Oh, shit. Yeah, your phone rang.

2:46:03SpeakerWe can see you.

2:46:04Jenn DoeYeah. How did that happen? How do I get back?

2:46:08BubblemanIs it an iPhone?

2:46:10Jenn DoeNo, I'm on my laptop.

2:46:13BubblemanWell, you're on your laptop. Well, you should be able to find it under Zoom. It'll be in one of your browsers, maybe, or on its own separately. Well, I'm tough on this anyway.

2:46:23Etienne FontanWe've seen you just fine, Jen.

2:46:26Jenn DoeOkay, if you can see me, I just can't see you. Okay, so this is like the coolest little contraption. So this is done by Puff Wizard Labs. We did a little collaboration on it. But basically, it is the best little tool that I've found to be able to smoke old school hash, right? So this little post, you just take a piece of a temple ball or something.

2:46:52Jenn DoeYou put it on that post and then you light it until it is smoldering. And then once you do that, you throw this lid on here and you've got like this awesome way to like just bypass the whole needle in a cup and shit that we used to do and Yeah, it's pretty fucking great.

2:47:13BubblemanSo what are they called here, Johnny B? We have those, but they're different. They're like the hash kettles or something. Hash kettles. Hash kettles. That's super cool. No, those are the best way to smoke old school hash out of the like anything like that. I like the post on that one. It's a little different. The hash, the hash kettle. Oh, no, I thought Johnny was holding one up.

2:47:33BubblemanThat is cool looking though with the straw. I like that. Bottoms up.

2:47:38Jenn DoeSo the other thing is so when what I've noticed is like ratios with this right because if it's too melty um it won't hold that ember so it's a little harder to get it to work um so what I've been doing is taking a lot of my meltier stuff and I'll actually just combine it with a certain percentage of of Rachel Jones, Uncleaned Keef. And so that'll keep that stability so I can get that ember.

2:48:04Jenn DoeSolventless Mind actually the other day kind of figured out another tech with it with a lot of our meltier stuff. So whether we're going with like those really insanely melty temple balls or even just like a full melt product is you can actually just torch this torch this post And then when it's hot, you drop your dab on there and then just instantly cap it and it's just acting like the old nail and don't.

2:48:31BubblemanNice, now it works both ways.

2:48:33Jenn DoeYeah, so it's super versatile. I think we're also going to be ordering for these collaborated ones with me. I think we're going to be Uh, ordering like a kind of like a quartz, like almost like a, an old school nail. Like this one's just designed with those three little holes on or three little balls on it. So that just like holds your temple ball up so you can get some airflow around it.

2:48:56Jenn DoeAnd it just sort of like holds it. Um, But yeah, you can keep that shit up and just hit it like for all the melty stuff as well. So, but this is great in the lab. I can load a piece of temple ball on there and just, oh my God, I get so high because it doesn't stop. It's not like a Puffco where it turns off, right?

2:49:17Jenn DoeSo it just keeps going, but super easy, super portable. Absolutely love this.

2:49:25BubblemanVery cool. Yeah.

2:49:29Jenn DoePuff Wizard Labs. I put the link in my bio on my IG. And we're keeping them really affordable. So they're like, I think they're like 40 bucks online. It's all not shipped. Yeah. So Puff Wizard Labs. But I put the link to buy it on my IG.

2:49:50BubblemanSee, in a perfect world, you could stick a quarter of traditional hash in there and sell it for 80 bucks.

2:49:55Jenn DoeRight? Exactly. That's what the goal is kind of to be able to. So as I'm doing this different work up in Washington and whatnot, the goal is to be able to just have complementing situations. So like, for the issue of people that don't really know how to smoke the old school hash other than just in the joint. Yeah, this could go right along with that. So they've got the set and with it being that affordable, you know, you can, you can replace it when needed.

2:50:22Jenn DoeLike if you break it or whatnot, there's no electrical parts. So technically it can last for fucking ever.

2:50:29BubblemanYeah. Just don't drop it.

2:50:32Jenn DoeYeah. So shout out to Joe Itza and Puff Wizard Labs for coming up with that design. And I was just super happy that they included me in it because it's been so great. It's like my favorite thing.

2:50:47BubblemanYou've got to ask them if they've ever seen the hash kettle, if it was helpful in the inspiration of the unit, because it's a very cool... You know, I'm not... A big fan of the kettle myself. I'd rather smoke hash a variety of different ways, but I feel like that design, it's just because of how airy it comes out in the kettle. We used to build our kind of own units with coals and stuff that we'd put, you know, the big container over and then be inhaling it like back in the 80s when we were first smoking oil.

2:51:15BubblemanBut I feel like that design with the straw in particular could really make it like, like tighten it up a little bit so it wasn't so like airy.

2:51:25Jenn Doeyeah exactly and then we decided to just drill like a little hole in the bottom i don't have it done on this one um but just to give a little more availability airflow so that you can kind of like add a little bit if you want or not doesn't affect You know, it doesn't affect it a whole ton, but it gives you a little more control to clear it.

2:51:44BubblemanYou could almost put a carb right down by your finger in the glass, even right at the bottom. So you had to suck the air from the bottom is good idea. Yeah.

2:51:51Jenn DoeAnd we've thought of that. The problem being we're trying to keep that price point down really low so that the end consumer is not having to pay for an additional $10 that it costs to put a small carb in the glass. So that's where I kind of decided, like, if we put it in the wood, we're able to just keep that price point for the consumers down.

2:52:13Jenn DoeBecause every single thing you do to the glass, that's going to be a lot more expensive as far as, you know, when they're in production. So keeping it simple, little drill in the bottom. So you've got that whole nut controllability. Yeah. The goal is to keep it very affordable. So. That's kind of why we didn't go like traditional hash. Yeah, exactly.

2:52:38BubblemanI like that affordable tool for affordable hash.

2:52:42Jenn DoeExactly. I still can't figure out how to get this back on my video. Let me just let me sign out and I'll sign back in. I'll see you guys.

2:52:54BubblemanI'll watch. I'll watch you. Okay. I'll watch for you.

2:53:00BubblemanOh, my goodness. Did anyone take a hit other than me? Because that was a great rip. Well, ATN, you've been nonstop. So at one point, people were like, holy shit, look at ATN, he's totally slumped. Good on you, old boy.

2:53:12Johnny BI did some cleaning behind me. I mean, smoking sift the whole time.

2:53:19BubblemanNice. Look at Sam's got a disco show going on over at his place. That's the first time anyone's ever seen the magical dry sift hand.

2:53:29Johnny BAnd I always bring Horatio with me everywhere. This is one of his tools that he would have when his separation and his little, he had a cement mixer and he would put everything in here and he had all these little, I think you have one of these, Mark. I know you do. So I always have Horatio sitting here.

2:53:47BubblemanHe's always with me. Very cool. Very cool. We miss Horatio. He was a thinker. He was outside the box. He was so far outside the box. It was unbelievable.

2:53:59Johnny BWe all are. We're all one being able to look outside of that box and see how far we can truly see in that vision that you can create, right? What you are, you invite. You wrote down what you were going to do. We talked about what you're doing a decade ago and this has all come true. From Worcester Tech to creating everything you've done, like that's what we all do here.

2:54:17Johnny BWe're all creating our and manifesting our future. Yeah, our house church has come over a decade. Look at the creations and where we're going, guys. And where do we see ourselves going in 2025 is the question. What do you got growing on? Put that in chat and we'll see all the chat going up, what you guys are going to be doing.

2:54:34BubblemanThey hear, they hear, they'll answer. I think I know what I'm going to be doing. I'm going to be building the Bubble Man brand down in the US. Yes. I'm getting more good partners down there and releasing more good products and You know, after 25 years of teaching people how to make the hash, it's kind of nice to be in the different markets making the hash and producing the product.

2:54:57BubblemanSo, oh, here comes Jen.

2:54:59SpeakerI can tell you from our perspective, like, oh, I don't know if I'm, can you guys hear me? Absolutely. Oh, cool. From our perspective in New York, you know, it's like such a different entry point for us because we, you know, we're this small company trying to like make it and get established. And pretty quickly, we've had to figure out like what our niches are going to be, especially as like a semi-outdoor organic sort of that's our pitch company.

2:55:24SpeakerThere's a question like what kind of longevity you can have in a market that way. And so we zeroed in on hash pretty quickly. And I think what my focal point is really for the next few years is to try to get this dry sifted static sifted hash into as many of these. We sell traditional hash, but really into flower products is what I'm most excited about because I think what you were mentioning earlier, Marcus with like the, you know, all the botanical terpenes and the distillate products, not that we make distillate here, so no hate on distillate, but that people can really get the best of both worlds.

2:56:00SpeakerLike they can get a really affordable product that delivers an amazing high with a really high potency by bringing together flour and dry sift hash in a way that makes those concentrates like really accessible to everybody. So that's definitely what we're excited about.

2:56:16BubblemanHell yeah, yeah, making it all available is definitely, listen, I'm not shitting on distillate in the sense, I guess I'm just shitting on the concept of, and I shouldn't even shit on that because the bottom line is it's just victims of circumstance. It's like, yeah, if you can't afford it, you're going to find value products. That's what you're doing.

2:56:34SpeakerNo, but it's generally, it's genuinely frustrating. Like we put out as Hudson Cannabis, you know, infused joint that doesn't use any added terpenes. And we're like so excited. We're smoking these things like we're going to, this is amazing. And then we get completely outcompeted by like heavy botanical terpene infused joints. And we're looking at each other like, you know what? We tried and they'll catch on. You know, we're not giving up, but.

2:56:56BubblemanI wish they would. I wish they would. And some of them will, I suspect. But it's it's about it's about the cost, not about what they want. That's what you have to put it in. The perspective is it's like it's what you want. So you go there for sure. But for for most folks, it's like, well, then you could get Mark Started on the botanical terps because I see people calling them fake terps all the time.

2:57:18BubblemanFor me, the botanical terps are not in the right ratios. The cannabis produces volatile organic compounds. That's my argument of botanical terps. But when people say they're fake terps, it's like, no, they're like literally the same molecule. Thank you for joining us.

2:57:47BubblemanWell, not unless we're perceiving the thiols and the thiolates and all the other compounds that are like, unless we start perceiving that whole picture and know that it's complete, only then could we be somewhat confident in saying we're creating these unique or exact compounds. Uh, uh, volatile organic profiles and then reestablishing them. And, and don't get me wrong. I think the ability to do that would be amazing, mainly for people, you know, like, like children, like Charlotte Fiji, who had these, these different, uh, epileptic seizures.

2:58:20BubblemanI know that there was a Haley young Haley here in Canada that John was very, is very close with. She had a very bad form of epilepsy. Haley's Comet, a cultivar that was created for her, would work sometimes and then eventually it would stop working. And it was like, oh, someone grew it a little differently, the profiles. So I see the value of being able to take cannabinoids and volatile organic compounds and put them into a medicinal product that, you know, someone like a Haley or a Charlotte could gain benefit from.

2:58:51BubblemanI also see obviously the benefit of what you guys are trying to do at Hudson Cannabis with trying to put out the best products and cannabis derived and this and that. Unfortunately, I'm also, you know, flustered the same way you are by the fact that People don't actually fucking care.

2:59:08SpeakerWell, and it goes the other way too with distillate because you can like, we make this beautiful distillate here. Our guys are very proud of the work they do, but ultimately like you smoke it or you put it in a vape and over time, if you know, you're someone who knows full spectrum products, like you start to notice these real differences in the experience and how it makes you feel.

2:59:26SpeakerAnd if my opinion, it's just too much THC in too high of a concentration without these like many, many, many other compounds. Thank you so much for joining us.

3:00:01Dr Mark ScialdoneMore is going to create that caustic thing. Right. No, Ezra, I totally agree with what you're saying about distillate. Unfortunately, and this is kind of like probably a result most having to do with prohibition. THC content is just such a big driver in a lot of different ways, you know, not just at the dispensary purchase, you know, where someone's like looking at like a 22% versus a 28% and it's like they're digging into their pocket.

3:00:38Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's like, okay, well, You know, which one should I choose? But I'm sure, Ezra, you could totally appreciate this at the wholesale level when you're when you're buying bulk biomass or trim or stuff like that. Like if you're looking to extract You want the highest, especially if you're making disty, right? You want the what test for the highest. And unfortunately, when you're making disty, it's all about just getting that stuff out and leaving everything else behind and getting as high a THCA number because or I'm sorry, THC number you can get in that disty because ultimately that's going to create more vape pens.

3:01:21Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's going to create a bigger Thank you for watching.

3:01:47Dr Mark ScialdoneYou know, it's going to analyze somewhere in the 60s or high 70s, right? Because there's so much other good yumminess in there, right? But I think that THC number, right? Is that, don't you think that's just an artifact of prohibition?

3:02:05SpeakerI mean, it's hard to say, right? I mean, we're in the New York market. People are just they really shop based on THC. And I think there is a lack of education like over the years of people kind of receiving all these different cannabis products. But there wasn't like, you know, a unified front of information about them. So like I even read like when I read, I spend a lot of time just reading like the hash forums of Reddit for Europe.

3:02:28SpeakerAnd I'm hearing terms for hash constantly that I've never heard of. And half of them might not even be real. It's just like what someone's dealer told them when they met up with them. But you have just like a way more fractionated population in terms of like what, you know, they understand about the plant. And I don't know, it's kind of this thing where we all say, I hope to see it change.

3:02:49SpeakerI hope to see the customer start looking for some different things or the consumer, but also with something we kind of accept at the same time. I have no problems with people wanting high THC values, but I would hope that would also have The proper terpene profile with those high THC values to create the effects that the people want. Then, I mean, if it's 25% THC but with the right terpenes and the right ratios, it just means they can smoke half as much and still achieve what they're after.

3:03:31Dr Mark ScialdoneI think I think you're absolutely right Sam like in an inhaled product where that's how you're experiencing it as though you're experiencing the flower the hash itself but um I think like like just to pick on beverages for a second so so when you're trying to put Thank you for joining us today.

3:04:20Dr Mark ScialdoneAnd you can buy beer and you can buy vodka and you can buy bourbon. But then at the end of the case there, you have a whole now selection of hemp derived THC beverages, you know, seltzers and sodas. And for them, it's just all about the molecule. Thank you for watching.

3:04:55Dr Mark ScialdoneBut I know that people are turning rosin into gummies. And supposedly the rosin gummy is a very, very different experience than just vanilla THC loaded into a gummy.

3:05:07BubblemanIt's way more intense, Mark. And I'm kind of sensitive to edibles. I don't eat big, you know, 1,000 or 500 or 100 milligrams. Like, I'm like, on a normal day, I can take 10 milligrams before bed and sleep like a baby. If I'm in pain... I might eat like 30 to 40 milligrams over the course of an entire day, 10 milligrams at a time. Whereas if I'm not in pain, 40 milligrams would just get me like higher than I needed to be.

3:05:32BubblemanAnd, you know, with distillate, I can I need about twice as much. And it's a different feeling. Then I get from Live Hash Rosin. The trick with Live Hash Rosin is you actually need to use, oh, what are they called? Like a sensory scientist, like a food scientist that knows how to pair the terpenes or the volatile organic compounds with the flavor profiles of whatever, you know, the edible is, whether it be a gummy or whatnot.

3:06:00BubblemanSo some stuff fits together better and some just does not fit together at all. And when you have a person like that, much like White Rabbit, the gummy company, those were some of the best gummies I've ever had in my life and really complex flavor profiles. And just clearly the person, you know, the people doing that work had a deep understanding of.

3:06:22Dr Mark ScialdoneHave you had, or has anybody in the panel had a full spectrum beverage that actually tastes good?

3:06:30Jenn DoeI don't think I've had a full spectrum beverage. And I think that, uh, I think these THC levels everybody's looking for is because if we think about it, like that's the illegal component in cannabis. So now everybody sees that as like the shining star because that's the thing that's illegal. So that's right.

3:06:52Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, I don't know, Jen, it's kind of like a double jeopardy because if you think about just hemp in general, like CBD, so you could now chemically convert CBD into THC and do that underneath a roof of a building that has a cannabis And so now what you're converting, what you take into your building is totally legal by the U.S. law. And what goes out of the building in a 10 milligram drink that's like 12 ounces, that's like 0.029% THC.

3:07:27Dr Mark ScialdoneSo it hardly qualifies on the radar as being even close to being legal. You know, outside that 0.3% or less THC number, but still you can get loaded. And even a cannabis user like me, Jen, I could drink two of those beverages and I totally feel it. I mean, it's just 10 milligrams of a single cannabinoid.

3:07:51SpeakerIsn't the effects different? Because when you're taking things orally, You're getting high on 11-hydroxy, not THC.

3:08:00Dr Mark ScialdoneNo, actually, Sam, that's not. So these things are nano-emulsified. So basically, there's a nano-emulsion that basically keeps that from going. I think it gets absorbed through the oral sublingual, or maybe it does go through the tract, but it... Sam, I'm telling you, I was super skeptical about this whole nano business. I thought it was all just a bunch of spinning bullshit, but it really works. There's a rapid onset of activity.

3:08:30Dr Mark ScialdoneIf I pour like a 12 ounce seltzer out that's got 10 milligrams, by the time I'm halfway through that glass, I can feel it. And again, I'm dabbing all day long. So it's like very hard to think, you know, again, that this is basically legal under the hemp law. And so what people are doing, again, because CBD is cratered down to, I don't know, like 450 a kilo or 400 a kilo.

3:09:00Dr Mark ScialdoneYou could convert that into THC. Hopefully you're doing it in a way that, you know, minimizes the byproduct formation. But if you're getting something like 85 or 90% THC, you're putting that right into a beverage, diluting it back down. And now what leaves the building is totally hemp. So it's, yeah, I mean, I don't know how the cannabis market is going to compete when you could convert CBD into THC for a whole lot cheaper.

3:09:33SpeakerAnd compete with dry sifting. That's the way. Well, yeah, exactly. Does anybody prefer 11-hydroxy over THC?

3:09:46BubblemanIt's more potent. Fuck, dude. It's like a fucking nightmare. Are you kidding me, dude? Yeah, it's more potent. It's like fucking, I'll just smoke more dabs if I want to get more high. I prefer it. I use it as an oral consumption as a medicine when I'm hurting, when I need to sleep. But do I enjoy it as a recreational drug? Oh, not so much.

3:10:07Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, this for the for big beverage, Marcus, this is just another ingredient there. So they're already formulating ingredients. They're making lots of sodas, lots of seltzers. Oh, now we can basically add hemp derived THC for them. It's just another ingredient, which is why it's such a. A play for big beverage. That's why all the big beverage companies are interested in this market. And this market is unbelievably large.

3:10:36Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's taking off like you would not believe. In the most cannabis unfriendly states, you could buy these beverages.

3:10:43Etienne FontanSo it's a large, they're large labs too. And people, small manufacturers can't afford that. However, this is for a limited time only because the new bill, that's the new hemp bill, new farm bill that's being written is going to close these loops. And they're looking to actively close them. So keep your eye out.

3:11:03Dr Mark ScialdoneRemember, ATN, the Farm Bill's regulation ends at harvest. So once that plant is deemed as hemp, what happens to that CBD is not covered in the Farm Bill specifically, right? Now, if they put some kind of like rider extender in there saying, oh, by the way, you can't convert CBD into THC or other psychoactive substances. Thank you for watching.

3:11:42Dr Mark ScialdoneI see warehouses that are three pallet racks high with full forklifts. And you only do that when you have a lot of money. So Big Beverage has got a lot of money. They got the canning lines. All they need now. Is the psychoactive ingredient, which they can make by chemical conversion underneath the same roof, put that into a nano emulsion and bam, you got cannabis drinks, you know, so through their distribution centers, which they have the distribution already set and centered.

3:12:15Etienne FontanSo, you know, anybody attempting to compete with that is in for a check.

3:12:21Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah.

3:12:22Etienne FontanYeah. You have to either join or like other people, you're going to have to pretty much commit to these people for in perpetude for distribution. And they can negotiate those types of realities against you because who's going to stop them? Nobody.

3:12:41BubblemanNo, and if you look at Canada, the companies that give the biggest money, it wasn't pharma, it wasn't tobacco, it was drink, it was beverage. Constellation Brands gave Canopy like 4 billion US dollars, which I believe was 5 billion dollars. Canadian.

3:13:00Etienne FontanYeah, we carry Pabst, Pabst Blue Ribbon. We carry their seltzers right now in our dispensaries. And I know you can go down a total Bev and Mo and buy it for probably two to three bucks cheaper there, you know, at the store that it is at the regulated dispensary.

3:13:17Dr Mark ScialdoneHow do they taste, ATN? Do they taste good?

3:13:19Etienne FontanI don't know. I don't, I've never tried them. I don't do drinks. So, I mean, I'm a hash person. So, but people, we keep reordering. Some people must like them. People must have that nanotechnology. Whereas, remember, you know, five, 10 years ago, you just got that layer of oil right off the top.

3:13:39Dr Mark ScialdoneIt was mixed well, right? Yeah.

3:13:41Etienne Fontanconsumers say they taste like a regular beverage and they feel like they're able to get a uh a consistent dosage depending on how much they buy which is considerably also different than the technology we had which is where these companies have food laboratories they can actually do these sort of things and test them Whereas just getting a laboratory up and running is almost, what, a million dollars?

3:14:08Etienne FontanYou know, quite a few million dollars just to get a lab up and going, right, Mark?

3:14:12Dr Mark ScialdoneWell, for a testing lab, it's more like $2 million because you need the equipment, but you also need a healthy chunk of money in the bank for that runway by the time you get up to full capacity. And I'm sure Ezra will also say this on the production side. You need money to basically make that runway as smooth as you possibly can until you're up at full production capacity.

3:14:36Dr Mark ScialdoneSo, yeah. Yep.

3:14:39SpeakerI would actually say to that point, I mean, it's a little bit different topic than what you guys are talking about. But one thing that's allowed me to like exist and be here as a, you know, in the cannabis industry has been dry sifting and static sifting. And what I found is that, you know, I was already working for this company and I basically heard a little bit about static through the years.

3:15:00SpeakerAnd I was lucky enough to get an opportunity to start trying to figure it out basically in an empty room. And absolutely agree. Like once you get to a point where you have a process and you have a goal in mind and you want to launch a product, you need a certain amount of money to like realize that and get it to store shelves. But luckily we were able to really like Thank you so much for joining us.

3:15:44SpeakerYou can generate a considerable amount of value from not a lot of starting material, you know, and for us, it was just seeing the trim come off of our very first harvest and realizing that there was an opportunity there. So I'm really interested to see what's going to happen with dry sifting over the next few years, because as people Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

3:16:05SpeakerThank you. Thank you. Thank you.

3:16:33SpeakerAfter you're done doing the dry sifting, extract the rest of the cannabinoids and terpenes and get value out of them. And static really changes that because, and we're still working on, again, like really pulling it together with duct tape. We don't have a proper freezer yet to run our, you know, Keith Thief. We love Keith Thief, but we don't have a freezer for their big machine. So we tumble it like 50 degrees with a really low humidity.

3:16:59SpeakerAnd the way we get around not having a freezer is we just beat the crap out of the material. We've actually, Hey, shout out to D420K in the house, dude. How fucking, the dry sift general himself just popped in. Can I hear a bong rip?

3:17:29BubblemanNo, you got to unmute yourself. Sorry, this stupid Zoom auto mute. There you are.

3:17:35SpeakerLong rep, mother lovers.

3:17:37BubblemanGood to see you. Oh, dude. That was awesome, dude. People are going to be tripping out in the chat room. How are you all doing? Fuck, we're just sitting around puffing dabs and talking about dry sift, dude.

3:17:53SpeakerYou know, I've got... Fuck, let me see this.

3:18:02SpeakerI've still got some dry set from the old days, buddy. Oh my God.

3:18:05BubblemanLook how red that is. That's awesome.

3:18:09SpeakerSee if I get a better shot of it.

3:18:11BubblemanOh no, it kind of went gold actually. It just looks red.

3:18:14SpeakerIs it still terpene rich? Not at all, Sam. Okay, that's what I was going to suspect. It's just really old tasting hash.

3:18:26BubblemanBut is it 10 years old?

3:18:28SpeakerOh yeah, this is out of the jar that we, that when you come up to do a film, to do a video, this is one of the jars that still has some left in it.

3:18:39BubblemanOh my God, dude.

3:18:42SpeakerWhen I come to Vancouver next time, I'll bring some and we'll just sesh it up to see what you think anyways. Hell yeah, dude. It gets you really high, but I like my rosins a lot these days, right? Like it's... It's my favorite actually, but still the OG Kush and all that sort of stuff. I'm just wondering about the dry sifting finish. What's the topic we're talking on on dry sift here?

3:19:08SpeakerAre we talking about being able to get it, being able to make it? What's the main subject?

3:19:13BubblemanI mean, shit, we went pretty deep, Dr. Mark. We're talking about making it, storing it, traveling with it, all the above, so... A lot of static information, a lot of people in the room right now. We got, let's see, well, we had Charles earlier, but we have like Ezra and Chris K and Wolverine Dabs and Renee and Holland, and they're sort of all part of the Sambal filtration, that sort of commercial machine that makes static dry sift now.

3:19:42BubblemanWolverine Dabs has lots of information. Logan, who's in the room here, he's been making dry sift with that and some other techniques. So just kind of all these different people have kept the conversation going. They're sort of, you know, novelly creating new things and kind of trying to just, you know, figure out exactly. We still don't really know why or how it works. But a lot of the people in the room right now are kind of part.

3:20:05BubblemanAnd you've been a big part of the conversation, dude, you know, with the iTunes card. Thank you for watching.

3:20:27SpeakerBefore I understood anything about what a trichome was, like what the science was. How about the guy that introduced us? I know I did the card math, but I didn't realize what I was doing and what I had found out. And then there was that guy, Mies McCallman, off of YouTube, with a bigger case, like a video game case, and parchment paper on it. And that changed the game completely.

3:20:55SpeakerLike it did give you grams at a time of brushing off the thing if instead of 0.2, 0.3 of a gram every time with the card. And then there's the black glove.

3:21:10BubblemanCorrect. And the balloon. No, that was all a part of it. And if you think about it, D, the same way you didn't really kind of quite understand, it was your sharing what you didn't understand that allows me to kind of figure it out and then share with you back. And Sam told his origin story earlier today on this episode of how he Thank you for watching.

3:21:46BubblemanYou know, complex, but yet simple understandings and discoveries that are often, it takes one person to do it publicly. So another person can see it and be like, oh shit, I think I see what he's doing there. And then it continues on. So obviously D420K was a big part of static sifting becoming public, becoming discovered really.

3:22:09SpeakerVery proud to be part of that. And I'm going to dive into a bone rip here if everybody wants to have a little Bong Rip, Mother Lovers.

3:22:16Johnny BI'm doing it. I'm loaded and ready to go.

3:22:21SpeakerYeah. Hey, Johnny. How you doing, bud? Jen Doe. Hi. I miss you. I miss all you guys. Man, how's everything going for you?

3:22:32Jenn DoeGreat.

3:22:34SpeakerJen.

3:22:35Jenn DoeYeah. Oh, shit. For me, life is freaking wild, man. Never dulled it.

3:22:40BubblemanI was going to say, Jen. Oh, my God. Jen could write a book on the question D420K just answered. We'll be crying. We'll be laughing. We'll be angry. We'll be celebrating. Go ahead, Jen.

3:22:53Jenn DoeYeah. No, you just nailed it. Thank you. That sums it up. Yeah.

3:22:58SpeakerWell, you still got a smile on your face, so that's a good thing. Good for you. Good to see it.

3:23:03Jenn DoeThank you. There's always a silver lining and no matter how small it is, I always seem to just find it. So, yeah. From snake venom treatments in the jungles of Mexico to damn near crazy death in the mountains, or not the mountains, in the woods of Maine to... Did I ever tell you that I smoked

3:23:32SpeakerKing Cobra, Snake Venom.

3:23:35Jenn DoeNo.

3:23:37SpeakerOf course you did. It's a psychedelic downer.

3:23:44SpeakerIt's sort of like a dis-personalization drug. And yeah, it's funny because before they would let you smoke it, it was the snake babas who were selling it to me in India. They would put it on parchment paper. They would first look in your mouth to make sure you didn't have any open sores because they said then it'll kill you.

3:24:10Jenn DoeYeah, because if it gets into your bloodstream, like the way that we administered the venom through the treatments that I learned how to do, it's all like through the lymphatic system. So if you get it into your bloodstream, it absolutely is deadly.

3:24:26SpeakerYeah, well, let me tell you, it absolutely is strong and it is a psychedelic de-spersonalization drug. I was shocked. I also smoked Scorpion Tails.

3:24:42Jenn DoeI was going to say scorpion. I've heard of that. I've heard of people smoking scorpion. Again, I use the scorpion venom for different medicinal things. And so, yeah, like how you, how you partake of that is going to change. So like, for example, when I'm doing snake venom directly into my lymphatic system, there is no psychedelic effect. Whereas if you're smoking it, you're getting a whole different situation.

3:25:07Jenn DoeSo that's, that's interesting.

3:25:10SpeakerI did it and I guarantee you it has a very strong effect.

3:25:15Jenn DoeYeah. Well, I had about 15 different snake venoms coursing through my body within about a month period, all of which do all sorts of different things. None of them were psychedelic, but all of them had... And it's also dosage, right? So if you're hitting snake venom in the chillum, like I'm over here microdosing it for... The more like subtle step up effect for my health versus like recreationally trying to smoke a shit and blast like that's crazy.

3:25:52SpeakerYeah, the only one I think I tried was King Cobra venom. And it was quite potent. I don't know. I mean, there are other venoms like Black Mamba and stuff, which are much stronger, but also too, like you say, each snake venom affects you in different ways. I mean, especially when you're bitten by the snake, you know, some of them stop you breathing, some of them stop your heart beating, there's infinite ways of killing you.

3:26:29Jenn DoeSome of them liquefy your blood, some of them thicken your blood. So when you start thinking about medical applications of the benefits of just that, the pharmaceutical companies came out with a product called Capitril, which is basically for like regulating like the thinning of your blood. So people that are having strokes or heart attacks and like there's so many medications that have already come from those. But yeah, when you start doing the research on how that venom kills its prey, and then we think of dosage, right?

3:27:05Jenn DoeSo the difference between like poison and medicinal is going to be the amount. So when you bring that clear down to a smaller amount, like what benefit is it to like certain neurological things, right? So some snakes, they are, they strictly, like, they paralyze their prey. Right. So it's not doing anything to their blood. It's it is paralyzing them because it's paralyzing their their neurological system. So when you think about that in terms of, say, like pain relief, OK, like if you can paralyze those certain signals that are being sent for pain, you're able to regulate pain.

3:27:42SpeakerSo it's like curry.

3:27:44Jenn DoeYeah. Yeah, it's so very interesting. I mean, when we when I compare it to cannabis, right, so all of these things do different things for all of these ailments and this plant will do this and this terpene profile. Well, venom is actually the same and in a sense that we're looking at like peptides, proteins and amino acids in different combinations and different things that are also present in that venom.

3:28:11Jenn DoeSo it's the concept of it's really an Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

3:28:40Jenn DoeYeah, if you look up like top 10, but the Taipan, I believe, is the most venomous on the planet. One drop of Taipan can kill something like 100 grown men in 30 minutes. And don't quote me on those numbers. I would have to go back and look it up. But yeah, Taipan. And then I think it goes to the Mambas, the Fertilances in there. And then you've got like your Sidewinders and all of your Vipers and Yeah, like the...

3:29:10SpeakerSome of the venoms, you don't have to be bitten by the snake, but spit it in your face.

3:29:17Jenn DoeYeah, they have spitting cobras. Like the cobras are the ones that spit it. But yeah, so they're trying to go for the eyes on that so that can blind you, right?

3:29:27BubblemanBut do you find that you prefer your snake venom air dried or freeze dried is what I'm really, that's the question. I like to.

3:29:37Jenn DoeIt's funny that you bring that up, Marcus, because yes, they freeze dry the venom. Believe it or not, venom is the hardest substance I've ever tried to actually fucking get my hands on ever. Like reaching out to any of the snake breeders and whatnot. It is so regulated by the pharmaceutical companies that they have contracts with anybody that is actually harvesting venom with huge repercussions if they allow anybody other than medical labs or pharmaceutical companies.

3:30:09Jenn DoeSo they do freeze dry it though. Unfortunately, I don't think air dry is an option because there's certain bacterias and whatnot that would cause the degradation of that venom too quickly. But they do freeze dry it in order to be able to do a lot of their lab.

3:30:25SpeakerIn India, they would milk the snakes, snake babas, sadhus, and dry it on parchment paper. And that's how they distribute it to their customers.

3:30:38Jenn DoeYeah. So I don't know, I'll have to air dry to do a side by side on the freeze dryer when I get the venoms going.

3:30:51SpeakerGuys, I do have to jump. Thank you so much for having me here today. Thanks for coming out. Yeah, you too. Hopefully I get to see some of you guys this week. And we generally my personal philosophy is I'm really happy to share anything about how we do what we do. Because if someone can figure out how to do it from whatever I say or other people say, then I think that's awesome.

3:31:14SpeakerSo always happy to talk more on or offline about about what we're up to.

3:31:20BubblemanAwesome, dude. Well, really appreciate you coming on and sharing and wish you the best of luck. And I'm sure we'll have you back on another day. I always appreciate people who come in from the lab on a Sunday.

3:31:32SpeakerHappy to be here. It's a pleasure. Thanks, guys.

3:31:36Jenn DoeAnd if you could shoot me a message on Instagram, I would love to connect. So yeah.

3:31:40SpeakerYeah, I will. I've got my tiny little hash account, Sandbox Rodeo. We try to just post what we're up to with no real agenda. We just like to be out there. So yeah, I'll shoot you a message.

3:31:53Jenn DoePerfect.

3:31:54SpeakerPeace, homie.

3:31:56BubblemanPlease help me. Well, we've got another half hour. We're going to chill out and hang out for Hash Church, one o'clock. I'd like to get that, yeah, go right to one today. I have a bunch of other stuff going on afterwards, but interesting conversation today, as always, from dry sift to snake bed. Oh, we definitely have enough time for mom ribs. Let's do it.

3:32:20SpeakerBong rip it.

3:32:21BubblemanI just took my D420K bong rip. Literally, like, I didn't want to interrupt, but I was like, look, I'm taking my bong rip, D. I'll give you another one just because. Just because you can. It's Sunday. What a wonderful thing to do. Where are you located, Chris?

3:32:38SpeakerI'm located in Germany, close to Basel. I heard you had it a couple of days ago last week on the previous episode.

3:32:49BubblemanYeah, Basel.

3:32:50SpeakerYeah, quite close to Basel, like around 40 to 50 kilometers. I'm not in the fortunate position to have a bong rib as well because I don't smoke inside. I'm a little kid here. Oh, yeah. But I have to wait a little bit and then I will also do after I meet you all. I will also hop hop off in in a short amount of time. But it was also a pleasure meeting you all you guys.

3:33:14SpeakerAnd talking to such professionals as well. I hope we can stay in contact for some more info regarding the technique and the scientific background of all the static electrostatic separation we do, especially with Jendo and Wolverine dabs, maybe get some more info about it to improve everything to make it even better. And I also wanted to say one thing to thanks to Skunk Man Sam, because I'm not a professional as you are, all of you.

3:33:51SpeakerI'm not doing it in a big scale, but especially the Skunk One was something that I had during my entire time as a little grower all by myself. And I still today use and I prefer skunk one strains and crossings. So it's a pleasure and an honor to talk to guys like guys like you and especially skunk man Sam who enlightened my youth, let's say like this.

3:34:22BubblemanVery cool, Chris. Thanks for sharing those words. And yeah, we'll definitely make sure we reach back out. Go ahead, Sam.

3:34:28SpeakerI'm glad you enjoyed it. Yeah, it's always one of my go-to strains and I'm as a regular Amsterdam visitor. Yeah, I've had a lot of it. Also, I had the honor to have the luck to have one of the cheese phenotypes, but not had the chance to clone or something like that. That was a yeah unfortunately but uh yeah it's great to have it and uh i till today like also for like around 25 years i enjoy skunk number one very much

3:35:10BubblemanWell, we'll make sure that I'm going to make sure Charles reaches out and gets me all of your guys' names and phone numbers and emails. I like to keep that for under all the panelists that have ever been on Hash Church. I just like to make sure I have those contacts. And so we'll be reaching out and staying in touch for sure. And I've also got a machine from Sambo Creek Filtration.

3:35:33BubblemanOnce we really start working with it and playing with it, I'll definitely be in touch as well.

3:35:38SpeakerYeah, funny, I stood in front of you last year at the Spanibus. Maybe we can recreate that again. And then I will talk to you. Weren't the Terps Army, I guess, in testing or judging? I don't know what you did there.

3:35:52BubblemanOkay, yeah, we threw a Legends of Hashish party in Barcelona last year and we did it in conjunction with Terps Army. Lorenzo's been a friend for many, many years. He was kind of an original bubble ambassador that just blew up and just, you know, he's doing so great now with his shop in Holland and his shop in Barcelona and... Yeah, that's cool that we, yeah, you know, I'll tell you my idea for this year, and this is, I mentioned this to Jolly Roger and the Puffco people, that what I'd really love to do is find the shop or the private club, because I've asked David and he explained, look, I could never do that to my clients.

3:36:31BubblemanThey're members of the private club. And what it was, was to have no tobacco for the entire Spanibus. You know, to have one spot in Barcelona during Spanibus, and I'm going to try and figure this out with some other companies that want to be involved, where we basically, you know, figure out a way to make it so the members are okay with it and just create like maybe four or five days where it's the place to go and have gabs and not have your throat be destroyed from burning paper and glue and tobacco.

3:37:04SpeakerMarcus, remember one time we had it where... The venue was divided and there was tobacco allowed at One area and not the other area. That was a step in the right direction.

3:37:19BubblemanRight. But you understand that was La Calada and they did that just for you and me. They like closed off half of their place and made it smoke freeze. And so do you remember also when we went there, they had the silver tray with all the full melt hashes and dry sifts? Oh, absolutely. Oh, my God. That was amazing, dude. Yeah, no, it was a step in the right direction.

3:37:42BubblemanIt was inspirational. Every year, including this year at Terps Army, I was dying every day that I left. My clothes stunk so badly. And it's like, I'm not trying to censor tobacco everywhere in Spain, but if we just could have one place Where we could gather and we could talk and I didn't have to go. I have to go home because I'm going to die soon from being in here and breathing in the secondhand smoke.

3:38:08BubblemanI just think it would be cool. So anyone that also thinks it would be cool, reach out to me at bcbubbleman at icloud.com and we'll figure out a way to make that happen. And shout out to La Colada.

3:38:20Jenn DoeIt's going to be quite the challenge.

3:38:24BubblemanIt will be, but you know what, Jen? I like a good challenge. I'm not going to lie. I like doing things that are hard.

3:38:32SpeakerWe did it for years. We did it for years at Legends in Amsterdam. There was no tobacco products allowed ever. Yeah.

3:38:42BubblemanI don't even know if we let people smoke joints.

3:38:45Jenn DoeAnd just like I enjoy as a smoker having my own little smoking section, I think when that whole situation is flip-flopped around, there should be a no smoking tobacco section. You know, us tobacco smokers want our little section, you know, just give me a little corner on the goddamn patio with a little thing. I mean, at the very least, they should have that segregated for non-smokers as well.

3:39:12Jenn DoeEurope's just hard. Spliffs, all spliffs. They don't like us pure folks.

3:39:16BubblemanWell, that's it. It's not, you can't say no cigarettes. It really has to be like no tobacco because it's all spliffs. It's, oh my goodness.

3:39:25Jenn DoeI mean, if I have a cigarette and then I have a joint and I'm smoking them at the same time, I call it my deconstructed spliff, but I still somehow get poo-pooed on for that cigarette. And I'm like, so let me get this straight. If I'm to like break this up and mix these together and put it back in a paper, then you're okay with it.

3:39:45SpeakerBut like separately, like, I don't know, culture though, you know, I try and respect people. Don't worry with me. No matter what you do, if there's tobacco in it, I don't like it.

3:39:57BubblemanI was going to say the same thing, Sam. You took the words right out of my mouth.

3:40:01Jenn DoeThat's very fair. Very fair.

3:40:04SpeakerSam, did you build a machine of static tech and that sort of stuff? And is it on the market now? No, I found one that would work. But as I described earlier in the show, The company that was making it was the Eastern Europe and they had very strong anti-cannabis laws. And I tried to get them to, I said, well, let me give you a $50, 50,000 Euro down payment so that you can bring one of the machines.

3:40:37SpeakerAnd if it works as well as I think, then you can keep the money and I'll keep the machine. But once they found That I was working with cannabis, even though I was legally licensed by the Ministry of Health, they wouldn't touch me with a 10-foot pole. That really sucks that there's still that stigma of it. I can't believe that. I can't even believe hearing that, that that would fucking take them.

3:41:05SpeakerWow. The solution is to just ignore the fuckers and...

3:41:12SpeakerYeah, absolutely.

3:41:14BubblemanSee, a lot of the people that are in the room and Chris, the gentleman from German, he was just talking about they do have a machine now. Sambo Creek Filtration has a machine. Charles was in here earlier, as was his electrostatic scientist, one of them, gentleman Alex, who's in Halifax. And these guys have been working on a machine. I have the machine at my facility in Delta there.

3:41:37BubblemanSo if ever you're around this way and we have some dry sift, you can come play with it. You just, it's got these crazy plates that get charged positively and negatively and like resin falls down between them and they separate and isolate. It's pretty cool. I have a question.

3:41:53Etienne FontanWhat's the best screen for snake venom?

3:41:59BubblemanIt's really hard to say, you know, I mean, we're working with such small volume.

3:42:10Jenn DoeI haven't broken it down to like the molecular level, but I feel like we're going to need like a fucking five micron to work with, with the small. Right? Because they don't have as much girth as...

3:42:25Etienne FontanThe only micron is the dilation of the snake tubes of teeth, right? So, you know, that's the only delivery methodology currently available.

3:42:37Jenn DoeYeah. Oh, inhalation.

3:42:42Jenn DoeI'll pull out my screens and see if I can separate it, but I'm going for the entourage effect. So I really, it's like, you know, the same concept of RSO. I want to keep as much in there as possible. So I don't think we'll be refining this down on screens anytime soon.

3:42:58SpeakerI've never tried to vaporize snake venom either. I combusted it in a chillum.

3:43:05Jenn DoeYeah.

3:43:07SpeakerFucking snake venom chillums.

3:43:08Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's going to thermally degrade into a bunch of crap.

3:43:11BubblemanOne more snake venom chillum we are making? Yes.

3:43:16Etienne FontanSo everybody knows, we're only kidding. Do not vaporize snake venom, okay? This is, you know, this is not for professionals only. Do not do it.

3:43:26Jenn DoeAnd don't be doing snake venom administration. Like I went through like very serious training down in the jungles of Southern Mexico with indigenous people. So don't try this at home.

3:43:40SpeakerOkay. I never suggested people smoke snake venom. I did it and it was my personal choice because I'm sort of a wild and crazy guy. But yeah, I would never suggest that anybody does that.

3:43:58Jenn DoeNow I've also partaken in 5-MeO DMT, which is the toad venom. So that you do smoke. But this is the first I'm really hearing of like smoking the Snake venom and having the psychedelic effect. The toad venom, yes. So that's why it doesn't surprise me that there is the potential for snake venom as well.

3:44:21SpeakerIt's more of a depersonalization drug than a true psychedelic.

3:44:26Jenn DoeYeah, well, I mean, the toad, that's like, that's a whole nother book. Like, I'll write a whole nother book on that one. But two different, two different applications, two different reasons. Definitely.

3:44:38Dr Mark ScialdoneThere's, there's tryptamines in, in toad venom. I don't think there's a tryptamines in.

3:44:44Jenn DoeI don't.

3:44:45Dr Mark ScialdoneIt's a, that as soon as it gets hot, it's going to degrade.

3:44:49Jenn DoeYeah.

3:44:51Dr Mark ScialdoneSo whatever Sam, you know, inhaled into his lung.

3:44:54Jenn DoeSo here's a question, Mark. Like, what about so I because I have seen like a vice on them smoking scorpion and I have utilized scorpion venom. Matter of fact, I have a bottle that I bought. It cost me like $500 for this small diluted bottle for blue scorpion venom because it is known to be able to help like with cancer and whatnot.

3:45:18Dr Mark ScialdoneAre there alkaloids in there, Jen, you know?

3:45:21Jenn DoeI'll send you a picture of it. I can send you the information.

3:45:23Dr Mark ScialdoneYeah, because peptides, the most like bee venom, like melatonin and most snake venoms, like you had mentioned the capitol, the antiplatelet drug that was developed based on snake venom. Most of those are peptides, you know, and those are not going to be thermally stable. If you try to dab those, they're going to immediately degrade into probably toxic shit. So yeah, don't smoke venoms in general.

3:45:55Jenn DoeAnd with the scorpion that I've heard, them smoking the scorpion to get high using it as a drug, it wasn't that they were trying to extract the scorpion venom. They were literally taking dead scorpions that were dried and cured, and they were breaking pieces of this fucking scorpion off.

3:46:13SpeakerThat's what I was doing with scorpion tails also.

3:46:18Jenn DoeYeah, but they don't harvest the venom from them because scorpions put out such a small amount of venom. Did you know that scorpion is like just the scorpion venom alone is like the highest priced fucking product on the fucking planet because it comes like one little drop at a time. So it's like millions of dollars for one gallon of scorpion venom.

3:46:42BubblemanDamn, who's flipping scorpion venom gallons is what I want to know. Like, holy fucking shit. Yeah, I got fucking 10 gallons.

3:46:52Jenn DoeRight? I had to source this blue scorpion venom that I was using in like fucking Cuba or some shit.

3:47:03SpeakerWell, you need gallons, Marcus, when you want to smoke it in a hubbly bubbly.

3:47:10BubblemanWell, there's two types of scorpion venom dealers, those that require gallons and those that don't. That's a little play on Howard Marks' hashish. Quote on dealers, those that need forklifts and those that don't. There's two types of hash dealers, those that are used to the sound of beep, beep, beep, and those that are not.

3:47:37BubblemanSo there it is.

3:47:39Jenn DoeWhat was the effects of smoking with snake venom? Because, yeah, I'm kind of like wondering if maybe they didn't slip you a little something else in that show.

3:47:47SpeakerNo, no, I saw the milk. The King Cobra. I dried it myself and I was very skeptical. I didn't know what the hell they were doing. I heard that, you know, these snake bobbins were doing this. So I went and tried it because, yeah, I'm an adventurous soul.

3:48:13Jenn DoeNow, are we sure they didn't maybe mix it with a little dash of datura, which a lot of them actually do?

3:48:20SpeakerNo, I saw them milk it, and they didn't adulterate it in any way, and then they dropped it on parchment paper.

3:48:35Jenn DoeYeah, but it takes quite a bit for it to dry. Are you sure that in that process they maybe didn't incorporate some datura?

3:48:45SpeakerThe snake bubbles, they didn't have long sleeves or anything. I was watching them pretty close. I'm a pretty observant type guy.

3:48:58Jenn DoeI have not heard of that, so I will have to do more research on it. It's very interesting, though.

3:49:03SpeakerI did it 25, 30 years ago. Yeah.

3:49:11Jenn DoeSo what were the effects of that? Like, tell us about your experience here.

3:49:15SpeakerIt's a psychedelic downer, a depersonalization drug. Kind of reminded me a little bit of like ketamine or PCP or even muscanol, if you've ever had any of those substances.

3:49:33Jenn DoeI have. So it's a disassociative then.

3:49:37SpeakerAbsolutely. It's a bit psychedelic disassociative, but yes, it's, people call ketamine the, the Cadillac of disassociated drugs, whereas I called angel-less PCP the, yeah, the shit version.

3:49:59Jenn DoeYeah.

3:50:00SpeakerThe crack version.

3:50:01Jenn DoeI had a lot of experience with ketamine down in Mexico as well and also learned how to administer that For therapeutic reasons to others. So it would, so here's the interesting thing that's catching my ears. Like, so one of the things that especially the King Cobra is, is like documented to have these effects is that it's an amazing pain medication because it, it, it acts in the same way as morphine as far as disrupting the nerve signals from your pain receptors.

3:50:32Jenn DoeCobra venom on some of the articles and the documentation that I've read It's actually 10 times more effective than morphine with zero effects. So, you know, I mean like, so ketamine with pain, right? It kind of like disassociates you and puts you in this different space. So those receptors are not actually active. So yeah. How would that correlate to like snake venom if you are, if you're actually administering it a certain way?

3:51:04Jenn DoeSo I'm not saying it's not possible.

3:51:09SpeakerWhen I smoked it, I smoked it in Goa, and I didn't think it was going to work, but it did.

3:51:25BubblemanSometimes experience is different from research. We can read all about things. And you know what? I found it very interesting when we did our Grateful Dead episode and we had Mark invited a really cool guy in who was like a historian. And so he hadn't necessarily been there for the experiences, but he met the people years later and he'd written about them. And he was he was writing about these stories that had happened so long ago.

3:51:47BubblemanBut then there was Courtney Pollack. And Courtney Pollack had actually had those experiences years ago. He was what this guy was writing about. Oh yeah, I was with Neil and I went to Egypt with Jerry. And he's telling all these stories in the most craziest, humblest way ever because he wasn't really dropping names. He was just talking about his experiences that he had during these times with the Grateful Dead.

3:52:11BubblemanAnd I just really noticed how different it was from the conversations that was coming from the other gentlemen who had been researching it. They are worlds apart. It's good for us to research and we learn an enormous amount when we do. But sometimes, like I will say this about my research, when it doesn't align with someone else's actual experience, then I look into that. Because, you know, there's, there's a lot of experiences to be had out there.

3:52:39BubblemanAnd sometimes my research tells me, well, that your experience is impossible. And the person was like, well, but it's not my research. It's my actual experience. So this is the difference. So and you learn that as I get older as well, I learn more about this. I feel like I'm really just at the cusp of starting to learn about this. I feel like for the first 40 plus years of my life, I was on the other side of it.

3:53:00BubblemanBut now as I get a little bit older, I'm still only 51, but a little bit, I'm starting to kind of get to the, I'm at the halfway point at least, that it's changed my perspective. What, I see you lifting your head up and down there, Wade, what are you thinking over there? We haven't, I always want to bother Wade, but I don't want to bother Wade.

3:53:21BubblemanI just want to include him and, you know, if he wants to be a part of the conversation, I always appreciate hearing from him.

3:53:28SpeakerThank you, Marcus.

3:53:32SpeakerYeah, I've been sitting here listening to the deep dive on snake venom and static sift, dry sift, and just feeling really grateful for the combination of determination and psychonautic Interest that drives people to explore these kind of things and to refine the work that we're all doing. I, uh, I personally am at a spot these days where, um, yeah, my condition doesn't really allow me to be as active in many of the ways that y'all are talking about as I might've once been.

3:54:19SpeakerI, um, Gosh, there's so many things going on in my head. I don't really even know where to start. I will say that personal check-in, it's been a pretty rough week. In addition to all the other fun that I'm having and living in this body these days, for the first time since my diagnosis, I caught some sort of a bug, a respiratory infection. It's not COVID. It's not turned into pneumonia, but it's been a very persistent and unpleasant difficulty breathing and coughing and whatnot and engaging in all kinds of the herbal preparations that

3:55:04SpeakerAre part of what we're talking about here today. The nature and the plant kingdom and the fungal kingdom and the animals, you know, snake venom offer us tools to help us have a better life. And it's really about learning about that. And it takes folks like who we are here today with the willingness to explore, to learn and take chances. But to do it with consideration and care and make sure you don't hurt yourself or others.

3:55:40SpeakerAnd one thing I wanted to share with you all is a picture. Back when Steep Hill first opened their new facility in Berkeley, I was invited to that event and Left the farm up here and went down back to the Bay Area. And among the reasons that I went is I wanted to renew my acquaintance with the Reverend Dr. Cameron and also renew my acquaintance with Fred Gardner.

3:56:15SpeakerAnd both of those fellows were there and we spent some time hanging out, sharing some food and conversation about this and that. But after that, while there was still a big crowd, I went outside into the crowd and there was an awful lot of suits and shiny shoes and big watches running around in the room. And I had gone down there thinking I'd run into a bunch of farmers.

3:56:38SpeakerWell, that was not what was happening. But over in the corner, there was a family. They were not well-dressed, no shiny shoes, no big watches, but they were gathered around a wheelchair And in that wheelchair was the first catastrophically ill young person I ever met.

3:57:05SpeakerAnd I won't share his name because he's a success story in my life. When I met him, I asked them what they were doing there. And they were hoping that there was somebody there who was growing ACDC. And I said, well, I grow ACDC, but it doesn't do well in our environment up here in Nevada County at my elevation. And long, long, long, long, long story short, made short in the interest of time.

3:57:45SpeakerWhen I met the family, Cam was, oops, the young man was on 15, 1-5 different anti-seizure medications. He was blind. He was wearing a diaper. He was totally in rictus, just like this. And it was really hard to see. He had a feeding tube close to, was he going to be able to live? Anyway, again, long story short, ended up working with the family. Today, I believe he's on one anti-seizure medication.

3:58:25SpeakerI have not exchanged genetics or plant material or oils with the family in probably six years, but his siblings learned how to grow and learned how to do extractions and Today, this is what Cam looks like. I don't know if y'all can see.

3:58:51BubblemanWow. We can see. Absolutely.

3:58:54SpeakerHe's fully there. He responds.

3:59:01SpeakerAnd part of why I wanted to tell his story is his mother Very early on helped me understand that due to prohibition and something called homeowners association agreements, they could lose their home if it became known that their child was using cannabis. And this is in the Bay Area of California. And it's still appalling to me that those are the kinds of things that patients, people who need cannabis have to deal with, the practical implications that still hang out in our culture.

3:59:36SpeakerAnd we've made reference to the stigma associated with cannabis and the other plant materials that we explore for their benefit, because for one reason or another, the culture chooses to say that's a bad thing instead of, I don't know, recognizing the importance of nature that Really, it's not just we humans are all in it together. It's the plants and the animals. We're all in it together on this planet.

4:00:13SpeakerAnd we really got to stop thinking we know what the hell we're doing and start recognizing that nature has been figuring out what's going on for many, many, many, many more years than we've been around. And we should recognize nature as the teacher she is for the gifts that she offers. I often think about the cannabis chemistry that this plant makes and that we folks like Sam and others have been so good at identifying and bringing forth in strong concentrations.

4:00:49SpeakerBut I like to remind myself that particularly in the realm of terpenes, that most of that chemistry is about the plant. It's about the plant doing what she needs to protect herself. And to create the opportunity to create offspring, all things that we want. And so it's really important to me that we don't forget that the further you get away from what nature is offering to us, the little it gets,

4:01:27SpeakerI trust in nature. I'll say it like that. And I'm not blind in it. I wouldn't. Sam, I don't know that I would smoke a chillum with snake venom in it. God bless you.

4:01:40SpeakerBut yeah, there's a whole lot. Well, I in return can say that I'm thankful to people like you. And a shout out to Fred Gardner. Fred Gardner was the one Participated in the discussions between me and Jeffrey Guy because we had already developed a CBD variety and he's the one who passed the information on down the line to you folks.

4:02:10SpeakerYeah, Fred's a, talk about a fella who's for years done really good work with no expectation of recognition or thanks. He's quite the sweetheart. I'm thankful he's still with us.

4:02:27SpeakerI think that's all I've got, everyone. Again, I feel really blessed and grateful for the environment of the community that I live here, here in Nevada County. It's perfect that we are talking about dry sift and whatnot. This morning, Delivered here to my home by a friend. It's a lovely little plaque of what I believe, I'm not sure, because I didn't have a chance to talk about it, is...

4:03:10SpeakerBlueberry muffin, dry sifted and hand pressed into a nice, feels like maybe a 10 gram heart. Yeah, that looks nice. Because, and part of what happened for me and part of why this conversation is so interesting, the same person a couple of weeks ago handed me a little piece of this, what I think is the same thing.

4:03:41SpeakerAnd when I got home from that event, I smoked it and I sent him a text message and told him that it had been a long time since I had experienced psychedelia as a result of consuming hashish. But along with the flavors that came with that hash he had given me, I actually did experience visual

4:04:12SpeakerAlteration, if you will. That was very enjoyable. I love the psychedelic experience, but it's been a long time since I had got there with Hashish. Anyway, that's the report from Wade. I'm doing good. I'm so, I got to say for days leading up to this morning, I've been excited and looking forward to what we would talk about today and who I might meet here. Again, Marcus. Thank you for bringing this crew together.

4:04:45SpeakerAll of y'all who showed up and have contributed your thoughts or your expertise or your, I just, as a patient and as someone who used to be pretty active in this work, I'm really grateful that There's still people doing it because God knows there's so much that needs to be done. There's people that, well, like I said, that young man that I showed you his picture is one example of folks that I know that have benefited greatly from cannabis, but they can't tell their stories for whatever reason.

4:05:22SpeakerAnd, uh, Yeah, don't do what you're doing for the work, for the recognition. Those of you that are in business, I really hope that you can succeed, particularly here in California. It looks like a total mess and nightmare for anyone who's trying to do it legally. And yeah, that's the last thing I want to say. Again, part of prohibition. Some of the persons who have, over the last few years, so generously provided me with high quality products, some of them have a license and a permit, some of them don't.

4:06:05SpeakerBut to a person, most of those folks, the ones with the license and a permit, Could lose their license and permit because of the way in which they are providing me the medicine that I need. Because it wouldn't be legal in a dispensary. And so there'd be a threat to their permit. And so I can't talk about it. And it just seems totally distorted and weird. That I can't openly talk about some of the most beautiful people I know making some incredible products because they might lose their license that they put so much time, effort, and money into securing and holding on to.

4:06:45SpeakerThat's wrong. They're trying to do it right by the rules. It's fucked up. Pardon my language, but those are messed up rules. They're trying to do it. And tool one, I don't know any of them that are flourishing I know a couple of them that are surviving. Their head is above water. They're current on their taxes and all that, but there's no gravy in it, that's for sure.

4:07:08SpeakerAnd meantime, there's way too many folks who have dropped out or quit because it's just impossible for those persons. That's the end of the report from Nevada City, California, and Wade in his beautiful recliner on a Sunday morning at Hash Church. And I love that picture you shared earlier, Marcus, with all those rows of upright buds in front of a stained glass window. That's a very evocative picture.

4:07:39SpeakerThank you.

4:07:40BubblemanRight on, Wade. I will send you that picture so you can have it for your own use. Very powerful words, as always. Incredible story about the young gentleman. That's the kind of work that you want to do in life. Just one of those, and I don't say just one of those, but really just one person like that, that's enough of a reason to do the work, and that's kind of the most...

4:08:06BubblemanBold, noticeably like it's, you know, there's people that use cannabis medicinally in a variety of ways, but a person like that gentleman who was just at the most extreme end of being incapable of probably really doing anything. I mean, you know, rigamortized just, oh my goodness, it's a heart-wrenching story. So I'm really glad you shared it and we appreciate it and anything we can do. To help in in those experiences and I hear what you're saying too about the not being able to talk about it and you know when I got my job at Embark and we got a license all of a sudden there was all these different rules and regulations you have to be careful how what you do and what and it was just it was wrong you could just tell it was just like this isn't helping anyone this is some weird fear and scarcity demonic based shit That has nothing to do with love and abundance and community and family and building.

4:09:01BubblemanIt's just tearing things down. It just sets a bad seed. It's like spraying the whole experience with a poison before you even get started, which of course is no surprise how they run the agricultural community. I see and the vision I see I'm aligned with you in a lot of the ways in most of the ways that you think in particular. So I do always appreciate you closing us out on Hash Church with powerful, profound words that You know, we can really think about for at least the rest of the day, if not the rest of the week or the rest of the month, or even better, forever.

4:09:39BubblemanLet's keep it at the top of our minds. I want to thank Samwell Filtration, Charles and Alex and Chris and Logan and Jen Doe and Renee and all the group of people that came in to talk about static dry sift today. Obviously, thanks, Skunk Man Sam, for Just once again, birthing the whole, you know, the whole fucking thing for everyone. Thank you, Johnny B. Always a pleasure to see you in the room, my friend.

4:10:07BubblemanAnd Dr. Mark, always good when you share your chemistry knowledge with us. We appreciate it. Etienne, you as well for all the amazing work that you've done over the years.

4:10:17Etienne FontanJust a quick one. Tomorrow is the DEA hearings. So you can go to the DEA. It's the first hearing for rescheduling. So just FYI, it starts at... Are they going to let you speak yet, Chad? We have filed our motions. We all just got our denials on Thursday. I mean, pardon me, on Wednesday, which is literally one day before. And so the clock actually starts for 30 days.

4:10:46Etienne FontanWe can appeal. So we already appealed last week. So but it didn't arrive at the court until because we had to mail it in. So I anticipate. Our Veterans Action Council will be ruled on first thing and tossed or will be allowed to participate. We wouldn't speak tomorrow. The hearings have been moved into February or March at this time. So we're trying to get Michael Krawitz in there to be our representative.

4:11:13Etienne FontanWade and I are for the VAC. But we won't know until tomorrow at 9 a.m. Eastern Standard Time to hear what the judge has to say. It's just going to be a hearing. It's not the entire thing as stated. They're going to read through all 40,000 comments plus, you know, the 25 people who have been decided. And there's multiple lawsuits. There's collusion between the DEA and Kevin Sabet.

4:11:39Etienne FontanAnd people are now suing for that data information. So sorry, not trying to hog your exit here, Marcus, but just want to give that brief update because this is a big blip in the United States happening tomorrow. So keep your eye out.

4:11:51BubblemanNo, that's a huge one. We're glad that you shared that, Etienne, as always. Do and do. Go and go and... Going that extra level for the Hash Church community. They appreciate it. I want to thank D420K for coming in today, man. It's fucking good to see you, dude. I hope you come back again next Sunday and fucking hang out with us and puff some bowls with us again.

4:12:12BubblemanOh, you're muted.

4:12:15BubblemanOh, can you guys hear?

4:12:19SpeakerI work like a dog, buddy. I hope any Sunday that I can come in, you know I will. But I'm literally looking after crews of guys now and stuff. It's a real good killer experience what I'm doing. And thank you for reaching out and inviting me in today to talk about it and see everybody. It's a pleasure to see all these faces, man. Like, it's great. You know, good to see you all.

4:12:44SpeakerLove you all. And keep hashing and keep doing what you guys are doing. ATN, you're just like a fucking Aztec warrior going to battle all the time for us for our rights and stuff. Yeah, man, good on you. You know, Jen and her education on the venom. That's that's some killer shit, man. I haven't heard any of that stuff before, but very impressive, very interesting and always throwing huge info out to everybody for absolutely free.

4:13:14SpeakerAwesome. You guys have a good night or a good day. I will see you guys soon again. You can count on it. When I get the chance.

4:13:22BubblemanMother lovers. And Jen, I want to get you back as well. It was awesome listening to you today. You shared such great information. We always appreciate your perspective and you're always doing amazing things. And, you know, it's crazy. I know you've been through some crazy shit in the last few years, but I swear that stuff just like builds you up, gets you stronger, gets you prepared for, you know, the work that you're clearly here to do.

4:13:46Jenn DoeYeah, for sure. I just came across in my memories the, what was it, eight years ago when we had Beyond After the Accident and that hash church. So I just revisited that. I was like, wow, it's been a long time. It was so amazing to me to be able to have that platform, to be able to share that on and to accomplish what we were able to as far as donations.

4:14:11Jenn DoeSo I just want to thank you again for You know, providing this platform to us and extending an invitation because I do like to come on and share as much cool shit as I can. Awesome.

4:14:26BubblemanWell, we want you to share and, you know, you can let people know, hey, if you can't find me, I'll be on Hash Church next Sunday.

4:14:33Jenn DoeRight.

4:14:34BubblemanSo thanks. Thanks, everybody. Everybody that's watching. We had about 400 people watching live today. Thank you guys so much. Bingo Lombardi for holding down the chat room and all the great people. New members, OG Brick 420, John Cox. Cake in a Cup, Camden Fragman. We have a whole bunch of people now. I think there's 30 or 40 of them that are members of Bubble Man's World on YouTube.

4:14:58BubblemanSo they've gone and got themselves a little membership. There's been some people, I can't remember the gentleman's name. Funny enough, it probably maybe isn't a gentleman. The name started with uterus, so you never know. But uterus, thank you for gifting five memberships out in Hash Church chat room today. Just went and bought five memberships and randomly gave them out to five people. We appreciate you guys. And as always, may the full melt bless your bowl sooner than later.

4:15:25BubblemanPeace out, everybody.